Mini 2059: Secrets of the Anuket Topaz [Over]

[Brigitte]

hey is your dog doing better?

[xRECKONERx]

she still has to be like carried up and down stairs but she's stopped yelping so i think the pain is going away

[Chara]

Do you really want me to unload that? I think you will get upset by it and Id rather save it for you postgame.

can pretty much guarantee i won't be upset. say whatever bad thing about my play or personality you'd like to say.

pedit: good to hear.

[Brigitte]

Do you really want me to unload that? I think you will get upset by it and Id rather save it for you postgame.

can pretty much guarantee i won't be upset. say whatever bad thing about my play or personality you'd like to say.

pedit: good to hear.

Because I see you as a person who is very agreeable and very easily convinced by a lot of the superficials in mafia which includes the confidence of people who push things. I was actually a bit surprised when you unvoted me and your reasoning behind it again was questionable to me, I would have argued against it. I think you are person that looks at a wagon sees people who you are townreading who are confidently pushing the wagon and that convinces you.

Versus the wagon which is being pushed not as confidently but just as a counter wagon to me. I think you had very bad reasoning to move of me, which to my knowledge was that I was agreeing wiith your points and giving you some positive support, and I think at this point you are going for what you think has higher chance of being right, which is more on the townreads you think are certain of themselves.

Is any of this incorrect?

[Brigitte]

she still has to be like carried up and down stairs but she's stopped yelping so i think the pain is going away

That's nice to hear. Give the doggo my best

[Chara]

hm, i think you're right about why i unvoted you initially.

but you're wrong about why i voted you again. the reason was what i said. i had no concept of who was voting where or how many players were on each wagon when i made the vote. and sheeping Ankamius, who went from having me in her scumlist to saying she wasn't fully sure about things, isn't something i'd want to do.

i asked because i was interested to see how much we'd played together in the past. i'm now more convinced you're not any of the players i thought you might be, because your idea of me isn't quite right. i can see how you came to the conclusion, however.

that you thought i'd be upset by that is another indicator, haha. but thanks for the in depth answer.

why didn't you argue against me unvoting you?

[Ankamius]

I'm going to sleep since I still want to hibernate despite having to work early tomorrow anyways

Vote Brigitte please, it's more likely to flip scum and gives more information

[Brigitte]

why didn't you argue against me unvoting you?

I wasn't in the mood to argue it. I posted that I could be negative if you wanted as a kind of silly jest post and was my kind of push back on it at the moment.

Didn't seem worth going into. Kind of like my skitter argument I just had. Probably not worth it.

[Brigitte]

I'm going to sleep since I still want to hibernate despite having to work early tomorrow anyways

Vote Brigitte please, it's more likely to flip scum and gives more information

I haven't been following your tris read. Are you townreading tris here?

[Ankamius]

With the wagon that popped up on her being this sketchy and how convenient the timing is while all of my comfortable townreads staying on this side, you could say that

[Brigitte]

Yeah those are all bad arguments, but I get how you think that makes it good.

[Chara]

i wonder what you consider to be a good argument, Brigitte.

[Ankamius]

lol

[Ankamius]

good night

[Brigitte]

Ones I make are decent. Most of the time. Maybe half the time.

[Succinct]

I assume tris is referring to this post? It's the only one I've posted that includes a rough idea of where the game is at even though we've had developments since then

Spoiler:

I have more to say on that and how my fundamental thought process as town works and WHY I've gone this specific route for this specific situation, but I'm pretty certain it'll just get written off as self meta so I'll just stop here and leave the thread for a while

i'd be interested in hearing this, when you get back

Okay.

My town thought process generally follows these guidelines:

1. Get initial reads that I'm reasonably confident in.
2. Build a picture for what the gamestate is looking like, where the overall trajectory is heading, and where the scum influence in that gamestate/trajectory are
3. Test that theory by shaking up the gamestate enough that everyone has to adjust to what I'm doing.
4. Narrow down where the scumteam are likely to be in the game, and narrow down the slots that are most likely the scum causing the scum influence in the game.
5. Rebuild the gamestate so that town is naturally going to find my townreads as town and my PoE as scum.

So essentially, my job in most games is to find where scum are weakest and force town to scumhunt within that area. The tactics change, but that's fundamentally what I'm doing from game to game.

