[align=center][img]https://www.wallpaperup.com/uploads/wallpapers/2013/02/05/35205/f429a8a775b7dbcff0b7cb2e1ade71e0-700.jpg[/img]
[size=300]Limbo[/size][/align]
[b]Moderator:[/b] AnonymousGhost
[b]Backup Mod:[/b] USERNAME
[b]Player List:[/b]
[list]
[*][/list]
* = Prod
`= Nudge (Two Nudges = One Prod on V/LA)
[b]Lost in the Mist:[/b]
[list]
[*][/list]
[b]Found in the Grave:[/b]
[list]
[*]No one has died yet.[/list]
Spoiler: Intro Post Preview
Limbo
Moderator:
AnonymousGhost
Backup Mod:
USERNAME
Player List:
* = Prod
`= Nudge (Two Nudges = One Prod on V/LA)
Lost in the Mist:
Found in the Grave:
No one has died yet.
In post 43, Jingle wrote:Assuming Ari doesn't see any gaps in my logic (which to be fair, is entirely possible), I'd sign off on the balance with the disclaimer that it's a little swingy. I'd definitely put the modular and the list of possible roles in the advert for the game to ensure you attract the right kind of people, as well as the deadline rules because they are nonstandard (standard being 2 weeks/2 days with 48 hour prods).
In post 55, Aristophanes wrote:I would also sign this from reading the thread and these answers
[color=#80BFFF][b]Game Overview[/b] - [size=75]Some rules were adopted from Plotinus, mhsmith0, MathDino, and yessiree. Thanks![/size]
[list][*]This game is conditioned as a full reveal. Upon a player's removal, a player's role and alignment are released to the public.
[*]The game is conditioned as [url=https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Modular_Open]Modular Open[/url]. Players will be aware of all possible roles that may exist within the setup, but will not be informed of the distribution or combination of these roles in advance.
[*]This game is guaranteed to not be mountainous.
[*]This game contains roles and/or role modifiers that would not and cannot be found in the Normal Queue.
[*]This game is conditioned as 3 scum versus 11 town players.
[*]The game will end when a game-ending faction has achieved its win condition. A game-ending faction is any faction whose wincon cannot win with any other wincon i.e. town, mafia, serial killer, jester, etc.
[*]Flavor is for fun and is not indicative of players, alignments, roles, abilities, game mechanics, or anything else related to the game.
[*]Roles are not indicative of alignment.
[*]Scum may talk during all phases of the game in their shared private topic.
[*]Individual scum cannot simultaneously perform their factional kill ability and use their abilities, if any, during the same Night Phase.
[*]I will not answer game clarification questions in misleading ways. (i.e. I will not tell you that an ability is passive when it is actually active.)
[*]I will not intentionally lie to you if you have a question concerning your role or the mechanics of the game. I may answer vaguely, i.e. “No comment” or “I cannot answer that at this time,” for instance.
[*]In general: if a question would break the game or implicate another player's role, there is little chance that I will answer it.[/list]
[b]Conduct:[/b]
[list][*]Try to not take things personally. You should expect debates to potentially become heated.
[*]Bear the following in mind: [i]Some will lie, and others will be deceived.[/i] It is all in the spirit of the game. That said, personal attacks or the implication of personal attacks are strictly [b]off-limits[/b] and may result in a Locked thread and/or a Mod Kill depending on the severity of the insult.
[*]I have the final say. Respect my judgement. I reserve the right to adjust and or change the rules as I see fit. I [i]will[/i] always tell players about a change in the rules as these changes happen in order to ensure the prevention of game breaking incidents from occurring.
[*]Pretending to break a rule is equal to actually breaking a rule and may get a player Mod-Killed depending on the nature of the infraction.
[*]This is my color. Don't use it. (#80BFFF)[/list]
[b]Post Content:[/b]
[list][*]Respect and obey the MafiaScum [url=https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=6470]Code of Conduct[/url]. All site wide rules apply. Play to win, please with respect, and try not to ruin the game for other players.
[*]Do not talk about this game anywhere else unless I have specified it is permitted such as in a private topic. This includes PM-ing other players.
[*]No invisible, cryptographic, or deliberate obfuscation of text.
[*]No talking after death.
[*]No editing or deleting your posts.
[*]No discussion of ongoing games.
[*]Paraphrasing is acceptable.[/list]
[b]Activity:[/b]
[list][*]Players who have failed to confirm their role PM within 72 hours after role PMs have been distributed will be auto-replaced.
[*]After 48 hours of inactivity, players will be prodded to ensure that they are still interested in playing the game and continue to participate. After the prod, players will have 24 hours to respond with game related material or be replaced.
[*]Players can request other players be prodded within reason and at the mod's discretion. These will be unofficial prods and will not count towards the two prod limit, but the prodded player will be expected to post game-advancing content within roughly 24 hours of being unofficially prodded. Failure to post game-advancing content within that 24 hour time-frame will in an official prod being handed out to said player.
[*][b]If you have not posted game advancing content in 6 days, regardless of V/LA status, [i]you will be replaced.[/i][/b]
[*]To avoid being replaced for inactivity, be sure to include game advancing content to your post i.e. “Got prodded, X is still scum. I'll catch up later”. Naked prod dodges ("I'll get to this later,") do not reset the prod timer.
[*]If you declare V/LA, you will be nudged every 72 hours (3 days). Two nudges equals one prod in V/LA. Nudged players will have roughly 24 hours to post game advancing content before they will be nudged once more. If they fail to post game advancing content within roughly 24 hours of the second nudge, they will be replaced.
[*]As a rule of thumb, if you are not on V/LA, you should try to post game related content at least once per every 24 hours.
[*]Players are allowed to be prodded [i][b]two separate times[/b][/i] before they will be replaced.
[*]Don't be afraid to use the V/LA, but don't abuse it either.[/list]
[b]Deadlines:[/b]
[list][*]Day phases are 12 days long. Night phases are 48 hours long.
