Jigsaw's Revenge - Game Over

[Elsa Jay]

I can already tell Albert is gonna make this different. In a good way.

VOTE: Dannyboy

[momo]

Drixx vs Vecna feels very TvT to me. That said, I don't like how willing Hectic was to drop a vote on Vecna just because ABR told him to. I get that he's on V/LA, but I don't particularly like any of the current wagons, especially with the way they have all seemed to stall. Reading through his iso, I get the feeling that even though Hectic is providing some reads, he doesn't particularly believe in them or rather isn't committed to them. For a brief period he was active and made his presence known in the came, so it itsn't as if he's playing with minimal effort. He just doesn't particularly care who the D1 lynch.

VOTE: Hectic

[GuiltyLion]

@momo - what are your thoughts on Battle Mage and that wagon?

[GuiltyLion]

quick attempt at full 20 player reads

townreads - VaultDweller, Morning Tweet, Vecna, George, a50, BBMolla
don't want to lynch currently and would say town but less confident than first tier - Danyboy, Xtoxm, Elsa Jay, pisskop, momo, Blake
fairly undecided, could see either way - farside, Drixx, Pine, Hectic
scummy - Battle Mage, Rampage, davesaz, Gamma

[Vecna]

coukd i ask you for some words on your townreads on george, a50 amd BBmolla?

Likewise the scumread on dave?

overall my thoughts are quite similar

[Morning Tweet]

I'm curious about BB and dave, as well.

I actually kinda thought Gamma was less scummy than I usually see him as, too

[Almost50]

It's funny nor one person -other than EJ himself- commented on my referencing him saying almost the same thing in another game where he was scum. I get that scum don't want to deal with that one way or another (if he is scum it's best if they let it die, and if he is town then either town pushes through the mislynch or scum use it later to mislynch me). Now why did no TOWN player talk about that?

[GeorgeBailey]

Well I went back over your first argument drixx, and I see where youre coming from.

I must admit I did a very surface level pass on Momo's post and ill agree with you the contents are actually laughable, especially since the "like" referenced was in a roleplaying post (and my comment stating liking Momo for town based on that post was crap). oops

To add some more thoughts; I dont know if scum actually do come up with a line of attack like that or if its just town trying to be a smartass and copy some out there theory they saw before that makes no sense.

Whether that makes battle mage scum for sheeping and voting on tweet straight away? Could be, but im not very convinced that is the case, since clearly I also just flew right over that post.

I should probably go and form my own opinion on this shit

Ok, I think the current way Vecna is defending himself seems Townie. Scum wouldn't really admit their mistake here, and would more likely die on their hill.

I think Pine is probably the most I want to see pushed right now. I don't think I trust the members on the IDany wagon, and I don't think Elsa is honestly that scummy.

VOTE: Pine

[SirCakez]

Prodding Pine.

[Elsa Jay]

It's funny nor one person -other than EJ himself- commented on my referencing him saying almost the same thing in another game where he was scum. I get that scum don't want to deal with that one way or another (if he is scum it's best if they let it die, and if he is town then either town pushes through the mislynch or scum use it later to mislynch me). Now why did no TOWN player talk about that?

I talked about it and I'm town. Does that count?

[farside22]

It's funny nor one person -other than EJ himself- commented on my referencing him saying almost the same thing in another game where he was scum. I get that scum don't want to deal with that one way or another (if he is scum it's best if they let it die, and if he is town then either town pushes through the mislynch or scum use it later to mislynch me). Now why did no TOWN player talk about that?

I checked more into ej as a player and i feel very unsure since they are very monotone playstyle.
So far all i get is a lot of meh.

Wagon bores me for now on EJ.
Next on my scum list.
VOTE: BM
Drixx would be second strongest scum read.

[Blake Belladonna]

I will be around tomorrow.

[Elsa Jay]

"Monotone"? What does that mean farside?

[davesaz]

It's funny nor one person -other than EJ himself- commented on my referencing him saying almost the same thing in another game where he was scum. I get that scum don't want to deal with that one way or another (if he is scum it's best if they let it die, and if he is town then either town pushes through the mislynch or scum use it later to mislynch me). Now why did no TOWN player talk about that?

In all honesty whatever you said may have flown right over my head. Was this before or after I was already scumreading him?

[Drixx]

farside - why am I your 2nd strongest scum read?

[Drixx]

Well I went back over your first argument drixx, and I see where youre coming from.

I must admit I did a very surface level pass on Momo's post and ill agree with you the contents are actually laughable, especially since the "like" referenced was in a roleplaying post (and my comment stating liking Momo for town based on that post was crap). oops

To add some more thoughts; I dont know if scum actually do come up with a line of attack like that or if its just town trying to be a smartass and copy some out there theory they saw before that makes no sense.

Whether that makes battle mage scum for sheeping and voting on tweet straight away? Could be, but im not very convinced that is the case, since clearly I also just flew right over that post.

