Fire on the Mountain [Over]
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- northsidegal
- northsidegal
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northsidegal
- Survivor
- Survivor
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- Joined: August 23, 2017
This is maybe Scum though.In post 318, Xtoxm wrote:challenge acceptedIn post 315, DoubtingThomas wrote:good luck trying to lynch me
VOTE: dt
I claim scum \o/
there we go
took longer than usual for someone to call me scum
took longer than usual for someone to call me scum
Smooth as silk when he's scum, and very much capable of running things from behind the scenes while appearing to be doing minimal effort. - Almost50
Xtoxm is consistently great - Shosin
you were the only wolf i townread at endgame - the worst
Xtoxm is consistently great - Shosin
you were the only wolf i townread at endgame - the worst
Also dislike this.
Looking to dip the toes in the pond.
I claim scum \o/
- Extrapolated Eagle
- Extrapolated Eagle
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Extrapolated Eagle
- Mafia Scum
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Can you sell me on it?In post 357, Shoshin wrote:Hey Vedith, can you vote DT please?
I quite like DT and the only time I haven't seen him more vocal or maybe as more of an aggressive stance is when he was Scum in the dance thingy.
I claim scum \o/
Game just finished so I can post it
Please read this game: https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=78729
To see why anti-town behavior is counter-productive.
I am sure this is just one example out of hundreds of games. It certainly wasn't my first experience with it.
I am playing on this account so you'll excuse me if I don't get into a debate I've had too many times. Just posting a very recent and specifically relevant perspective as this us just a larger version of that game.
And yes town did win. But it wasn't because town self-voted. We won LUCKILY
Please read this game: https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=78729
To see why anti-town behavior is counter-productive.
I am sure this is just one example out of hundreds of games. It certainly wasn't my first experience with it.
I am playing on this account so you'll excuse me if I don't get into a debate I've had too many times. Just posting a very recent and specifically relevant perspective as this us just a larger version of that game.
And yes town did win. But it wasn't because town self-voted. We won LUCKILY
despite
the self-votes.My main is BuJaber.
- Extrapolated Eagle
- Extrapolated Eagle
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Extrapolated Eagle
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2626
- Joined: October 26, 2015
- Location: Atop my eyrie looking down on the world
That's not a great way to push a "self-voting isn't bad" argument.In post 362, Shoshin wrote:I've never seen a town lose because of a self-vote.
"@EE
Aside from that entire post being annoying as fuck, your scumread on me makes no sense." -Elyse (scum)
Aside from that entire post being annoying as fuck, your scumread on me makes no sense." -Elyse (scum)
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... start=1500In post 362, Shoshin wrote:I've never seen a town lose because of a self-vote.
- Extrapolated Eagle
- Extrapolated Eagle
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Extrapolated Eagle
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2626
- Joined: October 26, 2015
- Location: Atop my eyrie looking down on the world
I'm calling you conceited because you're justifying bad play with "My friends say I'm good at this game." Your self vote does cause actual harm. It did cause actual harm. You attacking me personally and building yourself up personally instead of discussing your actual play is the problem here. Stop trying to change the subject. Bad players making a "good faith" effort won't learn not to make those mistakes if they're pampered. Which is why I'm not pampering your already massive ego.
"@EE
Aside from that entire post being annoying as fuck, your scumread on me makes no sense." -Elyse (scum)
Aside from that entire post being annoying as fuck, your scumread on me makes no sense." -Elyse (scum)
- Extrapolated Eagle
- Extrapolated Eagle
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Extrapolated Eagle
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2626
- Joined: October 26, 2015
- Location: Atop my eyrie looking down on the world
It's almost like I said "there are exceptions to this rule."In post 368, Shoshin wrote:1. Self-votes have different impacts depending on context. If I self-vote at L-6, it doesn't put me anywhere close to getting lynched. Thus, it causes no actual harm if I remove the vote long before I'm lynched. If I hammer myself, that obviously causes harm because I've helped cause my own lynching. But these are two different things. Context matters.
2. Harmless self-votes still create wagons & reactions. And wagons/reactions can be sorted into town/scum. Thus, harmless self-votes help town scumhunt, especially in situations where there's a lack of information (e.g. early D1).
