Newbie 1992 | Game Over

[Menalque]

I kind of do wanna lynch soonish, I can feel the apathy setting in and I don't really know if things are gonna get any better without a flip

like we're just gonna have the same argument repeating until we get some clarity by flipping

[Maduisha]

I agree. And we're set to get more information from him flipping than anything else we could do right now. We have to wait for Clidd, though, since Skitter does not want the lynch yet, and GWu is focused on scum!Datisi.

[Maduisha]

Wait no, we do have to wait until Skitter agrees too. For some reason I thought he was at L-1, but he only has 3 votes on his wagon.

[Karnage]

Vote Count 1.17

Marashu (3) ~

Menalque, Datisi, Maduisha,

Datisi (2) ~

team rocket queen, GeneralWu,

clidd (1) ~

word321,

skitter30 (1) ~

Marashu,

Not voting (2) ~

clidd, skitter30,

With 9 alive it's 5 to lynch

Deadline: (expired on 2020-03-27 19:08:54)

V/LA:

• skitter30 - Fridays and Saturdays & mental health vla for a couple of days (beginning 3/23)

[Menalque]

skitt will lynch when she's ready and if she wants to wait a bit we can, but I don't wanna let this go to deadline in case they claim PR

[Datisi]

I think I remember trq saying she finds Marashu scummy?

@trq, would you be willing to vote Mara with us? obviously not right now, but.

pedit: yeah good call.

[Menalque]

tbh I kinda get the vibe that trq is gonna do whatever trq wants to do

[Maduisha]

I don't know how willing are TRQ and Word to change their votes, but that's an option too. But I'll respect if they want to keep their positions still.

[Menalque]

if someone refuses to hammer once we have 4 votes on and i'm confident it's an all town wagon then I'm going to start calling refusal to declare intent a scumclaim

[Menalque]

@anyone who is doing a case or whatever, you have 24 hours to get it out

[Datisi]

tbh I kinda get the vibe that trq is gonna do whatever trq wants to do

i mean yes
i'm asking if trq wants to

[Marashu]

I'm also looking forward to marashu's skitter case.

First, skitt seems to be posting a lot of unneccessary "I don't knows" (or other variants). Some of them make sense (like when she is saying she doesn't know what someone else is trying to say and is asking for clarification), but even ignoring some of the posts as we were coming out of RVS, there are still quite a few of these already (examples in spoiler tag):

Spoiler:

i dislike that they've been going on and on about the merits of meta-reading off of old games without really interacting with what else is going on this game much

if i interact with the game more generally going forward would you be likely to view that as happening because you drew my attention to it?

not in particular, i guess?
idk this is a weird question in response

i'm not sure what else you expect me to say?
it's p7, i feel like you're expecting much deeper thoughts than i actually have, you've done this like three times now ...

i don't know what to do about datisi

i don't know

i want to figure it out in a few hours/days once everyone has calmed down, i feel like reading off of the emotional stuff is probably not the best idea

i don't know

i want to figure it out in a few hours/days once everyone has calmed down, i feel like reading off of the emotional stuff is probably not the best idea

can you give me a snap feeling on it? because I think datisi being upset is almost certainly like a weak spot for me in terms of being able to be objective bc of out-of-game reasons and so it's really throwing me off

i really dont' know
like part of gut me is saying scum
and the other part is saying town

and i feel like commiting to either atm is rash and wouldn't be a solid read

hmmmmmmm

i don't know how to be reading you rn

i'm not sure where to put him rn.
not sure how much more time to give him to produce content

A lot of these were about Dat, which to me is indicative of wanting to have enough reason to vote for Dat but display enough uncertainty if Dat flips town (which from what I'm seeing is probably what would happen).

Second,

like i feel like you're being rather elliptical and non-commital

I think this is exactly what skitt is doing, so it's interesting that she's calling TRQ out on it. I think her claim to be sitting back in this one could be a sign that she's willing to jump in where people make cases but be ready to back out so it doesn't look bad or gain town cred by appearing moderate and wanting to force out more discussion. As for her case on Dat, that brings us to my third point.

Third,
Skitt's the one who started the train on Dat. The initial reason was pretty vague,

because you feel weird and feel like you're just kinda like ~around~ and trying to seem active without actually doing anything, if that makes sense

As she stayed on the train she was pretty non-commital. To me it looked like Mena was applying the pressure while she was staying at arm's distance.

Fourth, like I addressed before (and kinda related to the above) was the way that skitt was interacting with Dat when the Dat push was happening. At the time I thought it was suspicious, but then I started to doubt myself. Now I'm feeling like I should trust my instincts - I think it's less likely that she was trying to keep from tunneling and more likely that she was trying to gain some early towncred.

[skitter30]

@skitt and @dats

if mara!town where are your heads at?

wu becomes townier
datisi becomes scummier
clidd stays the same
maduisha stays the same
trq becomes scummier
word stays the same
mena becomes scummier? idk actually for this one

[skitter30]

@skitt take as much time as you need

thanks.
still not super up to it but i'll see what i can do

[skitter30]

i have a completed game now, if you're still interested: viewtopic.php?f=11&t=82380

no theories quite like the one this game, but it might serve some purpose nonetheless.

i will take a look later

[skitter30]

btw skitter is scummy because people have to squeeze information out of her like they're squeezing toothpaste

she doesn't really explain any of her reasons for voting people until after she is asked to do so.

a) this isn't true
b) so what if it is. why is it scummy that people need to squeeze information out of me like they're squeezing toothpaste?