[*]The majority are allowed only one day phase extension for the entire game that does not involve replacements. If you'd like to use the extension, you can [vote]Extend the Day[/vote].
[*]A player replacement extension will add 24 hours to the current deadline during the Day Phase.
[*]Votes must be written in bold as [b]Vote: AnonymousGhost[/b] or use the vote tag - [vote]AnonymousGhost[/vote].
[*]Votes in quotes, spoiler tags or otherwise hidden will not be counted. Votes that misspell or have other minor errors will be counted as normal as long as I understand what you are getting at. Unvotes are helpful, but not necessary. Let me know if I make an error in vote counts and I will correct them.[/list]
[b]Win Conditions:[/b]
[list][*]Advantages: Wins when all threats to the town have been removed from the game.
[*]Hardships: Wins when they either equal or outnumber all other factions, or nothing can prevent this from occurring.
[*]In order to prevent underhanded scum hunting, the town/mafia win cons are word-for-word here as are in the role PMs player will receive.[/color][/list]
Spoiler: Game Overview Preview
Game Overview
-
Some rules were adopted from Plotinus, mhsmith0, MathDino, and yessiree. Thanks!
This game is conditioned as a full reveal. Upon a player's removal, a player's role and alignment are released to the public.
The game is conditioned as Modular Open. Players will be aware of all possible roles that may exist within the setup, but will not be informed of the distribution or combination of these roles in advance.
This game is guaranteed to not be mountainous.
This game contains roles and/or role modifiers that would not and cannot be found in the Normal Queue.
This game is conditioned as 3 scum versus 11 town players.
The game will end when a game-ending faction has achieved its win condition. A game-ending faction is any faction whose wincon cannot win with any other wincon i.e. town, mafia, serial killer, jester, etc.
Flavor is for fun and is not indicative of players, alignments, roles, abilities, game mechanics, or anything else related to the game.
Roles are not indicative of alignment.
Scum may talk during all phases of the game in their shared private topic.
Individual scum cannot simultaneously perform their factional kill ability and use their abilities, if any, during the same Night Phase.
I will not answer game clarification questions in misleading ways. (i.e. I will not tell you that an ability is passive when it is actually active.)
I will not intentionally lie to you if you have a question concerning your role or the mechanics of the game. I may answer vaguely, i.e. “No comment” or “I cannot answer that at this time,” for instance.
In general: if a question would break the game or implicate another player's role, there is little chance that I will answer it.
Conduct:
Try to not take things personally. You should expect debates to potentially become heated.
Bear the following in mind:
Some will lie, and others will be deceived.
It is all in the spirit of the game. That said, personal attacks or the implication of personal attacks are strictly
off-limits
and may result in a Locked thread and/or a Mod Kill depending on the severity of the insult.
I have the final say. Respect my judgement. I reserve the right to adjust and or change the rules as I see fit. I
will
always tell players about a change in the rules as these changes happen in order to ensure the prevention of game breaking incidents from occurring.
Pretending to break a rule is equal to actually breaking a rule and may get a player Mod-Killed depending on the nature of the infraction.
This is my color. Don't use it. (#80BFFF)
Post Content:
Respect and obey the MafiaScum Code of Conduct. All site wide rules apply. Play to win, please with respect, and try not to ruin the game for other players.
Do not talk about this game anywhere else unless I have specified it is permitted such as in a private topic. This includes PM-ing other players.
No invisible, cryptographic, or deliberate obfuscation of text.
No talking after death.
No editing or deleting your posts.
No discussion of ongoing games.
Paraphrasing is acceptable.
Activity:
Players who have failed to confirm their role PM within 72 hours after role PMs have been distributed will be auto-replaced.
After 48 hours of inactivity, players will be prodded to ensure that they are still interested in playing the game and continue to participate. After the prod, players will have 24 hours to respond with game related material or be replaced.
Players can request other players be prodded within reason and at the mod's discretion. These will be unofficial prods and will not count towards the two prod limit, but the prodded player will be expected to post game-advancing content within roughly 24 hours of being unofficially prodded. Failure to post game-advancing content within that 24 hour time-frame will in an official prod being handed out to said player.
If you have not posted game advancing content in 6 days, regardless of V/LA status,
you will be replaced.
To avoid being replaced for inactivity, be sure to include game advancing content to your post i.e. “Got prodded, X is still scum. I'll catch up later”. Naked prod dodges ("I'll get to this later,") do not reset the prod timer.
If you declare V/LA, you will be nudged every 72 hours (3 days). Two nudges equals one prod in V/LA. Nudged players will have roughly 24 hours to post game advancing content before they will be nudged once more. If they fail to post game advancing content within roughly 24 hours of the second nudge, they will be replaced.
As a rule of thumb, if you are not on V/LA, you should try to post game related content at least once per every 24 hours.
Players are allowed to be prodded
two separate times
before they will be replaced.
Don't be afraid to use the V/LA, but don't abuse it either.
Deadlines:
Day phases are 12 days long. Night phases are 48 hours long.
The majority are allowed only one day phase extension for the entire game that does not involve replacements. If you'd like to use the extension, you can VOTE: Extend the Day.
A player replacement extension will add 24 hours to the current deadline during the Day Phase.
Votes must be written in bold as
Vote: AnonymousGhost
or use the vote tag - VOTE: AnonymousGhost.
Votes in quotes, spoiler tags or otherwise hidden will not be counted. Votes that misspell or have other minor errors will be counted as normal as long as I understand what you are getting at. Unvotes are helpful, but not necessary. Let me know if I make an error in vote counts and I will correct them.
Win Conditions:
Advantages: Wins when all threats to the town have been removed from the game.
Hardships: Wins when they either equal or outnumber all other factions, or nothing can prevent this from occurring.
In order to prevent underhanded scum hunting, the town/mafia win cons are word-for-word here as are in the role PMs player will receive.
