Mini 2274: Terminator: Salvation Game Over!

[Fidget]

HEAL: PenguinPower

Hi!

[Fidget]

HEAL: PenguinPower

Hi!

This is probably not a great idea but thank you!

Aw im certain you would make a fine leader!

In any case I don't see why heals can't be functionally the same as votes for now

humanity... rests on my shoulders? uhhh humanity might be in trouble lol
~~~

uhhh I would like to specifically request that I am not a town leader.. that sounds like a lot of responsibility, and umm yeah, I'm town yes, and I'm sure I'll be a consensus TR soon enough, but also.. I don't think me being a leader ends well for us, even though I have no clue what it does XD

I'm not a fan of the instant heals... like, as soon as someone hits 6 they're a leader, so like yeah. plus post cap situatiion like, ehhh LOVE the gifs though :)

Kind of like how eliminations work yeah? But without the killing the person off and instead as a show of trust. Don't see how votes having meaning means we shouldn't make them

HEAL: Andante

I know she requested not to be one, but I find that those who seek positions of power are often not the sort of people I want in positions of power.

Hmm, but you know what, those who say they don't want power out of the gate might not be doing so because they don't want power...... paranoia...

[Fidget]

I wouldn’t mind nominating myself either just because the leader role sounds goddamn cool XD
but like, if I were to be honest- my read accuracy on MS was never much above rand :/
so yeah…
I recognize that I’m just acting illogical
I don't actually consider myself trustable

Is that what being a leader is about? Being right all of the time? Is that what trustworthiness is?

I don't think so

reverse psychology what?

:shifty:

I'm suspicious.

[Fidget]

NotHectic why do you want control or why do you want Peng to have control?

[Fidget]

Ok but like, why is your first instinct "I wanna self heal!!!!" this really isn't much different from a normal maf game where you find your town core or whatever, I say this, but if that was your first instinct it's probably more likely that you are town, cause I think maf would be more wanting to push each other, since there's 3 of them, like, 2 can push 1 to be healed, and yeah. ok tangent over, uhh not like a hard tr here or anything, but I think it's a good look for NotAHecticAlt

WIFOM, he's either scum doing it because it's too bold for scum or he's just town, either way, cannot say

NotHectic why do you want control or why do you want Peng to have control?

Because i know I am town and i tend to take these kinds of mech things seriously + my top townread is penguin rn so if i cant have it i might as well push a townread in atp.

Meme or serious read on penguin?

NAHA, you seem to be a bit lamisty.

A little bit

[Fidget]

I mean - no one has to decide now?

lol THANK YOU!! everyone's acting like we HAVE to have one in the first 24 hours, like... people chill it'll be ok lol

Who was doing that?

I know it sounds stupid but if I were to select a Town leader right now, I’d make a choice based on personality rather than my early “reads”.

This is the post that got me so upset. Like, seriously? I didn't join this game for it to become "who's personality do I like/hate" or "popularity contest time" just.. yeah no, I'm not commenting on this any further, and just reading all this? almost makes me just not want to play the game anymore, I'm not sure why you ever thought it'd be a good idea to come in here "I'm going off personalities!!!" I highly doubt I'm alone in feeling this way...

Doesn't seem terribly out of the usual to me. Sometimes when there's a Day 0 with special mechanics, some don't take a reading strategy and might instead give the spotlight to someone who might be particularly illuminating

I don't really agree with that idea but I don't equivocate it with a popularity contest, I'm not sure ejin was referring to voting according to who they like/dislike.

In any case I don't see why heals can't be functionally the same as votes for now

well, if someone hits 6 heals, they're leader... so like.. yeah

Kind of like when someone hits majority and gets chopped? Votes have to mean something for them to... mean something

[Fidget]

Hmm, but you know what, those who say they don't want power out of the gate might not be doing so because they don't want power...... paranoia...

hahaha woah what?? what an idea XD yeah see, cause it's mountainous, it's gonna have to be something that'll be reads related for our leaders, me and reads... my reads are eith decent or super off, so I read the leader thing and went "I really shouldn't be leader..." cause I know I'm gonna be a universal TR pretty quickly here, like, I almost always am one... as I'm catching up, I'm realizing I know no one here, or like, how yall play, I might know of some of yall sure, but I really don't know how anyone here plays, so I guess that's a good thing for my reads? which would mean, leader!me wouldn't be as bad as I initially thought, but ehhh I'm not campaigning for it lol I will push my TRs though!! They can make decisions!

What about "The town benefits from town being leader" does universal townread not jive with? I suppose I just am a little lost as to why you think not campaigning for leader is a losing strategy for scum, especially scum that tends to obvious town.

HEAL: Andante

This sounds like town!Andante to me.

are they always so dramatic?

Yes.

I also think they're also misconstruing you to at least some extent. Intentionally or not

andante would totally be the person scum me would be trying to make leader here btw.

thank you

frankly, the intentions behind this post are probably townie
it would be insanely easy for scum to nominate an emotional, tunneled townie and chill with the following yeets

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... #p12749463

Before you continue your discredit on Andante’s ability to scumhunt, I suggest you click on this link.

Are you saying that because Andante had a good town game, they cannot be pocketed or have wrong reads? That's what this post reads to me.

[Fidget]

I feel emotionally burned out despite having done literally nothing lol

Mafia

Agree with FB that Andante might be someone scum votes up early (I am not saying that I disagree with Andante as leader, I don't see any issue, but FB saying that he would probably try to WK and maybe take advantage of a tunnel is definitely something i see scum pouncing on. Plus, Andante's so likable i dont think anyone would mind.)

so in essence: choose a pool of players we'd want to kill if we had to do a vote and ranked before the next stage, that way we don't fuck ourselves over.
i myself am pro killing in ejj/loki/FB or a low/non poster

we can use hurt tags to vote on that

HURT: ejj
HURT: loki
HURT: Firebringer

Don't you think this is overkill at this stage? Why're you so eager this game, Not Not NotHectic?

[Fidget]

First off, I really really really hate the post cap thingie.

I would not have joined without the post cap restriction, to be honest. Games felt like battles of endurance as opposed to investigations

[Fidget]

oh lmao i just realized i kinda did overhype the penguin townread and internally made it stronger than it should be

regardless im fine with my heal there as i think the controversy around it spews penguin town :3

I'm so confused where it even originated on page 1

HEAL: Aisa

[Fidget]

And I definitely don’t want NAHA as leader because I don’t trust their reads whatever they are in this game.

You don't trust someone's reads before flips have happened? That's rather confident of you

[Fidget]

In fact you are saying you don't trust Not Not Not Not Hectic's reads before flips have happened and largely before he even made most of them.

I don't think that's terribly sound reasoning to push a read further. I am not trying to nag, but you are going to have a very made-up mind before the fun really even starts at this rate.

[Fidget]

but the role pm says we have our voice and vote, but glaringly missing from it is that there's nothing about voting out players from the game, which makes me think the leaders probably have control over the lims. So yeah, I strongly suspect read accuracy will matter.

That is never going to happen and if it does i hope they get 186 as well

oh lmao i just realized i kinda did overhype the penguin townread and internally made it stronger than it should be

regardless im fine with my heal there as i think the controversy around it spews penguin town :3

I'm so confused where it even originated on page 1

HEAL: Aisa

And I definitely don’t want NAHA as leader because I don’t trust their reads whatever they are in this game.

You don't trust someone's reads before flips have happened? That's rather confident of you

These two posts juxtaposed are weird

Because I'm critiquing both Loki and Not Hectic, presumably, and the Loki read is about NotHectic.

I think bad reasoning knows no alignment. Even if I'm having questions towards someone's motives, I'm not going to turn a blind eye to arguments being presented against them.

Or, perhaps, I'm mistaken about what you're getting at

[Fidget]

Because I'm critiquing both Loki and Not Hectic, presumably, and the Loki read is about NotHectic.

I think bad reasoning knows no alignment. Even if I'm having questions towards someone's motives, I'm not going to turn a blind eye to arguments being presented against them.

Or, perhaps, I'm mistaken about what you're getting at

Yeah

Or more specifically

NotHectic has a read that you don't understand

Loki also thinks NotHectic's reads are hard to understand

Hmm, I probably interpreted Loki as being harsher to Not Hectic than they really were being. I think I took their post as "I don't understand your reads, therefore, your reads are wrong" -- which is a weird thing to say on page five. But I think it's more likely I was reading into something that wasn't there.

