Silent Star 4: Yin and Yang

[Flea The Magician]

Context is incredibly fucking important. What do you lose from me, you, chara and someone else being in YOLO with Amy?

(1) lylo is a fucking nightmare and i prefer to avoid that shit like the plague. (2) if both scum are outside of that, we lose. (because frankly i don't have too much faith in you breaking out of your yin tunnel even if we flip a scum outside the criminals because you're already finding every single thing i did in this game scummy and i bet you could do the same for chara.) (3) if there's 1 scum in that, i have to scream at someone while the deciding vote will be a townie who scumreads me. no thanks.

1) yup. Unlucky
2) The moment 1 scum is found outside of that, then my process is proven wrong and it's aborted. Simple as. Something called bias means I can find exactly what I want to find in your posts if I wanted to.
3) Deciding vote goes to Amy, ultimately.

[Flea The Magician]

good for them, i'm not like most town.

i thought of better / more recent examples of town!me caring very much about the possibility being yeeted if you care.

Spoiler:

i'm always concerned about being scumread. my no1 mission in any game, regardless of my role (save rolling a confirmable town PR, and sometimes even then) is to project town as much as possible. i do not like getting executed.

and because i *will* shriek my lungs out when you start dragging me to the yeetotine (i can't believe i just typed that with my own two hands) and it will not be pleasant

but that's second hand meta... something you despise so much?

[Amy Dunne]

I still want her opinion on the proper solve b4 we send our bathero packing but yea i'm pretty solid on Town!Tweet

Yeah, Nalata and Infinty definitely look tike they’re working together tp dtive Tweetie nuts.

You’re Ydra’s cats’ think put me into stiches. lmfao

[Amy Dunne]

pooky i think that post fully convinced me on yeeting the fuck out of tweetie so if we get around to doing that today you have my vote

K, finally a recent post I like.

[Tanner]

sigh. i don't "despise" second hand meta, i don't have moral qualms with it. i don't like doing second hand meta *for myself* because i am a fucking idiot when it comes to second hand meta. i don't mean this lightly - every time i had a read on a person, and then i decided to look through a game i hadn't played in to see if that read holds up, every single time i would just end up reading what i wanted to read and i would end up tunneling the take i already had. it doesn't help me.

that doesn't mean it doesn't help someone else. if it does, more power to them. and i think saying "hey, i won't do second hand meta myself because reading an entire game i didn't play in doesn't help me solve" is very, *very* different than saying "hey, you suspect me for being survivalistic / having self-awareness / asking about the scumreads on me, here is an easily verifiable source of information that shows that you suspect me for things that are nai-to-towntell for me".

[Amy Dunne]

I’d vote him but he says he wants to be the last townie voted. \_0_ /

I just want to stay and help you! ^.^

<3

I admit, I like keeping you around which is probably selfish.

[Amy Dunne]

a naga is a monster with the lower half of a snake and the upper half of a human.

Thznks.

[Tanner]

3) Deciding vote goes to Amy, ultimately.

yes. and i have no desire to be in lylo with a confirmed townie who scumreads me and possibly loses the game on that wrong read and it ends up being my fault. i don't think that's a difficult concept to grasp.

[Ydrasse]

dont feel like engaging w this game atm, low energy + sick, tweets a fine vote

VOTE: tweet

[Amy Dunne]

What I don’t understand why Tanner is in such a damn hurry to be sentenced here? We have 5 townies to choose from excludng me, so why is Tanner so eager to be eliminated first?

i'm awful town in endgames. i can give links if needed - i have literally never won a town lylo where i was the deciding vote or where i wasn't in a 1v1 with someone. the longer i am alive, the bigger the odds the town loses, it's that simple. especially in a clusterfuck theme game like this where i am very aware that my reads are garbage.

god, reading 3430 is annoying. "i don't think scum!ydrasse rams through an infinity flip because she would know she needs to look good post-reveal... but also tanner is totally scum lol" like have you even seen why infinity wagon ended up being a thing???

