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[marcistar]

/if i am mo it will be very goode

why..? i only wanna vote someone who i think is townie, and i dont really have an idea on who that would be rn.

[Flea The Magician]

ok not going to lie, i'm in a mood and Alisae's ego has put me right off already.

i didnt see this originally, but i was thinking deeply about alisae just now
it seems like alisae wants alot of control over things i think. im not sure if its good thing

None of these abilities will be lost, it's a case of who goes for what on them.
Not sure what a hitman does, roleblocker is definitely one scum would want and honestly nobody will probably claim ownership of that one.

in one of the first few posts it says hitman stops anything that would protect against a nk, this seems useful for scum..?
we def cant let scum get stuff that'll help them >.<

One day I'll start reading the OPs again.

[Flea The Magician]

Now my problem is last time I played a game with a weird mechanic like this, I tried to lightningrod the bad for town roles and got my ass firmly handed to me

[Alisae]

I'm the best player on playerlist when it comes to docs and I want to run for MO, so I should just put down a brief on how doctors should be used

doctors should be used to protect the most important player to you. This person should be more important to protect than someone who could be scum and if they were shot by scum, you would be okay with it. For example, if you have no idea how to read user PookyTheMagicalBear, you think he might be town but also you aren't sure and you think that if scum shot him it would be better for you as it would ease your paranoia, then see if you can find a better target for your doc. If user PookyTheMagicalBear isn't being the best player in the playerlist, they're generally not worth protecting. Your ideal target should be someone who if they were shot, would make your game harder because that's 1 less easy player to read down. Sometimes the best doc targets are the players who are really easy to read as they'll eventually become immovable objects that cannot be killed unless they get shot. It's a bonus if they're good players with generally good reads. The best players to protect are the threats to scum.

If a player is a threat to scum, they are a threat because they have problematic reads for scum and/or they cannot be moved by scum except via shooting them.
If someone is town beyond a reasonable doubt but isn't a threat to scum, they're not worth being protected. Sometimes conftown will fall into this category. If someone is conftown and they are doing nothing to threaten scum, scum might just end up bringing that player into the Final Few.
If someone is a threat to scum but they aren't town beyond a reasonable doubt, they're not worth protecting. If they're a threat to scum, scum will take care of them because otherwise they might lose if they don't. By this logic, you don't have to fret over getting a read on players like Cabd or Ffery early, because even if they're scum you're not catching them early, it's just impossible, and you would need a lot of dead bodies before you could even try to draw any connections and figure out what happened in the game. Now if a player is still alive and appears to be a "threat to scum" but scum aren't actually shooting them, then something more is going on here.

tl;dr protect the obvtown players that you believe are absolutely town beyond a reasonable doubt and kicking ass. If someone is not kicking ass and is doing nothing, they're not worth protecting. If someone is not absolutely town beyond a reasonable doubt, they're not worth protecting.

[Alisae]

in one of the first few posts it says hitman stops anything that would protect against a nk, this seems useful for scum..?
we def cant let scum get stuff that'll help them >.<

Scum just deny the doctor since the doctor has more shots than the hitman

[Flea The Magician]

Knowing there's a doctor in the setup means scum are going to try and work out their best shot around that and will take out a null target, every single time.

You have to know how a player is handled by scum to know if they're a target too which relies on meta. Scum only aim for me as a null-shot. All you've given there is a lot on why you should have doc, so by all means go for it, have doc.

[Alisae]

The Hitman is an extremely low tier item in this auction.
This is because its better for scum to just secure both the doc and the cop. If they can buy out both the doc and the cop, it kills 2 birds with 1 stone.
1. It denies the village the cop and the doc.
2. If they take the doc, they no longer need the hitman.

If the village puts way too much money on the hitman, scum will make you waste your money and secure the doc for themselves.

[VFP]

tl;dr protect the obvtown players that you believe are absolutely town beyond a reasonable doubt and kicking ass. If someone is not kicking ass and is doing nothing, they're not worth protecting. If someone is not absolutely town beyond a reasonable doubt, they're not worth protecting.

You're starting to lose my vote.
Lead better.

[Alisae]

Knowing there's a doctor in the setup means scum are going to try and work out their best shot around that and will take out a null target, every single time.

You have to know how a player is handled by scum to know if they're a target too which relies on meta. Scum only aim for me as a null-shot. All you've given there is a lot on why you should have doc, so by all means go for it, have doc.

or you just
not give village the doctor?