I thought N-Hect's entrance was overdoing it and sort of (as Loki put it) LAMISTy. I did not really dig much of anything Loki was suspecting about N-Hect afterwards, though, and I was getting second thoughts about N-Hect from some thing or another which made me more critical of those Loki posts I didn't really like.

Hmmm, don't really have anything else on that.

Do you like scum

@Andante

?

[Fidget]

which posts are lamisty

Probably your page 1-2 felt weird to me. But it got better

Spoiler: These were all made in the first ~50 posts

HEAL: NotAHecticAlt

RR, what are you addressing?

oh rofl i just read the rules and you cant self heal lame

HEAL: PenguinPower

I'd also like myself to be healed as I tend to thrive with control over stuff in games like this.

because i felt they had the towniest entrance

also theyre a mod so clearly theyre already well suited in positions of power

moreso the frivolous attitude towards choosing a leader feels agendaless

NotHectic why do you want control or why do you want Peng to have control?

Because i know I am town and i tend to take these kinds of mech things seriously + my top townread is penguin rn so if i cant have it i might as well push a townread in atp.

I felt like your Peng read was a weird cross up of a joke and serious, yet at the same time Peng basically hadn't played yet. When I asked you why you were so eager to push control for yourself or Peng, you said that it was because Peng was your top townread and you "take the mech seriously".

I also was somewhat lukewarm on the campaigning. You seem like a player who wants to position themself both power-wise as well as wants to be proactive as early as possible since you're already fully trying to solve and get your way on page 1-2.

Of course, the impression of you I'm getting is not exclusive to a terminator mindset.

[Fidget]

Aisa Eiji Loki Gamma all feel town so far

FB seems like he's kinda just posturing

Why Gamma? Good impression of FB. My main impression thus far was him talking about what he would do as scum in this game.

we can use hurt tags to vote on that

HURT: ejj
HURT: loki
HURT: Firebringer

Oh and what’s weird about Gamma’s and CFS’ entrances?

And still trying to decide if you’re town and your ability to read me hasn’t improved since Anything uPick or you’re scum tunneling me similarly to what you did in Witch Hunt.

I’m really not impressed by the threat in the last lines. It feels like there’s enmity towards Hectic, yet the main message sent was “stop scum-reading me or I’ll scum-read you”
intentional or not, it feels manipulative

I echo this. That is not a productive line of questioning.

im not even trying to be townread ..? im trying to be leader, yes, but im overall trying to hardsolve the game d1 because im like always n1d as town nowadays

I… actually kinda buy this

ok ill spill why i want to be leader so bad - because i believe that leader gets nightkill immunity likely and id like that for myself.

Lmao why would you not want to get night-killed
Frankly, if I were to give it to someone, I’d choose someone whom I either trust 100% to protect them or whose decisions I trust… so that changes literally nothing :/
that post feels townie tho

btw, I doubt that. This is only a 13p game. Having 2 people with some sort of decisive power AND night-kill immunity for both of them seems like overkill
Could break the game in many scenarios

What do you mean that you buy they are not "trying" to be townread?

Second quote by Not Not Not Not Hectic is hard to believe. So, you're saying that you have a theory that for some reason leaders get nightkill immunity, and BECAUSE of that, you've decided to campaign for yourself really hard, BECAUSE you expect to blow scums sock's off so quickly so they'll have to kill u n1?

I'm not sure how to interpret that.

[Fidget]

like im doing a pretty shit job of getting townread by putting myself out there in a way that gives me negative attention and all lmao

Okay, come now.

Fidget may consider FM an obligation. Till now they seemed to have been responding to posts mechanically- more out of a sense of duty (because they joined the game and consider it necessary to be serious), not because they consider anything they talked about interesting.
Frankly, that just instinctively makes me wary. It’s near impossible to determine whether the feeling of “hAvInG tO be productive” comes from personality or being scum (they question players because they hAvE tO act townie and actually don’t give a crap about anything they say).
Anyway, the feeling that they’re not personally attached to what they’re talking about makes me wary. I’m struggling to see fidget’s personality through their posts besides that.

Hm.

I'm not sure what you mean when you say I respond to posts mechanically, or when you say that I don't consider what I talk about interesting. I respond exclusively to posts that interest me.

You are correct that I am attempting to conceal my personality. I think you're definitely picking up on some bits of truth.

[Fidget]

Ejj feels like the Town version of The Alt (not) Formerly Known As Hectic.

Like, they're similarly hyperposting, both coming off as somewhat arrogant, and tinged with LAMIST.... But for reasons I can't quite articulate, Ejj's posting seems genuine, while citceH's doesn't.

Hahahahaha. I love it.

Not Not Not Not Not........ 's posting brushes my fur the wrong way. Problem is, it usually does.

im not even trying to be townread ..? im trying to be leader, yes, but im overall trying to hardsolve the game d1 because im like always n1d as town nowadays

I… actually kinda buy this

What do you mean that you buy they are not "trying" to be townread?

that's what I'm getting from my observation. Hectic seems to be responding instinctively to most posts. Although the energy feels intentional, I feel no agenda behind it- they're just doing it on a whim- which matches what Hectic said about "trying to act like a leader, which is different from trying to act townie"

Basically -

regardless of hectic's alignment I believe that they believe that what they're currently doing is pro-town

if that makes sense

Hmmm, I think you're absolutely correct about the bolded. It just doesn't help me much.

You are correct that I am attempting to conceal my personality.

why tho

it'll only make it harder for people to read you

I'm well aware. I'm a fairly transparent book if I start letting anyone peek. I can't really offer much more explanation.

But make no mistake, I'm not disengaged, as you seem to have gotten the impression. Maybe I don't have a lot of answers, but we haven't been given kill pressure yet, and it's a sort of pregame limbo.

[Fidget]

HURT: Penguin
HEAL: ejj

That’s a 180 degree switch up? Especially on Penguin.

Yeah. Did Penguin even say anything since then? I don't think so.

Provocative just cause, or provocative to seem more complicated and solvey than they really are? My suspension of disbelief just grows greater and greater each time I read a post by N-H. They're just throwing things at the wall now.

oh roden/fidget prob town i forgot lmao

the people not really posting are "prob town" ?? what kind of logic is that...

Aren't you blatantly putting words in N-Hec's mouth here?

does anyone have any issue with a pairing of Penguin - Andante for team leaders btw?

yeah, Penguin isn't really talking...

Lol. Pretty much.

it does
they're not acting pro-scum so just don't scum-read them
if the behavior changes, change the read
whatever, D1 reads rarely last forever anyway

No, I agree with you that N-Hec thinks that they're acting pro-town. As scum or town. I meant it more as, they're convinced that what they're doing either A.) should be townread or B.) helps the town

Now, I have to suspend my disbelief super hard to get how they think preventing a nightkill on themself (And nominating Peng as leader / 180ing with no followup ) and etc are the most pro-town things that can be done.

[Fidget]

Now, I have to suspend my disbelief super hard to get how they think preventing a nightkill on themself (And nominating Peng as leader / 180ing with no followup ) and etc are the most pro-town things that can be done.

you don’t “have to” :) you’ll just be read for what you post

reading hyperactive townies based on “logic” has never worked for me well
it’s easy to find pure nonsense
bleh, I was supposed to go to sleep

tbh I’m sort of interested in why you’re reading into that but that's maybe for tomorrow

Still waiting on someone to tell me where i said i scumread penguin

you don't scum-read penguin
you corrected that already

I'm not sure what you meant by the first line. Your second point is fair enough to an extent, the sample size is larger, sure.

It is logical to me?
1. preventing a nightkill on yourself is pro-town if you're an above-average town player. Not Hectic clearly think they are an above-average town player.
2. Not Hectic supported Peng as leader on pages 1-3, IIRC. Given the amount of information available at the time, I think that made sense. They then decided to support someone else as more information became available. That also makes complete sense IMO. I believe they used the hurt tag on Penguin as a means of unvoting, not of expressing suspicion of Penguin, if that's what you're referring to.
3. If by "180ing" you mean the change of heart on ejj, there has been a sort-of follow up:

1. That's not my argument. I am saying campaigning for leader just because of the off-chance it might give nightkill immunity makes no sense.
