TENET - Game Over

[zMuffinMan]

you're unwilling to negotiate on imperium, spiffeh?

[Spiffeh]

lol stop

[zMuffinMan]

ive had it in my mind for a while that i'd prob do shellyc, almost50 and maybe gypyx in some order for the 3 shots left, ideally being done with it on the first shot

if it ain't over after that then uh... dunno

[Bell]

ive had it in my mind for a while that i'd prob do shellyc, almost50 and maybe gypyx in some order for the 3 shots left, ideally being done with it on the first shot

if it ain't over after that then uh... dunno

Good reads imo.

[Imperium]

I feel like it would read like fear-mongering tho

"the world where Titus is town because Titus has 60% moonlogic, 70% VCA that I don't understand, and had literally no reaction to my second push on her
The world where Titus is scum because she has way too little engagement with spiffeh and was willing to turnstiile him with no discussion"

this is basically the sort of stuff that wallpost would look like, do you actually think it would be helpful or would it be too incomprehensible especially since I don't really end up deviating from "I guess I'll compromise on shelly"

I don't think that there's anything wrong with posting paranoid thoughts in the thread - I think that this thread has a good atmosphere unlike the dark timeline so I don't think paranoid thoughts will result in people speed lynching something dumb.

It would certainly be very helpful for us - Tammy feels a little uneasy about you and me a little less so but you're someone I would feel better about if I had a better view of where you're coming from this game.

[Imperium]

@Cakez:

Any way that we can get a pause on deadline while you look for a replacement? Seems kind of rough for someone to be expected to come in and catch up and be able to do things in less than 48 hours.

[Imperium]

Annie Edison (notscience/The Bulge)
unwnd
shellyc
Titus Sirius9121
Spiffeh
Almost50
Hench Princesses (Happy Unbirthday Boon/anon)
Bell
Brian Skies
Imperium (Nachomomma8/Tammy)
Gypyx
zMuffinMan

I would be ridiculously surprised to find scum in Annie/unwnd/Bell.

I do not have concerns and aren't really thinking of ever lynching Titus/Brian.

I'm townreading Spiffeh/MuffinMan pretty strongly and would be shocked if scum but there are probably fringe universes where they are scum.

Gypyx I'm not scum reading at all but I also don't know him at all - peta mentioned his scum game would be fruitful to read so I'd like to do some skimming of his scum games.

Hench Princesses I am townreading but the slot I feel needs the greatest amount of DUE DILIGENCE (aka would maybe think of turnstiling 2moro with a Shelly miss). I townread their side in the unwnd nonsense but I want to revisit. I townread their attitude change when Boon replaced in the other game but Tammy brought up that it might have been to pocket him (aka being afraid of being called out if they didn't) and so I'd like to revisit. I don't see any of the other slots doing anything to change my read significantly so this is probably the one I'm hoping does the most soul-searching in crunch time.

Almost50 being scum would not surprise me THAT much. I think that a skitter-Almost team would be a little strange but not unreasonable. I still could very easily see him as town - didn't like the opening but since then he's just been so disconnected from the game overall it's hard to see a scum agenda in his posting.

Shellyc scum confidence level actually goes up considerably with the new info that she was sick for part of the day phase. I don't think the lurking is alignment indicative - she's capable of posting as scum - but I don't think the mindset in her posts is coming from a townie.

[Imperium]

I think that Pooky is scum that we sent over. I think that Pooky took advantage of the thread chaos in order to give a voice to people like Superbowl and ram through that mislynch. I hate him going over there and immediately having an agenda in mind when he couldn't cobble anything together in this thread.

Pisskop could still be scum. He could still be town. I am extremely skeptical that we hit all three in kop/Pooky/Shelly and so would love to find a fourth option that I don't feel absolutely garbage about before lynching. At the very least, would love to have some time Saturday to put together a big readslist.

[Imperium]

Or at least a readslist with reasons so people actually understand why I'm thinking what I'm thinking.

[Imperium]

ive had it in my mind for a while that i'd prob do shellyc, almost50 and maybe gypyx in some order for the 3 shots left, ideally being done with it on the first shot

if it ain't over after that then uh... dunno

What are your thoughts on Hench Princess?

[Spiffeh]

Can you elaborate on what makes Muffin a strong town read for you?

[Imperium]

I do think the decision to send over Pooky rather than execute Pooky is largely scum driven. I have zero problems sending over scummy people to the other thread. I just have zero belief we're getting to no scum in here by d3, not with consensus anyway.

I think that we started the red rover Pooky movement but I agree that scum took advantage of it. Do you think there's scum that actively pushed it or do you think they just tagged along?

[Imperium]

Can you elaborate on what makes Muffin a strong town read for you?

The townread does have a caveat in that I believe that there's two scum in kop/Pooky/Shelly/Almost. If there is not and we are in a worse position than it feels right now then that townread is faded considerably.

