newbie 1956 - car seat headrest [we gotta go back]

[Draynth]

VOTE: NotMySpamAccount
I like Geyde's point in 156
NMSA's reasoning behind jamelia's tone being wrong felt kind of forced and it's something I could imagine scum!Draynth saying
NMSA is also lurking a worrying amount (albeit he's not alone in that)

Why Spam over Faustiv?

When I voted faustiv i primarily wanted an answer to my question, which I got.
Tbh I'd still be fine with a faustiv lynch but i doubt we get much from it, the majority of his posting has been asking why he's being scumread / why people are voting him. There's little to no information to gather from him being lynched today in my opinion. It's a fine compromise lynch should we end up close to the deadline with no other viable options but while we have time I'd rather wagon objectively scummy people

[Draynth]

It's interesting to me that you mentioned how an "easy lynch" happened in your previous game where you didn't get much from it, and in the same post finally vote faustiv, an equally informationless lynch

[Jamelia]

It's interesting to me that you mentioned how an "easy lynch" happened in your previous game where you didn't get much from it, and in the same post finally vote faustiv, an equally informationless lynch

No, what I said was that we had an easy lynch that we didn’t gain information from because someone had hammered on them prematurely. The “easy lynch” happened on D2, and we figured they were scum since D1, but a last minute push led to them surviving and a townsperson getting out (D1, which explains my “wait until they have a chance to defend themselves” reasoning.

Faustiv has had opportunities to defend themself but chooses to ignore or ask another question. To me, we aren’t going to gain anymore information from them on this. Y’all pointed this out, I agree, so I voted for them.

[Egix96]

@Airan, Faustiv, Egix

What do you 3 think of NotMySpamAccount?

My prior thoughts on him still apply, but with two additions:
a) I find it selective that he applies the 'too many exclamation marks' tell to Jam, but not to Veggie (ofc this is a small digression that I made in my thoughts on Veg, but I was going through the ISO of each player in alphabetical order so it was initially missed)
b) I find it disappointing that he has made only two posts since I made my wall, both of which are simply him giving advice to other players.

[UrVeggieM8]

Spoiler:

@Geyde Following that huge thread about hammering in RVS... out of interest, who read as the scummiest to you and why?

Giving an early townread to Veggie, I think; 66 is the best question asked so far.

I do find it funny that no one has, so far, asked what prompted my giving a townread to Veggie based on 66, but I’ll expound on it here.
Simply put, I think it shows a willingness to understand where Geyde was coming from, and a desire to, despite what Geyde said, engage with and attempt to apply it in a solving sense. Their tone, also — I don’t know, but I feel a strange kind of mindmeld; a gut-townread — 66 is the kind of question

I

like to ask.

I tend not to feel this kind of instinctive gutread very often, and it hasn’t been wrong yet, so I’m trusting it this time. Certainly it’s not so strong as usual, but...

My wording in my post may have been strange, however — an early townread could have been better phrased as a townlean, perhaps, but still.

@Geyde
When quoting large stretches of posts, please use a spoiler= tag; it makes the thread far less cluttered.
Uh... as to Spam... I don’t really see what you’re saying there. I agree that the additional reason for voting was slightly reachy, but I can still see it coming from town, and I think that they were trying to make the read concise; I get the feeling that there was more behind it. I also did not see the interaction as forced, at least not from Spam’s side. Could you tell me if there were any

particular

bits about the interaction that felt forced?

His reason for voting was contradictory since other players at that time exhibited the same behaviors, but he chose to focus on Jam (notably Veg [?] to my memory). That's why his push is forced in my mind.

As for your feeling about more being behind the read, I would disagree.
What I think what happened was he thought he had a very strong point against Jam in order to start a push, but after posting he doesn't have anything to add on besides restating his conclusion when prompted. Additionally, if he had more to add, then why has he never revisited his push?

Correct me if I’m wrong, but I don’t think he’s had much opportunity to revisit it? It’s page 7.

