Newbie 2045: A Midwinter Night's Dream - End!

[fferyllt]

Vote Count 1-2

Prophetic dreams figure in several works of art and literature throughout history. In Homer's Odyssey, Penelope had a prophetic dream that her husband, Odysseus, would return to her and drive away all her unwanted suitors.

petapan

(2): safebet222, Lunar Martian

BBmolla

(2): petapan, Mikul

Mr Turtle

(1): unwnd

unwnd

(1): Illwei

Mikul

(1): BBmolla

Not Voting

(2): Mr Turtle, quiet

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to eliminate.

Deadline: December 27, Midnight US Eastern Time.

Countdown: (expired on 2020-12-27 21:00:00)

Due to the holidays, I have added two days to the Day 1 deadline so it doesn't fall on Christmas Eve or Christmas Day.

Mod Notes:

- quiet has 36 hours in which to post before I must search for a replacement. (expired on 2020-12-16 07:29:24)
-

[BBmolla]

UNVOTE: unwnd
VOTE: BBmola

Why?

[unwnd]

I mean it's kind of condescending, is that what you were getting at?

@unwnd- I'm guessing you weren't intending to come into the game like, "Eh... I think I'll play my 'B' game here so all you noobs can learn something..."

That's not what I meant I assure you. I just want to be a guiding hand instead of someone who gets all the credit? And me saying 'I gain nothing out of it' is because I am very excited to try and teach players my idea of scumhunting

[quiet]

Sorry I'm late. Excited to be here! Absolutely no experience playing Mafia via forms, though some experience with hidden role games more generally. While waiting for a newbie game, I read through some previous games, and spent some quality time with the wiki, but I get the sense that none of that will really compare to the real thing.

To properly roleplay my naïveté, it feels only right and natrual to sheep for unwnd. @unwnd, please be my guiding hand, teach me the ways of killing scum.

VOTE: Mr Turtle[\vote]

[quiet]

I'm sorry, let's try that again.

Ahem.
VOTE: Mr Turtle

[petapan]

Illwei, why did you squint your eyes? Do you think that I'm trying to get on your good side?

It just feels like a very performative thing to say, and strange to me because you didn't seem to claim an Alignment in that statement.

would claiming an alignment matter to you?

Sorry I'm late. Excited to be here! Absolutely no experience playing Mafia via forms, though some experience with hidden role games more generally. While waiting for a newbie game, I read through some previous games, and spent some quality time with the wiki, but I get the sense that none of that will really compare to the real thing.

To properly roleplay my naïveté, it feels only right and natrual to sheep for unwnd. @unwnd, please be my guiding hand, teach me the ways of killing scum.

VOTE: Mr Turtle[\vote]

why sheep unwnd? his vote was before anyone else had posted, so clearly it has no meaning.

[quiet]

why sheep unwnd? his vote was before anyone else had posted, so clearly it has no meaning.

It's day 1, I'm not sure anything will have too much meaning. If it matters, I was considering a vote on unwnd, to turn my sheeping more obviously ironic than it was, and BBmola, because I'm interested to see what happens when we get to 3 on them. Also, I didn't love the "Why?" response.

In the end, I decided that I would commit to the role, and really embrace my inner sheep. @unwnd, I need you to come back and teach me fast, so I can make sure to vote for the right person today. What's the GTO strategy here? We talkin mixed equilibriums? What's the vibe?

[unwnd]

I think your thoughts are exaggerated and won't help me read you, and I don't know where your commitments lie in regards to what sentiment you have given. You say you want me to guide you but at the same time it's ironic and you were going to vote me? I don't get it.

[unwnd]

If I were a teacher I would slap you on the wrist with a ruler, but instead I will instruct:

why sheep unwnd? his vote was before anyone else had posted, so clearly it has no meaning.

It's day 1, I'm not sure anything will have too much meaning

.

If it matters,

I was considering a vote on unwnd, to turn my sheeping more obviously ironic than it was

,

and BBmola, because I'm interested to see what happens when we get to 3 on them.

