Open 741: Red Flag [Endgame]

[northsidegal]

Votecount 1.11

THE MEME MEN (2):

Aster 297, Gamma Emerald 311

Volxen (2):

Blackjacks 238, THE MEME MEN 384

Firebringer (1):

Clemency 394

Springtrap (2):

Firebringer 442, Nibbui 470

Blackjacks (4):

Keyser Söze 635, RadiantCowbells 666, Volxen 709, ceejayvinoya 710

RadiantCowbells (1):

pinturicchio 694

Not voting (1):

Springtrap

With 13 alive, it’s 7 to lynch. The Day 1 deadline is in (expired on 2018-12-09 14:42:59).

[pinturicchio]

One last thing before leaving:
VOTE: Springtrap
I'm townreading Nibbui and trusting you on this, Growlithe.

[Nibbui]

1) that question goes for you too
2) you've seen me hard read people for far less and been correct about it

1)yeah, kinda, I still saw/played around 6 or 7 games with you though so I've at least a shallow knowledge about you. Not that reliable indeed.
2)I've seen you hard read people for one post yes, but the difference is that I actually though that the post you were reading them for was AI, you can be right and be town here maybe but as of now I don't know how you did hard tr Volxen. About BJ I get your point.

I'm mulling over about Volxen's recent posts rn

[RadiantCowbells]

What was your motivation in making this post? The part about warning people about voting. We aren't in lylo, so why would all four scum be inclined to all join the same wagon and quicklynch a townie on day one, when that would potentially bring all four of them under a lot of scrutiny on day two? Especially if the four scum were all the last four voters on the wagon and quickly voted back-to-back to bring the wagon to lynch. In lylo it would make sense for that to happen, but it doesn't make sense for the scumteam to do that on day one. It seems strange to be discouraging voting this early on in the game, especially since voting/pressuring is one way to help the game transition from "RVS" to "serious mode".

this was in and of itself a lot more town indicative than anyone else is giving it credit for.

[Springtrap]

Guess I'll become a counterwagon and a decent lynch of I dont do something.

VOTE: Blackjacks

[Nibbui]

RC, assuming you're town, in what scale are you going to be mad at me and find unreasonable that I'm entertaining you being scum here a lot?

and no this isn't average RC-paranoia I think, there's games from you that when I was reading I did find your posts very towny,

I very probably am not good at reading you but this simply doesn't sound like town!RC right now

Guess I'll become a counterwagon and a decent lynch of I dont do something.

VOTE: Blackjacks

if you're ever town this game you should really reconsider your behavior in post-game

and this is coming from someone that had a horrible behavior as well, albeit different.

You need to be lynched before LyLo if you're going to act this way.

[Gamma Emerald]

Guess I'll become a counterwagon and

a decent lynch

of I dont do something.

VOTE: Blackjacks

Wut

[ceejayvinoya]

lols

[Nibbui]

This d1 has gone wrong beyond repair. I'm like:

Do I vote Ruru for being completely meta-weird and side with RC even though I'm scum leaning him

Do I go for Volxen for reasons already discussed

RC and Pintu because I feel their reads have been kinda forced?

or do I go for Spring and Clemency for their very anti-town behavior?

All of them sounds good and bad tbh

I've lost my drive on Volxen considerably though until I carefully check his scum game

[RadiantCowbells]

i'm over it man. just be honest with yourself.

[RadiantCowbells]

you at least have the dubious advantage of having incorrectly scumread me as the dark wanderer as well so I take it less personally.

[Nibbui]

you at least have the dubious advantage of having incorrectly scumread me as the dark wanderer as well so I take it less personally.

yeah my bad on that game, I'm indeed not good on reading you

However I'm even trying to use that game to compare you here

You seemed different in a certain way that game that I don't want to disclose unless I'm going for your lynch, but now that I think about it, you did town read people kinda fast as well I guess...

considering that, I can back off from you for now and see what happens for a bit longer I guess

I think I'm going either for Spring, Black or Volxen for today

Unless something changes when I read Volxen's game, I'm more interested in either Black or Spring

What do you think of Spring? I know he sounds kinda lynchbaity but I've never seen someone post in that ratio and don't do anything relevant

Actually I kinda experienced it but it was against scum!Sashadin in a newbie game

[Nibbui]

Also I got interested on something, why did you town read me here while did scum read me there?

Or is it because I flipped town there and you changed how you approach my slot?

