Open 791 | Forest Fire | Game Over

[tea leaves]

PEdit: Ah, good timing. To start with: did you do anything with regards to the game during N1?

Nope!

[tea leaves]

Also, if scum|GuiltyLion goes after you with VCA, what would you expect Town|GuiltyLion to do?

A push on someone that's a whole lot more substantial and reasonable than whatever this is.

[Bell]

Yeah I thought about and shifted weight from Ydrasse to MT. I thought about end day gamma/Gl interactions and whether it was natural for GL to be as insightful as he was being in regards to me/ydrasse.
I thought about. given my averageness in scum hunting, if I should be looking at my null reads rather than my scum reads more.

Why do you have such a strong read on me Farren?

[Bell]

Oh, you were talking to tealeaves. Woops.

[GuiltyLion]

Also, if scum|GuiltyLion goes after you with VCA, what would you expect Town|GuiltyLion to do?

A push on someone that's a whole lot more substantial and reasonable than whatever this is.

I don't feel like you've given a lot of thoughts to my motives here

[GuiltyLion]

I'm beginning to see why tea leaves suggested GL/Farren the other day. If im not screwing up which I definitely am but still, it'd mean 1-2 of them is scum. Both I highly doubt

What is your actual read on tea leaves, though

like you say you might be getting tricked on them, but you're voting in a dichotomy that they presented?

and if Farren flips town, does that mean you vote me tomorrow?

[Farren]

Farren, what do you think about Ydrasse now? I see that you took her getting chopped down so much for granted that you moved your vote to pressure tea leaves on the basis that they were getting nervous in response to Ydrasse's pressure.

that does leave me somewhat confused on where you stand on her

To elaborate more on this: yes, I definitely took Ydrasse getting executed for granted. I did switch to tea leaves because of how they reacted to Bell's pressure. But I wouldn't say there's a connection between me taking Ydrasse's execution for granted and my voting for tea leaves.

Interestingly enough, I was worried about a possible flash-wagon on Ydrasse, but didn't anticipate a flash-wagon on Gamma. Which tells me that my perception of the game-state was off.

That doesn't address your question, though. I was nervous when Gamma flipped; couldn't put a finger on why. I was worried about flash-wagons on Ydrasse, but I think that was more of a case of not wanting to see any sudden action while a claim was resolving, just on general principles. Although now I'm wondering if my gut was trying to tell me something townie about Ydrasse.

So: confusion is understandable, as my position is conflicted between what my brain's telling me (middle of the road read leads to scum more often than death-tunnels do) and what my gut is hinting at.

[GuiltyLion]

As Morning mentioned, it's pretty easy to tell I'm on both wagons because it naturally follows from my earlier reads.

this is also kinda silly reasoning to defend yourself as town, scum are going to make sure their reads align with their votes

I'm interested in seeing whether a wagon on you here can get off the ground given it swung away twice yesterday

[Farren]

PEdit: Ah, good timing. To start with: did you do anything with regards to the game during N1?

Nope!

Is that your normal style of play when you're a VT or equivalent? Take a break from the game and relax?

[tea leaves]

Also, if scum|GuiltyLion goes after you with VCA, what would you expect Town|GuiltyLion to do?

A push on someone that's a whole lot more substantial and reasonable than whatever this is.

I don't feel like you've given a lot of thoughts to my motives here

Do you still like the reasoning for your vote, given the readlist Morning pointed out?

[tea leaves]

PEdit: Ah, good timing. To start with: did you do anything with regards to the game during N1?

Nope!

Is that your normal style of play when you're a VT or equivalent? Take a break from the game and relax?

Yeah, I very rarely reread stuff over the night.

[GuiltyLion]

Do you still like the reasoning for your vote, given the readlist Morning pointed out?

I like my reasoning for my vote for entirely different reasons than the reasoning you're challenging

[Farren]

A push on someone that's a whole lot more substantial and reasonable than whatever this is.

Do you think there's a strong case to be made against anyone right now?