2. That's not my argument. N-Hectic went from "Peng should be leader" to suspecting Peng, without any content from Peng happening. I am saying I find that performative nonsense either for reaction tests or to seem more genuine.
3. No, Penguin. It just seems like nonsense.

[Fidget]

HEAL: Ejj

[Fidget]

PP(i still townlean the slot)

???????

Did you not express a reversal on Penguin?

oh rofl

i used hurt tags to remove my leader vote on penguin. so i was right that you put words in my mouth.

Where did I say I scumread penguin?

Sigh, I don't know where I got that impression from then.

[Fidget]

Disregard.. sigh. Just a lot of wasted time. Apologies

[Fidget]

so in essence: choose a pool of players we'd want to kill if we had to do a vote and ranked before the next stage, that way we don't fuck ourselves over.
i myself am pro killing in ejj/loki/FB or a low/non poster

we can use hurt tags to vote on that

HURT: ejj
HURT: loki
HURT: Firebringer

Oh. That would explain why that was confusing. You're a difficult player to keep up with, you know.

I'm somewhat suspicious of Radical Rat. Maybe I'm just jealous of their ability to get a grasp on the game so quickly like in 188. Their first five or so posts are jokes or mech too, so they hadn't rlly engaged with too many of their reads, rather observing. I'm not sure though.

I townlean, probably Gamma actually. There was a sequence I liked early game and I think them owning they don't have reads is a good look. Maybe Cat Scratch but i havent really seen enough of her yet.

I believe in ejjinami being town

[Fidget]

I forgot to include this lol it seems cerebral

Spoiler: i like this read

I'm thinkin Aisa is town

she seems to be showing similar practice to me in her read formation, in a way that make me feel like she's town
I tend to also form reads pretty spontaneously as town, and the justification can be rather slim

[Fidget]

Whistle innocently

[Fidget]

Let's hope not. They're stacked.

[Fidget]

is that even a phrase like that? I meant as in, they're especially powerful and overqualified

starting to think i made that up while playing league and thought it was actual english (some characters stack power and get stronger indefinitely). Truly.. disturbing

pedit Do you like any leader vote?

[Fidget]

Oh I healed Aisa on a whim because i thought she was sort of towny and I was having trouble parsing the entire length of her posts. Or something as similarly shallow. I guess that doesn't make me exempt from judgement though.

I'm not sure the heals are going to mean much although fwiw I do sort of agree about RR even if it's somewhat coincidentally.

Now that I'm thinking about Aisa. I like their posts for how reasonable they are. I appreciate them taking the time to explain why what I was saying was wrong (even if I disagree partly). They're a mediator already multiple times I can see, it's very pro town, very conducive to getting to where we need.

pedit: God damn it FB

[Fidget]

I think your votes N-Hect and Loki are both probably town although im not sure I want that combination.

I'm going to share my new bright idea: N-Hectic isn't that towny early, but a lot of players I don't read kindly auto townread N-Hect so therefore gamestate, blablablabla n-Hectic is town. Plus, the game is less of a headache that way

I don't have any reasoning to think Loki is town. But I felt Loki was town earlier though. Skimming, it's like every post of Loki's is about that N-Hect confusion. Oh but I very much echo his take that N-Hect wasn't screaming town, I kinda like this in hindsight:

Yeah, I really don’t understand what he’s done that screams town to anyone? I don’t currently sr him but I don’t think he’s done anything at all ai so far.

Pretty sure that's the post I was skeptical of earlier but aside from the bit about not trusting their reads, I kinda see where Loki is coming from.

I dunno. Loki definitely had the same misinterpretation of Not Hectic's peng read as I did, for whatever that is worth. Doesn't really matter that much now.

don't worry fidget i don't suspect u at all. u are outside my radar of scum suspicion.

concealing sweat towel

ha, naturally

[Fidget]

GTH Gamma/Aisa/N-Hect/EJJ/Loki are at the top for me. IDK if Aisa and Gamma are as strong of reads.

Probably put at least the most of that into words by now. I suspect RR and Shoshin currently as fairly boring as that take is. There's like Cat Scratch, Pengu, FB, Roden who're all still wildcards. I didn't mention Andante.

Andante... I just have this mythical impression of I suppose. Bits and fragments I've heard here and there but I don't really know what she plays like. I don't know how to interpret her opening refusal of leader for say, or whether her posting style varies between alignments, I guess. It's one I'd probably be drawn towards townreading because it comes off very genuine off of the cuff.

[Fidget]

The game state is worrying me a bit.
I don’t exactly feel any agenda in the people voting and besides firebringer (who’s healing vanity wagons and literally can’t be pushing an agenda) and Loki (who’s talking about it)- people seem to be just chill with whatever happens :/
The first conclusion my brain wants to make is that scum either gave up and there’s no difference between the alignment of those who’re currently the top heals (me, andante, aisa)??? tho frankly, I had to convince myself that it makes sense before seriously writing it down
The same thing happened early on when everyone simultaneously agreed that cat scratch and roden are good candidates

I worry you might be reading too deeply into this phase. There's no guarantee that scum is really going to vie for this leadership thing, and if they do, they might've done it as town too.

I do not feel this can be read as deeply into as a clear cut vote to chop would.

Meh that's good enough for now, I'm like getting sick IRL, it's great, but yeah I had a partner read I don't remember who, it was fidget and someone... ahhh should've just written it down. whelp yeah.

HEAL: Radical Rat
HEAL: ejjinami

I think those 2 are good to heal though

What? What has Radical Rat done so far this game that's really pushed the game forward and made them town enough for one of your two heals?

Good question.

I am superbly lost this game
HEAL: no one
I still have certain mech thoughts but reads-wise I feel like I am behind

This rings town because same tbh

Yeah exactly.

I'm going to also say that the people shading shoshin are slightly more suspicious than they were before doing that.

They literally have not posted whatsoever. That's just a flake to me, and probably not AI unless they have a history of doing this as scum.

They do.

I mean, 188 was pretty good, Rat seems towny, thinking logically, I have no issue with rat and ejj being the leaders

Hmmm

They literally haven’t posted anywhere on site since June 12th.

Oh, kk then.

I changed my mind I want to strictly be leader again.

Anyone who opposes it i want detailed reasons because I can actually do well in setups like this with unknown mechs.

You always take a break from trying to take the driver's seat every time. You sound like a tape recorder stuck on repeat.

[Fidget]

You

could*

always take a break from trying to take the driver's seat every time. You sound like a tape recorder stuck on repeat.

[Fidget]

Spoiler: ejj

fidget’s read on rat - 294 - self-reminder nr 2. Later.


I feel good about rat. They’re deliberately choosing what to talk about (they only seem to talk about something if they consider it important) and the things they did consider important so far are purely pro-town.

Also, I thought the post cap being 150 per phase was high enough as to be largely inconsequential, but at the rate some of you are going... Yikes.

I stand by my Andante heal for now, she's overthinking things a bit, but looks plenty Town to me. Firebringer's point that he'd be electing her as scum is valid, but if scum wants to help elect a Townie as leader, I'm sure not gonna be the one to stop them.

I think Hectic is probably Town. Which is to say that the alt that ISN'T Hectic must not be. Really, just not a fan of all the grandstanding, feels like a spicy mix of LAMIST and Too Scummy To Be Scum, so they're off my list of viable leaders.

Firebringer I think is genuinely Town here, though largely gut at this point. Wouldn't want him as leader though, because while I do enjoy a good shitpost every now and then... I'd rather someone more reliable take the reins.

Ejj I could go either way on. Leaning Town for now.

Everyone else.... No terribly strong opinions on. Mildly sus of Penguin, but that's just like. A vague feeling, less than even gut.

They had the courage to go against the flow (SR on hectic; TR on FB – considered those reads important); yet they mention them only “by chance” and use their energy&vote to heal (probably) town leaders (me, andante)

Ejj feels like the Town version of The Alt (not) Formerly Known As Hectic.

Like, they're similarly hyperposting, both coming off as somewhat arrogant, and tinged with LAMIST.... But for reasons I can't quite articulate, Ejj's posting seems genuine, while citceH's doesn't.

Intent to hammer Ejj if there are no major objections

I'm going to also say that the people shading shoshin are slightly more suspicious than they were before doing that.

They literally have not posted whatsoever. That's just a flake to me, and probably not AI unless they have a history of doing this as scum.

focusing on pro-town stuff.