And I think Jam and Veg (what a nice pair of short-hand names) have actually had very different tones, personally — I don’t think that Veg’s entrance and follow-up posts were similar to Jam. I haven’t reread that bit, though, so feel free to prove me wrong on that count.

I've counted three defences from Spangled toward me right now and thought I would post this so that opinions can be formed. This is what I thought ingratiating with another player might look like, given that all these statements appear to be based on Spangled's opinion (as opposed to them being based on my post history or contradictory statements I've made). I get the feeling there might be players who have noticed this pattern already and think that Spangled's reasons for defending me are shaky at best.

[Jamelia]

Spoiler:

@Geyde Following that huge thread about hammering in RVS... out of interest, who read as the scummiest to you and why?

Giving an early townread to Veggie, I think; 66 is the best question asked so far.

I do find it funny that no one has, so far, asked what prompted my giving a townread to Veggie based on 66, but I’ll expound on it here.
Simply put, I think it shows a willingness to understand where Geyde was coming from, and a desire to, despite what Geyde said, engage with and attempt to apply it in a solving sense. Their tone, also — I don’t know, but I feel a strange kind of mindmeld; a gut-townread — 66 is the kind of question

I

like to ask.

I tend not to feel this kind of instinctive gutread very often, and it hasn’t been wrong yet, so I’m trusting it this time. Certainly it’s not so strong as usual, but...

My wording in my post may have been strange, however — an early townread could have been better phrased as a townlean, perhaps, but still.

@Geyde
When quoting large stretches of posts, please use a spoiler= tag; it makes the thread far less cluttered.
Uh... as to Spam... I don’t really see what you’re saying there. I agree that the additional reason for voting was slightly reachy, but I can still see it coming from town, and I think that they were trying to make the read concise; I get the feeling that there was more behind it. I also did not see the interaction as forced, at least not from Spam’s side. Could you tell me if there were any

particular

bits about the interaction that felt forced?

His reason for voting was contradictory since other players at that time exhibited the same behaviors, but he chose to focus on Jam (notably Veg [?] to my memory). That's why his push is forced in my mind.

As for your feeling about more being behind the read, I would disagree.
What I think what happened was he thought he had a very strong point against Jam in order to start a push, but after posting he doesn't have anything to add on besides restating his conclusion when prompted. Additionally, if he had more to add, then why has he never revisited his push?

Correct me if I’m wrong, but I don’t think he’s had much opportunity to revisit it? It’s page 7.

And I think Jam and Veg (what a nice pair of short-hand names) have actually had very different tones, personally — I don’t think that Veg’s entrance and follow-up posts were similar to Jam. I haven’t reread that bit, though, so feel free to prove me wrong on that count.

I've counted three defences from Spangled toward me right now and thought I would post this so that opinions can be formed. This is what I thought ingratiating with another player might look like, given that all these statements appear to be based on Spangled's opinion (as opposed to them being based on my post history or contradictory statements I've made). I get the feeling there might be players who have noticed this pattern already and think that Spangled's reasons for defending me are shaky at best.

I thought it was bizarre for the reasons you posted. However, I think that if Spangled was trying to intigrate, wouldn’t they have town reads on more people, not just you?

[NotMySpamAccount]

VOTE: NotMySpamAccount
I like Geyde's point in 156
NMSA's reasoning behind jamelia's tone being wrong felt kind of forced and it's something I could imagine scum!Draynth saying
NMSA is also lurking a worrying amount (albeit he's not alone in that)

Draynth: jam's lack of voting might just be aplaystyle thing
Also Draynth: spam is lurking early d1, mumst be scum.

anyone who's played with me can tell you I do this every game.

I do like veggie's reasoning in 164 and 165.

Also, everyone keeps referring to the exclamation point thing, which I said in the post was not entirely accurate. It's not just the number of exclamation points, but the entire tone of the posts. Veggie's posts come across as much more sincere. That's why I'm voting Jam.

