Open 798 | PYPX/Y+I/M | Game Over!

[Something_Smart]

Bc now I get to explain how your reasons are made up to look reasonable while not actually being reasonable and we get to kill scum!you for like, the first time ever!

I mean my reasons are just "your claims are extraordinary and you have given insufficient proof of them"...

[the worst]

vote count 4.17

Menalque (4):

Not_Mafia, davesaz, petapan, Something_Smart

petapan (2):

Infinity 324, Hoopla

Something_Smart (1):

Menalque

Not voting

: Best Bird, Smoke and Mirrors

Deadline: (expired on 2020-11-26 17:00:00)

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to eliminate.

mod notes

:
- quack

[Menalque]

vote count 4.17

Menalque (4):

Not_Mafia, davesaz, petapan, Something_Smart

petapan (2):

Infinity 324, Hoopla

Something_Smart (1):

Menalque

Not voting

: Something_Smart, Best Bird, Smoke and Mirrors

Deadline: (expired on 2020-11-26 17:00:00)

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to eliminate.

mod notes

:
- quack

This night in the Open Queue, we have... Something_Smart starring in Schrodinger’s Voter 2: Eletric Boogaloo

[Menalque]

Bc now I get to explain how your reasons are made up to look reasonable while not actually being reasonable and we get to kill scum!you for like, the first time ever!

I mean my reasons are just "your claims are extraordinary and you have given insufficient proof of them"...

You gotta know what’s coming here, surely

[Menalque]

"your claims are extraordinary and you have given insufficient proof of them"

[Something_Smart]

[petapan]

lmfao

[Menalque]

Like how do I make over 400 posts here defneind myself as scum instead of getting my team to bus the shit out of me?

1 They are not mutually exclusive; also, if the wagon on you went super fast, bussing would be expected.

Because if I /do/ successfully defend myself, I’m going down tomorrow, right? Like, look at how much pressure is on me, the only thing that buys scum!me another day is a scumflip

2 Maybe, but getting rid of peta first is a pretty huge boost to your team.

Getting my partners to defend me would be suicide for the scumteam overall because they’d go down after their connections to me once I went down tomorrow.

3 Not necessarily, because there will be other people who didn't defend you, and they can switch over if your execution looks inevitable, and they can make the WIFOM argument that they wouldn't be so obvious.

So, I’m only scum here if I’m hard bussing and the effort is to make me look really good. In which case, I have to have persuaded pretty much half the town to NOT vote me here even as scum are ACTIVELY SUPPORTING my death, and I’m good, but I’m not convinced I’m that good

4 I mean it could be one on you and one off, which you seem to have completely ignored... and 4b even if it is two on, people have a tendency to listen to the loudest voice so it wouldn't exactly shock me if peta's whole wagon is town.

So yeah, unless you think I’m scum with exactly Dave + one of the other people I pressured and who voted me or is leaning me, you need to explain why I suicide the scumteam and lose? Ego isn’t a good enough reason because I will demonstrably make pragmatic sacrifices to win the game even if I don’t /like/ doing them

5 Because it's not as clear-cut as you make it out to be, and you may well have judged that getting peta exed today is worth one or both of your buddies tying themselves to you because they still have mis-executions available to them.

(1) says who? and besides, there's 4 slots, it could have gone up at a very reasonable pace (plus I would very likely tell my buddy to get on me first or second which would make it less noticeable for the other buddy if it did go up fast)

(2) why? why is getting peta gone first a "huge boost to my team" when again, it's incredibly incriminating for me today if I'm wrong?

(3) almost nobody does that though -- you know why? because mostly towns don't think about it on more than the surface level, which means that if you look like you switched away to save -- EVEN IF THEY SHOULD KNOW YOU KNOW IT'S A BAD LOOK AND THEREFORE AVOID IT -- that mostly just doesn't happen. a lot of the time towns just wanna flip the stuff that looks bad instead of thinking beyond it. so it could happen, but you're making it sound wayyyy more likely as a scum strat than it ever actually would be

(4) I mean, no, that's unlikely because again, this almost certainly buys my team a free elim tomorrow and then after that they wanna be as protected as possible -- that means both on. (4b) you're arguing I'm soooo talented and loud and obvtownie that I'm surviving two of my scum buddies hard pushing me? I mean thanks, but you don't honestly believe that. who would be the scum in this actual game? bearing in mind that again, my scum buddies HARD push me here for the cred, they don't half ass if they're on a team with me and bussing me. so who, of the votes on me, is my scum buddy S_S? not speaking in generalities, who are my scumbuddies in this actual game?

even with you 1 on/1 off thing, who would my partners be?

