Micro 940: A Normal Blitz II - Game Over

[HoldenGolden]

Are you claiming PR monkey?

[Datisi]

GeorgeBailey (5) - Umlaut,

HoldenGolden

, Hiraki,

Hoctac

,

Datisi

Hiraki (2) - humaneatingmonkey,

GeorgeBailey

Datisi (1) - Madoka

Not Voting (1) - shiki

Or alternatively.

I'm blue da ba dee da ba die

[humaneatingmonkey]

Oh is blue PR color? I just wanted to emphasize that Umlaut and Hiraki are both unconfirmed in a green wagon and Umlaut is still working on a narrative that it's not an obvious counterwagon to Hiraki.

[Micc]

Votecount 2.02

Umlaut (2) -

humaneatingmonkey, shiki

Hiraki (1) -

Madoka

humaneatingmonkey (1) -

Hiraki

Not Voting (3) -

Datisi, HoldenGolden, Umlaut

With 7 players alive it takes 4 votes to lynch.

The deadline for Day 2 is in (expired on 2020-05-21 11:30:00).

[Umlaut]

Oh is blue PR color? I just wanted to emphasize that Umlaut and Hiraki are both unconfirmed in a green wagon and Umlaut is still working on a narrative that it's not an obvious counterwagon to Hiraki.

I can't quite parse this sentence. Of course I'm aware I'm unconfirmed to others, that's why I didn't make myself green, but I'm not going to just wall off the fact that I'm town and refuse to take it into account when I'm giving my perspective on the game.

[Umlaut]

Like how would saying "oh but maybe I'm scum too" make that post any better?

[humaneatingmonkey]

Okay fair enough

[HoldenGolden]

Oh is blue PR color? I just wanted to emphasize that Umlaut and Hiraki are both unconfirmed in a green wagon and Umlaut is still working on a narrative that it's not an obvious counterwagon to Hiraki.

I take it instinctively as a PR ish color since its not green nor red. It's also from where I've read mafia games off site that use blue for TPR

Isnt him saying hiraki's vote on George being survival in nature contradict your assumption that he is fighting that narrative? He could of easily said that Hirakis vote though makes sense given that it was his second scum lean.

I know that's an option because I'm reading those posts from Hiraki rn lol

[Madoka]

Also how is this factoring in the fact that bugs was the day 1 lynch which would force more interaction out of HEM versus here where Shiki hasn't had a serious bandwagon?

It does not matter. This is simply an attempt to communicate where my vibe was coming from in language other than 'vibe.' I do not at all think it is evidence that he is scum.

[Madoka]

Shiki, who would you have voted to lynch yesterday?

[Madoka]

The more that I think about it, the more I think gambit comes from town Umlaut. I think mafia would have been resistant to Hectic's plan, considering the backlash.

[Madoka]

HEM, in Blitz I you reacted to Hiraki scumreading you by scumreading him. You reacted the same here. And reacted the same to me when I asked if you and shiki were partners. Do you tend to do this as either alignment? And if so, would you be able to be able to provide an example of doing so as town?

[Madoka]

Also HEM why did you stop pursuing Hiraki as strongly as you were? Also do you think you may be pushing Umlaut more out of principle than legitimately finding his intentions scummy?

[Umlaut]

Okay fair enough

I don't like this, you are backing off an explanation given by your top scumread way too fast.

[Umlaut]

Spoiler: shiki reads on GeorgeBailey

i remember georgebailey reacting very literally to a similar situation in the past so my initial read was towny.

i think georgebailey simply took it at face value. he modded a game in which i was part of a hydra and my unnamed hydra partner impersonated me. at endgame, georgebailey continued to believe that the impersonator had been me, so i think him reading the mason claims the way he did checks out.

i think it is town indicative because of the way he seemed to be celebrating his past victory. its kinda the inverse of something i felt last time from humaneatingmonkey when it felt like he was trying to get me lynched before getting lynched himself not to win the game but because i had been scumreading him all game.

it kinda feels like our mason claims do not care who is lynched. umlaut is scumreading georgebailey for something i thought was kinda towny and hoctac is scumreading georgebailey for not responding to his request for reads promptly. umlaut voiced his suspicion of you immediately after monkey started the wagon and hoctac has jumped between the wagons.