[Draynth]

VOTE: NotMySpamAccount
I like Geyde's point in 156
NMSA's reasoning behind jamelia's tone being wrong felt kind of forced and it's something I could imagine scum!Draynth saying
NMSA is also lurking a worrying amount (albeit he's not alone in that)

Draynth: jam's lack of voting might just be aplaystyle thing
Also Draynth: spam is lurking early d1, mumst be scum.

anyone who's played with me can tell you I do this every game.

Jam has exactly one game on site which i went and skimmed through
I've never played with you so why are you being so lamist about it

[Draynth]

Also, lurking was 1 of 3 points made. that's some nice cherrypicking

[Jamelia]

VOTE: NotMySpamAccount
I like Geyde's point in 156
NMSA's reasoning behind jamelia's tone being wrong felt kind of forced and it's something I could imagine scum!Draynth saying
NMSA is also lurking a worrying amount (albeit he's not alone in that)

Draynth: jam's lack of voting might just be aplaystyle thing
Also Draynth: spam is lurking early d1, mumst be scum.

anyone who's played with me can tell you I do this every game.

I do like veggie's reasoning in 164 and 165.

Also, everyone keeps referring to the exclamation point thing, which I said in the post was not entirely accurate. It's not just the number of exclamation points, but the entire tone of the posts. Veggie's posts come across as much more sincere. That's why I'm voting Jam.

I’m using the exclamation thing as a point to say that beyond that, you have tunnel vision. Whether it was on me or someone else, I believe that you are hyper analyzing my posts (even though others have agreed that my posts are similar to the ones I posted in my first game on here), and have tunnel vision. Again, I like the way you analyze but I think if you put that same energy into everyone else I think we’ll start to agree on the context of your analysis.

Right now it seems like you’re pushing heavy on a vote for me based on reasoning that frankly doesn’t make sense.

[Draynth]

I don't think anybody said your posts were the same as the other game. I for one said your voting pattern was similar.
Did I miss someone saying that?

[Jamelia]

Ok thanks for all the replies. This is my first game here, so it’s natural I might find scum where there isn’t any. I just find bandwagons a bit suspicious, because scum might jump upon them quickly to get an innocent lynched. But because the bandwagon was at the start of the game, I am probably being a bit too paranoid.

Yes, and with the fact that a majority requires 5, at this point, you are most certainly being paranoid.
Don’t think anyone tends to get lolhammered in RVS, especially not in the newbie queue.

Somebody hasn't played enough newbie games then. Accidental rvs quicklynches are always a risk if a lolwagon gets to L-1.

I also don’t get how you can post something like this, and then act like I’m scum when my exact reasoning for unvoting on my RVS and NOT voting on my main scum lead right away is what you posted right here. We agree on the same style of gameplay, but you’re punishing me for it for some reason

[Jamelia]

I don't think anybody said your posts were the same as the other game. I for one said your voting pattern was similar.
Did I miss someone saying that?

Well in the post I just wrote I didn’t say people thought they were the same, because they aren’t. I’m being a little more aggressive with my opinions because I feel more comfortable after playing one game. But yes, you said my posts were similar and others too (I’m on mobile so it’s hard for me to quote right now, sorry!).

[Draynth]

Hmm, I briefly skimmed through jamelia's other game play (newbie 1953) and he only lay down two votes in that entire game (which lasted 3 day phases)
Perhaps it really is just a playstyle thing

I think this is very different to saying your posts are similar. If others have said that I guess I missed it and look forward to them being quoted by you when you get a chance

[Errantparabola]

promise me you'll go inside when i leave
i don't want you hanging around

- Boxing Day,

Nervous Young Man

votecount 1.7

NotMySpamAccount

(3): Spangled, Geyde, Draynth

faüstiv

(1): Jamelia

Jamelia

(1): NotMySpamAccount

Spangled

(1): Egix96

Not Voting

(3): faüstiv, Airan303, UrVeggieM8

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to reach a majority.