Last edited by AnonymousGhost on Tue Oct 23, 2018 3:04 am, edited 26 times in total.
[b]Modular Setup and Turn Order:[/b]
[list][*][url=https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Modular_Open]Modular Open[/url] setups are setups where all possible roles/abilities are known in advance, but the exact distribution and combination is not known.
[*]In a Modular Open, players would be informed that the following powers could exist: Doctor, Cop, Vigilante, Strongman, Paranoid Gun Owner, Naive, False, and Bulletproof.
[*]Players wouldn't be informed that the actual setup consists of a Town Aligned Naïve PGO, a Town Aligned Cop, and a Mafia Aligned False Doctor.
[*]As such, only the following roles/abilities have the possibility of existing within the game.
[*][b]Roles that are not listed [i]cannot[/i] appear in this game.[/b]
[*]Roles/abilities that may appear in the game in their turn order: Toxic Goo, Green Goo, Motivator, Jail Keeper, Elite Bodyguard, Lawyer, Neapolitan/Vanilla Cop/Follower/Tracker.
[*]Role modifiers that may appear in the game in their turn order: Ascetic, Weak, Conditional, Activated, Indecisive, Hated, Loved, Ninja, Percentage, X-Shot.
[*]This game will be using [url=https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Reasonable_Action_Resolution]Reasonable Action Resolution [RAR][/url] to resolve Night Actions.
[*][b]Reminder[/b]: flavor is for fun and is not indicative of roles, alignment, or anything else game related. For ensuring Flavor Unbreakability, the flavor matchup to each role/ability in the possible Role PMs has been randomized, rewritten, and/or created for this very purpose.
[*]This game has been reviewed and has found to be evenly balanced, but a little swingy.[/list]
[b]Possible Role PMs:[/b]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are Despair the Endless.
[Win Condition/Alignment goes here]. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread[/url]. You have no abilities besides your voice and your vote. Best of luck.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are Wrath the Vengeful.
[Win Condition/Alignment goes here]. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread[/url]. Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]He Who Laughs Last[/b] [Passive]: You are [b]Toxic Goo[/b]. Anyone who targets you with an ability will die of poison at the end of the following Day Phase. They will be alerted that they have been poisoned and will be able to use their vote, be a viable lynch candidate for that Day Phase, and use any day abilities (if they have any).[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are Envy the Jealous.
[Win Condition/Alignment goes here]. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread[/url]. Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]Green With Envy[/b] [Passive]: You are [b]Green Goo[/b]. Anyone who targets you with an ability will become Green Goo, losing any abilities they may have, but their alignment will remain the same.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are Charity the Compassionate.
[Win Condition/Alignment goes here]. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread[/url]. Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]Nothing Sought, Nothing Found[/b] [Active]: You are an [b]Motivator[/b]. You may target a player, allowing them to use an extra action the following Night Phase, if they have any abilities. If your target does not have any active abilities, then nothing will happen to them and they will not be informed that they were Motivated.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are Diligence the Successful.
[Win Condition/Alignment goes here]. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread[/url]. Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]Better Safe than Sorry[/b] [Active]: You are a [b]Jail Keeper[/b]. You may target a player, simultaneously role blocking and saving them from all kill attempts.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are Temperance the Restrained.
[Win Condition/Alignment goes here]. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread.[/url] Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]Chains of Command[/b] [Active]: You are an [b]Elite Bodyguard[/b]. In addition to protecting another player during the Night, you will kill whomever tried to kill your same target, but you will still die in the process.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are Pride the Arrogant.
[Win Condition/Alignment goes here]. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread.[/url] Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]There's Always a Catch[/b] [Active]: You are a [b]Lawyer[/b]. You may protect a player from any investigations during the Night, causing your target to Investigate as the least incriminating result to any investigative roles e.g. Vanilla [Vanilla Cop/Neapolitan], Town [Cop], No Target [Tracker/Follower].[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are Lust the Lascivious.
[Win Condition/Alignment goes here]. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread[/url]. Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]Good Cop, Bad Cop[/b] [Active]: You are an Alignment Cop. You may target a player, in an attempt to discover their alignment. Town players will return as 'Advantage' and scum will return as 'Hardship'.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are Gluttony the Voracious.
[Win Condition/Alignment goes here]. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread.[/url] Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]Ice Cream![/b] [Active]: You are a [b]Neapolitan[/b]. You may investigate a player in order to discover if they are Vanilla or not. Only Vanilla Townies will return 'Vanilla' results, all other roles will return as 'Not Vanilla'.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are Forgiveness the Absolved.
[Win Condition/Alignment goes here]. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread[/url]. Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]Have Mercy Upon Us[/b] [Active]: You are a [b]Vanilla Cop[/b]. You may target a player during the Night, investigating whether or not they are a Vanilla Townie or not. "Vanilla" results are given for any role that doesn't have any individual powers (e.g., Vanilla Townie, Mafia Goon, a Serial Killer with no other powers); "Not Vanilla" results are given on all others.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are Humility the Modest.
[Win Condition/Alignment goes here]. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread.[/url] Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]A Bird in the Hand[/b] [Active]: You are a [b]Tracker[/b]. You may select a player, learning who they targeted, but not what type of action they performed.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are Sloth the Indolent.
[Win Condition/Alignment goes here]. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread.[/url] Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]All Work, No Pay[/b] [Active]: You are a [b]Follower[/b]. You may select a player, learning what form of action they took, but not who they targeted.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are Kindness the Affectionate.
[Win Condition/Alignment goes here]. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread.[/url] Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]Selflessness[/b] [Passive]: You are [b]Ascetic[/b]. You are immune to all night actions except night kill attempts, reflexively role blocking anyone who targets you during the night.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are Chastity the Celibate.
[Win Condition/Alignment goes here]. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread.[/url] Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]Close to Godliness[/b] [Active]: You are an [b]Activated PASSIVE ABILITY[/b]. During the night, you may attempt to activate your ability.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are Acedia the Negligent.