Relating to this game specifically, my read on the gamestate began with this:

1. There was overwhelming support among the active players to lynch the NotMySpamAccount slot
2. Most of those slots were townreading each other.
3. The rest of the slots were pretty much absent entirely.

Initial deductions are: If scum are within the active slots, they are already well on their way to pocketing the active town within them. It's unlikely that all the scum are in the lurker slots because it's ultimately dangerous to allow that many town slots to townread each other so easily within the game and agree on one slot. Therefore, it's very likely that there is

some

scum intent in killing NMSA, which means that either NMSA is a mislynch or that scum are okay bussing him.

I can abuse those deductions and test them by building the increasing suspicion on my slot to force people to pay attention to me instead of NMSA. It's important to note here that I can toneread people much more easily when they are targeting me because I can direct their thoughts in a way that can reveal to me whether they are legitimately falling for my trick and scumreading me... or faking it. I assumed that either people would be very split among scumreading me and how much they were scumreading me, or there would be a good deal of melding... which would strongly indicate there's scum within that bracket since that would be evidence to my theory that scum are within the active players/NMSA voters, and therefore looking to pocket themselves into the active towns.

I eliminated Reck from that bracket since he was aggressively pushing his own wagon; I don't suspect this is to save NMSA because of the above deductions, I'm not getting the sense he's trying to

derail

town by throwing them down a different path since he's aggressive, but not RC-levels of aggressive. And lastly, the way he was treating my slot was indicative of him critically thinking about whether my slot is scum or not, which is not 100% unfakeable if my read of him is correct, but it's more than enough to leave him out of my PoE list for a good while until I have reason to revisit it.

I used the fake hammer to get the reads too, and purposely amplified people's emotional reactions to get people to further react to me and reveal their mindset, since legitimate emotional reactions that make sense with the situation and their internal logic is NOT easy to fake. Brigitte failed this spectacularly. urap2 became a decently strong townread because of when and how he reframed his reads (I still don't believe he wanted to pocket me, this was well before I started getting any townreads other than like... Reck).

The rest of my provoking people was mainly to see how they would react and how their read of me would shift as I continued posting. You perfectly nailed what I was looking to come off as, cocky at being obvtown and never able to be lynched this game; this is why I kept up the snark for so long and kept posting about how hard I am to lynch as town (which IS true, none of that was a lie). I strongly suspected that scum would either back off, or strain themselves in a tunnel against me under the opinion that they

couldn't

back off. Enter somewhat fits this, but I don't have enough to really place it anywhere concrete, and Brigitte pretty well failed this.

I think this is roughly everything?

Oh, that one. Skimmed it, but it didn't seem like a summary.
Is the game really "some slots townread each other, almost lynched NMSA together", nothing more?
If so, who were all the NMSA voters?

I should have a confident sr by now but I only have confident townreads.

Enough of those're superior to having scumreads.

Name them.

Not much time to post, but skitter is a strong townread, and it should be easier for everyone else to see now why Nim and Brig are scum.

Not convinced on Nimueh, but skitter-town/Brigitte-scum, can see.

Like I remember he was in my scum pool but fucked if I know why anymore

Experience says odds're slot's scum.

I like my company on the Brigitte wagon way more than the tris wagon, it looks suspicious as hell to me

Agreed.

Creature

>

skitter30 > tris = Ankamius

>

Nimueh >

Xtoxm = xRECKONERx = NotMySpamAccount = Elbirn = Chara

(need more on all of these)

>

Flubbernugget = Brigitte

Barring further info.

VOTE: Brigitte

[Brigitte]

That is L-1.
I will self hammer tomorrow.

[Chara]

you have so many words on why my decision and skitter's decision to townread you earlier was bad... but you have a stock phrase against arguments for tris to be town when you don't really have a good reason for her to be scum.

though if you're town and this is your thought process i have to say it's a fascinating one.

pedit: oh hello, Succint!
...*forgets if the main is outed or not*

[skitter30]

Not much time to post, but skitter is a strong townread, and it should be easier for everyone else to see now why Nim and Brig are scum.

So that means you couldn’t possibly be wrong then?

She was a strong tr in that game I just linked too, that’s how she won.

no offense, but given that i'm quite good at obvtowning when i'm, like, town, telling people to be wary of me by virtue of the fact that i got townread in a scumgame is dumb given that i get townread as both alignments

==

Couldn't Brigitte have acted like she did to give the appearances that she doesn't care about getting lynched. If that's what she was trying to do, it seems to have worked,

That was my point, that it wasn’t a valid reason for Skitter to locktown her on and her defensiveness to my pointing that out is pinging me, amongst other things.