Deadline is in (expired on 2019-09-27 09:56:00)

[Geyde]

Spoiler: Spangled

@Geyde
When quoting large stretches of posts, please use a spoiler= tag; it makes the thread far less cluttered.
Uh... as to Spam... I don’t really see what you’re saying there. I agree that the additional reason for voting was slightly reachy, but I can still see it coming from town, and I think that they were trying to make the read concise; I get the feeling that there was more behind it. I also did not see the interaction as forced, at least not from Spam’s side. Could you tell me if there were any

particular

bits about the interaction that felt forced?

His reason for voting was contradictory since other players at that time exhibited the same behaviors, but he chose to focus on Jam (notably Veg [?] to my memory). That's why his push is forced in my mind.

As for your feeling about more being behind the read, I would disagree.
What I think what happened was he thought he had a very strong point against Jam in order to start a push, but after posting he doesn't have anything to add on besides restating his conclusion when prompted. Additionally, if he had more to add, then why has he never revisited his push?

Correct me if I’m wrong, but I don’t think he’s had much opportunity to revisit it? It’s page 7.

And I think Jam and Veg (what a nice pair of short-hand names) have actually had very different tones, personally — I don’t think that Veg’s entrance and follow-up posts were similar to Jam. I haven’t reread that bit, though, so feel free to prove me wrong on that count.

About revisiting, fair.
I'm getting a bit ahead of myself there.
I remember Veg's posts being somewhat similar in tone to Jam's posts, but I'll pull them up if needed

[Geyde]

Spoiler:

Also, VOTE: faustiv

Why do you feel this way? I also scum read them, but not enough to definitively vote.

It's early d1, and you're not voting anyone rn. you should be.

I was voting someone early D1 until we actually were getting votes that were related to game play and not RVS. In my last game, we hammered on a town way too early and didn’t even get to hear a defense from the person (who was town and I believed was town) to speak, and then D2 we hammered and lost an opportunity for good information. I just am being more careful this time and preventing that from happening.

At the time of me unvoting on Faustiv, they had 3 votes on them. I just brought it down to two; which is still pressure, in my opinion.

Sharing some reads I've had so far.

Airan - seems more town than scum for me at this point. Posting about bandwagoning as early as they did doesn’t seem like a scum thing to do, purely because I feel it might have drawn more attention than scum might have wanted. Could be wrong though.

Draynth - Has asked questions that could be indicative of other town or scum. I feel that putting a second vote on faüstiv without a justification (102) is the first scum-play that’s come from them.

Spam - Tbh, I find their style of play to be provocative. Examples: Bandwagoning (7) and putting a vote out there that’s not rvs (52). For this reason, atm I read them as more likely to be town than scum. They’ve gone quiet as of late though? @Spam, do you have any opinions on the game thus far?

Faustiv - Not enough info coming from them! Has only asked questions about why they’re under suspicion or being voted. Most likely scum-read for me atm.

No strong read on Spangled just yet but I even I thought the early townread on me (while appreciated) felt premature. Not entirely sure why that would make them more likely to be scum though?

Updating this after reviewing the thread for a little bit.

Jamelia - I have rising suspicions because of the non-committal type posts they've been making regarding voting faüstiv. Both Draynth and Spangled have asked them "why not vote?" already. I am aware that Jamelia's response was that they wanted to analyse faüstiv's responses but I feel as though faüstiv has had ample time to give responses and we haven't seen many substantial ones so far. I'm surprised that Geyde has not said anything about this, given that they talk about applying info in a solving sense or trying to push the game further with questions.

@Geyde

What are your thoughts on faüstiv? I'm going to ask the same question that I asked Jamelia... based on the content that faüstiv has put out so far, if you had to put a percentage on them (example: 60% scum 40% town), what would it be?