Also, I didn't love the "Why?" response.

In the end, I decided that I would commit to the role, and really embrace my inner sheep

. @unwnd,

I need you to come back and teach me fast, so I can make sure to vote for the right person today. What's the GTO strategy here? We talkin mixed equilibriums? What's the vibe?

Red: Preemptive excuse(s).
Blue: Leading into, waving off one own's assumption that D1 doesn't matter by literally saying 'if it matters'
Orange: Backpedaling.
Violet: Further justification for literally one vote. Nervous.
Yellow: Joking own demeanor off compounding nervousness of statement in Violet.

[unwnd]

If I were to simplify that however I'd just say

You seem nervous and your means of justifying what should've been an innocuous joke is scummy. The color-coding is just kinda the process I have in my head.

[quiet]

Harsh, but fair. Here was my thought process:
1. Catching up on posts so far, thought the interaction between unwnd and BBmolla/safebet222 was the most fun of the bunch. "I will try to keep my thoughts a bit more simple", implications of condescension, not gaining much about being right about newbies, and most espeically:
2. unwnd "being excited to teach players his idea of scumhunting"
3. Seems like a fun dynamic to throw myself into, especially as I am, in fact, a total newbie. There's not much I can do on my first post to be town indicative, afaik, so why not pick the most fun thing and go with it.

So, I decided to offer to take on the role of pupil for day1. Given the dynamic with the whole condescension thing, I thought it would be fun. I have practically no reads atm, other then not loving BBmolla's "Why?" post, but that probably means just as little as my badly landed joke.

Is there much I can do beyond throw out some votes in day1 for totally arbitrary reasons? Stepping into the game when I did, would it be better to vote on petapan or BBmolla to push them to 3, turning up the pressure a little? The Mr. Turtle vote felt safer, something that wouldn't rock the boat.

[unwnd]

It wasn't meant to be condescending, consider me just a bit rigorous sometimes

However, know that I am actually a big hearted person and more often than not want to townread people. If you had to explain what you didn't like about BBMolla saying "why?" How would you describe it? I believe in reading the game beyond what people say and the intent others have by simply making posts. This is why posts like #33 don't come out in a normal game, because I internalize it and then fact-check with myself later.

[quiet]

Can't argue with the color coded reads, I'd def say I'm nervous. First game, intro landed badly, my teacher is already resorting to corporal punishment... things are tough, but I did sign up for this, and I will see my training through.

If you had to explain what you didn't like about BBMolla saying "why?" How would you describe it?

I feel like a why me response, especially in day1 where votes are p. much arbitrary, tends to be scummy. There probably is no reason, and there is nothing to defend, but it's natural to want to. On reflection, BBMolla's other post was also brief, so maybe it's meaningless, but it's what stood out to me on first glance.

Since you have given me no further guidance on GTO day1 voting, I will UNVOTE: Mr Turtle VOTE: BBMolla. They called your opening kinda yikes. No one talks about my teacher like that.

[Illwei]

would claiming an alignment matter to you?

No, but the way that unwnd opened with something specifically not declaring a side, and then followed that up with basically "woot let's do some scumhunting" is-

idk.

Then again (I, fun fact, did not notice page two for a bit) quiet is quite performative too, so- idk.

unwnd was performative in a calm...something else...sorta way, and quiet was performative in a "this is a fun little bit here imma do it" sorta way.
--
Asking 'why me' is something I wouldn't do as scum, but I'm not going to to judging people based on what i'd do, because...I don't really make the best decisions I don't think =P.

[Mikul]

UNVOTE: unwnd
VOTE: BBmola

Why?

Omgus

[BBmolla]

UNVOTE: unwnd
VOTE: BBmola

Why?

