Open 741: Red Flag [Endgame]

[Blackjacks]

(also, I didn't policy lynch you)

[RadiantCowbells]

i play to maximize winrate and still believe there are some lines of fun/winrate that you don't cross and i would say policy lynching people because they are good as scum is one of them.
my substitution was spending an inordinate amount of time learning to read e.g. lady lamdadelta so that i can deal with them and i recommend you adopt that strategy instead.
no one really cares if you can successfully lynch a top tier scum by policy lynching them but learning to read them pays dividends.

(also, I didn't policy lynch you)

you even advocating it completely threw me out of the game and made me just want it over. and i'm not so sure if i actually played to win that game if you wouldn't have policy lynched me in the end.

[RadiantCowbells]

i don't really play to maximize winrate so much as i play to maximize my personal ability to win games

i would get basically nothing out of a game i won by policy lynching a good scum player besides a feeling of regret that i wasn't good enough to catch them myself.

[volxen]

zzz

RC's case on me is more town than the keyser/volxen/springtrap votes, not that it makes him town or anything, but I pretty much expect him to want me out of the game, in any game, as either alignment, and my iso is objectively different from my town meta on my main so whatever.

Keyser can be read by postcount and he stopped postcounting here which is questionable, he's also voteparking us with a "sorting" vote while not really doing anything even though we've apparently developed into a Serious wagon
tbh nobody's really doing anything in this game us included so it's hard to get reads.

I think volxen is scum, ofrhz is starting to doubt it after his realtime posting spree but I don't know if we have any better shared reads than volxen

Springtrap is a token nullscum read but I don't know if he's too likely to be actual scum

I kinda townread clemency's utter lack of contribution

, I think isos like volxen that are trying to look like they're playing the game are much more likely to flip scum

Idc mafia right now, I'm on this account because my last game wasn't fun even though I won and efforting is too stressful so if we're going to get lynched for not efforting just lynch us so we flip and we'll go play another game where people can meta us better assuming ofrhz doesn't disown me for trolling all game

Why do you townread Clemency's "utter lack of contribution"?

[Blackjacks]

i don't really play to maximize winrate so much as i play to maximize my personal ability to win games

i would get basically nothing out of a game i won by policy lynching a good scum player besides a feeling of regret that i wasn't good enough to catch them myself.

I'm just less honorable I guess?

on a personal level I feel no regret pling players who are {scumreading me, acting anti-town, historically bad at town}

you're an unusual case because you're like actually good at the game in a way that doesn't involve having terrible winrates as one alignment or the other so I actually would feel regret pling you (although I would still do it in, say, nightless vanilla if I had no scumreads). that probably factored into how I played purgatory. that, and the fact that uglyduck was incredibly scummy

I do strongly believe in mechanical sorting (policy copping you and bop) when they're available options, and I know you hate those too, but whatever

[RadiantCowbells]

to me you're more interested in numbers on a page than what those numbers actually represent.

[Nibbui]

I liked this BJ vs Radiant

It definitely doesn't feel like s/s and it kinda seems t/t. Maybe s/t or t/s, but just maybe.

I feel good about considering it t/t as of now.

[Nibbui]

I was going to sleep but I couldn't stop mulling over something

yeah I think this is scum actually

VOTE: Ceejay

Ceejay, why do you think I'm sus of you?

Also, why did you roll scum against me again? :/

[Keyser Söze]

I think RC is likely right about BlackJacks. I've never played with Ruru, and my only experience with Orfhz is in another ongoing game, and yet both of them are convinced I'm scum because I don't have tons of posts in this game already. They even have referenced some of my previous town games, without even taking into account things such as that I do sometimes have gaps in my posts as both alignments, or that I often do better after day 1 when I have more information to work with via flips.

I don't feel like BlackJacks wants to sort my alignment, but rather it feels like both heads of the hydra just want to push a mislynch through.

Hi Volxen talk with me

I feel that BJ is hard pushing you without reconsidering it that much, yes. That point I can somewhat agree.

However the post they linked here from your town game sounded very differently than your posts here.

You didn't see engaged in sorting anyone alignment aside from posting things everyone had already said and approved, nor do you right now seem to focus on anything but avoiding your lynch or saying that BJ is scum.

Do you really think it's weird to scum read you here? I don't think it would be that hard for you to actually sound townier if you had some motivation.

What I'm saying is that the conclusion "Volxen hasn't made tons of posts = Volxen is scum" is overly simplistic, and I have a hard time believing that is coming from a townie who really wants to solve the game. For instance, you are at least trying to engage with me, whereas BlackJacks has multiple posts calling for my lynch.

Either he is scum, or he has some misguided preconceived notion of what town!Volxen looks like and thinks I'm scum because I'm not living up to that expectation. Considering he has never played with town!me in any of my completed town games, him posting as if he is some sort of expert on my town meta is fairly suspect.

I feel this is Volxen’s best post so far:
- does feel like they’ve taken a step back in their head and rationalized scum-BJ vs town-BJ
- I do empathise with Volxen’s ‘push my misslynch through’ mentality
- looking at different player’s approach on their slot (instead of being stuck in OMGUS against the one slot - it’s easier for scum to just stay tunnelled until their attacker backs down).
- under scrutiny by Nib but their reaction looks composed and defiant


This is a different Volxen to WatchersWanted scum-Volxen.

[Keyser Söze]

Aster requiring “quantifiable reasons” from RC demonstrates what two different players they are

@Aster have you played with RC before?