Ignoring players who COULD be healed, there are arguments for picking them, and may possibly be scum (fidget, aisa, loki, hectic)

This feels like a townie mindset
Or at the very least – unless they are precisely scum with andante- they are town-siding right now, showing no interest in talking about others despite having the guts to do so

How is scumreading N-Hect going against the flow? They're floating more to the town side right now, but a lot of their posting still leads nowhere, cause, hyperposting. I had the impression that N-Hect was more of a controversial type read than consensus town

RR comes off as not having takes in most of their posts, although when prompted by N-Hectic, they did give a sizable response, yeah. I guess we just disagree on the vibes it gives us. I also didn't really care for the town leader posts the same way you do. I'm not sure how to explain how I'm seeing a fairly withdrawn playstyle whereas you see towny. Let me check what I was saying the other night though

I'm somewhat suspicious of Radical Rat. Maybe I'm just jealous of their ability to get a grasp on the game so quickly like in 188. Their first five or so posts are jokes or mech too, so they hadn't rlly engaged with too many of their reads, rather observing. I'm not sure though.

Spoiler: start of RR ISO

HEAL: Andante

I know she requested not to be one, but I find that those who seek positions of power are often not the sort of people I want in positions of power.

Are there events for every day phase?
HEAL: Roden
HEAL: Cat Scratch Fever
First one is just cuz, second one is because I feel like the question about what Leader does is a genuine town ask

Anyway, looks like this is the chance to put some demons to rest more directly.

I think it's best we take this one leader at a time for now. Gives us time for more AI content to be generated from the first election that can be used to inform the second.

Why are we voting heals based only off a few posts? I like the reasoning behind the heals but the game just literally started.

We only have four days to make two votes. Things need to get moving quickly if we don't want it to default to plurality (and we do not want that)

I think the leader gets to go back in time and kill Pooky before he hosts this game

It's logical, but it's the kind of logical I see as safe and something I fall back on when I don't have much else to say.

RR has an impressive amount for someone this withdrawn and who doesn't "really have thoughts"

Also, I thought the post cap being 150 per phase was high enough as to be largely inconsequential, but at the rate some of you are going... Yikes.

I stand by my Andante heal for now, she's overthinking things a bit, but looks plenty Town to me. Firebringer's point that he'd be electing her as scum is valid, but if scum wants to help elect a Townie as leader, I'm sure not gonna be the one to stop them.

I think Hectic is probably Town. Which is to say that the alt that ISN'T Hectic must not be. Really, just not a fan of all the grandstanding, feels like a spicy mix of LAMIST and Too Scummy To Be Scum, so they're off my list of viable leaders.

Firebringer I think is genuinely Town here, though largely gut at this point. Wouldn't want him as leader though, because while I do enjoy a good shitpost every now and then... I'd rather someone more reliable take the reins.

Ejj I could go either way on. Leaning Town for now.

Everyone else.... No terribly strong opinions on. Mildly sus of Penguin, but that's just like. A vague feeling, less than even gut.

That's why I say I'm not sure whether to believe RR has had this many feelings at that point, or if they're stretching a bit.

EJJ, I kind of don't really feel like you responded to me so much as said.... well.. that RR is playing protown and you think they're townie. I've bolded what I mean below:

Spoiler: EJJ quote

fidget’s read on rat - 294 - self-reminder nr 2. Later.

I feel good about rat.

They’re deliberately choosing what to talk about (they only seem to talk about something if they consider it important) and the things they did consider important so far

are purely pro-town.

Also, I thought the post cap being 150 per phase was high enough as to be largely inconsequential, but at the rate some of you are going... Yikes.

I stand by my Andante heal for now, she's overthinking things a bit, but looks plenty Town to me. Firebringer's point that he'd be electing her as scum is valid, but if scum wants to help elect a Townie as leader, I'm sure not gonna be the one to stop them.

I think Hectic is probably Town. Which is to say that the alt that ISN'T Hectic must not be. Really, just not a fan of all the grandstanding, feels like a spicy mix of LAMIST and Too Scummy To Be Scum, so they're off my list of viable leaders.

Firebringer I think is genuinely Town here, though largely gut at this point. Wouldn't want him as leader though, because while I do enjoy a good shitpost every now and then... I'd rather someone more reliable take the reins.

Ejj I could go either way on. Leaning Town for now.

Everyone else.... No terribly strong opinions on. Mildly sus of Penguin, but that's just like. A vague feeling, less than even gut.

They had the courage to go against the flow (SR on hectic; TR on FB – considered those reads important); yet they mention them only “by chance” and use their energy&vote to heal (probably) town leaders (me, andante)

Ejj feels like the Town version of The Alt (not) Formerly Known As Hectic.

Like, they're similarly hyperposting, both coming off as somewhat arrogant, and tinged with LAMIST.... But for reasons I can't quite articulate, Ejj's posting seems genuine, while citceH's doesn't.

Intent to hammer Ejj if there are no major objections

I'm going to also say that the people shading shoshin are slightly more suspicious than they were before doing that.

They literally have not posted whatsoever. That's just a flake to me, and probably not AI unless they have a history of doing this as scum.

focusing on pro-town stuff.

Ignoring players who COULD be healed, there are arguments for picking them, and may possibly be scum (fidget, aisa, loki, hectic)

This feels like a townie mindset

Or at the very least – unless they are precisely scum with andante-

they are town-siding right now,

showing no interest in talking about others despite having the guts to do so

That's why I think we probably just disagree about the way it struck us, and I'm not sure there's too much else to investigate... we're not even really close

The one point you made though, I disagree with -- I don't think RR scumreading Hectic was particularly against the grain.

[Fidget]

TLDR: based on the threadstate:
no one supporting hectic (despite there being a lot of noise and people town-reading them) might make them town
People being so happy to jump onto Fidget’s heal-wagon with no explanation, just because… frankly speaking isn’t enough to make them scum. It’s just enough to make me wary
I said it before, I’m seriously against it
if anyone wants to talk about it, please do tho

I'm getting to the point where I'll probably just end up healing andante for safety regardless of what I said at the beginning of the game :/

Who is healing me? I'm pretty sure Loki is, I didn't notice others. Unless I'm being obtuse, I don't get why you reference worry towards people voting me so much.

I suppose you believe in your personality based read earlier -- or is it something else I did perhaps? I don't really mind either way, I'm just curious

[Fidget]

I am that low because if you’re scum here you need me dead. And you putting no poster in your PoE who hasn’t posted ANYWHERE on site is EXACTLY what you did to me in Witch Hunt.

not sure if you realize it, you’re both getting into an ego-fight.

Loki being this ignorant and not tmi-ing me town is town indicative

mm

Yes, you're pretty much right.

I also worry about Loki and Not Not Not Not Not..............'s post count limit too. They're having a mafia moment right now I guess.

If you're around I'd be interesting in discussing why you think it necessary to heal Andante specifically (despite what you said at beginning of the game).

[Fidget]

and frankly, I’m sorry if it’s just me reading into wrong things- I don’t trust fidget. I seriously don’t think anyone has provided any good reason for them being town . I mean, I admit that my reason for being wary of her might be pretty dumb as well but I really don’t like how seriously people want to heal there “just because” and are ok with doing it without really any progression being there.

Fidget [1]:

Loki Dokie

[Fidget]

She’s responding to everything equally. Shows no selection for posts – which implies that she’s power-posting out of a feeling of obligation
That alone makes me seriously against town-reading her for being “chill” and “helpful”
It feels like personality at best and scummy at worst (talking about everything equally and wallposting could be a sign that she’s just doing it because she thinks that’s the townie thing to do)

This is just not something I understand. What does it mean to select posts "equally"? I respond to what interests me, not a predefined number of posts from each player.

How is scumreading N-Hect going against the flow?

let me redefine “going against the flow”
Along with their takes on FB and PP- to me this was an indicator that they were willing to take initiative and create their own pushes
Notice how few people were talking about that trio – Making reads on people no one is interested in – is imo a sign of initiative and a sign of going against the flow
Considering the fact that they ONLY pushed strong town the entire phase and were just simply ignoring all opportunities to push less safe heals – I think it’s townie

RR comes off as not having takes in most of their posts,

that’s cat scratch to me
RR made reads on people no one was interested in – imo- that’s genuine thought
Cat scratch talked about those everyone was interested in (myself/andante (if I remember correctly))
while their only scum-read was a low-poster (rat) – imo – that sounds like the lack of individual thinking

That's why I think we probably just disagree about the way it struck us, and I'm not sure there's too much else to investigate... we're not even really close

fair

Nyeh. Don't really see it the same way at all. But that's okay, I think we're going places now.