I’ve never ever played with scum!Datisi but I’ve never been really suspicious of him in any of my games where he’s been town and at a gut level, I am very suspicious of him here. It’s of course possible I’m wrong but him being so hellbent on being the first one sentenced or not wanting us to lim Ydrasse because she’s tr him, just worry me.

wrong. i am pretty certain you thought i was scum and voted me out in quasi-lylo of krazy's post apoc upick. and i wanna ask what is it that's making you suspicious of me and i have a feeling the only response you'll have is "gut because you were obvtown in [this one town game] and you're not here" and holy fuck i want to headdesk every time i hear that nonsense

These kind of posts are just irritating me, so I really wish you’d stop it, please?

sure, i can control my tone around you if that's what you're asking. it doesn't change what i'm calling you out on - townreading ydrasse for apparently ramming through the infinity's wagon while at the same time calling me scum, despite me being the one who did that, is incorrect. and saying that you've never misread town!me is incorrect.

I don’t recall hard sr you in that game but I obviously did misyeet you yes. I said that I tr her for other reasons besides just that but I’m starting to lose confidence in Flea’s case, because @Flea, I need something a lot more then what you consider to be “nervousness”, because those things are entirely nia. What you need to do is to debunk Pooky’s towncase on him. If you can do that, I would be convinced but if I was being deathtunnelled, I’d be pissed too - irrespective of alignment and other than Yin, that seems to be your main argument, which isn’t really convincing.

[Amy Dunne]

Let’s set town!bat free. <3

[Amy Dunne]

Let’s set town!bat free. <3

[Morning Tweet]

oh am i being thrown out

That's fine, i was gonna reread when I got home but tbh, just dont let Flea/Chara/clidd out of the game and we win

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

how confident is your ydrasse townread?

because you kind of need to sell me on it i am very scared of her

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

i think it doesnt hurt to give you time to re-read i still want super tweet's help :<

[Morning Tweet]

Ye that was one of the things I wanted to check since you dont like her so much rn. I can say my Ydrasse read was less strong than Tanner

If you throw me out r u gonna have the numbers to throw Tammer out? prolly right?

i think it doesnt hurt to give you time to re-read i still want super tweet's help :<

awee x3

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

if you re-read her D1 it's so scum motivated.

I guess I'd need to see a game where town!ydrasse hard pushes a "scum" player out the window on day 1 with that type of conviction to be like "yea this is town"

cuz when me/infy played versus Town Ydrasse in Isis game she did not have anywhere near this level of conviction.

[Flea The Magician]

re 3598: the point wasn't *when* you called me survivalistic. the point was the fact that you did so at all shows that you have no clue about who i am or how i play. and your solve is wrong. why the fuck would i join that?

it's been a while since i've seen a wall that bad but here we go. i'm not even gonna spoiler this, i got to suffer reading this, others get to too.

Guess I'm kinder than you.

Spoiler: I AM THE ONE.

fLEA VOTE scum rn

VOTE: Tanner

that's wrong. she said vote

scum

, silly!

in all seriousness, i am interested in the thoughts behind this take.

Looking back at this I'm cracking up.
A joke vote in response to a joke post and the initial waves of worry are crashing out.

"tanner? asked someone about their read on him?? while trying to get out of rvs??? scum"

Something spikey...
something asking about an agenda...
asking about how serious a vote is.

All entirely different from what just happened here.
You didn't ask, did you?
You mused, pondered and expressed. But didn't ask. In all the examples, you ask.
Oh sorry, the first one you were insistant. My bad.
NEEEXT.

Yin hasn't posted yet despite being asked questions. What do people think about that?

was there a point to asking this?

slight town ping on robert, mostly because his intro gives me a vibe similar to my own. ircher feels tonally scummy but i'm not too interested in pushing that right now. if anyone who's town on ydrasse could let me know why, that would be cool.

hmm.

Yin

, how many actual criminals are there in the pit?

(the first person to say "wow, are you scum trying to townslip???" is getting slapped. alright thanks.)

The self-awareness is real.

oh gee oh boy self-awareness. the fucking self awareness. never heard that one before, i definitely didn't have an entire case written out on town!me in TM because of my jokey self-awareness. (second part of the post.)

Oh look more meta defence.
Self-awareness is something I have, and I'm familiar with.
The difference is in how its utilised and managed.
You outright cover your tracks here.
I'm aware I look scummy af in this game.
Difference is, I don't care.

Tanner: your early game kind of pinged, though 192 reminds me of... i want to say Chara's Folly Tanner? but it occurs to me i don't think i read the end of that game and i don't remember if you were scum.

my early game is weak (i cannot find my way around prolonged fluff posting / rvs, though that is nai as both scum! and town!me are awkward as hell there), so that's not surprising. and i was town in chara's folly.