I haven't read into them since I don't think the slot will be easily resolved outside of reading into their votes, of which I haven't seen in substantial amount

Here is some of my opinions. I have not checked out everyone though.
Draynth seems to be asking lots of questions and not giving lots of answers. Then again, we might want to question him a bit more.
Egix has posted little but his unified opinion was very informative. However, Draynth had to prompt him to post that.
Faustiv was asking lots of questions, but he didn’t elaborate on spangled being ‘too passive’ (I may be mistaken). He also wasn’t giving many answers.
Geyde had made good questions and encouraged people to vote. He had a good argument against spangled but didn’t have tunnel vision and pointed out that there should be a counter-vote by scum if he was right.
BTW @jamelia who do you think is scum?

I still think that faustiv is acting scummy. They’ve been asked a few times now about their passive / questioning tone and they haven’t responded in a way I’d expect someone who’s town would. So, they’re my main scum read. I also am suspicious of Spam, but I’m not sure if that’s because of their tunnel vision of my “exclamation points” or actual content. I like the way they analyze but I don’t necessarily agree with their content

Apologies if this sounds like a rehash of an earlier post directed at you.
Not putting a vote out for faüstiv seems contradictory to what you're saying about them being your main scum read. I do understand that you said you're wary of hammering someone who actually might be town but if faüstiv is your main scum read right now, then... huh???
If you had to put percentages on faüstiv (example: 60% scum and 40% town), what would they be?

My reasoning for NOT voting for them wasn’t because I don’t think they’re scum, but because they haven’t responded to any of the criticism of their posts. They’ve avoided the question. I’d like to hear their response before I give a vote. I like to be definitive with my vote compared to just constantly unvoting/voting. I understand that it creates pressure but I don’t find that as effective as learning as much information as possible before voting.

Right now I’d put Faustiv at 70% scum, 30% town. 30 if they are just waiting to see if other people think they’re scum too, and 70 because I think they’re just trying to have the attention shift on others.

—-

As for Spam, although I do think that they have tunnel vision on me, I don’t believe their questioning and analysis is necessarily scummy. I’d like to give them the benefit of the doubt that they’re at least analyzing a lot of the game and have set their sets on one specific thing. I think that Spam would help us more if he focused on others just as much as he focused on me, but I digress.

I've gathered from these posts that Geyde and Jam are both reluctant to put a vote on faüstiv because they’re waiting for an opportunity to analyse a response/vote. Judging by the way that faüstiv has posted over the last 7 pages (mainly asking why they’re under suspicion with a one-sentence read on Spangled thrown in), I don’t think this is likely to happen anytime soon!
I am wondering if this might be because Geyde and Jam are a scum-team and would like to keep a player like faüstiv alive for a few more rounds as they’d be an easy mislynch for town?

While following that line I've thought, UNVOTE: faüstiv for now.

I do not think that Faustiv is readable at this point of the game, which is why I'm not trying to read them.

[Geyde]

Spoiler:

VOTE: Jamelia not rvs.

Why’s that?

tone is all wrong. regardless of whether I like what you're saaying, you're saying it in a way that sounds far more like newb!scum than newb!town.

to put it simply (and not quite accurately), you're using too many exclamation points. More precisely, it sounds like pocketing/ingratiating yourself with people. In my experience, this comes more from newb!scum wanting to sound genuine than from newb!town who are extremely excited.

Why’s that?

Why’s that?

tone is all wrong. regardless of whether I like what you're saaying, you're saying it in a way that sounds far more like newb!scum than newb!town.

Hmm. What have I said to make you think that?

to put it simply (and not quite accurately), you're using too many exclamation points. More precisely, it sounds like pocketing/ingratiating yourself with people. In my experience, this comes more from newb!scum wanting to sound genuine than from newb!town who are extremely excited.

Gotcha. Is that like a meta thing? To use too many exclamation points or something?

This interaction does not flow normally.
It's...lukewarm (?) for lack of a better term, with the initial reason for voting having very little basis whatsoever. Hell, if Spam wanted to vote someone for trying too hard to ingratiate themselves with other people, Veg would be the correct choice in this situation. Because of this, I think the vote and following interaction was forced considering the initial reason wasn't strong and the conversation ended abruptly.