Also, I thought the post cap being 150 per phase was high enough as to be largely inconsequential, but at the rate some of you are going... Yikes.

I stand by my Andante heal for now, she's overthinking things a bit, but looks plenty Town to me. Firebringer's point that he'd be electing her as scum is valid, but if scum wants to help elect a Townie as leader, I'm sure not gonna be the one to stop them.

I think Hectic is probably Town. Which is to say that the alt that ISN'T Hectic must not be. Really, just not a fan of all the grandstanding, feels like a spicy mix of LAMIST and Too Scummy To Be Scum, so they're off my list of viable leaders.

Firebringer I think is genuinely Town here, though largely gut at this point. Wouldn't want him as leader though, because while I do enjoy a good shitpost every now and then... I'd rather someone more reliable take the reins.

Ejj I could go either way on. Leaning Town for now.

Everyone else.... No terribly strong opinions on. Mildly sus of Penguin, but that's just like. A vague feeling, less than even gut.

Ejj feels like the Town version of The Alt (not) Formerly Known As Hectic.

Like, they're similarly hyperposting, both coming off as somewhat arrogant, and tinged with LAMIST.... But for reasons I can't quite articulate, Ejj's posting seems genuine, while citceH's doesn't.

I think rat has gotten easy trs for not doing much, and that makes me wary.

They aren’t going very much against the grain, so I’m just kind of confused where these TRs are coming from

Like Andante was townreading them for that reads list and for “doing stuff” which is like a weird way to characterize their play

Yeah, I see it like this. Who can say.

Spoiler: long ejj post

Who is healing me? I'm pretty sure Loki is, I didn't notice others. Unless I'm being obtuse, I don't get why you reference worry towards people voting me so much.

I suppose you believe in your personality based read earlier -- or is it something else I did perhaps? I don't really mind either way, I'm just curious

Aisa did seriously suggest it
and loki followed
sorry, you’re right. I exacerbated
The fact that I don’t understand those reads and that they’re strong, freaked me out… Ignore it, it wasn’t logical

I mean, it’s not really like I had a strong read. honestly, at this moment I’m not even that interested in determining if my gut-feeling makes sense or not. Dunno how visible it is, I’m tired af
as unfair as it is, I’m just being stubborn because I was unable to find town-tells for you even when rested and I don’t remember anyone writing anything meaningful about you either

If you're around I'd be interesting in discussing why you think it necessary to heal Andante specifically (despite what you said at beginning of the game).

if you want an absolutely honest answer, my actions right now aren’t logical.
I’m tired after a day of work and feel myself getting paranoid over the people I haven’t heard anything townie from recently
Just based on my emotions rn- I’d rather heal hectic rather than aisa (despite my previous reads being exactly opposite).
This is not logical. I didn’t logically reconsider aisa’s alignment.
I feel like I’m also partially rejecting the idea of your heal so strongly just because in this state, my brain wants to get emotionally attached to some sort of idea and just stick to it.
(that’s also what you saw when I misremembered how many people voted you)
sorry for that, I’m partially fighting against it. I’m being vocal but won’t make any serious decisions in this mindset

my idea of healing andante isn’t logical either. I’m uncertain in any read I don’t “feel” at this very moment and that’s making me nervous. Talking about healing andante is a way for me to run away from the pressure of having to make a serious decision of who the other leader will be… like, frankly I’m just sheeping loki lol

but like, yeah. I’ll try to reconsider after seriously resting and looking at stuff without the emotional bias

To summarize: I am aware that my thoughts right now aren’t logical. Although they are very real to me right now, I’m not treating them seriously. In this very moment, I’d appreciate it if you just treated me as a clown or trigger for thoughts
or just anything that progresses the game but shouldn’t be taken too seriously
All of this may easily change once I rest up and think about it seriously later

Mafia's not always logical. I think the reason i was asking that question was just to see what exactly was the cause for the worry behind people voting me, as well as why the Andante vote was such a big deal.

Well, you've laid your thought process out in abundance, so thank you.

[Fidget]

im curious if nothectic,andante, aisa, fidget, cat scratch fever and radical rat still have second vote powers to nom two people or not since eji won already. My assumption is no but nowhere does it say you can't.

Pretty sure we can. Just can't find a good counterwagon to N-Hectic that i townread at least as much as N-Hectic

[Fidget]

anyways toog, any reason ur voting to just heal RR and not also gamma if u townread both or just feel like voting one person for leader now.

Also hi Figet how r u doing

Hi firefloofer im doing pretty, good kind of baked, it's been a fairly good day. How do u how do

theres actually a few good reasons to vote nothectic.
1) increases likelihood nothectic is night killed
2) see 1

Hmmm I hadn't considered this angle.

[Fidget]

O_O
@andante I kinda wanna ask why you feel like NAHA is “pointlessly spamming”
All that seems to be accomplishing rn is burning post limit if NAHA is scum?

And burning post limit as town is fine? I'm not sure what you're getting at.

Also, that's like saying scum can't play suboptimally.

@fidget are omnibus quote walls a thing you do a lot generally?

From time to time. Even moreso with the post limit, though. I try to keep various sections of thought condense if I can.

Shall i hammer/E-1 N-Hect because impatience or should i instead remain stubborn on the matter

Nevermind I see your vote Gamma

HEAL: CSF

[Fidget]

Are the people sent back to the past at jeopardy, or are the ones who stay behind at jeopardy?

I figure that they try to eliminate the terminators by making it so they never exist. If a terminator goes, something catastrophic happens. Do we lose the people in the time machine or the people in the present, I wonder though?

I could see either way -- the people in the time machine return to find the present oblierated. That, or the instant the people in the time machine leave, the people who are left behind instantly go to the new present. Time is like that I guess.

I do not have a terribly great inkling who the terminators are. I am nearly certain to include at least one. Unfortunate.

We only have one day though. I like.. EJJ, Aisa, NAHA, Loki. I suppose.

pedit: I townlean Gamma although I recalled that he can play laid back as hell as scum too. I am kinda wary of Andante, Andante is easily town but I don't want to say I think they are because I have no idea.

[Fidget]

Interesting we have 7 days to deliberate the teams but basically a split second to choose. I have classwork right now, I'll see you again.

EJJ bleeds town to me. Aisa is not as strong, I think she's an excellent mediator and plays protown but technically could be passive scum since, nothing in the game has really forced scum to do much of anything yet. NAHA is probably town and the same goes for Loki. It's just kind of the best I got.

I like Gamma's posting but I specifically recall a theme game, maybe AI UPick, where he afked as scum and got crazy townread. I too remember games where he actively tries his hardest at scum. Not sure. I overall identify more with his lost impression of the early game though.

[Fidget]

I have come to the conclusion that going to the past is probably where you want all of the town you can to go, because otherwise the game doesn't really make sense. Scum need an incentive to do something, and there has to be meaning to picking who goes and who doesn't. If it's a valid playstyle for scum to stay behind that's a bit strange considering it said we want town as leaders.

I don't think you should try to play PoE games with the pools because I am wary of what happens to the people who stay (and maybe the ones who go). But, it's your choice. We have 7 days to pick between the two teams, apparently.

pedit:

Sort of. Loki seemed genuinely locked in an ego battle with N-Hect, Aisa comes off as a pure being to me.... Loki I'm kinda still figuring out but they play a very distinct town game.

Lemme dig deeper just for you. Yeah it's their relationship with N-Hect, I think they're genuinely interested in the sort of... back and forth they're doing where they townread/scumread/townread/scumread back and forth according to various previous game performances. Loki bogged down like half their ISO with that, idk if it irks them as much as scum. Best I got.

Aija is kinda peaceful. I reread her ISO and didn't come up with anything. I might replace her with Gamma to be honest. I'm not sure what I like about Aisa other than that she's pleasant

[Fidget]

Wait i have heal hammer?

HEAL: CSF

who is enchant replacing?

and that's a scum claim. good work

Serious or not?

I have so much work to do, but I read thru this instead. I am not a very bright nimbat. I hope you're not too busy today leaders, pretty constrained deadline.

Out of the existing heal wagons, excluding myself, I'm still most comfortable with Andante by a long shot. Fidget or Loki maybe. Preferably Fidget.