And yet what you've given so far sounds so confident and active, at least on a surface level.

yes. my early game is weak in a sense that i struggle appearing town if the game is full of joking and has no ai material, and my reads suffer as a consequence too. but i will present them with confidence anyway, there is no reason not to.

Then make AI material. You've given me links above showing you trying to break RVS, so you clearly know what you're doing there.

1. awkward joke trying to get Ydrasse to talk about scum!norwee.
2. challenging Pooky's town read on a player because it's a bit early.
3. prompting and encouraging Satoru to talk about a scum read on Flea.

1. it was not a joke. i thought ydrasse's early vote on norwee was serious (at least as much as an early vote like that can be). when she told me she wouldn't seriously vote norwee for the reason she gave, i just told her i didn't know that.
2. what pooky said - this is a datisi alt. (though i kinda wished to not have it mentioned that fast...)
3. yeah. i was getting scumpings on flea. i wanted to talk about it with another player who said they got the same pings.

Three things meant to erode town reads and promote scum reads, because there's nothing that scum hates more than townies with under-developped scum reads on other townies, and strong town reads on townies.

If Tanner flips scum, then Norwee is town, Datisi is town, and Flea is town.

i mean, 1. is saying i didn't know how ydrasse reads norwee, and 2. is eroding a townread on myself... and even if the 3. were correct, i'm literally just talking about a ping i got. and considering i did out some townpings earlier (and one of them was on *you*, so from your pov you'd surely know it can't be scum!me being an idiot just townreading partners and scumreading all townies), this feels confbiased, if not intentionally malicious.

my early game is weak

Pre-emptive excuse for future scummy play.

...it's the exact opposite? like i'm saying "i struggle in early game when it's mostly rvs, but when the game gets serious, i'll get more townie as i'll actually have something to work with". that's not a pre-emptive excuse for my future scummy play, it's setting expectations for my future townie play.

i don't like these posts from robert. i can understand some early scumreads on myself (i'll be first to tell you i have not gotten into the game yet), but both 251 and 253 feel like throwing shit and seeing what sticks. the "future excuse for scummy play" line legitimately makes no sense. also, the "what" in 256, considering it was followed by no re-evaluation, kinda feels like scum who got caught not knowing what to do now that their point against their "scumread" was proven false, rather than a townie organically reacting to the development.

Then we got this which fucking lol's at it. Even the acknowledgement alone in here is amazing.

? what are you even talking about here?

This is early game content. Quite strong early game content.
But you're not good early game.
This is probably more a semantics misfire between two people, to be fair.

happi scumday hectic

I like Norwe Robert and Infy

maybe i'm biased, but i'm really curious what makes you like robert here. [edit after reading: goes for amy dune too. like, what about robert's posting has been remotely good.]

Yin

, how many actual criminals are there in the pit?

By my count....... four.

so this would imply yin knows how many of us are criminals here? though can't know he's including himself (or yang) in that, and whether he would lie about it. hm.

the cumulus fact does not seem right, but i don't know enough about meteorology to confidently say it's incorrect.

from my 30-second google search, i'd say that it is incorrect. is there any point to even talking with these two?

i just realized

I don't know who the mafia are.

There's no reason to believe there are mafia in this game, yet. the only distinction Yang has made between good and evil is that goats are baddies and llamas are presumably the opposite

Although, I suppose Yang still told us that Yin is the one who will tell us how to spot the difference. And Yang being able to freely post does support uninformed. Something about the use of "mafia" is irking me though cause i dont think any Silent Star has had mafia in it.

if we're sure that yang is isis (i'm Not Good at alt hunting), then i'm sure yang would at least know the flavour name of the scumteam, considering isis was a reviewer of this game.

also, the "what" in 256, considering it was followed by no re-evaluation, kinda feels like scum who got caught not knowing what to do now that their point against their "scumread" was proven false, rather than a townie organically reacting to the development.

Who did Robert think Datisi was in the first place?

considering he thought i was trashing town!pooky's townread on town!datisi... i guess he thought a different player?

Setting up the Yin discredit already.

"tanner didn't take everything that yin said as gospel? scum"
Tanner didn't even entertain an obvious mechanic THAT IS IN THE GAMES TITLE and was attempting to discredit said mechanic before it even got in full flow. That's the scummy bit.