I'm undecided on if I'm going for the doctor. I just want MO as I strongly believe I am the most suited for it. If that triggers you that fine because I would expect that to trigger you.
If I am going for the doctor, I will not be saying so but its not a decision I will make until after the midday announcement. And even if I do go for it, you're crazy if you think I'm going to broadcast that.

I wrote that brief on how to use the doctor ability because I do not think it is correct for me to go for it, at least right now.

[Alisae]

tl;dr protect the obvtown players that you believe are absolutely town beyond a reasonable doubt and kicking ass. If someone is not kicking ass and is doing nothing, they're not worth protecting. If someone is not absolutely town beyond a reasonable doubt, they're not worth protecting.

You're starting to lose my vote.
Lead better.

Come back to me when you have a track record of successfully saving a lot of people, because I'm the best user of the doctor role on the site, and I have the track record to prove it.

[VFP]

2. If they take the doc, they no longer need the hitman

Let's just ignore the other doc role and the BP role I guess.

[Alisae]

Like my approach to the role works for me, I have the results to prove it.

If you think trying to predict the night kill is better than making sure the most important player on the player list to you doesn't die then you're just bad at the game.

[VFP]

HEAL: Flea

You lose my support!

[marcistar]

Scum just deny the doctor since the doctor has more shots than the hitman

this is true, but scum can easily work around everything we have to offer as town. and theres other roles that are passive savers right..? or am i remembering wrong?
like u said, scums gonna try to get out people who they cant sway.. hitman would be useful in the event of a protection on that player.

i think someone should still try for the low tier items no matter what, since scum might just easily swipe them up and find a use for them later on. we cant just let all our funds go into the better items

[Alisae]

2. If they take the doc, they no longer need the hitman

Let's just ignore the other doc role and the BP role I guess.

Look, if you want to waste your fucking money, be my guest and pray to god that I'm not scum because if I am scum I will punish you for making a mistake like that.
I value the hitman as a low tier item, therefore I will not pay more than what I value the item as.

I have bids on everything. right now the bids are at 10$. If you do not like that, outbid me. I encourage you to do so as outbidding me says that you do not want me to have the item, which therefore generates information and content.

[VFP]

Like my approach to the role works for me, I have the results to prove it.

If you think trying to predict the night kill is better than making sure the most important player on the player list to you doesn't die then you're just bad at the game.

It was more to how obvious it was.
X shots I agree don't waste them on predicting. But this isn't a master science plan, it should be meta.
And you keep throwing around that everyone but you is bad. So maybe limming you first here just levels the playing field regardless on your align.

[VFP]

2. If they take the doc, they no longer need the hitman

Let's just ignore the other doc role and the BP role I guess.

Look, if you want to waste your fucking money, be my guest and pray to god that I'm not scum because if I am scum I will punish you for making a mistake like that.
I value the hitman as a low tier item, therefore I will not pay more than what I value the item as.

I have bids on everything. right now the bids are at 10$. If you do not like that, outbid me. I encourage you to do so as outbidding me says that you do not want me to have the item, which therefore generates information and content.

There's a huge difference to valuing it less, and doing what you are doing... down playing scums advantages of getting it.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Cop is definitely worth 301+ as it forces scum to lower their cash below 500. Bidding 300 can result in a tie with a scum that also bid 300, which would leave scum with 500 if they win the randomized tie, that they could still use to tie a full-wallet townie and potentially takeaway 2 good town roles.

This point was brought up in the previous iteration linked in the signups thread:

The role of the MO is not so much to determine

which

roles will show up, but in

what order

they will appear. For example, ideally the tracker/watcher roles will appear before Ninja appears, and Cop before Godfather. Since there are 20 roles and 16 will appear throughout the course of 4 Days, we can only avoid 4 of them, and on N3 when there are 8 roles left there is only a 20% chance of avoiding all 4 of those roles that the MO does not ENHANCE. Factor in chances of those roles appearing on prior nights and it's even less likely we can avoid all 4. The good news is that ORDER MATTERS for most of these roles. Godfather is useless to scum once the cop has blown their load, so whoever gets Cop, if you think the MO is town, you can probably afford to save it for one night as it's unlikely that specifically Godfather will appear tomorrow out of 16 roles.

We're already quite lucky to have gotten cop this early as it's our only counterable investigative (and the counter is not available yet) so scum will have to outbid town on 3 different roles to stop investigations, which is enough to free up other strong town roles such as 2x doctor for us.

