Mini Normal 2163: MItGBSMoD [game over!]

[Datisi]

Vote count 5.02

with 5 votes in play, it takes 3 to make a decision. day 5 ends in (expired on 2020-10-14 13:30:00).

execution

PlusJOYED [1]:

shellyc

Not Voting [4]:

Menalque, NDMath, Ydrasse, PlusJOYED

mod notes

~ datisi was prodded for being a lazy ass mod
~ lol oops

flavour

[NDMath]

I was originally backup JK and since D3 I've been promoted. I didn't crumb but I can point to a couple of points in the game where I think my role was very clearly influencing my play.

*mechanics viewpoint*
Best choice of actions from my pov:
D5 Elim Plus
N5 JK Ydrasse, I commute
D6 Elim Shelly
N6 JK Ydrasse, I commute
D7 Elim Ydrasse

It doesn't make sense to jail me because I'm decently likely to be ascetic as scum, meaning no info gained and only a small chance of an extra elim.
However, if eliming me tomorrow it does makes more sense to jail the survivor of shelly/plus than ydrasse, due to them being more likely to be scum.

i think at minimum for a mini there needs to be 6 vts

Lol. Where's this assumption come from?

ndmath please show up i would like to hear your Thoughts on plus voting you for a bit.

Objectiv-ish standpoint, Wifom on whether it makes plus/shelly more likely or plus/me more likely.
Either way it's very indicative of plus being scum.

[shellyc]

I was originally backup JK and since D3 I've been promoted. I didn't crumb but I can point to a couple of points in the game where I think my role was very clearly influencing my play.

wooooooah!

[shellyc]

5 prs is way too much for a mini sooo
UNVOTE: shellyc
VOTE: ndmath

what tf? why did you just vote outside your 1v1

[shellyc]

i’ve been going about my business and the andres nk is giving me cold feet a bit. i’m unsure if shelly would do something that like... obvious or not.

on the other hand i wonder if plus is just trying to pick a different 1v1 with math? like if shelly is town and plus knows they can’t win that way they’d rather go the route of math -> shelly.

no matter what my alignment is im decent at 1v1s and plus knows that, this is exactly how im interpreting the situation now

[shellyc]

but there cannot be 5 town prs, and since you claimed backup jk, we had 3 pr flips, and you are locktown to me

why can there not be 5 TPRs
loyal cop is weak especially with rolestopper
backup jailer might not see use
jailer is strong
miller checker is near-useless
full commuter is a stretch though

hmmmm what if plus/math are both scum

[shellyc]

on kerset, i didn't want to go into detail but I think I have to:
they do seem nervous from their iso. But newbish scumtells are also newbie pr tells. They are most definitely either doctor or mafia. From mafia!kersets perspective, they haven't been putting much effort into solving I think and have been one of the quieter ones. That could be a doctor who is worried about being outed (I think is likely) or a scum player who doesn't wanna seem sus. If they are scum, then by crumbing a fake claim early they'd know they are under suspicion. But Saudade death tunneled kerset from the get go and gave them many chances to prove towniness by posting game stuff early on; kerset did not. Why would scum!Kerset crumb there, when they could likely have escaped suspicion early pretty easily by just acting townie instead? That's honestly not hard to do as scum or town, especially given Saudades low bar. That doesn't make sense to me at all why they would crumb and take a big risk as scum; hell their 2 scum buddies could have helped them by evening writing out towny things for Kerset to say if Kerset didn't know how to do it. That's the biggest flaw in the scum!kerset idea imo.

Instead Kerset just got more nervous and defensive. This attitude makes the most sense from doc!Kerset perspective, where they don't want to appear too towny so they become a maf target and die n1. The early hammer reaction looked realish but could be faked. Rather, they wanted to lay low, maybe even appear a little scummy so maf would leave them alone possibly (idk for sure), but Saudade wouldn't back off, and a wagon formed. Kerset showed more signs of being nervous which makes sense from town!Kerset perspective imo. If I was scum and knew Kerset wasn't, I'd let Kerset live n1 and then jump on them like crazy day 2 to get them mislimed, which we might see. I came to this conclusion pretty early after Kerset claimed doc, and wanted to see who would jump on to get a solid scumtell start of day 2.

tl;dr scum kerset mindset doesn't make sense and so they are very likely town imo.

I'm leaning Saudade kerset being tvt.

the reread continues
plus, kerset is not a newbie lol
also why is nervousness a towntell or a tpr tell. and crumbing is not a big risk

[PlusJOYED]

god i already know its you but you pulled this same shit in as scum twice against me
its frustrating when you know the answer but cant convince town. i wish osuka was still alive
imma go out on a limb and say bob and iv played omega sus and I would have voted them again if i went back in time, but im not exactly good at this game either

[PlusJOYED]

Also shelly theres no way there is 5 prs, what are you smoking
that'd mean half of town is VT half is a pr

[shellyc]

god i already know its you but you pulled this same shit in as scum twice against me
its frustrating when you know the answer but cant convince town. i wish osuka was still alive
imma go out on a limb and say bob and iv played omega sus and I would have voted them again if i went back in time, but im not exactly good at this game either

hello
don’t try and AtE ok, the answer is you’re scum

jailer is strong pr
loyal cop is mid-tier pr (gives clears but not hard reds)
commuter is strong pr
backup jailer is weak pr
miller checker is weak pr

[Menalque]

i’ve been going about my business and the andres nk is giving me cold feet a bit. i’m unsure if shelly would do something that like... obvious or not.

