Open 798 | PYPX/Y+I/M | Game Over!

[Hoopla]

This is an insanely wolfy and opportunistic hop on, hoopla, and it’s exactly like what you did on D2

no offense, but i'm not really interested in having a prolonged back-and-forth with you. i've made my decision. if you're town, i'm sorry, but the game just makes more sense if you're scum.

i'd rather spend the rest of the day talking with peta/dave/lilith/N_M if they want to talk shop.

[Menalque]

I’m pretty sure there is at least one but not 3 scum in (lil, Dave, Best Bird, peta, infinity)

I think there is still a decent chance of 1 scum in (hoopla, best bird, NM)

EBWOP

vote count 2.06

Menalque (6)

: lilith2013, Infinity 324, JacksonVirgo, Hoopla, Dunnstral, TheGoldenParadox

TheGoldenParadox (2)

: Uncrowned, PenguinPower

JacksonVirgo (1)

: petapan

Infinity 324 (1)

: Menalque

Not voting

: davesaz, Something_Smart, skitter30

Deadline: (expired on 2020-11-13 13:00:00)

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to eliminate.

mod notes

:
- skitter30 v/la fridays & saturdays
- JacksonVirgo v/la til 06/11/2020
- quack

There’s also prob 1 scum in (Best Bird, peta, Dave. S_S, skitt)

How does this add up?

If we cross reference the DGB voters with the people who stayed off me D2, who is in both piles

(Best bird, Dave, peta)

There’s also the fact that if there is scum in the 4s it’s (hoopla, NM, best bird) of which I would lean NM, but if it was best bird I think that would spew NM and hoopla town

dunn --> dave, Best Bird --> NM --> peta, hoopla --> infinity, lili --> S_S, skitter

Strong TR is skitt

Probably TRing S_S again, and I guess I will sheep skitt on infinity

Think hoopla is prob town too tbh

Think lili is prob town mechanically

Max 1 scum in (Best Bird, N_M) imo

Elim through (Dave, peta, Best Bird, N_M) bearing in mind the 1 scum max thing

I don't think bird and NM are ever scum together because I don't think JV is a meme-y enough player to take 4 with his scumbuddy

I strongly suspect davesaz would be in place of one of NM/JV if lilith is correct

okay, so

I think infinity and hoopla are both locktown by their reactions tbh

I'm pretty deeply unsettled by S_S disappearing like that, especially as there was a moment there when I saw him come online in online users at the bottom of the main page, but then disappeared almost immediately and didn't comment anything in the interim. this is a big question for me now of whether to trust skit's read or not

NM I think is very likely to be town from his reaction

Lilith's reaction was... very meh? not exactly what I'd expect to see from someone who just caught scum, but equally quite plausibly someone from someone who knows I'm lying

peta could have been a scum reaction

Dave could be a scum reaction

BB not here sadly, but could be scum regardless

so does anyone have a problem with just sequentially eliminating (Best Bird, Dave, lilith, peta)?

[Menalque]

This is a selection of posts dating back to yesterday where BB has been an active part of my solve

[Menalque]

i've made my decision. if you're town, i'm sorry, but the game just makes more sense if you're scum.

THIS IS SUPER FUCKING SCUMMY AND DON’T FORGET ABOUT IT TOMORROW

[Menalque]

Hoopla is voting me based on lies and when pushed is actively unable or unwilling to provide any reasons for her vote

[Menalque]

She’s also never explained why N_M is cleared beyond a fallacious argument (that I refuted and she didn’t pick me back up on) and she’s talked a good game about teams that make sense but is unable/unwilling to cover how I fit in with the only plausible scumbuddies she’s arguing I have

[Menalque]

i've made my decision. if you're town, i'm sorry, but the game just makes more sense if you're scum.

THIS IS SUPER FUCKING SCUMMY AND DON’T FORGET ABOUT IT TOMORROW

[petapan]

UNVOTE:

i've been worried about hoopla all day but fuck, i don't know. i can try and reread

[Hoopla]

alright, i was misremembering your exact positions. from memory i had you overly focusing on lilith/dave/peta solves.

so, i rescind that point and apologise for the misrep. but it also reinforces my point that you're literally keeping all options open.