Probably the only other thing I have to say about the setup right now is that scum WILL most likely outbid us on dayvig so whoever gets MO should withhold that role, as tempting as it might be to have it

[Alisae]

Scum just deny the doctor since the doctor has more shots than the hitman

this is true, but scum can easily work around everything we have to offer as town. and theres other roles that are passive savers right..? or am i remembering wrong?
like u said, scums gonna try to get out people who they cant sway.. hitman would be useful in the event of a protection on that player.

i think someone should still try for the low tier items no matter what, since scum might just easily swipe them up and find a use for them later on. we cant just let all our funds go into the better items

Its important for the village to not waste money, but also force scum to go out of their way to spend money so that in the later phases of the game, the dayvig is more likely to end in the hands of the village than in the hands of the mafia.

This means you have to prioritize items accordingly.
If scum see that the village does not know how to use their money, they will capitalize on the mistakes that the village is making.

The bids on Cop and Doc need to be high, because these are the items that are the most valuable to force scum to spend their money on. I do not think scum will allow the village to have a cop. But forcing scum to go 501$ on the cop is good for the village.
When it comes to the doc, the bid should be high because we should be forcing scum to either handshake giving them the hitman (since the doc is stronger longer and will outlast the hitman, which ends up being a favorable trade for the village) or to secure the doc for themselves and only have 1 player who can bid 501$ on the dayvig. I'm not sure if the correct amount is 301$ or 500$, but its one of those numbers.
The roleblocker I think is a mid tier item in this auction. I'm actually unsure how to approach this item since blocking aren't something I understand to the extent of protection actions.
The hitman is definitely the low tier item in this auction and if scum sees that you spend an unreasonable amount of money on a hitman, I would definitely expect them to just try to secure the doc just to try to drain another villagers wallet.

[Alisae]

Like my approach to the role works for me, I have the results to prove it.

If you think trying to predict the night kill is better than making sure the most important player on the player list to you doesn't die then you're just bad at the game.

It was more to how obvious it was.
X shots I agree don't waste them on predicting. But this isn't a master science plan, it should be meta.
And you keep throwing around that everyone but you is bad. So maybe limming you first here just levels the playing field regardless on your align.

I treat you all like idiots when it comes to mechanics because when I ran this game no one knew at all how to use their money at all and the only player who even had an idea of what was going on mechanically was Titus. She was the MO in the game I ran and she played extremely well due to how she was able to take a lead and turn it from an inch to a mile mechanically. I was in awe while I was reading her PT.

Also in the last money game that Pooky ran when it came to stocks, I obtained 90% of items for extremely cheap because no one wanted to outbid me, partially because no one understood the setup, and also that no one was bidding, because players on this site don't know how to approach these games.

[Alisae]

Cop is definitely worth 301+ as it forces scum to lower their cash below 500. Bidding 300 can result in a tie with a scum that also bid 300, which would leave scum with 500 if they win the randomized tie, that they could still use to tie a full-wallet townie and potentially takeaway 2 good town roles.

It's not a randomized tie.
Whoever bids 300 on it first has a 300 bid, and then to outbid that person another person must bid higher than 300 to win the item. If 2 people bid 300 on an item, the first player to bid 300 on the item will win it.

[Distance]

cyrus is the worst candidate for mo in this playerlist lets get real here

[Alisae]

The role of the MO is not so much to determine which roles will show up, but in what order they will appear. For example, ideally the tracker/watcher roles will appear before Ninja appears, and Cop before Godfather. Since there are 20 roles and 16 will appear throughout the course of 4 Days, we can only avoid 4 of them, and on N3 when there are 8 roles left there is only a 20% chance of avoiding all 4 of those roles that the MO does not ENHANCE. Factor in chances of those roles appearing on prior nights and it's even less likely we can avoid all 4. The good news is that ORDER MATTERS for most of these roles. Godfather is useless to scum once the cop has blown their load, so whoever gets Cop, if you think the MO is town, you can probably afford to save it for one night as it's unlikely that specifically Godfather will appear tomorrow out of 16 roles.

This is good.

[Alisae]

cyrus is the worst candidate for mo in this playerlist lets get real here

I am going to be fuming if Cyrus is voted to be the MO I might actually just give up on humanity at that point tbh

[Distance]

wtf is hitman