VOTE: NotMySpamAccount

I wouldn't discount the possibility that the interaction was staged either, but I'm not willing to go all in on that conclusion yet

Interesting take. I agree that Spam (with this reasoning) should be voting for Veg. Do you think they are doing this to try to lead a vote on me quickly? Or do you think they’re trying to create pressure?

Jam agreeing with Geyde here raises an eyebrow for me. Given that Geyde didn’t actually say why and how they thought I was trying to ingratiate myself with others, it feels like Jam was agreeing despite having little to go on. I read this as a scum-play because it feels similar to the way scum might jump on a wagon without giving some kind of justification. In contrast, I feel that the town-play here would have been to ask for examples of my ingratiating posts and then pick apart/agree/disagree from there.

Spoiler:

Also, VOTE: faustiv

Why do you feel this way? I also scum read them, but not enough to definitively vote.

It's early d1, and you're not voting anyone rn. you should be.

I was voting someone early D1 until we actually were getting votes that were related to game play and not RVS. In my last game, we hammered on a town way too early and didn’t even get to hear a defense from the person (who was town and I believed was town) to speak, and then D2 we hammered and lost an opportunity for good information. I just am being more careful this time and preventing that from happening.

At the time of me unvoting on Faustiv, they had 3 votes on them. I just brought it down to two; which is still pressure, in my opinion.

Sharing some reads I've had so far.

Airan - seems more town than scum for me at this point. Posting about bandwagoning as early as they did doesn’t seem like a scum thing to do, purely because I feel it might have drawn more attention than scum might have wanted. Could be wrong though.

Draynth - Has asked questions that could be indicative of other town or scum. I feel that putting a second vote on faüstiv without a justification (102) is the first scum-play that’s come from them.

Spam - Tbh, I find their style of play to be provocative. Examples: Bandwagoning (7) and putting a vote out there that’s not rvs (52). For this reason, atm I read them as more likely to be town than scum. They’ve gone quiet as of late though? @Spam, do you have any opinions on the game thus far?

Faustiv - Not enough info coming from them! Has only asked questions about why they’re under suspicion or being voted. Most likely scum-read for me atm.

No strong read on Spangled just yet but I even I thought the early townread on me (while appreciated) felt premature. Not entirely sure why that would make them more likely to be scum though?

Updating this after reviewing the thread for a little bit.

Jamelia - I have rising suspicions because of the non-committal type posts they've been making regarding voting faüstiv. Both Draynth and Spangled have asked them "why not vote?" already. I am aware that Jamelia's response was that they wanted to analyse faüstiv's responses but I feel as though faüstiv has had ample time to give responses and we haven't seen many substantial ones so far. I'm surprised that Geyde has not said anything about this, given that they talk about applying info in a solving sense or trying to push the game further with questions.

@Geyde

What are your thoughts on faüstiv? I'm going to ask the same question that I asked Jamelia... based on the content that faüstiv has put out so far, if you had to put a percentage on them (example: 60% scum 40% town), what would it be?

I haven't read into them since I don't think the slot will be easily resolved outside of reading into their votes, of which I haven't seen in substantial amount

Here is some of my opinions. I have not checked out everyone though.
Draynth seems to be asking lots of questions and not giving lots of answers. Then again, we might want to question him a bit more.
Egix has posted little but his unified opinion was very informative. However, Draynth had to prompt him to post that.
Faustiv was asking lots of questions, but he didn’t elaborate on spangled being ‘too passive’ (I may be mistaken). He also wasn’t giving many answers.
Geyde had made good questions and encouraged people to vote. He had a good argument against spangled but didn’t have tunnel vision and pointed out that there should be a counter-vote by scum if he was right.
BTW @jamelia who do you think is scum?