(5) again, why would I put such a high priority on getting peta today?

[Menalque]

this was very good tho and will be sharing to the "appreciation of funny content" thread postgame

[Menalque]

peta, infinity, any more thoughts on switching over to S_S?

[Hoopla]

good morning, just checking before deadline to make sure tha-- oh, great.

mena's done it again.

[Menalque]

eh

done what?

[Menalque]

townspewed everywhere? I know

[Hoopla]

spammed the shit out the game.

[Menalque]

in my defence hoopla, it is my wincondition to not die today and the best way I have seen to do that is arguing frantically with absolutely everyone to try to make them realise they're voting town

[Menalque]

also, I now want S_S, help me please?

[Menalque]

peta and infinity have both made vague noises about how they might vote S_S but unless you change over asap it won't be viable

[Hoopla]

in my defence hoopla, it is my wincondition to not die today and the best way I have seen to do that is arguing frantically with absolutely everyone to try to make them realise they're voting town

also, I now want S_S, help me please?

what salient points have i missed in the last 6 pages? it's probably best if you can condense what has happened, as i don't have time this morning before work to read all that then respond to it.

[Something_Smart]

1 - they literally aren't. The burden of proof is on you to explain why you're incapable of making 400 posts while being bussed.
2 - because scum need two mis-exes to win. If you flip scum, you're never getting the peta exe, so that's why it's so valuable to get him first.
3 - yeah it's usually suboptimal, but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen. I've seen people make unintuitive votes in lylo out of paranoia before. If your team thought they could save you, they might consider it to be worth the risk. Alternatively, they can always switch from peta to you, which under that same surface level analysis would make them look just as good as being on you from the beginning. (See why that analysis is a bit of a caricature? Towns are more nuanced than that, even if they do use surface-level thinking sometimes.)
4 - this doesn't make any sense. I think you're ignoring the fact that your partners bussing you increases your chance of being executed; it's not a foregone conclusion. So they need to balance looking good when you flip scum with trying to prevent you from flipping if they think they can-- and also with what they were previously saying (flipping randomly to you is gonna look weird even if you flip scum).
4b - "pushing" is kind of a charitable way to describe the people who are just passively sitting on you and not doing anything.
I don't know who your partners would be. Premature associatives are a great way to work yourself into a logical gutter. I'm not even all that confident you will flip scum.
5 - see 2. It's a mis-exe that you're never getting if you don't get now, and going to lylo is really good for scum because it requires quite a lot of coordination from town to execute scum.

[Menalque]

in my defence hoopla, it is my wincondition to not die today and the best way I have seen to do that is arguing frantically with absolutely everyone to try to make them realise they're voting town

also, I now want S_S, help me please?

what salient points have i missed in the last 6 pages? it's probably best if you can condense what has happened, as i don't have time this morning before work to read all that then respond to it.

I've basically been asking for explanations on how people (especially those who know me well, à la S_S, could really reasonably believe that I'm scum this game, and in the lack of those I am assuming scum

I decided that peta is actually probably town and that I'd rather try a last minute S_S wagon than vote someone I know is town, although I will switch back to peta if I can't get any votes on S_S bc at least I know my alignment and I could be wrong on peta

[Menalque]

^the current points being debated between S_S and I are him trying to argue/to persuade me that town!him would reasonably believe I'm scum here

[Something_Smart]

What do you even mean by "believe"

[Something_Smart]

Like I would say you're maybe 55% likely to be scum right now?

[petapan]

this is potentially going to be a very bad decision

[petapan]

VOTE: something_smart