But, I think that Muffin's approach this game in general is not one that he would be taking as scum simply because as scum he's not really doing anything to fool and reassure the people he needs to fool and he's not crafting a narrative in order to spin these losses into wins or create anti-alignments between him and his scum partners like he should be. I think that Muffin has a similar frustration to me wrt general quality from scum players *these days* and if he had the opportunity to lay the smack down on a town and teach them the meaning of true pain than then he absolutely would - this isn't what that would look like. There are, of course, smaller things in his thoughts here and there that I'll get into when Tammy and I spend time putting together our big ol' readslist (so we can spend out time in Purple Room figuring out wtf is going on over there in Hell) but that's the gist of it.

Tammy is also townreading him independently for completely different reasons which is a big boon to that - she's usually pretty great at getting at least paranoia pings to guide me to revisit my thoughts with him and that hasn't happened at all.

This isn't as strong if we're in the middle of cannibalizing ourselves at the moment since Muffin doesn't have to worry about tying himself to partners and when you're stomp thwomping the town you have the freedom to do whatever the fuck you want to get townread hence why this is the first read to go if everything starts burning down.

[Imperium]

Can you elaborate on what makes Muffin a strong town read for you?

Can you reassure me that HP is actually town?

[zMuffinMan]

What are your thoughts on Hench Princess?

seems town enough but i dont remember which posts gave me that impression. stuff early on and that hasn't really changed over time

[zMuffinMan]

i guess if i had to describe it, it'd be like whatever that expression is about wearing stuff on your sleeves, even though that never really made sense to me because that's like physically impossible, you're not really wearing it at that point

don't really think reads are being made up to fit stuff i guess? just seems to come naturally~ish

[zMuffinMan]

the disclaimer there is that ive been largely ignoring any and all reads from everyone with regards to people in the other thread, and i know youve said something about their flavour leaf read being weird or something

but uh... *shrug* ill read over that again too i guess

[Spiffeh]

What pushed me over the edge for HP was their spat with unwnd, I doubt scum!HP, aware of the PoE list shrinking quickly, decides to get in a fight with one of the most influential and obvious town players in either thread

They also convincingly pitched Gypyx as town to me who is one of the few slots they'd have to compete with to keep their spot here

This along with their defense of shelly goes against of what scum in their position would be doing here: keeping all the mis-lim and mis-turnstile options on the table

[Imperium]

Don't do something horrible like read the other thread.

The only point was that Flavor Leaf replaced in at their ISO #98 and their behavior changed dramatically; they went from conservative to aggressive shit poster pretty quickly. Tammy's thought was that this was more likely to happen if he was trying to pocket/not get caught by Flavor Leaf and I think while I disagreed at first I'm slowly starting to agree.

[Spiffeh]

I'd still like to ISO HP at some point because I haven't really started paying attention to their posts until recently and I realize they recently listed shelly as their most desired lim for reasons that aren't entirely clear to me even after their explanation

That probably won't get done until next phase tho

[Spiffeh]

I'm also interested in Tammy's separate reasons for town reading Muffy

[Imperium]

What pushed me over the edge for HP was their spat with unwnd, I doubt scum!HP, aware of the PoE list shrinking quickly, decides to get in a fight with one of the most influential and obvious town players in either thread

They also convincingly pitched Gypyx as town to me who is one of the few slots they'd have to compete with to keep their spot here

This along with their defense of shelly goes against of what scum in their position would be doing here: keeping all the mis-lim and mis-turnstile options on the table

I think that picking a fight with a townie over nonsensical garbage is one of the quickest routes to getting townread as scum. I mean I think it's +town for HP but there was nothing in particular within the fight that pulled at me although it is something I'd like to revisit.

I forgot how much time they spent defending shelly, and while I don't like them calling Shelly the best vote now, I definitely see your point. I'll dwell on it a while.

I don't remember the Gypyx posting and couldn't find it via Ctrl+F - do you mind linking it for me?

[Titus]

I do think the decision to send over Pooky rather than execute Pooky is largely scum driven. I have zero problems sending over scummy people to the other thread. I just have zero belief we're getting to no scum in here by d3, not with consensus anyway.

I think that we started the red rover Pooky movement but I agree that scum took advantage of it. Do you think there's scum that actively pushed it or do you think they just tagged along?

That depends on a few factors I am not certain of. This answer will be filled with assumptions.

If we assume Pooky is scum, then scum planned this tete with Flavor Leaf. There's a very slim chance that scum send over Pooky with no resistance, have him magically wake up and push on town. I'm not buying it.

To get back to your question, in the Pooky scum world it depends on how reactionary they are. I would expect more active pushers as Pooky v FL feels planned. The big exception is if they're desperate.

So most likely active in the world I am seeing. Could be taggers who scrapped a plan together.


In the Pooky town world, I am uncertain. They could be apathetic, if they're happy with their positions. They could actively push to change the dynamics.

[zMuffinMan]

I'm also interested in Tammy's separate reasons for town reading Muffy

realistically speaking, is anything they say about me going to convince you one way or another? just wondering where you think that conversation is gonna go

[Spiffeh]

Yes it could

You're not doing much that makes you readable to me so if people are seeing things I'm not I'd like to know about it

Do you think my caution is unreasonable?