on the other hand i wonder if plus is just trying to pick a different 1v1 with math? like if shelly is town and plus knows they can’t win that way they’d rather go the route of math -> shelly.

yes, +1 on the andres NK, but I think it's all just WIFOM at this point. like, if you have someone calling for your head and you're scum, you either kill them and argue that you wouldn't do that because it points back to you and it's a setup, or you don't kill them and you claim that them still being alive is why you're not scum. I think personally the andres kill was prob much more about the fact that he's a solid analytical player who was about to re-evaluate and deep-dive the game again after finally having untunnelled himself with the osuka flip, plus he was prob the hardest possible push for scum given that he'd already claimed a PR that fit very naturally into the setup.


on plus trying to pick another 1v1 with math... maybe? like yes, if he's scum, I think that's what he was trying to do. but again it's just so incredibly inelegant that idk if it's too blatant

this is the problem with letting a slot that is verging into TSTBS territory into lylo, you just keep getting stuck on the back and forth

[Menalque]

But it’s shit like this that just makes no sense to me from either alignment but I’m gonna feel worse about then losing to that if shelly is town and my TR there was good and it is just math + plus

Like I don’t understand why you ever unvote there when the person should be conf!scum to you, especially when I don’t understand what happened to the possibility of shelly/ydrasse that you had before. Like has that completely evaporated? I would expect shelly being conf!scum to you would make you more concerned about that being right again vs less

But then equally, voting math also doesn’t make sense for scum!plus because it just looks so off in an optics sense and ugh

you misunderstand mena
i still think ydrasse has played a scummy game, i think scummier than ndmath even
but there cannot be 5 town prs, and since you claimed backup jk, we had 3 pr flips, and you are locktown to me
so therefore commuter is fake
ndmath being shellys partner is just my poe, so therefore ydrasse has to be town
what i think would make the most sense from a scumteam pov is for shelly to be the rolestopper and ndmath claims ascetic/commuter while doing the nk most nights so they'll be immune to everything basically

but like, why can't there be 5? there would normally be 3-4 in game vs goons, and there's 2 scum left and we know that at least one of them is PR. if the other is also PR (idk, role cop maybe would work in this setup?) then 5 TPR is very plausible

I don't understand how you're getting ydrasse has to be town here, and like it's that again you're moving math around in a way that feels like you really don't wanna be connected to him but also that you scumread him

[Menalque]

I don't think I phrased that last thought very well

like throughout the game you've moved math to a point where he's always just not quite the person you want to vote. now you've got conf!scum (fypov) shelly and yet you still vote math which just seems like hnnnng

[Menalque]

I should really reread ydrasse but I don't have the energy so I'm just really gonna hope andres was right alongside my own feeling that there's no way scum!ydra plays EoD1 like she did

[PlusJOYED]

half the town being prs in a normal is insane to me, its not possible and i've never seen it
we shouldn't vote outside of me/shelly anyway

[PlusJOYED]

basicially mena I don't believe you. There has to be 4 prs this game for it to make sense and I won't be convinced otherwise
the solve is shelly/ndmath
regardless, no way me and shelly isn't TvS
lets just end this day now im getting sick of the back and forth myself and people being inactive
i also have a meta tell on shelly being scum and ydrasee town im not gonna share
but scum!shelly loves to seem friendly and appease the rest of town. Look back to doggos and hedgehog newbie, she did the same stuff there too

[Ydrasse]

i haaaaaate this game

[PlusJOYED]

the fact that people are on at different times is annoying to me too

[PlusJOYED]

im sick of saying stuff and waiting 20 hours for a response
VOTE: shellyc
im sticking to this, I'm waiting for people to make up their minds between me and shelly today.
I'll answer questions tho

[Ydrasse]

sell me on not voting you before i do

[PlusJOYED]

no

[NDMath]

this is the problem with letting a slot that is verging into TSTBS territory into lylo, you just keep getting stuck on the back and forth

I don't see how you don't have this problem anyway. Every slot has to be in some way sorted at some point in games which go to lylo.

basicially mena I don't believe you. There has to be 4 prs this game for it to make sense and I won't be convinced otherwise
the solve is shelly/ndmath
regardless, no way me and shelly isn't TvS
lets just end this day now im getting sick of the back and forth myself and people being inactive
i also have a meta tell on shelly being scum and ydrasee town im not gonna share
but scum!shelly loves to seem friendly and appease the rest of town. Look back to doggos and hedgehog newbie, she did the same stuff there too

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=29549
^Mini normal role list archives
Focusing on the recent, a plurality of 4 town pr games (among the 13 player games) but there's a decent number of 5-6.


Shelley just called a commuter stronger than a loyal cop.

[shellyc]

Shelley just called a commuter stronger than a loyal cop.

loyal cop with rolestopper means rolestopper stopping town = basically framer for scum
commuter is also a miller to loyal cop

[shellyc]

sell me on not voting you before i do

ydrasse I will be very very disappointed if you dont end up voting plus because plus is scum

[Menalque]

I don't see how you don't have this problem anyway. Every slot has to be in some way sorted at some point in games which go to lylo.

What I mean is that you often don’t want to leave eliminating a slot you think has good odds of being scum but that you’re not sure on until lylo because those slots are like crack for scum who desperately want them in lylo as a good misguillo option

Like the worst is being in gylo with a slot that you think could be scum but could have been brought by scum as bait