Spoiler: WHO LOST CONTROL

VOTE: robert

those posts on me were just bad. i can kind of excuse 251 if i squint, considering he didn't know whose alt this is (but also not really because point 1. is still awful), but the stretch of "tanner is excusing his future play!!" and the fact he's shown zero nuance in thinking about his read on me after learning that some of his points were moot... yeah no.

flea is currently next on my list. i got excited seeing 319, thinking it's actually gonna be a game related catch-up, and instead it was just... mech filler. faer only real read so far has been "tanner gut"... not vibing.

other people that i dislike so far are ydrasse and amy dunne - for kind of similar reasons i guess? ydrasse has still not really Done anything, and Amy's posts seem to be forced posting for the sake of posting.

(i can already hear robert typing how i'm blocking townread on a lot of people - yes, i am. these people aren't being townie. they deserve to get called out.)

norwee and tweetie seem like they're not internally screaming when they're posting, so i'll call those a townlean. pooky is not giving me evil vibes for once, and i don't know what that means, but i'm running with it for now. also ircher seems like he gives absolutely zero shits so, in the absence of proper townreads, i'm calling that a townlean for now too. i think everyone else is too close to the null line to go one way or the other for me.

This is beautiful. Daitsi knows how deep my catchups can go, and knows my catchup style is either intermittent post, or wall'o'fluff. Also note the "mech filler" comment.
I'm pretty sure Daitsi also knows how I can utilise mech, hell I turned a loyal 1-shot neighbouriser into a 1-shot cop AND left enough crumbs to build the witches house previously. (Still proud of that, Pooky you should remember that too seeing as it was your slot I damned. )
The other thing I like about this post, is the misyeet setups happening here.
I'm town, so is Ydrasse and Amy. "For similar reasons". I'm mech fluffing, Ydrasse "has not really done anything" and Amys posts are posted for the sake of posting.
There is not any scum mentioned in this post. Either confirmed or mech'd. Bearing in mind Nakata and Infinity were both lurking it out and I don't recall Chara being the most active either.

ok first of all, the fact that you don't even know how to spell my name shows how much you actually know about me. but anyway - i don't know you. within the mafia side of things, i have had *one* interaction with you, modding a game when you were on an alt. a game that you were town in which was a scum sweep, so forgive me if my impression of your play from that one encounter isn't the best. i've forgotten most of the details from that game (fuck was it boring) so i have no clue what your attempts at mech were there, and i haven't read any of your games otherwise. so no, i have no clue how you utilize mech nor do i care, judging by this game your mechplay is godawful. (if you're town.)

THE MISYEETS SETUPS. in a game that turned out to have the opposite alignment wincons. i'm getting shit on for scumreading town and not trying to get scum yeeted. how much of a brainfart did you have at this part?

I was sure we'd interacted more. That game is my only loss on that account... sad times.
Honestly I'm still recovering from heat exaustion and the brainfarts are stinky. I admit I'm tunnelled.
This still stinks of deepwolf setup, honestly.

ircher seems like he gives absolutely zero shits so, in the absence of proper townreads, i'm calling that a townlean for now too.

Inactivity makes you townlean them? Why?

it's not inactivity, it's the random pop-ins, giving his thoughts, then fucking off and not sweating about the pressure on him. i will admit that i don't actually know whether that's +town for ircher, but as said - in the absence of people acting townie, i'm fine going for a weaker reason to townlean someone.

pedit: i didn't mean just from today. random pop-ins to give his thoughts (213, 258) while not caring about the wagon/pressure on him strikes me as somewhat more likely to come from town.

"people aren't acting townie so amma pull reads outta my butt."

OK not as bad as I'm making out, but ya know, subtle signs are as important as the big ones.

yes. i said it before (let me know if you care about me digging through, i'd guess you don't) i'll say it again, i need anchors in this game. i need *some* reads to orient myself around. if the whole game is acting weird? yeah my standards are gonna lower.

No... no you don't. You have a baseline. if people don't meet that baseline, scumread the lot of them. No mercy.

why is not getting killed so important?

because i'm town, and i don't want the town to waste a yeet on me.

Gone from "You absolutely should not yeet me." to "Just fucking yeet me and get me out of the game".

So far this stinks of a desperate and deepwolf setup.

??? what? if this is saying that i wanted to get yeeted earlier - no i didn't? that post is obviously saying that i don't? nowhere in Stage One did i say to yeet me??

if this is saying that i wanna get yeeted in Stage Two... yes???