I didn’t sr Enter because it felt like he really believed in his sr on me. I’m obviously a lot more suspicious of NMSA - mainly because of the absurd me/Brigitte linking but his push on me still sounds more believable to me, than Skitter’s. Skitter seems to me to be looking for reasons to push me. This becomes super obvious, when you compare her reads on me with someone like Chara, who clearly lacks any agenda wrt his read on me is concerned.

a) i didn't locktown brigitte, don't misrep me

b) i'm not looking for reasons to push you

==

I'm only seeing one subtle difference from her play in that game to the town game I saw from her recently and that same metric doesn't fit this game.

(i'd be kinda interested in hearing more about this (maybe in like post-game or whatever) because i think those two games are quite different actually)

==

Skitter is pushing a sr on me partially based on this vote. Chara along with Tris, are amongst the people she seems to be pushing. I’m suspicious of her, because she seems to be sr me on a for a lot of NAI reasons, including this vote and earlier she jumped on me re: the Reck L-1 thing. In a nutshell, despite at her own admission not having “confident” reads, she immediately jumps on things she should either view as NAI or questioning me about, instead of immediately jumping to a sc of me. Her disregarding the reads of someone, who otoh, does actually have a confident read on me - Ankamius - is very concerning to me.

a) i acknowledged i could be scumreading you for nai reasons, which is why i'm not, like, voting you, given that i don't know if i actualy scumread your or not. not sure why your'e characterizing me as jumping on you or trying to lynch you given that i said i might want to vote you but *chose not to*, and the fact that i'm like dancing around committing to scumreading you because i for the life of me can't tell whether or not my read is actually based on things that have happened in this game.

b) yes, when i cite ank's read on you as a reason why i'm not voting you i am disregarding ank's read, that makes a lot of sense

==

not really townreading creature yet
tris wagon is kinda gross actually

ngl one of the reasons i started it was to see if *that* would gain some momentum given that the four previous wagons were all pretty stagnant and the fact that a bunch of sketchy people (and/or people i don't really have reads on) voted there is kinda meh

tris(5) ~ skitter30(221), Brigitte(240), Elbirn(217), Creature(36), Flubbernugget(78)

so i know i'm town
pretty sure elbirn is town

don't have good reads on brigitte or creature or flubber
i'd probably rank them best to worst as brigitte >>> creature > flubber
but like this is not such a clean wagon

the brigitte one is still pretty pure

Brigitte(4) ~ Ankamius(304), tris(119), xRECKONERx(124), Xtoxm(255)

i like everyone on here except maybe tris herself
xtoxm i'm kinda null on but urap was obvtown so that's fine

i'll probably switch to brigitte but i'm going to finish catching up first

==

I like my company on the Brigitte wagon way more than the tris wagon, it looks suspicious as hell to me

oh yeah i agree with this

==

i've come around to town!chara i think

==

yeah i'm caught up
UNVOTE:

the speed/sketchiness of the tris wagon is weirding me out and i don't like the people voting on it
my gut says brigitte isn't scum tho, but it's a much better wagon

p-edit and succinct was enter right?
it's a townie wagon but i dont' think brigitte is scum; i don't think scum says they'll self-hammer

[skitter30]

That is L-1.
I will self hammer tomorrow.

like this isn't a scummy reaction imo

[Succinct]

oh hello, Succint!
...*forgets if the main is outed or not*

Not to my knowledge.

[skitter30]

Creature > skitter30 > tris = Ankamius > Nimueh > Xtoxm = xRECKONERx = NotMySpamAccount = Elbirn = Chara (need more on all of these) > Flubbernugget = Brigitte

boy am i interested in hearing more about these (specifically: me, creature, chara, nimueh, and tris)

[Brigitte]

I already said my tris reasoning wasn't all there. I take offense its just stock phrases. How rude of you Chara.
I am scum leaning tris, and I don't have enough energy to do a deep dive or analysis of tris, but I don't think it will help? I think in my current mindset I would be very biased to reading posts to be saying things like "X post is scum!" when it might not be very scummy.

[Chara]

i've come around to town!chara i think

but why

[skitter30]

i don't know