I still think that faustiv is acting scummy. They’ve been asked a few times now about their passive / questioning tone and they haven’t responded in a way I’d expect someone who’s town would. So, they’re my main scum read. I also am suspicious of Spam, but I’m not sure if that’s because of their tunnel vision of my “exclamation points” or actual content. I like the way they analyze but I don’t necessarily agree with their content

Apologies if this sounds like a rehash of an earlier post directed at you.
Not putting a vote out for faüstiv seems contradictory to what you're saying about them being your main scum read. I do understand that you said you're wary of hammering someone who actually might be town but if faüstiv is your main scum read right now, then... huh???
If you had to put percentages on faüstiv (example: 60% scum and 40% town), what would they be?

My reasoning for NOT voting for them wasn’t because I don’t think they’re scum, but because they haven’t responded to any of the criticism of their posts. They’ve avoided the question. I’d like to hear their response before I give a vote. I like to be definitive with my vote compared to just constantly unvoting/voting. I understand that it creates pressure but I don’t find that as effective as learning as much information as possible before voting.

Right now I’d put Faustiv at 70% scum, 30% town. 30 if they are just waiting to see if other people think they’re scum too, and 70 because I think they’re just trying to have the attention shift on others.

—-

As for Spam, although I do think that they have tunnel vision on me, I don’t believe their questioning and analysis is necessarily scummy. I’d like to give them the benefit of the doubt that they’re at least analyzing a lot of the game and have set their sets on one specific thing. I think that Spam would help us more if he focused on others just as much as he focused on me, but I digress.

I've gathered from these posts that Geyde and Jam are both reluctant to put a vote on faüstiv because they’re waiting for an opportunity to analyse a response/vote. Judging by the way that faüstiv has posted over the last 7 pages (mainly asking why they’re under suspicion with a one-sentence read on Spangled thrown in), I don’t think this is likely to happen anytime soon!
I am wondering if this might be because Geyde and Jam are a scum-team and would like to keep a player like faüstiv alive for a few more rounds as they’d be an easy mislynch for town?

While following that line I've thought, UNVOTE: faüstiv for now.

Despite whether I agree with the line of thought in these posts or not, they are high effort enough that I don't think Veg is ever a good lynch candidate today
They both bring up well thought up points but aren't stressed about building them into a push yet, which I think would be the case if Veg was team with Spam.

[Geyde]

Spoiler: Veg tone

Thanks for your insight Airan!

As the person receiving Spam's vote, when I first read their post my gut reaction was "that seems a bit lhf-ish. Maybe they're doing that to try and get information out of everyone"... which is not necessarily a scum move. To me personally, Spam doesn't quite read as scummy... just suspicious.

Interested in hearing what everyone else thinks!

VOTE: faustiv

Sorry, reposting because I voted the incorrect way before!

I find it scummy because instead of voting for anyone else to check reactions, he voted for someone who had already been voted for.

I am not saying spam is a scum, or that you should vote for him. I am just saying that what he did was scummy

I mean, from what I've seen, RVS bandwagoning is fairly common on this site.
So I personally wouldn't consider it scummy, it's just a site meta thing.

Okay sure. But voting for veggie and not for anyone else is still a bit suspicious. I mean why bandwagon?

Why not bandwagon? You often get some good information from it and it progesses the game
Why do you find it inherently suspicious?

Not speaking for Airan here, but just wanted to put my .02 in. Bandwagoning isn't bad and it kick-started the game in this case! But I think that it can be inherently suspicious depending on the order that people decide to jump on the bandwagon. Spam put the second vote in, which (to me) makes them more suspicious than Draynth putting the first vote in. Ofc it's still not a strong indication of Spam being scum though. Just wanted to say that order matters.

Thanks for your insight Airan!

As the person receiving Spam's vote, when I first read their post my gut reaction was "

that seems a bit lhf-ish.

Maybe they're doing that to try and get information out of everyone"... which is not necessarily a scum move. To me personally, Spam doesn't quite read as scummy... just suspicious.

Interested in hearing what everyone else thinks!

@bolded: Hm, in what way?
How would you define the term LHF?