[Win Condition/Alignment goes here]. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread[/url]. Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]Once in a Blue Moon[/b] [Passive]: You are a [b]Conditional POWER ROLE[/b]. Your action will fail if [PREDETERMINED EVENT] happens.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are Justice the Fair.
[Win Condition/Alignment goes here]. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread[/url]. Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]For Your Own Good[/b] [Passive]: You are [b]Hated[/b] and require one less vote than normal to be lynched.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are Prudence the Wise.
[Win Condition/Alignment goes here]. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread[/url]. Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]Better to be Loved than Feared[/b] [Passive]: You are [b]Loved[/b] and require one more vote than normal to be lynched. This modifier will stop working during MyLo and LyLo.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are Greed the Avaricious.
[Win Condition/Alignment goes here]. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread[/url]. Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]Everything and Anything[/b] [Passive]: You are a [b]Ninja[/b], as such you will never be seen targeting anyone by roles such as Trackers, Watchers, or any other similar investigative roles.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are Courage the Strong.
[Win Condition/Alignment goes here]. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread[/url]. Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]Achilles Heel[/b] [Passive]: You are a [b]Percentage POWER ROLE[/b]. Your ability has a #% of working.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are Rebelliousness the Rejector.
[Win Condition/Alignment goes here]. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread[/url]. Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]Weak Willed[/b] [Passive]: You are a [b]Weak POWER ROLE[/b] and if you target a player with an anti-town win condition, you will die.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are Ignorance the Blind.
[Win Condition/Alignment goes here]. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread[/url]. Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]No Sight like Foresight[/b] [Passive]: You are an [b]X-Shot POWER ROLE[/b] and only have X amount of times you can use your ability.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are Dishonesty the Devious.
[Win Condition/Alignment goes here]. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread[/url]. Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]Fool Me Once[/b] [Passive]: You are an [b]Indecisive POWER ROLE[/b]. Your Indecisive modifier restricts you from using your ability on the same target two nights in a row, regardless if you were successful or not the first time you used it.[/area]
Spoiler: Preview
Modular Setup and Turn Order:
Modular Open setups are setups where all possible roles/abilities are known in advance, but the exact distribution and combination is not known.
In a Modular Open, players would be informed that the following powers could exist: Doctor, Cop, Vigilante, Strongman, Paranoid Gun Owner, Naive, False, and Bulletproof.
Players wouldn't be informed that the actual setup consists of a Town Aligned Naïve PGO, a Town Aligned Cop, and a Mafia Aligned False Doctor.
As such, only the following roles/abilities have the possibility of existing within the game.
Roles that are not listed
cannot
appear in this game.
Roles/abilities that may appear in the game in their turn order: Toxic Goo, Green Goo, Motivator, Jail Keeper, Elite Bodyguard, Lawyer, Neapolitan/Vanilla Cop/Follower/Tracker.
Role modifiers that may appear in the game in their turn order: Ascetic, Weak, Conditional, Activated, Indecisive, Hated, Loved, Ninja, Percentage, X-Shot.
: flavor is for fun and is not indicative of roles, alignment, or anything else game related. For ensuring Flavor Unbreakability, the flavor matchup to each role/ability in the possible Role PMs has been randomized, rewritten, and/or created for this very purpose.
This game has been reviewed and has found to be evenly balanced, but a little swingy.
Possible Role PMs:
Last edited by AnonymousGhost on Sun Oct 14, 2018 7:20 am, edited 31 times in total.
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are [color=#BF0000]Diligence the Successful[/color].
You are aligned with the [color=#BF0000]Hardships[/color] and will win with your equal or outnumber all other faction, or nothing can prevent this from occurring. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread[/url] and [url]here is the link to your PT[/url]. You may converse with your allies during all phases inside this PT. Best of luck.
Besides your voice, your vote, and access to your faction's night kill ability and PT, here are your abilities:
[b]An Ounce of Preparation[/b] [Active]: You are a [b]Vanilla Cop[/b]. You may target someone during the Night, investigating whether or not they are a Vanilla Townie or not. "Vanilla" results are given for any role that doesn't have any individual powers (e.g., Vanilla Townie, Mafia Goon, a Serial Killer with no other powers); "Not Vanilla" results are given on all others.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are [color=#BF0000]Wrath the Vengeful[/color].
You are aligned with the [color=#BF0000]Hardships[/color] and will win with your equal or outnumber all other faction, or nothing can prevent this from occurring. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread[/url] and [url]here is the link to your PT[/url]. You have no other abilities besides your voice, your vote, and access to your faction's night kill ability and PT. Best of luck.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are [color=#BF0000]Temperance the Restrained[/color].
You are aligned with the [color=#BF0000]Hardships[/color] and will win with your equal or outnumber all other faction, or nothing can prevent this from occurring. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread[/url] and [url]here is the link to your PT[/url]. You may converse with your allies during all phases inside this PT. Best of luck.
Besides your voice, your vote, and access to your faction's night kill ability and PT, here are your abilities:
[b]Patience[/b] [Passive]: You are a [b]Conditional Ninja[/b]. If you are targeted by a tracking role, or any of the like, when you perform your faction's night kill, you will not perform the kill. If you are targeted by an investigative role that learns a target's alignment or role, you Conditional modifier will not take effect and you will perform the kill. The investigative role will receive a result.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are [color=#00BF00]Greed the Avaricious[/color].
You are aligned with the [color=#00BF00]Advantages[/color] and will win your faction eliminates any and all threats to the town. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread.[/url] Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]Bullying A Dragon[/b] [Active]: You are an [b]Indecisive Elite Bodyguard[/b]. In addition to protecting another player during the Night, you will kill whomever tried to kill your same target, but you will still die in the process. Your [b]Indecisive[/b] modifier restricts you from using your ability on the same target two nights in a row, regardless if you were successful or not the first time you used it.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are [color=#00BF00]Pride the Arrogant[/color].