I should probably go and form my own opinion on this shit

Ok, I think the current way Vecna is defending himself seems Townie. Scum wouldn't really admit their mistake here, and would more likely die on their hill.

I think Pine is probably the most I want to see pushed right now. I don't think I trust the members on the IDany wagon, and I don't think Elsa is honestly that scummy.

VOTE: Pine

In general I feel like mistake admission is a personality thing more than an alignment thing.

Also I kinda pointed out that the last person to go all over the top "you're scummy and bad and should die IRL" on me about a day 1 push followed by me clamping down when the reaction was bad ... was scum.

Need to mull it over.

[Drixx]

Also my hood has died basically. Nobody in there seems motivated to talk at all.

When someone questioned the die off, another someone told them to scum hunt in the main thread.

Of those two responses to the hood going dry ... I feel like the "don't use it, just scum hunt in the main thread" response is maybe questionable. Thoughts?

[Morning Tweet]

It'd depends-- different people have different views on the usefulness of hoods, so it wouldn't surprise me.

[Elsa Jay]

That's how people were in the 50p game that got cancelled too. The bigger the hood the less people wanna use it instead of the main thread.

[GuiltyLion]

coukd i ask you for some words on your townreads on george, a50 amd BBmolla?

Likewise the scumread on dave?

overall my thoughts are quite similar

George I explained earlier in 362, I've had no issues with any of his posts since then either, I disagreed with the Vecna vote but his presentation and following up on it - leading to ultimately a reversal - felt genuine and town-motivated.

a50 felt pure to me in engaging with me over the danyBoy scumread, I also thought his pushback on ABR didn't feel like S-S and I think ABR is way scummier in that exchange. That said, when I went back in reread it again to write this up, I guessss it's not impossible to be theater. I might lower him to that second tier bc I don't think my reasons for townreading him are all that solid when I challenge myself on it, he basically just felt town-motivated in what he was doing but I can't rule out it being scum aiming to pick up town cred.

BBMolla I align a lot with his reads, the early ABR scumread and townread on me strike me as more likely town's Original Thoughts^TM rather than reads that help a scum agenda, 385 and 600 also feel like fundamentally honest posts.

Dave scumread is a combo of - didn't like his reads in 360 both in terms of the conclusions and how he formed them, I don't like the way he's taken swipes at my slot and Xtoxm for activity, and his spot on the EJ wagon fits the profile of where I suspect scum would try to jump on. Also, his interactions with ABR strike me as decent odds of S-S - says ABR is town in 360 then does some soft-ball engagement in 601 and then dismisses a point for scum!ABR in 638.

Speaking of 638, I don't like that post in general, he's agreeing with me that it seems like a scum!ABR comment, only I'm the buddy instead and it's meant to set up davesaz for a later lynch? Why is ABR was initially trying so hard to wagon me then, did he really decide to open the game by bussing me? And if it was just a reaction test then why agree with me in the first place?
I can maybe see 638 making more sense if the first sentence is meant to just be a joke, but it's not clear to me from the post whether it's joking or not.

[davesaz]

oh and Rampage had that line in there about "maybe GL and davesaz are bussing" and that was entirely illogical, feels like a subtle way to set me up if davesaz flips red

Nah, it's a subtle way of lining me up if you flip red.

Yes that's just a play on I'm town so gotta fix that for you.

In either case it's totally nonsensical.

We both agree that it was illogical. Neither of our behavior toward the other looked like bussing so where did he get that idea from in the first place?

I suspect he was just saying it to see if anyone would react.

ABR is plainly going for reactions in damn near every post he makes.

[davesaz]

As for reads in 360, if saying what you're thinking when someone asks is a problem, then don't know what I can say about it.

[VaultDweller]

@Drixx, speaking of, you never answered my question, unless I missed it.

Vecna and momo hard defending battle mage like that is interesting. I can't see two teammates defending him so early in the game, unless he has a very powerful role. Though it could be that vecna is town and scum!momo jumped on vecna's defense of battle mage. Not sure what to think of the whole thing, but there's a good chance there's scum in it, probably either Drixx or Battle Mage/momo.

@Drixx, what are your thoughts on this? Do you think all 3 are scum? What are your thoughts on momo?

VOTE: Drixx

For ignoring me.

[BBmolla]

Sorry I’ve been inactive. I’m having an off day. I’ll be back tomorrow.

[Vecna]

It's funny nor one person -other than EJ himself- commented on my referencing him saying almost the same thing in another game where he was scum. I get that scum don't want to deal with that one way or another (if he is scum it's best if they let it die, and if he is town then either town pushes through the mislynch or scum use it later to mislynch me). Now why did no TOWN player talk about that?

I checked more into ej as a player and i feel very unsure since they are very monotone playstyle.
So far all i get is a lot of meh.

Wagon bores me for now on EJ.
Next on my scum list.
VOTE: BM
Drixx would be second strongest scum read.

So you scumread BM but drixx is your 2nd strongest scumread?

So you either think drixx is hardcore bussing as his only read, or this proves youre really not reading the game at all?

Which is it