revO emaG - TENET

[Deacon Blues]

Why did you vote him yesterday?

[skitter30]

I dont remeber voting him so i have to go back to check. Not saying that i didnt, i just dont remember context or what prompted it etc so give me a sec

[Dandelion Wine]

@Skies can you like effortwall pooky-town-case?

Somebody beam that over or something

[Deacon Blues]

you unvoted him, pisskop and someone else in the same post. This was before you voted FL.

[skitter30]

i think so yeah, that's why i took my vote off

and i'm ok with that

UNVOTE: lld
UNVOTE: midway
UNVOTE: pisskop

@deacon hydra how are you feeling on dandelion wine again?

i'm realizing there aren't *loads* of people i'm comfortable with my vote being on. maybe they really do have all the scumz

Here? This was basically a response to someone (either peta or superbowl) saying we trh to form some sort of consensus, and iirc they said it would help if everyone would show the people they were willing to vote, and this was my list

It's not that i inherently scumread them, so much as they were on my 'willing to vote at that juncture' list
(This was post me being wagoned and pre fl being wagoned iirc)

[skitter30]

so do u townread me skitter.

because i really think everyone should be voting nullreads because looking at the VC we have like no pressure of Elim on anyone and we are almost at 150 pages of day 1. Which is kind of crazy.

Oh it was fire.

[Firebringer]

past me sounds so reasonable

[Deacon Blues]

i think so yeah, that's why i took my vote off

and i'm ok with that

UNVOTE: lld
UNVOTE: midway
UNVOTE: pisskop

@deacon hydra how are you feeling on dandelion wine again?

i'm realizing there aren't *loads* of people i'm comfortable with my vote being on. maybe they really do have all the scumz

Here? This was basically a response to someone (either peta or superbowl) saying we trh to form some sort of consensus, and iirc they said it would help if everyone would show the people they were willing to vote, and this was my list

It's not that i inherently scumread them, so much as they were on my 'willing to vote at that juncture' list
(This was post me being wagoned and pre fl being wagoned iirc)

I get having a townreads/poe reads process. That's been my tendency since forever.

I feel like you're much more interested in sorting the other thread than this one. Your reads of a few players over there seem more developed than most of your reads here.

and your whole schtick about one of us/dandelion being scum if you're elimmed and flip town feels like you're scaremongering and trying to get us to stop pushing you out of our self-preservation.

[skitter30]

i wouldn't say i'm 'much more in sorting the other threads than this one' so much as 'it's easier for me to find scumreads over there than here', which i wouldn't say is the same thing. i'm also not sure if i inherently agree with the assessment that my reads are more developed over there than here.

i'm like imminently watching the clusterfuck that's going to happen upon my townflip (i.e. namely that we're going to just go down the list of claims afterwards), and i consider it part of my job as town in this situation to try to mitigate it as much as i can for afterwards. if that means loudly shouting at people not to listen to you lot tomorrow, i'll do that. if any of you in these hydras had indicated that you found my concerns valid and that you'd take that into account upon my townflip, i woudln't feel like i need to put much effort into this endeavor but you're not really so here i am.

(i've also taken this approach before multiple times)

[skitter30]

like it's not a self-preservation thing, and i've never made it such. i'm not trying to get people to listen to me *today*, i'm trying to get people to listen to me *after i flip town*.

if i flip scum you lot can do whatever you like, idc, but i happen to know that we dont' live in that universe, and that if you continue on your current course the next several days are going to be a clusterfuck, so i'm trying to prevent that from happening, and that means i need to actively undermining your position post-townflip, yes i'm going to do that

[skitter30]

today has literally never been abt self-preservation for me so i strongly object to you characterizing what i'm doing as 'scaremongering and trying to stop us pushing you out of self-preservation' and i challenge you to justify where i'm being survivalistic, and i dont' think you can

and ask gamma about me taking this tactic before, he's seen me do it (not necessarily with as much pr emphasis, but more like - trying to set people on the right track post flip)

[Deacon Blues]

like it's not a self-preservation thing, and i've never made it such. i'm not trying to get people to listen to me *today*, i'm trying to get people to listen to me *after i flip town*.

if i flip scum you lot can do whatever you like, idc, but i happen to know that we dont' live in that universe, and that if you continue on your current course the next several days are going to be a clusterfuck, so i'm trying to prevent that from happening, and that means i need to actively undermining your position post-townflip, yes i'm going to do that

I'm saying that it feel like you're trying to invoke OUR sense of self-preservation as a way to get us off your case.

[skitter30]

oh pooky too, he ws in the hydra iwth me that game

pedit that's not what i'm doing, no. i'm trying to deter you lot from taking a silly approach to the game after i flip town

[Deacon Blues]

Also, I don't feel like the softs and claims on the table HAVE to contain scum if you're town. That's not how I'd approach the next day if you flip town.