You are aligned with the [color=#00BF00]Advantages[/color] and will win your faction eliminates any and all threats to the town. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread.[/url] Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]Devilish Pride[/b] [Passive]: You are [b]Ascetic[/b]. You are immune to all night actions except night kills, reflexively role blocking all actions taken against you during the night phase.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are [color=#00BF00]Charity the Compassionate[/color].
You are aligned with the [color=#00BF00]Advantages[/color] and will win your faction eliminates any and all threats to the town. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread.[/url] Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]First One's Free[/b] [Active]: You are a [b]Ninja Lawyer[/b]. You may protect a player from any investigations during the Night, causing your target to Investigate as the least incriminating result to any investigative roles e.g. Vanilla [Vanilla Cop/Neapolitan], Town [Cop], No Target [Tracker/Follower]. With the help of your [b]Ninja[/b] modifier, you will never be seen targeting anyone by roles such as Trackers, Watchers, or any other similar investigative roles.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are [color=#00BF00]Forgiveness the Absolved[/color].
You are aligned with the [color=#00BF00]Advantages[/color] and will win your faction eliminates any and all threats to the town. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread.[/url] Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]Get the Scoop[/b] [Active]: You are a [b]Neapolitan[/b]. You may investigate a player during the Night in order to discover if they are Vanilla or not. Only Vanilla Townies will return 'Vanilla' results, all other roles will return as 'Not Vanilla'.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are [color=#00BF00]Lust the Lascivious[/color].
You are aligned with the [color=#00BF00]Advantages[/color] and will win your faction eliminates any and all threats to the town. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread.[/url] Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]Love is for Children[/b] [Active]: You are a [b]Conditional Loved Tracker[/b]. During the Night, you may select a player, learning who they targeted, but not what type of action they performed. Your [b]Conditional[/b] modifier dictates that you will die if a player with an anti-town win condition targets you at any point in the game. While your [b]Loved[/b] modifier makes you require one more vote than normal in order to be lynched. Your Loved modifier will stop working during MyLo and LyLo.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are [color=#00BF00]Gluttony the Voracious[/color].
You are aligned with the [color=#00BF00]Advantages[/color] and will win with your equal or outnumber all other faction, or nothing can prevent this from occurring. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread[/url]. Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]Om Nom Nom[/b] [Active]: You are an [b]Indecisive 2-Shot Motivator[/b]. You may target a player, allowing them to use an extra action the following Night Phase, if they have any abilities. If your target does not have any active abilities, then nothing will happen to them and they will not be informed that they were Motivated. Your [b]Indecisive[/b] modifier restricts you from using your ability on the same target two nights in a row, regardless if you were successful or not, while your [b]2-Shot[/b] modifier only allows you to use your ability only two times.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are [color=#00BF00]Envy the Jealous[/color].
You are aligned with the [color=#00BF00]Advantages[/color] and will win your faction eliminates any and all threats to the town. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread.[/url] Best of luck.
Besides your voice and your vote, here are your other abilities:
[b]Green with Envy[/b] [1-Shot Active]: You are a [b]50% Toxic Goo[/b]. During any single night of your choosing, anyone who targets you with an ability will have a 50% of dying of poison at the end of the following day phase. They will be alerted that they have been poisoned and will be able to use their vote, be a viable lynch candidate for that Day Phase, and use any day abilities (if they have any).[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are [color=#00BF00]Humility the Modest[/color].
You are aligned with the [color=#00BF00]Advantages[/color] and will win your faction eliminates any and all threats to the town. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread.[/url] You have no other abilities besides your voice and your vote. Best of luck.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are [color=#00BF00]Sloth the Indolent[/color].
You are aligned with the [color=#00BF00]Advantages[/color] and will win your faction eliminates any and all threats to the town. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread.[/url] You have no other abilities besides your voice and your vote. Best of luck.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are [color=#00BF00]Kindness the Affectionate[/color].
You are aligned with the [color=#00BF00]Advantages[/color] and will win your faction eliminates any and all threats to the town. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread.[/url] You have no other abilities besides your voice and your vote. Best of luck.[/area]
[area]Welcome [b]USERNAME[/b]. You are [color=#00BF00]Chastity the Celibate[/color].
You are aligned with the [color=#00BF00]Advantages[/color] and will win your faction eliminates any and all threats to the town. Please reply to this PM to show that you have confirmed. [url]Here is the link to the discussion thread.[/url] You have no other abilities besides your voice and your vote. Best of luck.[/area]
Role PM Previews
Spoiler: All PMs
Last edited by AnonymousGhost on Sun Oct 14, 2018 7:38 am, edited 22 times in total.
- Scum Vanilla Cop and Town Lawyer target X, the Elite Bodyguard. Lawyer comes before Vanilla Cop. Therefore, ScumVC would receive the result "Vanilla", instead of "Not Vanilla" due to the Lawyer's ability.
- Town Tracker and Town Lawyer target X, the Elite Bodyguard. Lawyer comes before Tracker. Therefore, TownTracker would receive the result "X did not target anyone," instead of "X targeted Y [the EBG's target]".
Currently, it looks too scumsided. The easiest fixes would be to either throw a couple more VT's into the game or to switch one of the goons to town and add one or two 0/negative utility roles to town as well (To drop the power of the Neopolitan).
Lawyer could use clarification. I would switch the wording from "most favorable" to "least incriminating" to head off the argument that most favorable to the lawyer would be a false guilty on scum.
Ninja and tracker are both not in your list of included roles, which you should fix .
Because it's a modular setup, you can just use a list of Possible Roles instead of sample PR's. Format the Role PM's for every role you list that might be in the game and make template addition sections for your modifiers. It's extra work, but it'll raise the quality of your game immensely, imo. It also means you can specify the type of results Lawyer leaves behind (tracker would recieve No Result, for example).
Weak Ninja by MS standards wouldn't function as described. I don't think there's a role that does explicitly what you want (although I DO like the role), but you could have a modifier in your list that would be "This players action fails if [PREDETERMINED EVENT] happens." I'd probably name it Conditional, but that's a personal choice, as long as you make it clear what it does somehow.