Love your ignorance here. It's cute.
You are so assured in that you are town, and your ability as town... that you are apparently 100% vital to the town wincon.
Remind me again who's wincondition you're playing to?

why is not getting killed so important?

because i'm town, and i don't want the town to waste a yeet on me.

I thought you meant not getting NK'ed.
But you was saying you didn't want to get limmed?

yeah, my "i need help not getting killed" in 341 was referencing the fact i had a grand total of *gasp* 3 votes on me at one time, and that i don't wish to eat the yeet. i will neither confirm nor deny whether i want to die by nightkill.

in fairness, context was based around eliminations. but like he said, a grand total of *gasp* 3 votes on him. He wasn't even half way to yeet, so why the survivalist attitude? Because the deepwolf setup is failing a little, maybe?

tanner made a joke about not wanting to get killed because he had a moderate amount of votes on him??? scum????

Tanner made a not-joke to a not-joke response to a not-joke answer.
not a joke. Just a bad smell....

Spoiler: BUT IN THE END

yin

, are you a criminal?

i'm not sure if there's a point asking this, considering we don't know if he's telling the truth either way, but that then goes for all questions, sooo.

Hey look another mech discredit attempt.

didn't.. take yin.... as gospel?? scu m ?
Tanner... mechanic... bullshit.... O.O
Also thank fuck for Ditto.

why is not getting killed so important?

because i'm town, and i don't want the town to waste a yeet on me.

hmmm....

is there a meaning behind this "hmmm"?

Amy is officially a townlean now.

was this caused by 389/390? if so, what gave you a townlean?

for the record, amy is giving me a townie vibe as well, but i can't put my finger on it.

i kiiinda wanna townlean ydrasse for 407? i have no idea what happened in ms rpg, but i've been getting the feeling that infinity sounds "...?" too. though i'm not exactly the best at reading infinity myself so /shrug. by the time i finished reading, the "...?" feeling on infinity has disappeared and has been replaced with "yeah ok i have no clue how to read her i will just ignore her for now and hope someone else does", but i'll keep that townlean on ydra.

i am

not

getting any townie pings on clidd this game, which i think is somewhat concerning, considering that every game with him so far (that i was town and thus had to read him), he'd give me those townie pings and he was town?

ok friends are calling me, i got to go so i will finish the rest of this a bit quicker - liking tweetie's posts bc energy but also not really worrying about her as she's one of my "will probably stop being so townie later if scum" reads, and i'm also liking chara for ??? reasons idk i'm probably playing with fire here, i've heard spicy things about its scumgame ok cool bye

The defensive strikes again. Almost like my rep proceeds me. Tanners already rattled I got the sus on him.

literally all i did was ask how you're reading me

god forbid i ask someone why they scumread me to try to read them

and again - the only reputation of you i know is you playing town in a game that ended up being a scum roflstomp. so get off your high horse please.

Still rattled you though didn't I?
And no I wont, my god complex is kicking in and frankly trying to stop that is like trying to stop a speeding train with ya pinky.
It's a toxic behaviour I know, I try and focus it elsewhere when I can.

Oh and is that a bad link? Because it seems irrelevant to the matter.

i am not getting any townie pings on clidd this game, which i think is somewhat concerning, considering that every game with him so far (that i was town and thus had to read him), he'd give me those townie pings and he was town?

actually before i go, i just remembered that is a lie, he did fool me once. but also i'm still not getting any townie pings from him this game so take it as you will.

Literally just sus of everyone lol.

"tanner's townread on ircher is bad therefore he's scum"
"but also tanner's scumreading everyone therefore he's scum"
do you hear yourself?

Myself and others, yes. Why?
thing here is it's inconsistant with the rest of your play, you say your bars been lowered, here it hasn't.

It would be interesting for us to discuss your read on Robert when you have time. Something tells me he's someone like ''town acting erratic/sporadic'' but not ''scum planning a push''.

it's 2am and i have a headache (an actual one, not related to this game) so i'll likely sleep soon, but i'm not sure i've got anything to say here that i've not already said. his points on me just felt really reachy. and while i know that is not necessarily scum!indicative of itself, the fact that he froze and stopped posting once he found out one of his points is moot, as opposed to started re-evaluating his push... i don't like it. it's not a slam dunk case in any way (and i'm not pretending it is), but it's the best i got so far.

i noticed you started off saying he's scumpinging you, then later on you said you don't vibe with his wagon - have you explained what changed your mind here?

