Hi! Do you feel different about the heals in particular? Would you feel this way if they were votes? Surely people can count?In post 17, Andante wrote: I'm not a fan of the instant heals... like, as soon as someone hits 6 they're a leader, so like yeah. plus post cap situatiion like, ehhh LOVE the gifs though
I'm thinking that's a resistance fighter mindset right there. How easy do you think it would be for you to bamboozle me as a terminator?
Why yes people irl do tend to complain that I'm too deepIn post 47, ejjinami wrote:I think you are way too serious as for a read based on one postIn post 36, Aisa wrote:I'm thinking that's a resistance fighter mindset right there. How easy do you think it would be for you to bamboozle me as a terminator?
"Since I've started writing this I see this has been discussed and people mostly seem to agree with me" was shorthand for "I skimmed some of the discussion. On a more careful reread people have already made these points, and it's also been discussed more since I started writing this".In post 105, Andante wrote:I laughed way too hard at that ISO of mine linked... like wow... hahaha. wow, thank you for the laugh Loki!! wow.. a whole year ago..
Umm at this very second, I'd probably heal ejjinami and NotAHecticAlt, I feel a little better about ejjinami over NotAHecticAlt
and 102 has me against healing Aisa, it's a lot of repeating what I initially said, so gut is telling me it's scum trying to look towny, like she acknowledges "since I've started writing this I see this has been discussed and people mostly seem to agree with me, but eh, not gonna throw away what I've already written." but like, it was like 2 hours ago I said this.. ehhh I don't feel great about Aisa.. this post screams "I'm maf!! make me leader!!"
It can be. It's not good for reads if there's so much content that people struggle to digest it. Remember I brought up the busy-ness to justify why I wrote a post that essentially repeated your point.In post 113, Andante wrote:I mean, isn't a busy thread good for reads?In post 111, Aisa wrote:eh, digesting posts fully is hard and the thread is busy right now.
I know I know I said I would leave for the rest of today. Except my friend has left me alone and bored and I am having to fend for myself and I just happened to pop by and noticed the newest vote count. I have not read the rest of the thread.In post 102, Aisa wrote:If we are concerned about Andante being leader (I haven't played with her before) that is fair enough and we can think about "leader-ing" someone else, but FWIW I think I agree with Loki's idea of trying to heal town. After all, one of the only pieces of moderator-confirmed information we have is that a town leader should be good for the town. Doing anything other than healing townreads seems equal to acting on the basis of setup speculation, and IMO would require slightly stronger justification than what we've seen so far. (P-EDIT: since I've started writing this I see this has been discussed and people mostly seem to agree with me, but eh, not gonna throw away what I've already written.)
Also, if we are concerned about putting too much power in the hands of one person there might be ways to mitigate that? For example, we could ask whoever we elect as leader to pre-commit to keeping other's votes into account. For example, if 'leader' = dayvig, we can ask them to just shoot a consensus elim. If 'leader' = can determine the pool of elims on the next day, we can ask them to put people we all suspect in the elim pool, and so on. Of course, this may not work if the leader is some sort of night-acting role.
@ejjinami64 - if later you think of anything I can do to make your experience of playing with me better let me know, regardless of my alignment I'd like you to have a good experience in this game. But it's also ok if I just ping you and you can't explain why.
I see some discussion of my playstyle. While I'm not sure it's amazing for gamestate to get hung up on the three posts I've made so far, I also feel the urge to explain myself, so gonna stick it in a spoiler tag:
Spoiler: spoiler
Also, UNVOTE: , things are getting serious and I'm not ready for a serious heal yet.
Sounds like yer attention span is better than mineIn post 201, Cat Scratch Fever wrote:What, the game only had 5 pages at this pointIn post 111, Aisa wrote: "Since I've started writing this I see this has been discussed and people mostly seem to agree with me" was shorthand for "I skimmed some of the discussion. On a more careful reread people have already made these points, and it's also been discussed more since I started writing this".
I realise this sort of posting is anti-town and it would make life better if my posting were accurate the first time around. What can I say, eh, digesting posts fully is hard and the thread is busy right now.