Can you explain the scum sidedness? I actually thought that this setup would be town sided based on the mafia versus town power role ratio! XD
How would adding one or two roles drop the power of the Neapolitan? I'm guessing that it would "disguise" the mafia by providing more opportunities for receiving the "Not Vanilla" result.
Good idea with the Lawyer! I'll make that change ASAP!
I like the idea of formatting every possible role into a PM. This obviously sounds like just one PM per role, which in all reality it is (but they don't need to know that ;3), but can you provide an example of the modifier template section? Thanks!
Ah. Okay. I was going off of some recent experience where my role had the Weak modifier attached to it and it worked similarly to what I described for the Ninja. I'll change the name to Conditional, it makes more sense that way, but keep the "Weak" modifier in the Modular set up information.
That's exactly the why of the Neapolitan power drop, btw. The power of the Neapolitan is in it's ability to generate innocents. If there are fewer people it can accurately get that result on, it becomes less and less useful. Especially if there are nonsense roles like Weak Townie (If it targets scum it dies, but it can't target anyone), nonconfirmable roles like Informed Town (if their information is something you would've announced anyway or something inane) or outright negative utility roles like hated. I would shy from anything that targets though to prevent unintentionally beefing up the tracker. Maybe a visitor, but nothing confirm-able like Fruit Vendor.
Balance wise, 10v3 with some fairly significant town power is the norm. Something like Cop + JK. Adding a scum player takes the number of required mislynches down from 4 to 3. Adding a townie on the other hand doesn't change the number of mislynches, just whether you're on the MYLO or LYLO track. It ups the power of the EBG and lowers the power of the Ninja, but not enough to throw too much into question.
Power role wise, Tracker is going to get limited guilties, because most scumteams are going to use the Ninja while it's alive. Neopolitan can't get guilties, only innocents. Tracker can't get real innocents either, unless scum is already losing. And the Lawyer is going to function as a free mislynch most of the time despite the fact that it DOES have town utility in this setup. EBG is by far the most powerful role, but it can only give one inno/guilty per game.
The limited pool of fakeclaims hurts scum, but on the other hand the limited pool of roles they can be fighting lets them try to figure out exactly what they might be up against and need to play around and those two things are roughly equal depending on the strengths and weaknesses of the scumteam themselves.
Flavor wise, if you want to use more roles, you could do Acedia or one of the other prior incarnations of the sins/virtues, but honestly I think the modern ones make for a nice theme without feeling too forced.
How could I balance a setup with 14 players? I know that the even number hurts town, but I think that 11 v 3 would end up hurting the Mafia by sheer numbers. Got any advice?
Hmm. Maybe I'm not seeing something but how would increasing the number of scum reduce the chance of mislynching? Is it because of the higher probability of hitting scum? If so, then that makes sense.
So in a nutshell, what roles/modifiers would you add or throw away in both scenarios of 4 v 10 and 3 v 11?
I'm thinking I should randomize the flavor in the possible role PMs, in order to avoid people trying to break the game via flavor. Better safe than sorry!
Possible role PMs are all done! Tell me if I missed anything! I think a few of them had the "here is the link to your PT" shtick, but I think I've caught them all! So, no possible scum slips via flavor! (I hope!)
AFAICT, the PM's themselves look good to go. There were a couple of grammatical errors that I can hunt down and point out if you care, but nothing that should influence readability. (the one I can remember is an motivator instead of a motivator.) You should probably leave in a sample VT PM (The despair one was good if you still have access to that) just so scum can see the formatting, or at least put it in the scum PT. Randomizing flavor in the role PM's works, but you could also leave it vague ([Flavor Goes Here]) if you want and achieve the same goal. It kind of just depends on what you think looks better.
One thing I just saw is that you have a dead player list outside of spoilers in your OP. You might consider spoiling it just so that people reading the game after it's conclusion can choose whether to be spoiled or read along without spoilers. Not a big deal either way, but I think convention leans towards spoiling it nowadays.
11v3 is worse for mafia by sheer numbers, especially if you have any roles like doc or vig to take the town off of evens. (EBG is basically guaranteed to do so.) What that means is that you should give town less power or scum more power to compensate. 10v4 is a much larger swing though. It's not that mislynches are more likely, although they probably are since there are more scum influencing things, it's that it changes the number of mislynches scum needs to win.
In a standard 10v3 game, after the first mislynch, it's 8v3, after the second it's 6v3 and after the third it's 4v3 LYLO. In a 10v4, that changes to 8v4 then 6v4 meaning they need to lynch one less town player to win. Power helps a lot here, but your game is pretty close to balanced if you drop a VT. Maybe a little townsided, but not horribly broken.
For balance a 10v4 needs some insanely high levels of town power. Something like a guaranteed scum lynch or multiple frontloaded innos. I could see a setup with 2 pairs of masons, a ridiculous number of docs (3 would be my bet), true follow the cop with a little bit extra, a D3 guilty child, a mafia traitor who can't be recruited... etc. There's lots of ways to balance it. It just shifts the focus of the game away from dayplay towards nightplay, and I tend to argue against a lot of the roles that can do that. For example, a guilty child is probably the easiest role to fix the balance with, but for most players they're probably going to see that role PM and just not want to play the game (there are exceptions of course, but hoping you get one of the few people who would want to play guilty child is fairly naive). You could also go the route of limiting the scumkill, but games that mess with core mechanics (scum can only kill every other night, for example) tend to be very difficult to balance by their very nature because they alter the underlying concepts of mafia.
An 11v3 on the other hand just needs to have more power for the scum or less power in the hands of town. In your setup, the easiest ways to do that are A. limit the power of the EBG, B. Lower the power of the investigators, C. Give scum additional power, or D. add negative power to the town. A combination would of course work as well.
A. is pretty straightforward. You could instead of making it an Elite BG make it a 1-shot BP BG. You could give it an X-shot modifier. You could make it indecisive (can't target the same player on two consecutive nights). Anything to lower the chances that he actually hits one of the scum before they find and hit him.