3. The impact of self-voting largely turns on how other players react. If all the townies decide to PL the self-voter instead of sorting her, then self-voting becomes harmful. But the issue here isn't the self-vote, it's how other players responded. If players don't PL the self-voter, the self-vote becomes harmless. Ironically, self-voting only becomes harmful because of PLing (i.e. when it comes to self-voting, PLing is entirely circular in its justification).
Conclusion: self-voting is like drinking wine, whether it's beneficial or harmful largely depends on other factors that have nothing to do with the vote (or drink) itself.
Your self-vote distracted from other things that were going on in the game and was not in any way "harmless."
Congratulations, you have discovered the victim mentality. My play isn't my problem, it's the people around me that cause my play to be a problem.
Draw a conclusion without testing your hypothesis and all you've done is make a fool of yourself.
"@EE
Aside from that entire post being annoying as fuck, your scumread on me makes no sense." -Elyse (scum)
Aside from that entire post being annoying as fuck, your scumread on me makes no sense." -Elyse (scum)
- Extrapolated Eagle
- Extrapolated Eagle
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Extrapolated Eagle
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
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- Joined: October 26, 2015
- Location: Atop my eyrie looking down on the world
EBWOP.In post 372, Extrapolated Eagle wrote:It's almost like I said "there are exceptions to this rule."In post 368, Shoshin wrote:1. Self-votes have different impacts depending on context. If I self-vote at L-6, it doesn't put me anywhere close to getting lynched. Thus, it causes no actual harm if I remove the vote long before I'm lynched. If I hammer myself, that obviously causes harm because I've helped cause my own lynching. But these are two different things. Context matters.
2. Harmless self-votes still create wagons & reactions. And wagons/reactions can be sorted into town/scum. Thus, harmless self-votes help town scumhunt, especially in situations where there's a lack of information (e.g. early D1).
3. The impact of self-voting largely turns on how other players react. If all the townies decide to PL the self-voter instead of sorting her, then self-voting becomes harmful. But the issue here isn't the self-vote, it's how other players responded. If players don't PL the self-voter, the self-vote becomes harmless. Ironically, self-voting only becomes harmful because of PLing (i.e. when it comes to self-voting, PLing is entirely circular in its justification).
Conclusion: self-voting is like drinking wine, whether it's beneficial or harmful largely depends on other factors that have nothing to do with the vote (or drink) itself.
Your self-vote distracted from other things that were going on in the game and was not in any way "harmless."
Congratulations, you have discovered the victim mentality. "My play isn't my problem, it's the people around me that cause my play to be a problem."
Draw a conclusion without testing your hypothesis and all you've done is make a fool of yourself.
No amount of "what ifs" and special exceptions will convince me that your rash and unthinking self-vote was anything but that.
"@EE
Aside from that entire post being annoying as fuck, your scumread on me makes no sense." -Elyse (scum)
Aside from that entire post being annoying as fuck, your scumread on me makes no sense." -Elyse (scum)
- Extrapolated Eagle
- Extrapolated Eagle
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Extrapolated Eagle
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2626
- Joined: October 26, 2015
- Location: Atop my eyrie looking down on the world
I don't know how you can honestly bring up "mafia is a complex game and no one knows why or what is optimal and suboptimal" and "my play is optimal" simultaneously.
I want to push your lynch right now but I'm not going to, because I'm still trying to get responses for the things that I did earlier that you so neatly detracted from with your "harmless" self vote. And if you think your wagon will stay assembled, you have a gross understanding of what mafia is and how it works. It will likely meander around whatever it's at now. I highly doubt anyone will get a policy lynch off of you. And I'd be super curious to see how your reads have changed because of your self vote, since it was so useful to you.
I want to push your lynch right now but I'm not going to, because I'm still trying to get responses for the things that I did earlier that you so neatly detracted from with your "harmless" self vote. And if you think your wagon will stay assembled, you have a gross understanding of what mafia is and how it works. It will likely meander around whatever it's at now. I highly doubt anyone will get a policy lynch off of you. And I'd be super curious to see how your reads have changed because of your self vote, since it was so useful to you.
"@EE
Aside from that entire post being annoying as fuck, your scumread on me makes no sense." -Elyse (scum)
Aside from that entire post being annoying as fuck, your scumread on me makes no sense." -Elyse (scum)