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![:]](./images/smilies/icon_smiling.png "Cheerful Smile"){kind=icon}
I found this a bit convoluted and it took me a couple rereads to understand, which makes me lean slightly town on CSFIn post 205, Cat Scratch Fever wrote:YeahIn post 204, Fidget wrote:Because I'm critiquing both Loki and Not Hectic, presumably, and the Loki read is about NotHectic.
I think bad reasoning knows no alignment. Even if I'm having questions towards someone's motives, I'm not going to turn a blind eye to arguments being presented against them.
Or, perhaps, I'm mistaken about what you're getting at
Or more specifically
NotHectic has a read that you don't understand
Loki also thinks NotHectic's reads are hard to understand
I haven't really talked about many players in this game, I guess you could say most of the playerlist is invisible to me. But would love to talk about my read on you. No clue how to read you so far. I feel like some of your comments are a bit speculative. This, for example:In post 261, NotAHecticAlt wrote:I have the highest post count and i seem to be invisible to you - wanna talk about your read on meIn post 260, Aisa wrote:[...]
for your theory to make sense we require Loki = scum, Andante = town, and I felt like that was a slightly strong assumption.In post 124, NotAHecticAlt wrote:Loki's interest in being on Andante's good side, knowing how Andante tends to play, comes off as a scum pocket in the sense that they're trying to look good by giving andante leader ? this is like strictly a preflip off seeing andante as town and noticing how loki is treating Andante, as matter of fact town who has good reads and not separate from that, if that makes sense.
ejj feels LAMISTy in like a subtle way too
so rn like preliminary scumpool is [FB/ejj/Loki] for independent reasons.
gamma/CSF had weird entrances too
I agree with you! It does feel like Radical Rat is a bit fence-sitty in the post your are referring to. Ultimately they are stating a lot of hedge-y views but not doing a ton to advance the game. The caveat is that it could just be playstyle, and I haven't really had time to look into what their playstyle is.In post 191, NotAHecticAlt wrote:RR trying to hedge a read without appearing to do so
very creative strategy, I'll have to try it sometime
Though if the "scumread dressed up as a maybe townread" you're referring to is Loki's read on you, I think you're misinterpreting what they're saying.In post 236, NotAHecticAlt wrote:The point was they made a scumread by dressing it up as a maybe townread - I dont think this kind of "testing the waters" is towny and frankly, looks outing to me.In post 218, ejjinami wrote:forgive me for being blunt, accusing people for doubtful reasons at best won’t accomplish much at this pointIn post 191, NotAHecticAlt wrote:RR trying to hedge a read without appearing to do so
very creative strategy, I'll have to try it sometime
You wrote that read without thinking much, possibly a response to a scum-read on you.
Possibly as a way to maintain the leader-persona
please, quit it.
it just makes you appear unpredictable. It would be good to have some way to determine whether you seriously think of scum-reading someone or it’s just a reaction-test
[...]
I think I know what you're referring to re: ejj feeling genuine and NotHectic not feeling as genuine. But I would say they have quite different posting styles. I think ejj's posting style may be more "introspective" or "stream of consciousness-like", which to some, maybe myself included, may inherently appear more towny.In post 265, Radical Rat wrote:Ejj feels like the Town version of The Alt (not) Formerly Known As Hectic.
Like, they're similarly hyperposting, both coming off as somewhat arrogant, and tinged with LAMIST.... But for reasons I can't quite articulate, Ejj's posting seems genuine, while citceH's doesn't.
It is logical to me?In post 280, Fidget wrote: [...]
No, I agree with you that N-Hec thinks that they're acting pro-town. As scum or town. I meant it more as, they're convinced that what they're doing either A.) should be townread or B.) helps the town
Now, I have to suspend my disbelief super hard to get how they think preventing a nightkill on themself (And nominating Peng as leader / 180ing with no followup ) and etc are the most pro-town things that can be done.
In post 245, NotAHecticAlt wrote:[...]
I'm not explaining ejj at this time - I realize I flipped my read there and I want to see how the gamestate adjusts to that shift.
I feel the same way, which is why I'm a bit worried about Andante and NotHectic. If we're worried about scum looking for towncred I think those are two good places to look.