Omgus

okay

[petapan]

thrilling

[BBmolla]

I feel like a why me response, especially in day1 where votes are p. much arbitrary, tends to be scummy. There probably is no reason, and there is nothing to defend, but it's natural to want to. On reflection, BBMolla's other post was also brief, so maybe it's meaningless, but it's what stood out to me on first glance.

how am I supposed to read what a vote means if there's no reason behind it

and I was right there was reason, it was OMGUS

[petapan]

now that i've slept some and can actually read -

Is there much I can do beyond throw out some votes in day1 for totally arbitrary reasons? Stepping into the game when I did, would it be better to vote on petapan or BBmolla to push them to 3, turning up the pressure a little? The Mr. Turtle vote felt safer, something that wouldn't rock the boat.

why the emphasis on being safe, though? is your concern more toward "not rocking the boat" and trying to look good, rather than trying to pressure people?

would claiming an alignment matter to you?

No, but the way that unwnd opened with something specifically not declaring a side, and then followed that up with basically "woot let's do some scumhunting" is-

idk.

Then again (I, fun fact, did not notice page two for a bit) quiet is quite performative too, so- idk.

unwnd was performative in a calm...something else...sorta way, and quiet was performative in a "this is a fun little bit here imma do it" sorta way.

do the different responses make one of them more suspicious to you?

[quiet]

now that i've slept some and can actually read -
why the emphasis on being safe, though? is your concern more toward "not rocking the boat" and trying to look good, rather than trying to pressure people?

First game, first post, don't rock the voting boat would be the thinking there. I didn't want to enable two quick votes for a lynch, but I wasn't/ am not sure how likely that would be. It would certainly tell us something though, which probably means enabling it isn't bad.

A few posts in, I'm feeling a little more comfortable, and @petapan, you were right, Mr Turtle is a null vote, thus the change.

[Mikul]

UNVOTE: bbmolla
VOTE: quiet

This is obvious newb town or nervous scum.

To properly roleplay my naïveté, it feels only right and natrual to sheep for unwnd. @unwnd, please be my guiding hand, teach me the ways of killing scum

This bothers me because it comes off as a half ass buddying attempt. It's also meant to install humor or emotion into his opening post. Maybe it's because he's new and trying to break in with a good intro or maybe to try and get empathy which is a typical scum tactic.

It's day 1, I'm not sure anything will have too much meaning

This post is the acknowledgement that he has played enough to know what RVS is. That most of the votes and wagons on dp1 are typically just to build pressure and to try and form reads. Also that implies that more often than not, it's hard to get anything of value. He would especially carry this ideas as a new player because dp1 can often yield nothing. The framing of that implies a basic understanding of how DP1 is suppose to function

Everything after that post is really defensive and nervous. Again this could be newb town or nervous scum. Then intro comes off as fake to me and a way to try and connect with the players for empathy and the follow up is very defensive, especially after unwnd brought up valid questions regarding to him trying to justify a rvs which he acknowledged he understood the point of (by saying DP1 typically yields nothing)

[Illwei]

do the different responses make one of them more suspicious to you?

slightly so on quiet, but that's also for other reasons that have already been stated mostly, and those make me look at everything they say in a suspicious light or whatnot.

[safebet222]

I didn't steal it because it was clever. I stole it because it's how I felt. In fact, you stole it from me pre-emptively.

I suppose I just don't like getting copied like that, even in RVS. I mean, especially when it was as awkward as your post was. Is being awkward in RVS common for newbie games? I have 3 games in my career in, 2 of them more than 2 years ago, and I subbed in to 2 of them. I don't remember the other being so awkward as this has been.

[safebet222]

do the different responses make one of them more suspicious to you?

I know this wasn't aimed at me but, gonna answer anyways...

It's been an awkward RVS in general, quiet's awkwardness and defensiveness doesn't raise any suspicions at all. In fact, I think a lot of what is commonly seen as townie behavior in mafia is pretty counter-intuitive to complete neophytes, including myself. So, I'm gonna lean newb town.

I'm not sure what to think about unwnd... (Not sure on the pronoun to use for you, unwnd) He/She/They seem to jump from wanting to teach newbs to scum hunt to low-key sussing quiet for considering an RVS vote on him/her/them. Raises some suspicions.

[fferyllt]

beep boop