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[Titus]

I might have to reread this game Sunday. I really loathe the idea of a reread but I really want to win this.

[Hopkirk]

i was really hoping i wouldn't have to reread your iso Ceph. can you point me to any good bits?

every post i make is a masterpiece

I hope the dead chat is having fun. Sigh I wonder what they're up to in there.

i don't think team mafia has dead chats

how do you imagine me responding to this...

let's see if i can get through a 600 post monster iso

[Cephrir]

I was expecting to get my ass handed to me, so I'm kind of disappointed

[Hopkirk]

Page 1/4

i rolled town this time and i'm so relieved

agar

im free

i dont have to care whether everyone townreads me or not anymore

i am awash in the energy of liberation

there's quite a few things early on that feel kind of Lamist in the same way i'm not liking your posts today (albeit there aren't many)

what's your read on herc?

Meh

I liked his opening but it seems like everyone else hated it so I'm just sort of filing it away and nothing else from him has made me feel any kind of way

would probably expect scum!ceph to have an opinion on Herc here? Oka & TheWorst are voting Hercule at this point so i'd probably expect other scum to be voting against the Herc wagon rather than being 'not sure'? with Ceph later on starting to push Herc somewhat then it could be a 100% bus i guess, but idk how i feel about that

what do you like on a50?

He feels more at ease and is actually posting and playing mafia somewhat. I just came off a scumgame with him where he basically lurked

Could certainly be playing better this game though

do you think A50 would hard lurk in team mafia after finishing a scum game where he lurked & having been active as town in part 1? this feels like it isn't super useful unless A50 hates scum to the extent he just won't play it
i feel like he's trying to be overly at east. the tone feels different/fit-in-ee

he might. i don't understand the guy.

you seem determined to interact with me, what's with that?

i remember disliking this pushback. felt overly hostile rather than actually asking a question? don't really see what you're getting out of it but this also feels like a personality tell, eh

ABHAHAHAAHHAHAHAAHHAHA

Ceph.

CEPH.

He's scum complaining about being caught for the wrong reasons.

It's open now. He's upset not because he's town being pressured, but because he's scum and he doesn't think he should be suspected for what he's done so far.

You can see it right? It's fucking obvious.

yeah, i can see it.

i'm also hyper aware that voting him here is what i'd desperately want to do to get your attention off me if i were scum here, and that this post is probably the exact post i would make to try to get away with it.

VOTE: hercule

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

i think 'if i was scum i'd do x'/self awareness like this is a slight towntell based on past experience with it (mostly over video mafia)

let it be known i don't have any confident reads at this time but i felt like making this list to help myself sort where i'm at and also decided to post it for townie brownies

townleans in no particular order

mastina- ugh. this may change in later days as i feel i can read her better then
x- even amidst auro's posts, he has thoughts and appears to give a shit sometimes
dannflor- i thought his antivibe at the start of the game was +town on further thought. he's had a lot of analysis that felt real and i mostly agreed with. but he could be a deepwolf :3
jjh- just seems generally unworried about stuff
dunnstral- his posts from unvoting hercule to voting him again make my heart go pitter pat
a50- vibing

weaker townleans

IV- he's weirdposting for sure but it doesn't seem self conscious to me, quite the opposite. i am interested in how he responds to titus' post above though.
winter flakes- he seems to be in a better mood than last game, and i guess that could be a bad thing? but im finding his posts followable
LLD- i'm not going to try to explain this it's just how i feel right now and is very much subject to reevaluation

never mind, this actually isn't too many townreads, it just felt like it

meh pile

titus- hasn't done much yet but i'm not excited by her jumping in with colored vote counts and also not doing much with them
agar- can't remember much from him
oka- not a brilliant ball of light, sorry you set high standards
dgb- the only reason this isn't in my scum pile is because attacking LLD seems high risk low reward. but seems more agenda driven than last time.
ythan- i am willing to policy elim this dude as he seems to have no intention of being useful at any point

scum candidates

hopkirk- i want to vote him and i don't know why, i should reread this
the worst- i felt like his few posts didn't do much/were picking at stuff just to pick at stuff, but i am posting this without going back to look at them so this could make 0 sense
hercule- reaction to pressure is scummy imo, although yes i can see the flip side here.