Scumreading someone but not vibing with the wagon are two very different things. You can solidly scumread someone and not vibe with the wagon. How else do you find associatives?

okay? even if so, why do you have such a problem with me asking clidd for an update on his reads?

Who said there was a problem with the asking?
The phrasing around it is what I'm drawing on.

@Tanner

Initially he pinged me as scummy, but after I started theorizing about his course of action in a scum!Robert scenario, it didn't make much sense that he specifically selected you to push, mostly because of the cost-benefit.

He attracted a lot of attention to himself and ignored your town ping on him to go into a 1v1. If you were the one who went to him first, it would make more sense for scum!him to respond appropriately with a scumread, but he was the one who went after you and started the conflict, which is why I don't see a plausible *scum motivation* in his actions (and made me reconsider the initial impression on him).

i don't really see the issue with cost-benefit - at the time of his push, i was a relatively popular scumread, having a few votes on me and not having gotten into the game yet. so not like my "vague townping on robert" was worth much of anything or like he had much to lose there. besides, he's not familiar with my game, i wouldn't say it's unlikely that scum!him thought i was a relatively easy townie to push, not being aware that a shitpush on my slot is exactly what i needed to wake up.

Freeze after lighting a spark between the two of you would also be terrible for his credibility. Would scum!Robert just not care about that?

i don't think it's an issue of not caring, i think it's an issue of not *knowing* how to respond to the new information because he was hoping his push on me would be enough to show that he's solving, at least for the time being. like, look at his recent posts, does this look like a townie who's genuinely evaluating the game:

Why did Robert think Datisi was in the game and which player?
This seems like something we should really know.

I don't know any Datisi, Pooky brought something up about a Datisi and I I get this, Datisi and Tanner are the same player?

well first of all, this is a lie, you played in a game i modded, but giving you the benefit of the doubt and assuming you've genuinely forgotten about me - the second part still feels off. it has been confirmed multiple times, by me as well, that this is an alt of datisi. again, one of the major points about why i'm scum (shutting down townreads of other people) has been showed to be moot (as i was shutting down a townread of myself), and there's no explanation or response from him, just more playing dumb. he's obviously not bothering to even *read* my response to him.

I see people what to eliminate me on day 1 again. I take that to mean I'm right about Tanner being scum.

this also makes no sense. like, unless this is trying to say that i'm scum, and i panicked, and i told all my scumbuddies to immediately dogpile on robert... what is this even supposed to mean?

I didn't like this when i saw it, honestly.
Strawmanning. "Everyone wants me limmed so I'm on to something here" does not equate the implication that you, a known mafia veteran, would panick and ask your buddies to dogpile. Given your buddies are Nakata, Infy and Chara, they all know better anyway. This is a BAD reaction.

what? "everyone wants me limmed so i'm correct" pretty much implies that scum wants him limmed because he's correct (because surely it doesn't imply that town, who has no idea who is who, would magically want him limmed for having a correct read). even if he didn't think that it was me specifically who told my team to pile on, it still shows the thinking of "scum is piling on me".

There's means and ways to secure a "panic" elimination. Now admittedly this is an inverse objective game, but gotta keep up appearances, right?

Spoiler: I'LL BE THE LAST MAN STANDING.

Seriously? Clidd is probably my strongest tr so far.

good for you, was there a point in posting this? (also, please don't quote full wallposts if you're gonna respond to one line. highlight the relevant part, then quote.)

I think Robert’s probably town. Town!TSE made a very similar kind of slip in a game he was in.

for one, robert is (probably) not tse, but do you maybe want to link this?

The mechanics And purpose behind the Yin and Yang players aren’t clear enough for me to just blindly assume something like there has to be scum in me/Chara/Pooky just because of something Yin said.

+1. yin said he's a thief. until we have more info as to what the hell his role is here, i don't think we should be listening to what he's saying.

besides, i highly *highly* doubt hectic + isis would make a game where townies can just ask an npc for who the scum is, and that they would give an honest answer.

also saying this right now, if robert ever flips scum this game, nakata is locktown and i'm deathtunnelling ydrasse until one of us is dead.

More Yin discrediting. There's not even a thought Yin could be accurate here. Note also the defence of a buddy and threat towards a townie.
Oh, and eat my wall post. Context is key and I'm leaving nothing out. Bold is mine btw.
Scum know the setup. Just like last time, we had a major effect against us.
I'll say it again.