You see something about me? I also am pining for more Andante deets if you have any to spare

compare your posting style to Rat’s. Rat is silent and possibly lurky until they find something they find very important (like a read). You can somewhat guess what prompted them to write each post as most of those seem to have personal importance to them.

Compared to that your ISO (especially early game) looked like a bundle of everything.

I do not understand the processes that spur me into action, but they are not out of a sense of duty. I feel duty towards... hm... hanging around ancient talking swords, oddly enough.

RR comes off as not having takes in most of their posts, although when prompted by N-Hectic, they did give a sizable response, yeah.

I do want to say that I was actually in the process of writing 188 when "prompted" by They Who Shall Not Be Hectic. Which is why I gave the "Nah, not really" post as a direct response.

Lol. Very nice.

Also, I thought the post cap being 150 per phase was high enough as to be largely inconsequential, but at the rate some of you are going... Yikes.

I stand by my Andante heal for now, she's overthinking things a bit, but looks plenty Town to me. Firebringer's point that he'd be electing her as scum is valid, but if scum wants to help elect a Townie as leader, I'm sure not gonna be the one to stop them.

I think Hectic is probably Town. Which is to say that the alt that ISN'T Hectic must not be. Really, just not a fan of all the grandstanding, feels like a spicy mix of LAMIST and Too Scummy To Be Scum, so they're off my list of viable leaders.

Firebringer I think is genuinely Town here, though largely gut at this point. Wouldn't want him as leader though, because while I do enjoy a good shitpost every now and then... I'd rather someone more reliable take the reins.

Ejj I could go either way on. Leaning Town for now.

Everyone else.... No terribly strong opinions on. Mildly sus of Penguin, but that's just like. A vague feeling, less than even gut

.

rr went from this to their current fabricated stance bc they see a chance to get power

This ties back to RR's read on you somehow..?

RR suspicion hasn't really gone anywhere for me. That's convenient when we're townhunting, sort of, but doesn't make me feel particularly confident about the possible identities of the terminators.

[Fidget]

I need to get back to work, but NAHA, Loki, Fidget, Gamma, ???

Add me in crew 5 times and that's it.

I wouldn’t object to me, Loki, Enchant, NAHA, Fidget being one of the options

Yeah but why/who is Enchant though? Roden.. I do not recall

[Fidget]

lol ok, I think Loki and Aisa are 2 maf

What? Why?

[Fidget]

I don't think I've paid enough attention to the game since I've mostly skimmed, and even skipped quite a few pages, but I think I'd be wary of people trying to get into a group. I'd probably argue Penguin might be a good choice since they don't want to go.

I'm kinda meh on that reasoning. Penguin hasn't really

wanted

to do anything yet. Except sell bridges. He's very good at that, really good, he once sold, I think, 10 bridges??? He didn't even own them!

I don't have time to go through everything properly right now, but I will later tonight, and provide the requested details on my CSF read, promise.

In the meantime, I will say that my preferred team would be Ejj, Andante, Myself, Firebringer, Aisa, and Fidget.

Could swap one of 'em for Loki maybe. Haven't figured out a read on Enchant, Gamma, Penguin or Toogeloo yet.

Kinda reasonable. I still don't get the Andante read though RR!

Spoiler: RR on Andante

HEAL: Andante

I know she requested not to be one, but I find that those who seek positions of power are often not the sort of people I want in positions of power.

Also, I thought the post cap being 150 per phase was high enough as to be largely inconsequential, but at the rate some of you are going... Yikes.

I stand by my Andante heal for now, she's overthinking things a bit, but looks plenty Town to me. Firebringer's point that he'd be electing her as scum is valid, but if scum wants to help elect a Townie as leader, I'm sure not gonna be the one to stop them.

I think Hectic is probably Town. Which is to say that the alt that ISN'T Hectic must not be. Really, just not a fan of all the grandstanding, feels like a spicy mix of LAMIST and Too Scummy To Be Scum, so they're off my list of viable leaders.

Firebringer I think is genuinely Town here, though largely gut at this point. Wouldn't want him as leader though, because while I do enjoy a good shitpost every now and then... I'd rather someone more reliable take the reins.

Ejj I could go either way on. Leaning Town for now.

Everyone else.... No terribly strong opinions on. Mildly sus of Penguin, but that's just like. A vague feeling, less than even gut.

Anyway, no one's yelled at me about it, and time is starting to become a relevant factor so.

HEAL: Ejjinami
Welcome to leadership

Who’s your preferred second vote rn?

Still probably Andante, nothing's really changed on my read there, and her tendency to obvtown is very good for leading.

Out of the existing heal wagons, excluding myself, I'm still most comfortable with Andante by a long shot. Fidget or Loki maybe. Preferably Fidget.

bahh why!!!!! I'm skeptical she's tending towards obvtowning, at least so far.

To briefly summarize on CSF, there was a Lot of mech spec fluff, which to me felt like it was intended to distract from the process of sorting out Town to elect as Leaders. Like, I get being sucked into mech rabbit holes, I do it all the time as both alignments, but in this case, all the fussing over what a leader may or may not do... It just wasn't relevant to the actual decision. And she wasn't alone in doing so, but it just... Struck me with her in a way that didn't with the others.

There was a lot of mech stuff early as opposed to other stuff, yeah, I agree. I don't know if CSF really talked about it an overblown amount IMO though.

I'm not sold on CSF town, I do kinda like how her gameplay seems more or less agendaless. There is no consistent narrative in the ISO, just individual thoughts and comments. That is something I tend to gravitate towards.

But you're not wrong that she has a lot of posts I would say are more adjacent to the main discussion since they were more mech based. And I think when you're commenting versus rallying/pushing, it's easier to go unnoticed as scum that way. I kinda wanted to put CSF as leader to put someone in the spotlight who might not usually be in it.. could be particularly revealing.

[Fidget]

I haven't really thought about Fidget in a couple days.

I''m still here! Doonn't forget meee

I skimmed. Nothing changed for me, although I haven't read the meat RR post abt CSF that everyone's buzzing about, guess I'll save it.

The terminators could be most places still in my mind. We're still in this pregame limbo thing. Maybe scum knows more than we do though, maybe they care a bit more, I haven't really considered that.

[Fidget]

Koba why you need alts if it's always obvious who you are?

Like

WHAT POINT

Almost everyone who uses alts is super obvious when they do. It must be some kind of phenomena.

It just blows my mind that someone would genuinely sr me for differences in posting length in two games where only one of those games had a post cap, because it freaking makes no logical sense.

Are you saying EJJ is scum because you think their reasoning is illogical?

[Fidget]

duuuuuuuuuude Loki's vibe in https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... er_sort=Go
(town game) is so different than here

The reads are straight to the point and there's much less AtE, especially when responding to scum-reads
even tho he does get annoyed by scum-reads as town, he complains about it in 1- sentences max and goes back to solving right away
not like here where it's literally several dramatic walls one after another
reading further but lol YEAH I don't trust this at all
It feels as if he's trying to portray his reactions clearly here and make sure that people do see it - TLDR - the lamist mindset may truly be scummy

getting more and more convinced that the town-read on gamma might just be whiteknighting

Loki gets bogged down with others reading them unfavorably fairly consistently. I never really observed them handling it better as town. It probably depends on more than alignment.

pedit: Gamma's list is fine lol

[Fidget]

I could be on anyone's team if either of you is feeling me town. I haven't been in the game long enough to really town tell I'm guessing. I'd assume both leaders should have at least 5 reads they could (hopefully) trust on their team. I'm just along for the ride right now.

Depends on what skillsets you're bringing to the time travelin crew. Can you drive a DeLorean? Swindle people out of bridges? Will you bring the snacks?

[Fidget]

and I'd argue Gamma Loki NAHA aren't all town, so it's whatever. then fact that is our "town core" the the teams are "those 3 + 2 TRs" and "those 3 + 2 SRs" like, whatever. yall can discuss if you want, I'm not. the fact I literally HAVE to vote my SRs I've been saying... cause I don't want to be voted in just to get tunneled, so yeah no thanks

You'd rather see 3 scumreads go than have yourself go and get suspected..?

[Fidget]

I don't have any problem with how EJJ chose to do the team. I see what he was going for. I do not trust RR and Andante as much as team #2's substitues in general though. I guess that's largely because I am one of them.