this is objectively a very good reads list since 2/3 of the bottom pool are flipped scum, and if Ceph is town then the 5 in the meh pool has 1 flipped scum and 1 unflipped scum
i hate that it's followed shortly afterwards by the worst possible vote there/starting a push on me there given his other two scum candidates were scum

just vote me already you're clearly building up to it

VOTE: hopkirk

now it'll be omgus

if it helps to pretend im a humorless dipshit, you can

i'm not, but maybe your "humor" is just too "subtle" for me

ok, i don't think you need an excuse to not give flopz' reads because you could easily just not post about him at all

i do partly agree with his second paragraph that posting that accomplishes nothing, and i also didn't enjoy the inflammatory element. i don't think i ever said "i 100% agree with a50's reasoning here" only that it was weird to be on the same side as him but ok

ok, i don't think you need an excuse to not give flopz' reads because you could easily just not post about him at all

i do partly agree with his second paragraph that posting that accomplishes nothing, and i also didn't enjoy the inflammatory element. i don't think i ever said "i 100% agree with a50's reasoning here" only that it was weird to be on the same side as him but ok

and since you made a post after that one that said you didn't think i was having as much fun this game i'm

sure

you're sincere in scumreading me for having some shitposting mixed in just like in EVERY FUCKING GAME I PLAY. you're scumreading it both happening and not happening at the same time which makes this blatantly bad faith

there's shitposting and then there's shitposting that has the potential to become toxic and i think the difference should be obvious

oh yeah all this dumb stuff happened and i'd call it really sus if multiple people also pushing it hadn't already flipped town...
i still don't get the perspective that you're arguing here? it's also hard to judge objectively... hey @Ythan?

i'm fully aware that i look like an LLD partner right now but i am not going to let that stop me from pointing out that the game state is completely irrational.

this feels weird but it's hard to put into words

Quick, IV! Make another post where you pretend to be scum! That will throw them off for sure!

I enjoy ur thoughtful walls Danny pls feel free to do them as much as u like

you have a lot of snark that feels like overconfidence in stuff compared to where it feels like you are outside of it. is that a bad sign

the case for scum!LLD, to me, is:

1. enters the thread with sole purpose of discrediting mastina and "eliminate players in inverse order of her preference"

2. then decides to back up this idea by saying just that my entrance was garbage

3. re-iterates that my entrance was garbage multiple times in order to get votes on me

4. rallies the thread to vote me, still with no evidence

(4.5?) big ego post about their scumgame

5. when i finally respond to her like, "ok, enough's enough let's talk" she's just like "nah lol you're caught scum"

6. when i'm like "ok well that's bullshit" she's like "lmaoooo such a scum reaction now my vote is, like, even more justified"

7. when a counterwagon forms on her, she AtEs and leaves the thread (also like, can't tell if she's mad that more people aren't voting me despite her not seeming to be sure or just mad that she's being voted)

i'm aware this is a slightly humorously uncharitable framing of her game but it also feels like a somewhat reasonable one

1 is definitely not a scumtell. 2 also sounds like a pretty ordinary thing to do. you are currently townreading mastina for doing 4, and 4.5 is something you also have done. 5 and 6 sound like what dgb is doing too. multiple people have already said they think 7 is town indicative.

most of this i don't really see as connected to a scum agenda either and you haven't really done so here -- you've only summarized events

i feel like i should have thoughts here but i have no idea how to read your interactions surrounding herc given two scum were pushing it
you feel kind of off given you had herc at the bottom 3 of your reads lists followed by votes on me/DGB instead of flipping to herc

VOTE: DGB

I guess my vote flopping wasn't a scumtell after all, I just can't resist doing what oka/dunn/dann are doing

why was Oka here? your last read on him was the meh/scum-lean pile and there's no indication that you liked him more. how did you move from sus -> sheepable here?
similar for dunn but less notable since dunn wasn't scum but oka was

[Cephrir]

why was Oka here? your last read on him was the meh/scum-lean pile and there's no indication that you liked him more. how did you move from sus -> sheepable here?
similar for dunn but less notable since dunn wasn't scum but oka was

I was grouping those people together as the group I was vibing with last game- I find them charismatic and fun to work with

I am running out the door to get vaccinated but will be able to respond to more of this soon

[Hopkirk]

p2 - (idk if i'll be able to do p3 today)

it's because oka's present and understandable and also cute and we have few enough people like that that we'd be making the game less fun by killing them

i don't especially think bell is scum yet; i also don't want to kill his slot today anymore because ive been told he is an easy read with a little time.

i think ythan is a good wagon because frankly i don't know what's going on in this game and nothing of value will be lost if he flips town. i am having difficulty generating and maintaining any scumreads i can feel good about, so why not aim for the "will always be null" pile. i guess i no longer think LLD is the worst yeet of all time because it would provide a wealth of information, but i don't know that i trust most of you to usefully parse that information and dannflor is probably getting shot tonight if she flips town and that will make me very sad.