Occams Razor is an amazing concept for a game.

and I fully expect Hectic and Isis to troll the collective orbs off the player base by placing such a mechanic in a

Silent Star game which are known for screwy as all hell mechanics!

DEFENSE OF A BUDDY AND AN ATTACK ON A TOWNIE IN A FUCKING REVERSE WINCON GAME ARE YOU SERIOUS

and even then, that was only valid for if robert flipped red - he didn't. and even then, the fact that that only takes place after robert flip, would mean that scum!me would first have to get robert flipped, have him flip green (bad for scum!me's wincon) *then* somehow use that to get even more townies flipped even though that is even worse for scum's wincon like what

Gotta keep up appearances. I wouldn't put it past you, yeah I may be wrong on the experience I have with you, but you strike me as the smart kinda deepwolf. You gotta keep up that appearance.

i think Yin said he's a thief because the character he's being is a phantom thief.

right. i still don't think it overrides my other points, that we genuinely have no clue what his role is and whether he'd be truthful to us.

yin

, is yang a criminal?

pedit: i vaguely remember seeing town!robert act a bit more freely in the game i modded, but (1) been a while ago and (2) not like i was putting in effort into reading him there. i'll try to skim his completed games at some point to see if anything interesting pops up. maybe. idk i hate meta research.

Discrediting Yin but still interacting? Interesting.

not taking yin as gospel but still thinking that there might be value in interacting with him? what is nuance, amirite?

Nuance, as defined by the Merriam Webster, a subtle difference or variation.
You've been out to discredit yin from the start, why bother interacting now? I mean it's clearly for your own amusment at this point as it's nothing exactly constructive you're trying to ask.

does playing on a different account help with that?

so far, yeah. but i've never made it to endgame with this account, which is usually where my nerves really go off the rails, so remains to be seen.

ay yo ircher, wanna place an actual vote on someone?

First time for everything, right?

pointless filler

Welcome to my brain. it has lots of it...

I have suspisions.

do you plan actually talking about this?
I am pretty messed up on heat and medication at this point. and seeing as it's come up elsewhere, I'm on non-opioids because oh boy do I react to those, I take a mixture of Naproxen(Aleve) and Pregabalin(Lyrica) day to day, with Nefopam(Acupan) on the bad days which leaves me super messed up. (Why Americans call everything by brand name will always confuse me.)

ircher wagon feels like a wagon on a townie who's being weird. and distracting from a buddy who's caught with their pants down but people are giving them a pass because "???" "what if they're lhf".

Nothing much to say beyond people who are survivalist give me the heebies.

the most survivalistic bastard you'll see in a game, nice to meet you.

pedit: didn't see anything that shows they can't both be scum. that's just what my gut is telling me right now.

The thing I hate is people always want a case of STRONG points, never lots of weak ones. Even when the weak ones massively outweigh any solid town reasoning. Survivalism is the biggest one. Most town I know don't care about being elim'd as long as their information gained is decent.

good for them, i'm not like most town.

Wow thats an old game.
Also I don't see the relevance? you're coaching town a little?

i'm not going "two competing wagons must be t/s" > "robert is the scum, ircher is the town".
i'm going "i'm scumreading robert and i'm vaguely townie on ircher" > "their wagons are competing, i think they're t/s"

Speaking of weak, order of operations is something I'm using as part of my toolset rn, and seeing how it helps me. That second line to me reads as Robert Town, Ircher scum.
This is just a general note for me to call back to at some point for my own universial shenangians.

?

Exactly what I said.

573 does make it sound like it has to do with Robert scum. which, sure, i could see it.
where do you get town for Ircher? he's been pretty null for me. maybe a little townier for the response to you asking him to vote and Ircher sitting on his Yin vote instead.

err, yeah, my current guess is that scum would want to subscribe to the easy ircher wagon. but i'm not saying it's impossible robert and ircher are both scum (or both town).

i talked about it in 328 and 336. like, he started receiving pressure, and instead of doing traditionally townie things he kept doing his own thing? i thought that was somewhat townie.

Not everyone responds to pressure. Generally unless you know a players meta it's NAI. As scum I flail like a beast under pressure, as town I'm next to usless under pressure too. it's just how I am, I'm more reflexive than active.

ok, what does this have to do with anything? do you wanna show how using that read makes me scum or...

Ircher doesn't really respond to pressure in my experience.

i'd have hoped seeing so many pedits of ydrasse screaming how ircher is a bad vote would've made me think she's town, but they did not. sad.

