Mini 2018 - American Presidents Mafia (Game Over)

[skitter30]

aside i think this is hands-down the longest game i've ever been in

[skitter30]

can you explain again what you're not liking about errant's recent posts?

[Gustavo]

aside i think this is hands-down the longest game i've ever been in

This is pretty long and we still have 5 days to go and an entire day phase after that.

[BlackVoid]

can you explain again what you're not liking about errant's recent posts?

Okay, he comes in pointing out a bunch of reasons Gustavo is town. Or whatever that was where he lists a bunch of options and asks people which they think it is. There's an implication that he doesn't think Gustavo is going to flip scum. The obvious conclusion from his POV would be that I'm scum. But he doesn't really attack me, question me, ISO me, or try to figure out my alignment. He reads like he's playing coy to let me push the Gustavo lynch through and set it up in a way that he looks better. I don't think he'd actually look better, more that scum really like to position themselves in a way that they are right. He's not going to burn his towncred pushing one of us when we're doing it for him.

His behavior during the N_M lynch was also not townie. I might have said this but maybe not: he came in at the end and unvoted N_M after he'd been hammered. If he's scum, I suspect it was a fake unvote and he knew that N_M was already hammered and he was just trying to look good from it. He then said I was towny but also implied that I was scum. His behavior towards me has definitely been one of trying not to antagonize me while also having me as a voting option. I don't think he wanted me to tunnel him with full force.

But Gustavo is

frustrating

. Even if he's town, there's no real chance he's going to figure out I'm town or Errant is scum and he tries to apply these hardline scumtells and push them as universally applicable without context. I'm scumreading his slot mainly for 1. Stungun's interactions, 2. His trying to derail Momrangal's lynch, 3. That vote hop on Gamma. I had a feeling that one of N_M or Gustavo were probably scum from those late votes.

But you're right about his frustration. Him asking to be hammered did give me pause. That's why it's a hard decision. They both have things that make them really town.

Regarding your 3698, me townreading you is probably the least alignment indicative thing I've done. If I'm scum, I'd definitely townread you for sure. You're getting hung up on something I'd do as either alignment. But there are things I'd only do as town: you pointing this out earlier but my push on Nauci fits in that category. I'm way too involved and active to be scum here. I suspected both flipped scum early on (although Errant did too). Then there's the guilty on me from TheWorst. It just makes way more sense for TheWorst to neighborize a partner and fake a guilty on a townie than the other way around. Guiltying a partner at that point without knowing the setup is basically suicide for scum. He'd have to explain his survival. He might ultimately be POE'd by other PRs. He had you and others scumreading him. He knew his days were numbered and he wanted to take someone down with him.

Another thing that crossed my mind is why he chose me specifically. He did it shortly after I replaced in. My guess was that he felt threatened by my analysis. If it is indeed Errant/TheWorst/Momrangal, then my replace in were really good because I had them all as scum. I'll have to check the timeline on how much I said before he started saying I should be investigated though. But that's not really a solid point.

As long as I don't get lynched, we're guaranteed a win. You're getting way too hung up on what I said in the hydra PT about me trying to copy townread players. You've never actually seen me as scum and this is not even close to what it looks like. For example, I'd never push Irrelephant as scum. He'd be more trouble than his lynch would be worth. I'd probably be hard-townreading Nauci. I don't think I'd even catch that she's a PR but even if I did, it's like you said, I wouldn't be pushing her. I'd not defend Not_Mafia. I'd anticipate that he's a mislynch that needs to be cashed in at some point. Yeah, I pushed him later but that was POE and I wouldn't put myself in such a silly position where I have a fake a convincing reason I'm changing my mind on him.

I'd play like Errant did. If I saw Momrangal wagon as a likelihood, I'd get on the wagon early. I wouldn't agonize so much over which of my buddies to bus. I wouldn't ask them both to claim and lock them in when claims are a weapon that can be used later on. But most importantly, I wouldn't be here and solving the game for as much time as I have. As town, I always want to be online, and always think about the game. I'm more laid back as scum.

[BlackVoid]

What I don't like about his posting are the mysterious townreads on Nauci (claiming that Nauci is making good points and focused on getting reads is flat-out wrong. The townread on Irrelephant is also not understandable). Mysteriously having me at the bottom of his readslist is weird too.

His progression on Momrangal is a bit too one-dimensional. He consistently suspects Momrangal for reasons that aren't very strong, hops on mid-wagon and stays there, pointing out pre-flip associatives. I couldn't help thinking that if I were scum, this is how I would bus.

This still applies.

[Gustavo]

I’m ahead of schedule with work stuff, I’ll relook at both skitter and errant today. If not I’ll do it this evening while my kid is at summer camp.

[Keyser Söze]

I am here guys (not avoiding) - just reading and digesting. We have the time.

[Gustavo]

Conspiracy theory. Skitter/tw post claim is scum theater.

[Irrelephant11]

Yeah I had the same fear.

It's hard how at some point we have to just do a lynch... I don't think there are any scum here. sigh

[Irrelephant11]

I still think it's just Gustavo. Sorry, I settled like 5-10 pages back that he's my preferred lynch and unless Keyser + skitter really want a different lynch super badly he's probably just the choice here.