i was also told Bell is an easy read by Hectic and (by the end of p2) your progression on him feels weird in terms of sussing him the entire time then pushing the Titus wagon instead of the Bell wagon when they were dueling later and i'm really confused

except you can parse the meaning perfectly fine if you're not trying to pick at a single word?
everyone knows which wagon came first. scum!hop would have no reason to lie about the order. likewise, as town i don't lie about it
so why's it AI? why does scum!hop say something he knows is untrue when it isn't even relevant to the point he's pushing or any scum agenda?
this kind of nit picking the wording of something comes from scum a lot more than town
i want other people to weigh in on this point. this is scummy af

even though i still suspect you, yes i don't think agar's point here is very compelling and it is the sort of refuge in logic thing that scum classically love to pick at

towny perspective on the agar/me interactions now that in retrospect it was a TvT and you were pushing me somewhat but didn't try to take advantage of agar's pushing

accrual clown

idk if i made a comment like this at the time but

Dr - Clown Expenses
Cr - Accrued Expenses

Dann's corpse to me says titus, Luca, bell. I want to give bell more time.

bell progression to note for later

I subscribe to a school of thought that scum very rarely if ever engage in misrepresentation on purpose, and because of that I'm not seeing scum in either you or agar at this time even without doing a deep dive into the argument to decide who I think is right (I dont care who is right)

town slight as above

ythan reaction to that is really towny

yes, i see that

good ythan progression consistent i remember form here

unrelated to the above, VOTE: Bell

What is it related to?

Well, I've been told you're an easy sort, yet I am thus far unimpressed, so.

need to see where this changed

(have to go now but will do next 2 pages tomorrow)
current vibe feels like sus from play but towny from associatives except from that one wagon

[Cephrir]

oh yeah all this dumb stuff happened and i'd call it really sus if multiple people also pushing it hadn't already flipped town...
i still don't get the perspective that you're arguing here? it's also hard to judge objectively... hey @Ythan?

Fair - I regret this line of argument now

[Cephrir]

you have a lot of snark that feels like overconfidence in stuff compared to where it feels like you are outside of it. is that a bad sign

Idk. Snark is part of my enjoyment of mafia

I have felt considerably less grumpy than I was in the first iteration of this game (well, until recently) and I hope that came through

[Cephrir]

Re bell- I think I took "bell is an easy read" to too great an extreme. I haven't actually seen his scum game, but I did see how easily he got a town pass in tenet. So I doubted my read when bell started doing anything.

[Titus]

oh yeah all this dumb stuff happened and i'd call it really sus if multiple people also pushing it hadn't already flipped town...
i still don't get the perspective that you're arguing here? it's also hard to judge objectively... hey @Ythan?

I know Ythan is your flag, but I am marking this for Sunday

[Titus]

i was also told Bell is an easy read by Hectic and (by the end of p2) your progression on him feels weird in terms of sussing him the entire time then pushing the Titus wagon instead of the Bell wagon when they were dueling later and i'm really confused

Bell also seems missing from his readwall unless I am blind.

[Titus]

His readwall violates the rule of 3 though.

[Titus]

@hopkirk, you spend a lot of time propping up hercule early. Why?

[Titus]

My team has come back to life a bit, and they have issue with your vote history d1.

[Cephrir]

i was also told Bell is an easy read by Hectic and (by the end of p2) your progression on him feels weird in terms of sussing him the entire time then pushing the Titus wagon instead of the Bell wagon when they were dueling later and i'm really confused

Bell also seems missing from his readwall unless I am blind.

bell replaced the worst

[Cephrir]

His readwall violates the rule of 3 though.

I'm better than this lol

[Titus]

Cephrir looks 1000% better by the votes so him encouraging me to look elsewhere is actually a good look for him. Scum!him likely would have played up the fact he looked better at least on day one rather than bitching about me saying the votes tell the story.

[Titus]

My read on Bell is improving.

Also, where did this come from

Because I can't think it came from Bell directly

It did. Scum!Bell doesn't try at all here. No need for him to.

Okay, but what points to Bell trying here?

I was severely unimpressed by his catchup posts that even included team reads. And then he made an excuse for "all replacements are gonna be scummy."

If I had to vote right now, I'd be ok with that but I'm still wanting to do stuff Sunday.

[Titus]

Sorry, I was looking at why Dann dies over Cephrir given Cephrir day 1 reads and I wanted to make sure it made sense.

[Cephrir]

Lord almighty do I wish I had been killed night 1.

[Titus]

Murdercat thinks that Cephrir is too good to be true and is distancing.

[Titus]

Murdercat wants to still look at claims, tone, etc.

[Cephrir]

oh stop, i'm blushing

[Titus]

Ythan, cmon man.

[Hopkirk]

@hopkirk, you spend a lot of time propping up hercule early. Why?

i'm a sucker for really overt self meta. i've definitely brought this up before. i pretty much locktowned him this post 15 posts into the game and never looked back because it felt like something that doesn't come from scum EVER. factored into my push on LLD somewhat. i don't plan to rely on the tell again
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... #p12557883

Cephrir looks 1000% better by the votes so him encouraging me to look elsewhere is actually a good look for him. Scum!him likely would have played up the fact he looked better at least on day one rather than bitching about me saying the votes tell the story.

have you done the VCA? i'm assuming you have from this and i don't really get it