Ok sure butIn post 488, Radical Rat wrote:How did CSF get that high?
Lodging a formal objection to this one, I think there's a solid chance she's scum here
Not sure you're interpreting the rules correctly here. This said, not sure I'm interpreting the rules correctly here.In post 573, ejjinami wrote:I don’t think that’s the mechanically correct thing to doIn post 567, Cat Scratch Fever wrote:ohhhh okay then that simplifies things a bit, since we don't have to decide who goes into which group
so we basically pick our top 5 townreads I think
It “feels” like it’s the right thing but frankly, that may be a huge landmine
I’d at least seriously consider choosing people who’d give the most benefits from getting them in a PoE
I’d also consider what the benefits of having the same players on both teams are. Like- the team that remains in the present will surely have to do something as well
Lmao, I feel like if I chose the players I genuinely town-read, no fucking way I'm going to the future
people would be so mad
(and I'm actually not confident enough to do that... only for a few players :/)
tho lmao, happens.
that might be a better thing anyway
Again, having difficulty decoding what people think the setup is, but I basically echo this. I think you want to have generally "towny" people in the team that eventually gets selected because:In post 577, Fidget wrote:I have come to the conclusion that going to the past is probably where you want all of the town you can to go, because otherwise the game doesn't really make sense. Scum need an incentive to do something, and there has to be meaning to picking who goes and who doesn't. If it's a valid playstyle for scum to stay behind that's a bit strange considering it said we want town as leaders.
I don't think you should try to play PoE games with the pools because I am wary of what happens to the people who stay (and maybe the ones who go). But, it's your choice. We have 7 days to pick between the two teams, apparently.
Just got a massive townping from this =PIn post 618, Loki Dokie wrote:If that happens, wonderful but if it doesn’t the two of you will be forced to take another look and re-examine everything.In post 616, ejjinami wrote:[...]
Right this second, I would probably doIn post 621, Cat Scratch Fever wrote:What does your ideal crew look like, Aisa?
Is chill, agree that seems like a good reason to get people's preferred groups outIn post 642, Cat Scratch Fever wrote: Sorry if I made you feel uncomfortable
I think it's good to get people's preferred groups out now in case the group picked fails, we can see who was pushing who
*the scum games I readIn post 851, Aisa wrote:After my quick and dirty investigation of Gamma's meta my confidence in them being town has increased slightly. I emphasiseslightly. They seem more inquisitive in this game than they seemed in the scum games they read. Feel like they are actually trying to solve here.
Essentially this resonates. As far as I remember CSF seemed a bit less committal in the scum game of hers I read, so I still believe she is town. I should double check this tomorrow. And then well, actually doing the harder work of trying to sort RR, Fidget, and AndanteIn post 510, NotAHecticAlt wrote:Csf has a fairly polarized game and IMO she has shown her town game here- and there are takes i dont believe she makes as scum, i.e. they feel too bold for her - in that i dont think we mindmeld the way we have this game if she is mafia.
Sure you can call me scum and say that shes just scum with me but if you can see one of us as town the other should come naturally.
You're assuming there is a point to having two separate teamsIn post 906, PenguinPower wrote:yeah but 3/5 when you knew the other team kinda eliminates the point of having separate teams - though I think I see what ejji was going for since the two that are different I believe are scum reads from the majority of team 2.In post 903, Gamma Emerald wrote:It’s honestly probably smarter to copy some from the other team rather than do a full divide
What I mean is that maybe optimal play / EV is to have the two teams both be as similar as possible (and of course, containing widely townread players)??In post 916, PenguinPower wrote:i mean - there is simply by game design...
The most cleared from the flip are me and Gamma, obvIn post 1096, ejjinami wrote: [...]wdym?In post 1067, Aisa wrote:Nooo Fidget
I've waited 24 hours to say this so it hits a little less hard now, but to any pals from my PT who are reading and Gamma, that CSF flip was an emotional rollercoaster hahaha.
Who’s the most cleared from that
Well I look forward to you sharing that idea with the rest of us mortals then <3In post 1090, Gamma Emerald wrote:based on the fidget kill btw I have a decent idea of who the last scum might be
Conftown status sure, sheeping me is a bad idea, your job is to stop me from doing stupid things, not amplify whatever I say.In post 1071, Enchant wrote: So let's give remainings of Team 2 conftown status and sheep them.