[tea leaves]

As Morning mentioned, it's pretty easy to tell I'm on both wagons because it naturally follows from my earlier reads.

this is also kinda silly reasoning to defend yourself as town, scum are going to make sure their reads align with their votes

I'm interested in seeing whether a wagon on you here can get off the ground given it swung away twice yesterday

No, it's the fact you're using the the reasoning that I was on both wagons to support your argument. It labels me as opportunistic, when that's not the case since those were my bottom two scumreads.

[Bell]

If you guys make an insanely good case on tea leaves i’ll Consider it.
But clidd kind of obvtowns every game he’s in and this game wasn’t an exception to that.

[tea leaves]

Also, I was wagoned to 3 or 4 votes yesterday a couple of times, so confused by that reasoning too.

[GuiltyLion]

As Morning mentioned, it's pretty easy to tell I'm on both wagons because it naturally follows from my earlier reads.

this is also kinda silly reasoning to defend yourself as town, scum are going to make sure their reads align with their votes

I'm interested in seeing whether a wagon on you here can get off the ground given it swung away twice yesterday

No, it's the fact you're using the the reasoning that I was on both wagons to support your argument. It labels me as opportunistic, when that's not the case since those were my bottom two scumreads.

I've never said you were opportunistic. If anything it's survivalist, but it's not opportunistic, and the larger point really had nothing to do with why you were voting where you were voting at all, and more to do with the way D1 played out

[GuiltyLion]

Also, I was wagoned to 3 or 4 votes yesterday a couple of times, so confused by that reasoning too.

yeah and I was not one of those voters

so

[Farren]

Yeah I thought about and shifted weight from Ydrasse to MT. I thought about end day gamma/Gl interactions and whether it was natural for GL to be as insightful as he was being in regards to me/ydrasse.
I thought about. given my averageness in scum hunting, if I should be looking at my null reads rather than my scum reads more.

Why do you have such a strong read on me Farren?

You've been pushing. You've been hunting. Pretty much constantly since you got here.

That's a good sign of Town in general. If it results in a whole bunch of Town corpses by the time ELo rolls around, then it's time to re-evaluate.

[tea leaves]

A push on someone that's a whole lot more substantial and reasonable than whatever this is.

Do you think there's a strong case to be made against anyone right now?

Not a strong case, no. There might be if I looked through stuff again.

GuiltyLion doesn't feel like he's pushing me in good faith here though.

[GuiltyLion]

If you guys make an insanely good case on tea leaves i’ll Consider it.
But clidd kind of obvtowns every game he’s in and this game wasn’t an exception to that.

I don't really see how clidd was obvtown, he said his scum reads were Pine/Dunn and gave a locktown read on Menalque, pushed back against me when I voted him but didn't scumread me.

[GuiltyLion]

A push on someone that's a whole lot more substantial and reasonable than whatever this is.

Do you think there's a strong case to be made against anyone right now?

Not a strong case, no. There might be if I looked through stuff again.

GuiltyLion doesn't feel like he's pushing me in good faith here though.

again, I don't feel like you're considering motives for my vote or why I'm doing what I'm doing.

[Bell]

If you guys make an insanely good case on tea leaves i’ll Consider it.
But clidd kind of obvtowns every game he’s in and this game wasn’t an exception to that.

I don't really see how clidd was obvtown, he said his scum reads were Pine/Dunn and gave a locktown read on Menalque, pushed back against me when I voted him but didn't scumread me.

*blink*
And?

[GuiltyLion]

why are you saying he was obvtown? What did he do that he doesn't do as scum?

[tea leaves]

Dunn wagon at L-1:

Dunnstral - 4 (Morning Tweet, GuiltyLion, tea leaves, Ydrasse)
Unofficial, blame me for errors.

Gamma wagon:

VOTECOUNT 1.FINAL

Mountains

[5] Gamma Emerald :

Dunnstral, Bell, tea leaves, Isis, GuiltyLion

tea leaves is on both and was a counter wagon to both - is anybody hard townreading them?

I mean, I don't think I'm missing anything here?

You're voting me because I was on both wagons, and letting the reader draw the conclusions of why that makes me scum (opportunism/survivalism) - except you leave out or don't consider the detail I scumread those two throughout before the wagons on them existed, and it was natural for my progression to vote them.