I really need to understand why Andante thinks everyone that I think is town is scum so highly. But I also need to understand why Andante is voting for said 3 suspected terminators to go.

pedit: Earlier I thought the players in the present would die. That'd be kind of lame since we haven't done any execution phases though. Maybe the stuff the people in the past do influences the game for the people in the present. I just hope the optimal play is keep as many terminators in the present as possible.

[Fidget]

Going:

Gamma Emerald, Lokie Dokie, NAHA

--------------------------

OPTION TEAM ONE:

Ejjinami

,

Andante

,

Radical Rat

OPTION TEAM TWO:

Cat Scratch Fever

,

Fidget

,

Aisa

[Fidget]

can i join if the time travel thing doesn't pan out? Blackjack and hookers sounds like a promising plan B

[Fidget]

Other than a growing worry over CSF/Aisa potentially both being scum, right in front of me, taunting me

I'm not really sure I'd want RR/Andante over them. I don't have any burning suspicions but I don't understand what Andante's thinking (nor why there are so many townreads on Andante). I'm scared that they're genuine but as of right now I kind of have been getting the impression they're playing up frustration. I'm really not sure where the immediate vote on team TWO comes from other than for maybe appearances.

I'm gonna read RR's comments on CSF now.

So, these are the mech posts that pinged me, though in my mind there were a lot more of these, I guess I got stuff mixed around in my head.

Spoiler:

Last blurb on spec I promise

but the role pm says we have our voice and vote, but glaringly missing from it is that there's nothing about voting out players from the game, which makes me think the leaders probably have control over the lims. So yeah, I strongly suspect read accuracy will matter.

---

HEAL: Andante

This sounds like town!Andante to me.

are they always so dramatic?

Dramatic? They sound genuine and that’s why I’m so confident she’s town here.

what I meant was- they misunderstood my posts in pretty silly ways
I got the feeling that they read my posts, got slighty triggered and then overwhelmed with anger when they started writing and describing how scummy and rude I am. As if just writing that kept fueling their anger, causing them to notice new and new arguments for how I'm being bad (which actually were based on pretty simple misunderstandings- I don't think it should be considered scummy by a person who's emotionally sober)

I was asking if it's normal for town!Andante to get so lost in their feelings and lose track of reality
or like... if it's just normal for them to tunnel

sorry if I'm being rude again, I don't know how to describe it otherwhise

I don't think they lose track of reality, but yes Andante does play a very emotionally transparent game. This is completely within her townrange

Feeling town on Ejjinami, I like their analysis here and on 96

but the role pm says we have our voice and vote, but glaringly missing from it is that there's nothing about voting out players from the game, which makes me think the leaders probably have control over the lims. So yeah, I strongly suspect read accuracy will matter.

That is never going to happen and if it does i hope they get 186 as well

Never say never but yeah that would be kind of unfun

Another theory I have is they get special PR-like abilities based on what I'm reading about John Connor in the Terminator Wiki lol

However, they just seem weird and out of place, like I said earlier, like they're meant to draw attention away from relevant discussion.

Beyond that, the energy here is wonky. I know she said she was sick, and that's probably part of it, but... It feels very coasty, kinda going with the flow.

And then after being elected, the suggestion that she'd just pick her healers is demonstrative of a lack of care or investment. Like, if she's scum here, she's already won, it really doesn't matter who her team is, so picking something as superficial as that makes sense. And then she backed down when called on it, of course.

I do not see what you're seeing. I agree that CSF is light on content early, she's felt like she's not really trying to exert control over the game.

Could be scary scum hiding right in front of my eyes but I just didn't pick up on the wonky vibes RR was getting. I also think the reasoning at the end is stretching somewhat -- like does this:

And then after being elected, the suggestion that she'd just pick her healers is demonstrative of a lack of care or investment. Like, if she's scum here, she's already won, it really doesn't matter who her team is, so picking something as superficial as that makes sense. And then she backed down when called on it, of course.

Really seem like a fair description of this?:

Spoiler: a bunch of CSF quotes around the aforementioned area

If it comes down to the wire since we only have a day, I'll probably pick ppl who voted for me lol

Hmm actually

@pooky

, can someone be selected to be part of both crews?

ohhhh okay then that simplifies things a bit, since we don't have to decide who goes into which group

so we basically pick our top 5 townreads I think

I need to get back to work, but NAHA, Loki, Fidget, Gamma, ???

What does your ideal crew look like, Aisa?

I'd consider enchant.

Enchant, why did you hammer me for leader instead of hectic? We were both at e-1

FB is a maybe town, bc upon review of his ISO, I feel like his posting felt more scum motivated in Infernal Affairs than it does here... he's just like out here vibing. But he's also just a bigger wildcard in general, and idk if I can ever get to a point where I feel good and confident about healing there

ahhh I'll sleep on it. I should be able to make time for this game tomorrow morning

But for now, this is my squad! :D

Like, I didn't notice the "she backed down when called on it" part. Maybe I just missed it? This really doesn't seem like CSF feeling like she's already won, which I already think is a huge stretch, since we're just in the second phase and CSF didn't noticeably like, go down in content since becoming leader.

[Fidget]

Andante why won't you engage with meee

I can't read you because your thought process seems completely illogical to me, so I need elaboration, but you're scumreading me + are too frustrated about the teams to do anything other than.. vote for said bad teams

What is the merit to voting for the team you think has more scum on it, besides because you don't want to face suspicion after the event?

[Fidget]

VOTE: Team 2

[Fidget]

VOTE: Team 1

i wasn’t seriously about wanting to vote my SRs… i love the votes just casually flying at Team 2… People TR Aisa and Fidget?

Why do you refuse to engage with me and instead just be confusing

[Fidget]

It's less ignoring me, more ignoring everyone. Like you're either so convinced that everyone trying to talk to you is scum and your frustration is blinding you, or...

Andante you've been saying you don't trust me and Aisa like all game and I've been trying to talk to you all game, learn something, but you just go and do something else full speed no stop no explanation!

[Fidget]

TLDR: You're scum-reading andante for having shallow/nonsensical reads, which is largely NAI imo.

Disagree. You're reducing my argument down significantly. Andante bothers me because she seems to play nonsensically in a way that I find, intentional and potentially deceptive. She is hugely frustrated with the game, and yet, she doesn't make any attempt to change it.

You say it's illogical play. I'm saying it's intentional illogical play. I think that'd be a better way of putting it.

I'll change my mind when I have reasoning to believe so. Not just because Andante "might be playing lazy".

[Fidget]

or she's being lazy -_-
I mean, let's be real, being serious isn't fun
it's not scummy for her
Not giving a shit about acting townie DESPITE personally caring how people read them- is townie imo

She does gives a shit about acting townie. You just disagree with me on that.

I think her posts are designed to sound like townie frustration, and you're being tricked by it. Obviously I could be wrong, but you need to present evidence other than "I could be wrong".

If Andante would talk to me or any of the other like 3-4 people she hasn't bothered to, maybe we could figure out which of us are right

[Fidget]

i wasn’t seriously about wanting to vote my SRs… i love the votes just casually flying at Team 2… People TR Aisa and Fidget?

they do
people always town-read wallposters

i wasn’t seriously about wanting to vote my SRs… i love the votes just casually flying at Team 2… People TR Aisa and Fidget?

I seriously don’t get the srs on Fidget? Can you explain to me why you think she’s scum? Because to me, she’s like super obvious town.

I really feel leaders messed up by not including Penguin. He’s beyond like super obvious town now. :/

...becuase she appears to care about the game? because she solves a lot?
bleh
frankly- I attribute it to skill. I'm not gonna argue about it tho, it's just my personal wariness
that's why reading wallposters is difficult
why is fidget town?
why is penguin town?

I thought I was playing laid-back this game, personally. Perhaps I was mistaken..? I am usually a background player, especially as Fidget.

Maybe I have some lengthy posts but it is for the sake of not clogging the thread with a new post for each and every response.

I'm sort of flattered by your read though. But it's not something I'd reserve for a player like myself. Reminds me of how I'd treat skitter, she's on top of it as scum more than she isn't.

You've been asking Loki why I'm (and Aisa) are town all game and to be honest I'm not sure Lokie ever really answered. I'm convinced Lokie believes in the read, although I don't think they've done much to share with you why.

[Fidget]

TLDR: You're scum-reading andante for having shallow/nonsensical reads, which is largely NAI imo.