I can't remember if someone's brought this up at some point, sorry if it was. The Roden-Enchant slot is missing here. I wonder what that means...In post 285, NotAHecticAlt wrote:[...]
ejj>andante>CSF>PP(i still townlean the slot)>Aisa>Fidget>Loki>FB>Gamma>Radical Rat>Shoshin(default reading this bottom of the pack)
[...]
How obvious do you think it was that Andante ragequit? I'm not asking to help sort Andante/Johnny, I'm actually trying to understand your thought process here. Like, was the most heated moment right before the end of the day? It also sounds like she got the elim she wanted?In post 1117, Radical Rat wrote:[...]
Now then. Andante's ragequit probably spews that slot Town, as well as townreading her beforehand.
[...]
SameIn post 1114, ejjinami wrote: frankly, i feel like i could use a reread of d1 :/
I mean just look at that cuteness you guys are sooo wholesome if you're scum together, I want it to be true for the memes if nothing else.In post 494, Radical Rat wrote:And this is scum panicking because they're meeting resistance electing their partner ;3cIn post 492, NotAHecticAlt wrote:Btw this is scum who is panicking that a 2 town leadership is about to be established^In post 488, Radical Rat wrote:How did CSF get that high?
Lodging a formal objection to this one, I think there's a solid chance she's scum here
CSF pushed me a little in the PT for posting a lot of mech, kind of makes you wonder whether there were conversations in the scum PT about mech posting which stuck in her mind.In post 656, Radical Rat wrote:To briefly summarize on CSF, there was a Lot of mech spec fluff, which to me felt like it was intended to distract from the process of sorting out Town to elect as Leaders. Like, I get being sucked into mech rabbit holes, I do it all the time as both alignments, but in this case, all the fussing over what a leader may or may not do... It just wasn't relevant to the actual decision. And she wasn't alone in doing so, but it just... Struck me with her in a way that didn't with the others.
Hmm, NAHA also went after the Vivax slot a lot though.In post 1126, Radical Rat wrote:If I need to die to state your collective paranoia so you can move on to Vivax, so be it, but like. Given what seems to have occurred in the past PT, and in the main thread prior to the split, our hypothetical scumteam's strategy would have apparently been to just all bus each other, which.... Isn't really an ideal tactic if you ask me, and certainly hasn't worked out for "us" so far.
Ah yes, MU, that makes sense. (I was just asking because you came across as pretty confident and I was trying to understand where that came from.)In post 1142, Vivax wrote:No I'm not an alt, I go by Vivax wherever I play (✟TL mafia✟, MU).In post 1141, Aisa wrote:[...]
Nah, the PT wasn't accessible at any point Vivax. (Or it was but no-one except ejjinami ever noticed.) Are you an alt by the way?[...]
Regarding the bolded: How do you presume that it wasn't accessible or that only ejjnami noticed it? Seems like a generous assumption to make.
Wait, is that why you pushed Gamma a little? Have you read e.g. my post on why Gamma and I are probably town? Do you agree or disagree?In post 1154, Vivax wrote:[...]
I don't disagree that both scum pushing me should be treated as NAI for my slot, which is the reason I didn't like Emerald pushing the notion.
Currently though I'm warming up to the idea that Johnny could be mafia cause I'm getting the vibes that he's just lurking and trying to sentiment snipe the best wagon for his survival. Calling my posts a flail was a reach, I much prefer Aisas take on that one. I do try to have fun.
I'd also like to add that ejjnami was a lot more active in the PT.
But apparently Enchant floats the notion that there's 2 confirmed town and so far I've liked the slot for town too much to dismiss that. I don't know who he means exactly but judging by the posts I'd guess it's RR and Aisa. Those seem fairly town to me.
Not quite sure what you mean by the bolded, but I think you may be misunderstanding how PTs work again?In post 1165, Vivax wrote:That can be fake-dumbtelled.In post 1163, Radical Rat wrote:Ejj is Town because they took a long time to realize the PT existed. If they were scum, they would have seen it when they went to post in the scum thread.