B. is what I suggested. Currently, the tracker is largely a WIFOM investigator with a high chance of utility if he lives to the late game. Your big source of power here is the Neapolitan. Cutting down the number of players he can safely investigate cuts the power by making it more likely to get useless results. Additionally, more weird and useless claims gives scum more room to fakeclaim. If you put a Weak VT into the setup, who's to say you didn't also put in an informed townie who is told that flavor x is role y?
C. is usually the traditional go to, but honestly I like games with goons. You could add a scum rolecop to help find the investigatives. You could add a roleblocker to mess with Neopolitan/tracker results and allow scum to kill past the EBG. But the power light status of the scumteam seems like a feature, not a flaw, of your design.
D. is interesting, but again, I wouldn't rely only on it because most negative utility roles just aren't fun. Miller? Cool, I have to die some time! Hated? Cool, I'm a liability to town! Most of them are just not fun role PMs to get. If it works with the setup, then go for it, but I advise against negative utility unless you have a flavor or setup reason to want a specific one in the game.
This is very helpful! Like... I can't even put it into words how helpful this is helpful! I'll put the VT PM again!
Sure, I'll take the grammar errors!
I'll putz around with the possible roles I can put in.
I'd have to pick apart the part of your 10v4 paragraph in more detail, (I'm having lunch ATM), but it looks like that is slightly more complicated & swingy! I'm guessing that 11v3 wouldn't be as swingy then? Can you explain why? That way I can reduce swing in future setups!
Now, there are a lot of words I tend to use synonymously, but balance and swingy are not the same thing, I'm sure, right? Pretty sure I looked both terms up on the MS wiki, but could you give me a rehash + some examples of good/bad balance & swing? Thanks!
Ooh! I like your suggest Indecisive suggestion for the EBG! In theory, it sounds good. In practice, what would be the chances - do you think - that the EBG would target the same person two nights in a row?
Currently, the tracker is largely a WIFOM investigator with a high chance of utility if he lives to the late game.
Can you elaborate more on this, specifically the utility aspect? I have a vague idea of the Tracker's usefulness in late game, but clarification's always good!
How many VTs would replace with weird/useless Town roles?
But the power light status of the scumteam seems like a feature, not a flaw, of your design.
Sounds about right.
Scum's "biggest" weapon is having the Vanilla Cop, which basically functions like a Role Cop, but having thrown the Neapolitan in the mix will - hopefully - dissuade anyone from trying to solve the game via role mechanics & WIFOM.
It helps that it's Modular Open! Conditional Ninja's kinda neat, but Tracker's already kinda neutralized by the fact that they can't get a clear guilty on scum via the "Scum targeted X and Y" route.
At this point, town's kinda tripping over its own toes ATM w/ all the Investigative roles hopping around - which is kinda the point.
Usually when I make setups, I try to nudge the point that players shouldn't completely rely on game related mechanics *coughs*
night play
*coughs* to solve the game for them. In theory, I hope it works. In practice, it probably won't always work. *winces*
Hmm. Let's see. There are 5 town PRs, but it's actually 4 since the Neapolitan would never self-target. So that leaves 6 VTs that the Neo could get innocents on.
Got some new roles, plus I spiced up some older roles. Thoughts? I'm kinda drawing a blank as to what else I should throw in the town PR mix.
This makes 7 Town PRs [Neapolitan's not in the list since it hasn't been altered yet], but 6 when you take away the Neapolitan. So this leaves... (wow I'm bad at math)... 4 VTs (Vanilla results) that the Neapolitan can receive.
Last edited by AnonymousGhost on Sat Aug 25, 2018 4:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Which Goo is the least annoying? Toxic or Green Goo?
Green Goo is probably least annoying to Town, but it might screw scum over since - based on the wording - it would, theoretically, turn which scum targeted it into a Traitor (removes ability to access PT, to perform the NK, but remains aligned with scum).
Toxic Goo is somewhat bad cause it'd basically function like a 1-Shot PGO in this setup, except maybe not
as
bad because it basically allows its victims to be Tree Stumps.
Think I might switch out Green Goo for Toxic Goo. Thoughts?
Currently, the tracker is largely a WIFOM investigator with a high chance of utility if he lives to the late game.
Can you elaborate more on this, specifically the utility aspect? I have a vague idea of the Tracker's usefulness in late game, but clarification's always good!
Tracker basically becomes a full cop if there's only one scum left. Not
quite
that level of power, but close enough for the world of balancing a setup.
As the setup was I would add 2 0 utilities or 1 negative utility. Also, Green Goo could be useless against goons depending on the mod interpretation. It depends on whether you define PT access and nightkill ability as an ability of the player or the faction. Basically it's more about how you word the scum PM than the Goo PM. Between the two, I prefer the Toxic Goo. It has less of a swing factor, although it is still negative utility and very swingy.
AnonymousGhost wrote:Ooh! I like your suggest Indecisive suggestion for the EBG! In theory, it sounds good. In practice, what would be the chances - do you think - that the EBG would target the same person two nights in a row?
If they haven't hit before claims? High. Particularly if the Neapolitan and the Tracker claim at the same time. It's a toss up which is the better kill, and if they guess opposite the scum, they probably then can't stop the scum the next night either. Otherwise, it's still a decent chance, because if the EBG is wrong about a NK, they're still targeting for likely nightkill targets, meaning that whoever they targeted is likely to be a high priority target the next night. On the other hand, it also means they can't accidentally sit their protect on a single particularly towny scum player for the first three nights, so it's not all bad news for them.
I'll run through balance and swing in it's own post, because it's likely to turn into a wall before I'm done.
First off, Swing is not a good v bad gradient. There are fun games that are high swing and fun games that are low swing. It's all about preference and game design. As you play, you'll likely find that you like a certain level of swing in your games. As you moderate, you'll probably find that you like a certain level of swing in your games. Those will not necessarily align. Until you have the experience to gauge how much swing there actually is (which is really just reading and playing games), I always advise shooting for a middle of the road approach. On the other hand, there is most certainly good and bad balance.