You're imputing a mindset that, at least in the deacon case, doesn't exist.

[skitter30]

Would like an elaboration on what happens after my townflip plz

Would like a very very clear answer to this because i see how the next like 3 days are going to go if not

@cabd Are we just ignoring this or ...

ya know it would have been a bit helpful if you lot didn't ignore this ...

[skitter30]

i want to know what happens after my townflip in that case

[Deacon Blues]

In my case it's a matter of priorities, spoons and attention span. This isn't a topic I'd generally discuss with a strong scumread, and I haven't had the spoons until today.

Mostly I've just noted that if you're town, you've made assumptions about our approach after being wrong about you (if we are wrong) that simply aren't how we play the game.

mafia isn't a game of decision trees and it seems kind of shallow to expect experienced players to play like it is.

pedit if you flip and you're town, then I look at my independent POE/scumreads (who aren't all that dependent on you flipping scum atm) and figure out where to go from there. There's a pooky entanglement with you but it's not the entire basis of my read of him. His play in the other thread prior to hammering the turnstile vote vs his play in this thread is a much larger reason for scumreading him.

[skitter30]

Just noting that i probably dont go this route if you lot had acknowledged my concerns the first (four) times i brought it up ... or at the very least didnt ignore me doing so
I dont think the issue is entirely mine for 'making assumptions about how you approach the game' when i was repeatedly ignored trying to get the information (or at the very least interaction) that i would need to *not* make that assumption. Notice how i only started this after not getting any sort of acknowledgement or response the first four times i asked

[skitter30]

Like it's kind of frustrating that you're putting the onus on me here when i tried to get what i needed to, you know, not go down this route

[skitter30]

skitter I did look back and see that you were trying to get to this thread relatively early. tbh I don't get why you didn't hardclaim watcher to get yourself sent here day 1 though, before annie got sent over. You still claimed it anyway, but only at F-1, and after annie was turnstiled and it wasn't on the table to send you anymore. Like you can whine to your thread about how they've treated you but frankly you kinda bungled day 1 in a world where you're town, you should have hard-claimed earlier and you should have given the slightest indication you could, idk, actually work with people that are town in this thread. The town in inverted thread are not the reason you aren't in this thread, you are the reason you aren't in this thread. I know you will qq at this post too and I'm not interested in whatever bad-faith rebuttal you have lined up. If you're town you've worked pretty hard for the scumreads on you.

-E

- i started indicating *very* early on that i wanted to be turnstiled - i think p2 of this game
- i did strongly object ot annie being turnstiled and was actively working on trying to get myself turnstiled. i didn't realize they were that close to being turnstiled when they were, or i would have made more of a thing of it
- claiming watcher that early vs softing changes what exactly? not sure why you think this would be particularly beneficial, i think claiming it taht early would ultimately avoid most of the mess with my slot ... and i think it also strongly ups my odds of being, like, dead
- most of the rest of this i'm not gonna respond to

[Deacon Blues]

Like it's kind of frustrating that you're putting the onus on me here when i tried to get what i needed to, you know, not go down this route

I'm not going to apologize for having a shitty month. I think you can probably appreciate that rl and mafia don't always mix agreeably.

I don't feel like I owed you an answer to "what will I do next". Except in the most general terms, I don't even want to DISCUSS what I might do next at this point.

[skitter30]

ok :shrug: then. i felt like i tried to get what i needed to not take this tack, and when i didn't, i tried something else. will object to you describing me as 'scaremongering' you because that's not what i'm doing

i hope irl gets better

[GFITAC]

Back to reading soon
But first a thing @ forwards thread, specifically HP: why am I being leashed to fire? I think he’s town, but why is he worth protecting?
-BCCorp

[GFITAC]

Btw which of Scorpia and Entrapta is HUB? Which one wanted to be right about Flavor, as well?
-BCCorp

[skitter30]

i think claiming it taht early would ultimately avoid most of the mess with my slot ... and i think it also strongly ups my odds of being, like, dead

Yes. Seeing your own death as a bad thing is precisely why you f'd up day 1 if you're town. The second Imperium revealed, as town watcher in the wrong thread, you should have hard-claimed and explained why it is mechanically *braindead obvious* that you MUST be in the forward thread. Even if you're scum and even if we think you're a scum watcher, we probably still go for it because we force you to keep nachotammy alive. You can say "oh I softed hard enough" but not in a gamestate this cluttered. If you're town, you dun goofed. Anyway yeah no point continuing this now, just think you really are not helping by haranguing your thread about their reads of you when your mech play leaves a lot to be desired in a world of town!skitter. But if you're town I'm not helping by pushing this further either so I'll go ahead and disengage now.

-E

uhhhhhh the ic claim happened *after* annie was turnstiled ....