[Gustavo]

like if elephant man wasn't cleared, i would swear he is scum. his play today makes no sense as town.

He basically lined up lynches - Saying me first, if I am town, bv tomorrow.
misrepped my motivation
seriously suggested I was scum because I didn't misgender mom

town is going to lose because he is going to be the person to decide in lylo. The person who thinks misgendering is AI is town's only hope of winning?


GG to whoever the last scum is. TW set up guys up nice and left behind this clown

[BlackVoid]

If you're so sure I'm scum, then why would you be mad at Irrelephant if you expect him to lynch me next? If you are not, we really should talk about Errant. Skitter isn't scum but there's a very realistic chance Errant is and I feel like part of the reason people are feeling lost/paranoid is that they're dismissing him as town based primarily on reactions around the neighborhood.

[Irrelephant11]

good thing I'm cleared

my job rn is to provide ordered reads, since keyser might be the one to do lylo

[Irrelephant11]

Gustavo feels like scum angry for being caught for all the wrong reasons

also I'm not a clown, thanks <3

[Gustavo]

I was referring to the act of lining up lynches. regardless who the lynch target is, lining up lynches is extremely anti-town especially from his pov. for me I know for a fact that scum is you or errant. Elephant man doesn't know that but made a post that basically implied he's going to be coming in with his mind made up, which brings up another anti-town attitude. From his pov he doesn't have the same luxury I have. He has to decide between 2 so coming into lylo with your mind made up is also extremely attitude.

once I am dead, I have no control over what town does, but I don't want anyone coming in with a closed mind and he basically said he was going to do that.

[Errantparabola]

BV is not reading my posts and it doesnt make me want to open this thread anymore

[Gustavo]

good thing I'm cleared

my job rn is to provide ordered reads, since keyser might be the one to do lylo

yeah, keyser is being killed tonight i'm pretty sure. Scum have to get rid of the smarter players and you have shown you aren't on the same level as keyser with your misgender accusation.

[Errantparabola]

Like, look

"ep is townreading gustavo yet not pressuring me so therefore ep knows that gustavo is going to flip town and wants to be in a better position tomorrow"

I've repeatedly said that I think gustavo has to be the scum and that BV, despite ANYTHING ELSE, just does't make sense as scum because of the TW guilty

But I think there are a bunch of reasons why Gustavo is towny and I have POINTED those reasons out NOT because I """"""know""""" Gustavo is going to flip town but because those are just my thoughts

It's like you've taken little slices out of my gameview and taken them out of context, you know? and i feel like youve done that a lot that's jst so infuriating to me

like you pointing at things i've done and inserting your own interpretations into them just makes me feel like shit and i literally have no response to them

what the fuck ever i'm done

[Irrelephant11]

EP no you rock don't quit
Do you think maybe his refusal is AI?

Gustavo I just explained that I have to give my preferred lynch order to help Keyser
Nauci did the same thing, it's just good town play
Of course I'll re-evaluate if I'm in lylo but if not Keyser needs every person he knows is town to share their reads before dying


pedit: not sure why you enjoy playing mafia, seems like it's just an exercise for you in expressing anger at friendly people (maybe that's why), but regardless if this is your appeal for me to townread you it won't work, regardless of your alignment. Hope your day includes better things than being stuck playing a game with me, the idiot clown

[Gustavo]

Gustavo feels like scum angry for being caught for all the wrong reasons

also I'm not a clown, thanks <3

how do you tell the difference between scum being angry and caught for the wrong reasons vs town being angry for being lynched for the wrong reasons?

And you may not be a man who dresses up with a wig, big shoes and a red nose, but you sir are a fucking clown if you think misgendering is remotely AI.

[Errantparabola]

i dont enjoy playing mafia irre
i have an unhealthy relationship with mafia
I apologize for blowing up at you BV

[Gustavo]

Gustavo I just explained that I have to give my preferred lynch order to help Keyser

keyser is more than likely dying tonight. scum is keeping you around because you give scum the best chance to hammer wrong because of how close minded you are being.

[Errantparabola]

Yesterday someone wrongly (but semi-jokingly) accused me of cheating in a board game and I got so upset that I almost just quit playing.

(The joke is then I then went and talked to people in a forum game where the central mechanic is people accusing each other of being liars)

[Irrelephant11]

EP I know you're town, and not just for the simplistic reasons BV says. I was just about to work on explaining it

Sorry if this game isn't fun for you any more, I know the feeling

pedit: Gustavo I'm done being insulted by you. I'll continue to engage with you when you have a post to respond to that doesn't try to hurt my feelings, thanks.

pedit2: I don't know what to add, EP, other than I'm sorry this is rough for you rn

[Gustavo]

not sure why you enjoy playing mafia, seems like it's just an exercise for you in expressing anger at friendly people

mafia and monopoly are the same to me. I enjoy playing it but the people I play with are sometimes so bad that i get angry. Sometimes I am so bad I make others angry.

i don't quit monopoly, I am not going to quit mafia.