-His positioning between the Hiraki/monkey wagons, and assuming it's TvS and but not that they're bussing. I didn't find the way he ruled out TvT natural.

i thought this was weird as well, though his explanation of what he thought town v town arguments looked like kinda resonated with me.

So, from a bit of research, turns out George's tone is completely NAI, and he's actually just a really nice guy.

scum!georgebailey feels really aimless to me.

Said she thought he was town. Continued to say she thought he was town. Raised meta points to support this. Would have looked super weird jumping onto his wagon. I think it's safe to say if there was scum waiting in the wings to jump onto the GeorgeBailey wagon, it was definitely not shiki, because she put herself in a position where it would have been hard for her to do that plausibly.

[humaneatingmonkey]

The more that I think about it, the more I think gambit comes from town Umlaut. I think mafia would have been resistant to Hectic's plan, considering the backlash.

Why would mafia be resistant to Hectic's plan? It's the perfect excuse to kill off your neighbor and get townread for it. It's either accept this gambit or ML the town neighbor. Both would flip the town neighbor in such a way that reveals they weren't confirmed, but the other provides an excuse to be seen as town.

HEM, in Blitz I you reacted to Hiraki scumreading you by scumreading him. You reacted the same here. And reacted the same to me when I asked if you and shiki were partners. Do you tend to do this as either alignment? And if so, would you be able to be able to provide an example of doing so as town?

I don't know if I do it as both alignments. I can tell you why I reacted the way I did now. If you want to, you can scan my previous town games.

Also HEM why did you stop pursuing Hiraki as strongly as you were? Also do you think you may be pushing Umlaut more out of principle than legitimately finding his intentions scummy?

Who said I stopped? My lynch order is Umlaut and Hiraki, and it's increasingly getting obvious that Hiraki isn't trying to case my slot in good faith.

I don't like this, you are backing off an explanation given by your top scumread way too fast.

There was no reason not to believe your explanation, and it's an explanation that makes sense even if you're scum. I can see that you're trying to make your POV consistent, and that's fair.

[humaneatingmonkey]

Like, don't agree to the gambit, your town neighbor becomes suspicious "why wouldn't he want that?"
Agree to the gambit, and don't kill your partner, your town neighbor becomes suspicious "why wasn't I killed last night?"
Agree to the gambit, and kill your partner, you get towncred.

There's a scum!planation for agreeing to it, and I don't think you should dismiss that.

[humaneatingmonkey]

If you guys got any more questions, you got 30 minutes before I put the lights out.

[humaneatingmonkey]

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=74541

This isn't a flattering town game but I pretty much OMGUS tunneled Sephiroth here.

[humaneatingmonkey]

Now that I think about it yeah I think I have the inclination to 1v1 anyone who finds me scummy regardless of alignment lol. I think the egg came first before the chicken in as much as I OMGUS as town, and I try to emulate that as scum.

[humaneatingmonkey]

Since that terrible encounter with Sephiroth, though, I try to take myself out of tunnels by checking with my townreads if my reads are right.

[Madoka]

I think the first line is incorrect. If you don't agree to the gambit, your partner thinks nothing or town reads you. If you agree to the gambit and kill your partner, you do not get town cred. The only thing the gambit was useful was the possibility of line two. Had they not died, we would know one or the other was scum. But one of them dying does not provide insight one way or the other.

As to why mafia would be resistant to the plan, because of how bad it makes them look among the town. We gave umlaut multiple chances to come clean and he could have used any of those as a way out of the gambit. You made it clear that if he was lying we would lynch him. The fact that he continued it any way I think is indicative that he was less concerned about self-preservation and more concerned about reading Hoc.

[humaneatingmonkey]

It's a very hard question to answer with 100% certainty because I can only see who I voted and I can't check if it's because they were sus of me in under 3 minutes, so I trust that you'll do the honest digging for me (I want to sleep). You can ask shiki for her meta on me. Although I remember Winter Wonderland like a traumatic event and that's the first thing I'll refer you to.

[humaneatingmonkey]

Madoka, Umlaut literally celebrates Hoctac's death because now he's confirmed town, he says.

[humaneatingmonkey]

Hoctac's idea was that it would confirm mafia believed the neighbor claim and so the other neighbor was town, but I did point out at some point in the day that if he were scum he could just kill me and use that same argument to "clear" himself if people bought it, so I don"t necessarily expect to be treated as clear. But I know this means Mafia at least thought the claims were likely to be true.

Do you 100% buy this perspective?