[Blackjacks]

zzz

RC's case on me is more town than the keyser/volxen/springtrap votes, not that it makes him town or anything, but I pretty much expect him to want me out of the game, in any game, as either alignment, and my iso is objectively different from my town meta on my main so whatever.

Keyser can be read by postcount and he stopped postcounting here which is questionable, he's also voteparking us with a "sorting" vote while not really doing anything even though we've apparently developed into a Serious wagon
tbh nobody's really doing anything in this game us included so it's hard to get reads.

I think volxen is scum, ofrhz is starting to doubt it after his realtime posting spree but I don't know if we have any better shared reads than volxen

Springtrap is a token nullscum read but I don't know if he's too likely to be actual scum

I kinda townread clemency's utter lack of contribution, I think isos like volxen that are trying to look like they're playing the game are much more likely to flip scum

Idc mafia right now, I'm on this account because my last game wasn't fun even though I won and efforting is too stressful so if we're going to get lynched for not efforting just lynch us so we flip and we'll go play another game where people can meta us better assuming ofrhz doesn't disown me for trolling all game

[Nibbui]

Black, what do you think of Ceejay?

I think his vote on you is one of the worst ones as well.

[Blackjacks]

His vote was weird but idk if it's scummy weird or just weird

I don't know how to read ceejay at all, ofrhz might have a better opinion

[RadiantCowbells]

this is really not personal ruru, my dislike of the way that you view mafia is independent of my read on you

i stand by having found you trivially easy to read in most games, if you're actually town here then all you are obligated to do is give this game like a day of solid effort and i'll figure out that you're town and you can shitpost and troll or do whatever the rest of the game. i don't want to mislynch you if you're town but avoiding making posts that you can be read off of and then deflecting from the 1v1 with me is pretty much exactly what scum!you should be doing here and I'm not losing this game to scum!you

[Blackjacks]

I didn't say it's personal, I just think you think it's -ev for me to exist in your game because you lump me among some set of people who ruin your games

like lynches are based on reads but they're also based on ev. when you or I play mafia, sometimes we don't lynch the scummiest player, we lynch the player most likely to lose us the game and I think you believe that I tend to treat your slot in an unreasonable way.

[RadiantCowbells]

what should I be doing differently right now?

[RadiantCowbells]

you're right that i think that lynching you is genuinely +some ev, some of the time. in this setup only two scum lynches are required and i'm super unlikely to get a chance to impact more than one lynch. i'm not sure if you're spinning this strategically or just misunderstanding me as a person, but if you weren't my top scumread i wouldn't be voting you here, ever. and you have an extremely easy time proving yourself as town so i don't think expecting you to actually put in the minimal effort to townfirm yourself is an unreasonable expectation

[Blackjacks]

Itt blackjacks tries to convince their top scumread that they are town

for the record, posts like this make me not want to engage you because they're completely unreasonable and dealing with people who are being completely unreasonable might maximize winrate but it doesn't maximize fun. like, I don't think you actually hold this viewpoint about our posting. because of your playstyle, that doesn't make you scum, it makes you {town trying to brute force a lynch that you believe in, town reaction testing, scum trying to look like one of those}. ofrhz used the hurt2 tag in our pt and apparently didn't feel like engaging you either.

I think your townread on volxen is scummy but that makes you 34% scum or whatever which doesn't make me want to 1v1 you because {it's not enjoyable, I don't believe in policy lynching you in this setup anyway}.

[Blackjacks]

you're right that i think that lynching you is genuinely +some ev, some of the time. in this setup only two scum lynches are required and i'm super unlikely to get a chance to impact more than one lynch. i'm not sure if you're spinning this strategically or just misunderstanding me as a person, but if you weren't my top scumread i wouldn't be voting you here, ever. and you have an extremely easy time proving yourself as town so i don't think expecting you to actually put in the minimal effort to townfirm yourself is an unreasonable expectation

I'm probably partially projecting how I think about mafia onto you because you win games or something

[Blackjacks]

also scum.me is literally too incompetent to have this conversation right now, and my trysoft meta on this alt is already ruined, thanks a lot.

[RadiantCowbells]

i mean i could say the same regarding you policy lynching me to maximize winrate and i think that's several rungs lower on the not maximizing fun ladder than exaggerating pushes to get things through but i don't really want to fight with you and i'm not feeling as good about my read on you so i'd rather we just take a break from each other. sorry if you're town.

UNVOTE:

[Blackjacks]

I don't play to maximize fun on my main, I play to maximize winrate

believe me I had no fun on day 1 in purgatory