[Menalque]

Okay, so I think hoopla and Dave are basically outed scum at this point

They’re outed scum or throwing town, so I’m going to go with outed scum *shrug*

[Menalque]

alright, i was misremembering your exact positions. from memory i had you overly focusing on lilith/dave/peta solves.

so, i rescind that point and apologise for the misrep. but it also reinforces my point that you're literally keeping all options open.

Interesting how your position has swiftly and radically reversed from “town by play” to “obvscum that needs to be eliminated”

[Menalque]

Who are my partners, hoopla?

[Menalque]

...infinity are you scum?

[Menalque]

...S_S are

you

scum?

[Hoopla]

Who are my partners, hoopla?

i stand by my logic at the end of 3424.

probably two of SS/BB/infinity.

[Menalque]

Okay,

E x p l a i n

T h a t

[Menalque]

infinity has good partner equity with menalque (he jumped on my push on SS quite easily with no original thought), and when you view the game from a menalque-scum angle that is suspicious timing. SS and BB sitting back while this whole thing rages on makes for good partner equity too.

Or is this literally all you have to say by way of your beliefs on the matter?

[Hoopla]

Interesting how your position has swiftly and radically reversed from “town by play” to “obvscum that needs to be eliminated”

the reality is at this point in the game there are good reasons for every player to be town, so "town by play" doesn't cut it when you have a larger amount of suspicious reasons counterbalancing it.

[Menalque]

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... B%5D=32813

^this is the ISO for my last scumgame btw, where I did high effort

Tell me there’s anything like as much content in there as I’ve got in this thread

And also let’s note that, again, clearly effort isn’t /clearing/ for me, but it is indicative

And the fact is that I’ve made 100 posts more in 2 weeks less when comparing that (one of my highest WIM scumgames) to this (a pretty typical towngame)

[Menalque]

Interesting how your position has swiftly and radically reversed from “town by play” to “obvscum that needs to be eliminated”

the reality is at this point in the game there are good reasons for every player to be town, so "town by play" doesn't cut it when you have a larger amount of suspicious reasons counterbalancing it.

Prithee, tell me what are all the good reasons for everyone else to be town?

Why is N_M locktown? Why is Dave? You have never explained either of those beyond spurious mathematical arguments that I’ve refuted

[Menalque]

Well, I’ve refuted the one on N_M anyway

Idk that you’ve ever actually offered a reason on Dave

[Menalque]

{me, hoopla, mena}

We need to find one more town.

i would gamble the game on the neighbouriser being town.

Does knowing I would actively prioritise getting neighbouriser if I was scum impact this take at all?

No I’d pick neighbouriser because I like PTs

This is the problem hoopla, you’re assuming all the decisions made will be to try and play the game to the maximum wincon % but a lot of us make at least some of the decisions for reasons totally unrelated to that, in this case role being part of that

I don’t play PyP to minmax, I play it because I like the people in the game and maybe I’ll get a cool role that I like

Plus just the general problem of induction — just because people in previous games have not chosen neighbouriser as scum, it doesn’t hold that they’ll have done the same in this game

[Hoopla]

Or is this literally all you have to say by way of your beliefs on the matter?

this is reasoning that is built from a perspective of PoE that is making assumptions elsewhere. so, i'm not particularly interesting in arguing why the walls of PoE have closed to where they have. incidentally, that is the beauty of PoE. i don't have to get into arguments with scum about why they're scum - that is never a fruitful endeavour.

if you want to talk about my assumptions elsewhere, i'd be more willing to discuss those.

but like i said, i'd rather talk to other sections of the playerlist than get in a protracted back-and-forth with you.

[Menalque]

I am LITERALLY trying to engage you about the flawed assumptions that you’re making in order to create that PoE and you’re dismissing it with the circular logic of “well, I used certain assumptions to make a PoE, you’re in the PoE so I won’t bother to explain my reasons or talk to you because you’re scum because you’re in the PoE, and so I won’t listen to any critiques you have of the way I formed this PoE”

[Menalque]

BIG BLARING FLASHING RED ALARM THAT HOOPLA IS SCUM, REMEMBER THIS TOMORROW

ALSO DAVE IS SCUM