[skitter30]

1 is a bad reason bc I just explained it
2 while he has made some posts that are iioa there are also other posts of his that are analysis
3 is probably associated with his activity. Let's suppose you were on V/LA for a few days, and then the game totally changes when you get back. The last posts you made could become irrelevant to the current situation. (If not completely irrelevant, it might still be pointless for you to follow up on your last posts because the situation has changed so much).
4 well I feel like his opening was not as bad as people think.
Like the main reason people disliked his opening was because of this:

1. inactivity by itself isn't a problem
it's a problem when the posts, when they do exist, are utterly lacking and he has rather little real content
and it's a problem when he keeps promising content ('like after work') and then not following through
2. the vast majority of his posts are iioa. if i have to ask him what the takeaway of his posts are because there aren't any, we have a problem
3. yeah, then i'd expect him to at least say 'so i think my question in post 7 got answered by player x, but i have a followup question in that blah blah blah'. that's what i mean by follow through. it doesn't exist
4. if he believed the mason claim was real he shouldn't have announced that to the entire thread because he called scum's attention to it

[skitter30]

I think you're scummy not only because of marashu but bc of the way you're pushing me.

Please do elaborate when you get the chance.

I think the way you're pushing me makes me feel like you're trying to get me to vote someone and not think too much about it.
You also feel like someone who's trying to push a lynch on whoever is easiest.

wait why are you easier than marashu rn ?

[skitter30]

she doesn't really explain any of her reasons for voting people until after she is asked to do so.

Why’s this scummy?

Because it's good if you have reasons for voting someone. You might agree with someone that a particular person is scummy, but you might have a different reason for voting him.
Also a mafia could just sit around for the whole game and just sheep people to hang some random townies if he doesn't get hanged.

you're equating not stating reasons with not having any, which is fallacious
if anybody wants to know my reasons you can just ask
also does it look like i'm sheeping people ???? like where is this happening even ???

i don't understand why this is scummy
maybe you don't like it, but why it is *scummy*

[skitter30]

Because it's good if you have reasons for voting someone.

So do you think skitt doesn’t have reasons for her votes?

it's better if she explains cuz she seems like she's just sheeping or making random votes

again, why exactly do you think i'm doing either of these things

point to a place where i'm sheeping
and do you really believe i'm just making random votes?
like my thought process and reads are abundantly clear in context around my votes even if i don't literally write

vote: x, player x is scummy because ...

in the post where i voted

[skitter30]

The reason marashu is getting scumread is because of this post, and his activity.
Everyone has a different schedule, and some people just post more than others.

you're also reducing my entire argument for why i'm voting marashu into the one inactivity point which i feel like vastly oversimplifies the reasons i'm voting him

[skitter30]

As town, would anyone say "didn't read lol" and continue to post in the thread as if it didn't matter?

both alignments do this unfortunately

also i think word is probably town

[skitter30]

guess what i flipped.

uh tonally i think you feel different in this game to that game

i only have like one solid townread and 1 maybe townread and 2 maaaaaaabe townreads and it's a problem

[skitter30]

First, skitt seems to be posting a lot of unneccessary "I don't knows" (or other variants). Some of them make sense (like when she is saying she doesn't know what someone else is trying to say and is asking for clarification), but even ignoring some of the posts as we were coming out of RVS, there are still quite a few of these already (examples in spoiler tag):

this is a writing/playstyle quirk

I think this is exactly what skitt is doing, so it's interesting that she's calling TRQ out on it. I think her claim to be sitting back in this one could be a sign that she's willing to jump in where people make cases but be ready to back out so it doesn't look bad or gain town cred by appearing moderate and wanting to force out more discussion. As for her case on Dat, that brings us to my third point.

no, i'm sitting back because team mafia took a shit ton of energy out of me and i haven't like completely ~gotten back into mafia ~ yet

trust me, if i wanted to like effort and case people i can, and will. i just don't want to play like that right now
it has nothing to do with my alignment

As she stayed on the train she was pretty non-commital. To me it looked like Mena was applying the pressure while she was staying at arm's distance.

i wasn't being non-commital
that was exactly the reason why i wanted to vote datisi, because he was playing differently than i'd have expected from him, and i wanted to explore that
i wasn't staying at arm's distance, iirc i literally started the push

Fourth, like I addressed before (and kinda related to the above) was the way that skitt was interacting with Dat when the Dat push was happening. At the time I thought it was suspicious, but then I started to doubt myself. Now I'm feeling like I should trust my instincts - I think it's less likely that she was trying to keep from tunneling and more likely that she was trying to gain some early towncred.

i don't get it
what exactly is bothering you about how i was interacting with datisi
i pushed him p strong there
why would i back off there if i was scum?
how was i trying to gain some early towncred?

[Menalque]

guess what i flipped.

uh tonally i think you feel different in this game to that game

i only have like one solid townread and 1 maybe townread and 2 maaaaaaabe townreads and it's a problem

Must we do this every game now