Also weird that they would notice scum chat in the OP butnot realize that there are PTs in the game.
I was very confused about mechanics as well, I just don't think that's a good reason for a read.
I had that thought too!In post 1161, Gamma Emerald wrote:why is ejji town? I know some people have said he is but tbf I think he could be scum based on some of the false theory CSF was spouting, since it feels like they could have tried to instate scum for both leaders and have the third scum on both teams so each one would have two scum, letting CSF spout that false theory of 1 scum in the coalition to scum's potential benefit in either universe.
Glad we're on the same page about PT access. Powerscum vibes is fair.In post 1174, Vivax wrote:Spoiler: Relevant context
I'd say my confidence is just how I play this game. I'm not necessarily as talkative 'off-paper', and definitely not as pompous.
My town play can be very disruptive at times. I just love chaotic, emotional games and can be quite reckless at provoking that in a game.
Regarding §1 I'd say it's not a slam dunk reason if ejjnami wasn't able to access it. I'd also like to add that I got powerscum vibes off them in the PT and mentioned it there, but that was more feels based.
As for §2 (Gamma), I'll have to think it through because I don't know if 3 scum in a PT killing off everyone else wouldn't be too obvious to spot for the people from the other PT before mafia could secure a victory. Since I'm a sub/replacement I don't really have a good grasp on the alternating phases for now to be able to reconstruct that off the bat.
What would the town tell be, please do tell?
As for the avatar, it just stopped working. Got it from N_M so who knows.
Ok, here we are. Behold me trying to summarise a PT you cannot read and why the things Gamma said felt towny to me.In post 1177, Vivax wrote:Not my town tell, the town tell for GE in the post you linked to me where you dismissed the 3-scum-in-1-PT theory.In post 1175, Aisa wrote:[...]
What's wrong with that?
True - if you flip town, then I do know you're being honest at the very least. I still don't think "setting the stage for Vivax tomorrow" is as good of a deal as you seem to suggest it is. I'm not exactly diving through any of the ISOs of the dead town players right now to necro-sheep them. (That sounds like it could be useful actually, but effort!)In post 1180, Radical Rat wrote:I don't think I'm being apathetic. I do care what happens, and I do want Vivax dead. But we're not in immediate danger, and we can afford a miss as long as it brings us closer to actually winning. If that miss is me, then that means you know I'm being honest at the very least, and sets the stage for Vivax tomorrow.
And sure, Ejj COULD have faked not seeing the PT, as anyone can fake anything. But to me, it seemed real. It didn't look intended to come across as Town, just as a genuine excuse for not having posted.
Of course, I suppose it's also possible that they'd just bookmarked the scum thread and never passed through the PT list, but... That can be worried about if Vivax doesn't end the game
Hmm, ok. I'm not massively sold, but it's possible.In post 1202, Radical Rat wrote:There is one other thing.In post 1199, Aisa wrote:Maybe help me see why Vivax might be scum? So far, I've got:
- you think their entrance today was scummy
- you townread everyone else
- maybe something about NAHA bussing there, I'm not sure if you were talking about that just as a hypothetical
Is there anything I'm missing?
Early on, I defended shoshin from Not Hectic's seemingly random push on them for flaking. I said that flaking is NAI unless they have a history of doing that specifically as scum. I don't remember who, I think it was either you or Fidget, said that they do have a history of doing that. I have not independently confirmed this, because I don't know how to search for games a person was in but never posted, BUT... it would make sense to bus a partner who committed a meta scumtell, especially when that tell is refusal to play the game.
This is what makes it distinct from Not Hectic and I "bussing" each other.
Strictly speaking I don't really share that mindset, but you're a townlean, so *shrug*In post 1208, Enchant wrote:Probably will say something dumb, but which i have on heart.
I literally don't care who to kill, if we can't hit mafia in 4 ppl with 3 bullets, we probably deserve to lose.
=(In post 1211, Gamma Emerald wrote:I’m mega out of it rn
What is one half of NAHA, pray tell? xxIn post 1217, Vivax wrote:One of NAHAs halves each was sent to a timeline. I don’t see a problem here.
Give! Me! The! Rat!