Disagree. You're reducing my argument down significantly. Andante bothers me because she seems to play nonsensically in a way that I find, intentional and potentially deceptive. She is hugely frustrated with the game, and yet, she doesn't make any attempt to change it.

You say it's illogical play. I'm saying it's intentional illogical play. I think that'd be a better way of putting it.

I'll change my mind when I have reasoning to believe so. Not just because Andante "might be playing lazy".

I guess I'll just let you argue then
that's not my place to talk at this point

or she's being lazy -_-
I mean, let's be real, being serious isn't fun
it's not scummy for her
Not giving a shit about acting townie DESPITE personally caring how people read them- is townie imo

She does gives a shit about acting townie. You just disagree with me on that.

I think her posts are designed to sound like townie frustration, and you're being tricked by it. Obviously I could be wrong, but you need to present evidence other than "I could be wrong".

???
what makes you think that it's fake in the first place?

The answer is in the first quote you responded to.

Disagree. You're reducing my argument down significantly. Andante bothers me because she seems to play nonsensically in a way that I find, intentional and potentially deceptive. She is hugely frustrated with the game, and yet, she doesn't make any attempt to change it.

You say it's illogical play. I'm saying it's intentional illogical play. I think that'd be a better way of putting it.

I am saying I don't buy that Andante is frustrated that we aren't listening to her on her reads. Why? Because her heart hasn't been in it. It's not like she's talked to any of us. She hasn't given anything.

Yes, she could be actually frustrated, lazy and/or illogical. What I've surmised of her play is that she is being fake. The frustration at the beginning of this phase felt as if it came out of nowhere. And then she proceeded to say "I know you all will think I'm scum if Team #1 goes through, so I'm going to vote Team #2 even thought all of my 'scumreads' that I definitely very passionately believe in are on it.

Perhaps you're seeing a least a little where I'm coming from. I don't disagree with you that I might be mistaken, text isn't exactly an easy medium to read someone off of + im nothing special at it. I'm just not going to entertain the devil's advocate too much without reason to do so. Andante's posts don't match up with what she's saying she reads, she isn't trying to change what we think or talk to us, she just wants us to be aware she heavily dislikes our team and it has killed her motivation, essentially. Is it plausible? Maybe. Do I believe it? No.

[Fidget]

Yes, she could be actually frustrated, lazy and/or illogical. What I've surmised of her play is that she is being fake. The frustration at the beginning of this phase felt as if it came out of nowhere. And then she proceeded to say "I know you all will think I'm scum if Team #1 goes through, so I'm going to vote Team #2 even

though

all of my 'scumreads' that I definitely very passionately believe in are on it.

"

Kinda butchered second paragraph.

Point is her defeated frustration seemed overblown and played up for, probably, townreads.

[Fidget]

You've been asking Loki why I'm (and Aisa) are town all game and to be honest I'm not sure Lokie ever really answered. I'm convinced Lokie believes in the read, although I don't think they've done much to share with you why.

they gave a short answer once

why are you convinced they believe it?

Loki hasn't been playing for looks. It's a funny thing to say when that's something you said about Andante, though. I think we're seeing the game so very differently, but that's okay.

Loki's actually been quite vocal about his reads and putting up resistance whenever anyone suggests pretty much anything against them. In the way I'm accustomed to from him. I'm not really sure exactly why they townread me n Aisa but that's less important to my read.

[Fidget]

Hello Andante.

[Fidget]

I am saying I don't buy that Andante is frustrated that we aren't listening to her on her reads. Why? Because her heart hasn't been in it. It's not like she's talked to any of us. She hasn't given anything.

you don't buy that I'm frustrated? NAHA has it out for me and I see I'm on a team WITH NAHA, like, I genuinely don' care, it sounds like you're trying too hard to justify a SR on me, like, does that mean group 1 is all pure? and so you automatically lose if we're picked? like, I don't get why I'm such a huge focus of yours. like, I genuinely do not care which team is picked? uhh in those 24 hours or whatever I was busy IRL, whenever I look at this it's "ANDANTE ___" the op says this is strictly mountainous and now we're playing coalition. like, I don't care... high chance neither Team is pure, I'm good with just voting and moving on, I don't see the problem with my play

You're a focus of mine because I suspect you and you ignore my (and most other) questions.

I figure both groups probably aren't pure, I'm not sure what you mean exactly.

The reason I haven't been buying your posts is because they seem unjustified, I suppose. The actual thing that's getting on your nerves is the setup isn't mountainous? You said earlier that you didn't want to have to deal with NAHA coming after you if Team 1 succeeds. But how does that make any sense to be at the front of your mind?

You voted for the team with your passionate scumreads over having to defend yourself against NAHA. And then you're acting like I'm grasping at straws when I'm actually just grasping to try and get an answer

and I really don't think we want tryhard andante right now, so yeah,

> Point is her defeated frustration seemed overblown and played up for, probably, townreads.
That actually annoys me, everything about my play this game has been real/genuine I've been sick like the 18th - 21st or whatever, like, yall get the me that's having a good time, I'm happy to be here, I can't recall getting mad at this game? like, I've told yall what I've thought.. mad me? I really don't think I've been mad

I don't mean this in a personal way, I absolutely do not mean to say your experience is not valid. I am sorry to hear that you've been feeling ill

I mean more to say that your posts don't seem like things that you would be thinking of as green. I suppose they're just outside of my realm of believability. I'm glad that you talked with me, in any case.

[Fidget]

also if you ask me both teams actually have a terminator in it.

facts... so it's pointless to just tryhard to pick one, like who even cares??? I'm just seeing my name thrown around like "Andante reaction fake" like wtf?? we reading the same game?? or...

This is a huge leap of logic. Are you saying that:

There is most likely scum on both teams,

therefore:

There is no discernible difference between the two teams and it matters not who votes for who

Like this phase isn't invalidated by statistical probability. It's also not invalidated if you scumread both wagons.

Also, what does this have to do with my comments on your reaction?!

[Fidget]

I also realize I should give lenience to Andante not really responding to most of my and other concerns since she's under the weather. Her activity did decrease probably largely cause of that and I didn't put that together.

[Fidget]

Toog voted for 1

I still think Team 2 is the best!

what are your thoughts on Fidget pushing me being maf as the reason for why team 1 is bad though?

What?

[Fidget]

I also realize I should give lenience to Andante not really responding to most of my and other concerns since she's under the weather. Her activity did decrease probably largely cause of that and I didn't put that together.

so now that you realized I'm not an easy push, all of a sudden we're walking back the claims that all my "unbelievable thoughts" make me scum?

What?

I don't know how to respond to this

I am glad you are playing now it seems

[Fidget]

Andante it's like you're responding to another person and addressing it to me, honestly. Maybe I'm high. I'm mostly just glad you're here.

[Fidget]

What's with people coming out of the woodwork complaining about teams after they've been selected

I floated my proposed team long before i actually locked it in so people can talk about it, and I don't remember this much opposition to the teams then? Like barely anyone pushed back

I mean, I don't like how ejj took an extra hour to basically copy your team, so then I'm more inclined to vote for you, but it's the same 3... plus Fidget.. and fidget is trying to say team 1 is bad because of me, so I don't trust fidget at all

Like? What? I'm saying I think you're suspicious because you're suspicious. And even then, nyeh.

Did I say that my read about you has anything to do with anyone else on Team 1..?

[Fidget]

I've certainly never played with anyone quite like you before. In a good way of course.

[Fidget]

That explains some things

[Fidget]

That explains some things

has it not been obvious I haven't really cared?

Nothing you have done has seemed obvious to me. You came across as irked over the team selections, but you played no part in the process prior so like why would you even care in the first place?

It felt like a mismatch but maybe you're right and I read into malicious caring where there wasn't I suppose.

[Fidget]

Mmm…not really liking fidget.

Oh ya? I'm gonna steal one of your bridges, and then, I'm gonna sell it back to you at a profit. Just you see

[Fidget]

"Wow these teams are both terrible, but I don't want to have to defend myself so I'll vote the other team" is your idea of judging them after the fact?

[Fidget]

The restriction on the Mafia Nightkill was that it had to be made on the side with fewer mafia, the design was to prevent the possibility of no survivors from the town coming from a timeline so there would always be at least one town player surviving either side.

Smart

I had fun! Thanks for the game