LHF because that the comment Spam made is one that vegos tend to hear a lot as a provocation. I'm not entirely sure if Spam would have commented the way they did if it wasn't following the previous comment from Draynth "I just ate a vegetarian meal". I feel that Spam may have used the previous comment as context for their reply. Hope I explained that in a way that makes sense?

Ofc though, whether someone is vego or not is completely irrelevant here so nothing was taken seriously and no feelings were trampled on I do understand that their comment was most likely made for the purpose of gathering information, irrespective of what their actual opinion on vegetables is! LOL

Thanks for your insight Airan!

As the person receiving Spam's vote, when I first read their post my gut reaction was "

that seems a bit lhf-ish.

Maybe they're doing that to try and get information out of everyone"... which is not necessarily a scum move. To me personally, Spam doesn't quite read as scummy... just suspicious.

Interested in hearing what everyone else thinks!

@bolded: Hm, in what way?
How would you define the term LHF?

LHF because that the comment Spam made is one that vegos tend to hear a lot as a provocation. I'm not entirely sure if Spam would have commented the way they did if it wasn't following the previous comment from Draynth "I just ate a vegetarian meal". I feel that Spam may have used the previous comment as context for their reply. Hope I explained that in a way that makes sense?

Ofc though, whether someone is vego or not is completely irrelevant here so nothing was taken seriously and no feelings were trampled on I do understand that their comment was most likely made for the purpose of gathering information, irrespective of what their actual opinion on vegetables is! LOL

Tbh I don't really get what that has to do with low hanging fruit in the mafia sense but... okay...

Did some hunting around the webz and sounds like I've misunderstood the meaning of LHF in the mafia sense. Apologies for that! In this case I meant LHF in the sense that I felt Spam was using a common provocation to try and get information. Will be sure to use LHF in the mafia sense from now on!

@Spangled

[Geyde]

VOTE: NotMySpamAccount
I like Geyde's point in 156
NMSA's reasoning behind jamelia's tone being wrong felt kind of forced and it's something I could imagine scum!Draynth saying
NMSA is also lurking a worrying amount (albeit he's not alone in that)

Draynth: jam's lack of voting might just be aplaystyle thing
Also Draynth: spam is lurking early d1, mumst be scum.

anyone who's played with me can tell you I do this every game.

I do like veggie's reasoning in 164 and 165.

Also, everyone keeps referring to the exclamation point thing, which I said in the post was not entirely accurate. It's not just the number of exclamation points, but the entire tone of the posts. Veggie's posts come across as much more sincere. That's why I'm voting Jam.

Thread counterwagon for Spam seems to be Jam at this point.

I really don't like this response by Spam here.
They mainly shadethrow their accusers while also setting up a push onto Jam without a lot of the thought process I'd expect of town being pushed.

They notably omit:

- Any analysis of 164 and 165
- Any showing of the difference between Veggie's posts and Jam's posts

Their response therefore sounds more like panicked scum trying to get ground back rather than someone seriously trying to analyze players and their motivations.

[Geyde]

I'd expect town that's being pushed to try to clarify the viewpoint they are being pushed for as much as possible.
Instead, Spam supports posts that could support a push on Jam, one of the only valid counterwagons at this point in the game.

His 'clarification' doesn't have any analysis to it whatsoever.
Why are Veg's posts so much more sincere?
I've quoted the ones in question and I don't see that from what they've posted in the past

Sure, recent Veg is really good.
But Past Veg left nothing to the imagination whatsoever in a crafted way. (38, 44, 46)

[Airan303]

Yeah, I think that spam has got tunnel vision. Not sure if this makes him scum...

[Airan303]

Yeah, I think that spam has got tunnel vision. Not sure if this makes him scum...

[faüstiv]

Reads:

Airan - Null leaning town
Draynth - Town
Egix96 - Null leaning scum
Geyde - Scum
Jamellia - Town
Spangled - Town
Veggie - Null but most probably town

VOTE: Geyde

[faüstiv]

Spam - Null leaning scum