Balance refers to the chances of various factions to win the game. Generally, the rule of thumb is that every player should have between a 40 and 60% chance of winning the game, with the closer to 50% the better. Obviously, this is more of a science than an art because there are so many subjective elements to mafia. Examples of bad balance would be, in the extremes, setups like 6 VTs versus 5 goons or 2 goons vs 4 cops and 3 VTs. Obviously, no one is going to want to play those games. The exception to this rule is in the cases of games involving Jesters/Cults. Both of those roles are ridiculously hard to balance, but properly advertised Jester and Cult games can be fun for the right people even if they're awful from a game design sense.
In the more complicated cases of multiball/third parties, you have further consideration. There is a bit of a preference issue involved in balance with multiple factions, and there isn't universal agreement on the correct determination. Basically, some people think that town should have a 50% chance and the scum should split the remainder, and some people think that all factions should have an even chance. I personally lean towards the former, but just be aware that when balancing multiball you will have to answer that question in your own mind.
Swing on the other hand, is a measure of how much impact the roles and mechanics will have on a player's chance to win. In general, the more complicated a setup, the swingier it is. A mountainous game would thus be the game with the lowest amount of swing while role madness tends to be high swing.
Certain roles have higher swing than others. Take for instance Cop vs Tracker. Both function in a very similar manner, giving their alignment additional information. Cop is definitely the stronger of the two (at least in the hands of town). On the other hand, Cop is a very low swing role, because it's hard to play cop in a way that hurts town. Barring getting lynched or killed without investigating, a cop is going to give useful information to the town. Tracker, on the other hand, could be very good for the town if it gets a guilty, bad for the town if it outs a PR on accident, or very bad for the town if it tracks something like a cop to the nightkill. Therefore, tracker is a high swing role. Other roles that are notoriously high swing are things like PGO (Could kill scum, could kill Doctors, and both because you were playing well as town) and Redirectors (notoriously hard to balance around). Basically, the more likely something is to generate faulty results or bite your faction in the ass, the higher it's swing.
As to where a game should fall on the swing scale, you want to have at least some, but honestly for inexperienced mods the best bet is low to medium. You could theoretically perfectly balance a 500 player mountainous nightless game using math. And no one would play it because that sounds like the most tedious garbage of all time. Similarly, Great/er/est Idea games are all more or less balanced based on the random chance element of the setup, but the level of swing involved often makes them unfun for many more 'serious' players. Queues also tend to have a certain expected level of swing to them. Normal games are usual somewhere in the mid to low range, although I have seen good Role Madness Normals with high levels of swing. Opens are almost universally low swing because of the player knowledge. If there's a way to break the setup, people will probably find it pregame, and any truly zany roles and mechanics are easily anticipated and recognized when they impact the game. Themes tend to be higher swing because that's the queue that lets you play around with weird and crazy mechanics. Regardless of your queue though, it's just a good idea to give your players as accurate an idea of the level of swing in your game as possible.
As an aside, modding philosophy:
As a mod, your number one goal should be to provide a good experience for the players. (Note, this is my opinion and is not universally shared.) My golden rule when it comes to modding is to always ask "Would the average player want to play this game?" Note, this does not translate to "Would I want to play this game?" because you'll probably find that if you make weird and zany games, you'll answer yes to the second and no to the first. That's not to say that weird and zany games are bad, but that you should always let people know what to expect from your style of modding.
Now, as for how balance and swing play into each other, that's a little more complicated. The short answer is that eventually you'll get a feel for what is and isn't balanced. How long that process takes is entirely based on the individual, and even the best sometimes drop the ball. The long answer is that there are a series of things you can look at to determine what your rough level of balance is, but it's still largely subjective.
First off, the common milestones. Most games are based around an established set of numbers of players. The closer you get to one of these sets, the easier it will be to balance the game. These are, for singleball,
7v2
10v3
13v4
18v5
Multiball is harder, because you have a larger range based on how you want to balance the factions against each other. Additionally, adding factions adds swing, which makes balance harder.
Once you've got your starting point, (or you've tweaked your starting point) you can start playing with roles and mechanics to bring things more in line. The things I always consider/tell people to consider when balancing a game are pretty straightforward.
How many of your roles are unlynchable? By that I mean things like Innocent Child, Doctor or Mason, where barring incredibly bad play, a claim should get you out of most jams. Obviously, scum fakeclaims can override that, but you can pretty much assume that the Doc is never going to be a mislynch.
How many mislynches does scum need to win? This, in most cases, is pretty straightforward. Cases like vigs, hiders and suicidal modifiers can change the math, but you can usually tell exactly how many town players scum are going to have to get to the gallows to win at the outset of the game. (This is the number of mislynches bit that came up earlier).
How many potential innocents do you have per night? (2, but most commonly one)
How many potential deaths do you have per night? (2)
How many potential guilties do you have per night? (1)
In the best possible play for town, how early is the game unwinnable for scum based off of innocents? (D3) (EBG and Neapolitan are probably unlynchable roles, Neapolitan can inno one per night. Neapolitan can get an extra inno off of Motivator. Motivator targeting town PR makes it unlynchable. Therefore, possibly 6 unlynchable slots with 10 alive on D3, with optimal results (none of the unlynchables/innos killed, Neapolitan targeting only VTs, Motivator targeting Neapolitan D1.))
In the best possible play for scum, how early is the game unwinnable for town? (D4) (EBG misses every night and claims/dies, town mislynches four times.)
Generally speaking, anything more than three for the first three questions is too swingy and anything earlier than Night 2 for the last two is too swingy. If a game can be decided D1 and it isn't in the micro queue, you should probably put a lot of effort into making sure people know what they're signing up for.
.
role PMs to the ones in the spoiler!