[Gamma Emerald]

This mentioning of policing lynching is making me tune out the game
I agree that lynching the scummiest person is smartest

[Keyser Söze]

Chainsaw defense is when you defend a partner right? I don't agree with that then but it's a good and fair point, very close to what I believe

Does scum-RC hard defend town-Volxen for towncred? I don’t think so.

I had him as null with all the anti town shit he did, but that changed with volxen towning it up

I don’t understand how your personal read development of Volxen is related to RC’s nose-dive trajectory... Are you saying RC should be developing reads to the same pace and intensity as your own?

[Keyser Söze]

Guess I'll become a counterwagon and a decent lynch of I dont do something.

VOTE: Blackjacks

Interesting...

[Keyser Söze]

zzz

RC's case on me is more town than the keyser/volxen/springtrap votes, not that it makes him town or anything, but I pretty much expect him to want me out of the game, in any game, as either alignment, and my iso is objectively different from my town meta on my main so whatever.

Keyser can be read by postcount and he stopped postcounting here which is questionable, he's also voteparking us with a "sorting" vote while not really doing anything even though we've apparently developed into a Serious wagon
tbh nobody's really doing anything in this game us included so it's hard to get reads.

I think volxen is scum, ofrhz is starting to doubt it after his realtime posting spree but I don't know if we have any better shared reads than volxen

Springtrap is a token nullscum read but I don't know if he's too likely to be actual scum

I kinda townread clemency's utter lack of contribution, I think isos like volxen that are trying to look like they're playing the game are much more likely to flip scum

Idc mafia right now, I'm on this account because my last game wasn't fun even though I won and efforting is too stressful so if we're going to get lynched for not efforting just lynch us so we flip and we'll go play another game where people can meta us better assuming ofrhz doesn't disown me for trolling all game

BJ, this is probably your first self-reflective post.

Until then you have been in tunnel mode versus Volxen (like possessed by an agenda to push through Volxen’s lynch since the start).

I don’t think anyone has had any meaningful interactions with you.


What’s changed your vibe then? The Springtap vote?

[pinturicchio]

Chainsaw defense is when you defend a partner right? I don't agree with that then but it's a good and fair point, very close to what I believe

Does scum-RC hard defend town-Volxen for towncred? I don’t think so.

I had him as null with all the anti town shit he did, but that changed with volxen towning it up

I don’t understand how your personal read development of Volxen is related to RC’s nose-dive trajectory... Are you saying RC should be developing reads to the same pace and intensity as your own?

I dont really care about RC right now, I'm leaving that slot to the rest of you. But what I meant about volxen was towning it up is that RC' defense was too intense for someone who posted once and with low contribution in said post.

[Nibbui]

Look on Ceejay's ISO guys.

- He actually tries to frame Volxen the same way he did in a scum game of his

- He doesn't take a firm position on anyone

- He doesn't follow up on his questions

- Later when Volxen says that Ceejay did try to frame him as scum, he gives up and votes BlackJack when their wagon starts to build up

- He posts in the thread but ignores or don't read my posts about him

I'm afraid of leaving Spring alone though...

But yeah I think Ceejay is scum here, again.

[Nibbui]

Ceejay you either show me that towny-Ceejay that I love and like or I'm gonna need to tunnel you here :/

Just re:read Spring's ISO and although he has potential to flip scum, his slot is kinda like a coin flip right now. We can lynch that later.

I get real scum vibes from your ISO however.

I'm scum reading you to the point of almost wanting to strongarm your lynch and take some responsability if you don't flip red.

[Nibbui]

Like, I mislynched you once and did scum read you right twice. I don't have much confidence in sorting you and it's not a reliable ratio.

However, this game you've been playing very different than when I mislynched you or than any of the games I played with town-you.

Do you agree?

[northsidegal]

AnonymousGhost replaces THE MEME MEN.

[AnonymousGhost]

This better show up in my "View Your Posts" list....

UNVOTE:

So... what the hell did I miss?

[Springtrap]

I noticed I was being scummy, so now I'm being quiet and accepting that I'll have to be lynched before LyLo or MyLo but I'd rather not hurt town by being hung day 1. Hence, being quiet.

I'll mainly use my vote as an incentive for town to use at their leisure until I see something of true value being pushed. Blackjacks does seem more town though.

UNVOTE:

[Nibbui]

This better show up in my "View Your Posts" list....

UNVOTE:

So... what the hell did I miss?

mmmmh, we all being scummy I guess?

Welcome to the party AG!

I noticed I was being scummy, so now I'm being quiet

and accepting that I'll have to be lynched before LyLo or MyLo but I'd rather not hurt town by being hung day 1. Hence, being quiet.

I'll mainly use my vote as an incentive for town to use at their leisure until I see something of true value being pushed. Blackjacks does seem more town though.

UNVOTE:

No...like...
If you don't want to be scummy, I would say you simply need to post more your thoughts, your list and engage more with us

Really sorry if I was too rude about the "horrible behavior" thing but I just got frustated that so many slots are being harder than usual to be read here.

Sorry, for real.

That said, if you just keep being quiet and all, you'll only sound scummier, however, I'm sure that if you put some effort in doing what I said, you can probably improve a lot your play (regardless of alignment) and who knows...

maybe get to a "strong town read" status by us!!

Really, just let your thoughts about the game flow in your posts and therefore in the thread. That's all we're asking you and Clemency for.

[Nibbui]

I mean, Spring, even if your posts are scummy, regardless of alignment the medicine isn't to keep quiet/stop posting.

Even if you end up lynched as scum here or mislynched as town, I would say that at least you'll be improving your play instead of not progressing by becoming a lurker.

[AnonymousGhost]

mmmmh, we all being scummy I guess?

Elaborate?

[northsidegal]

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