"Aww Ydrasse didn't give me a reason to townread her."

yes?

It amused me.

Spoiler: I was hoping it would fit in the 4, honestly...

i mean, i agree that Ircher has some votes, but it feels early to say he's an easier wagon when iirc Robert had the same amount or more (at least 3, by my count), and i believe i make three on Ircher.

my point is that scum want an easy wagon on a townie. and i don't think robert is a townie. therefore robert *cannot* be an easy wagon at all.

also considering how much discussion on robert there is, and many people are going "hurr durr lhf" (while ircher is picking votes up effortlessly), robert doesn't feel like an easy wagon at all.

Thing is optimal scumplay is never to take the easy wagon D1. But to derail it.

okay? this is relevant to my alignment how?[/quote]

have you read what i've written about robert and why i'm voting him? i saw you earlier asking that there was a robert thing, and like. what do you think of my case?

I'm in ISO right now and WHAT CASE!? THERE IS NO CASE HERE.

i don't fucking write cases i wrote one proper scumcase in my life and it was a disaster. but i'd talked about robert plenty of times up until that point and pretending that i didn't make my reasons clear is straight misrep

Well I'm missing them clearly.

actually i don't care enough about it, hopefully he's gonna come back and make his alignment really obvious, one way or another.

why you voting chara, pooky?

Literally the entire case is a meta read. Amazing. And one you're not even that bothered about.

it's not. i'd never played with robert before.

But you have modded a game with robert, and previous game is still meta... so it's a meta read.

Case on robert is hes been caught in a lie about knowing mains/alts

it's not. my main points against him are the garbage push he made on me, then freezing / not knowing how to react once the information about alts came to light (second part of 545).

This is 100% absolute horse crap. Your case was entirely meta based and backed up with ketchup/catsup pretending to be hot sauce. I wanted to feel a burn, all I felt was sweet tanginess.

it. was. not. meta. i didn't know jack shit about robert's meta. are we reading the same game?

Apparently not. because i ain't seeing what you're putting down and it certainly ain't blowing my socks off.

pedit: i vaguely remember seeing town!robert act a bit more freely in the game i modded, but (1) been a while ago and (2) not like i was putting in effort into reading him there. i'll try to skim his completed games at some point to see if anything interesting pops up. maybe. idk i hate meta research.

That would be really helpful.

debatable. second-hand meta usually just makes me tunnel what i already think. and you'd think that would stop me from saying "i should do meta research" but it does not.

do you plan on linking that "slip" from tse?

Tanner i’m very interested in your response now.

here's a take - i see absolutely nothing town-indicative in what robert has posted in his return.

upon getting back, he started getting pissy, doing the most surface-level omgus. he repeated not once, not twice, but three times that he's mad he's being wagoned for "not knowing alt accounts". i explicitly said that i don't give a shit he didn't know who i am - my problem is that his original attack on me and his reaction upon learning about the alt both reek of scum. his original points on me were garbage, and he has showed no re-evaluation of my slot upon learning the new info. even now! he chose to completely ignore me and what i'm saying (and why i'm voting him) and instead just go omgus someone else. you'd think town!him would, i don't know, at least *address* his read on me (you know, the thing that got him into this mess in the first place) by this point?

why the hell are people reading him as town? because he got mad? like, ircher called him out, he wasn't doing jack shit other than being mad and insisting he's being wagoned for not knowing alts. that's not town-indicative behaviour. and the "it's obvious i won't make it to night so people defending me are suspicious" like, you had 3 votes as an early day wagon, who the hell are you kidding by pretending to think your yeet is already set in stone?

Kinda like you're getting a lil shirty with my single handed push on you? That I've been sus on you the entire game? That you know by my rep I tunnel and its rare I stop? how about your points? Your persistent meta, using that he got caught out by not remembering every player and alts in a game he played in? Showed no-revaluation because why would he? Who you are had nothing to do with this push on you that I recall, I may be wrong.
Theres something amazing here though.

you had 3 votes as an early day wagon, who the hell are you kidding by pretending to think your yeet is already set in stone?

Coming from the wonder defender. Beautiful.

i don't know shit about your rep and i don't care. my points on robert weren't meta and framing them like they were as you're allegedly reading my iso is disingenuous af.

Ooooo I got to you didn't I?
I am reading your ISO, I am sharing my thoughts as they happen. I have not seen ANYTHING that suggests anything other than meta. It's busywork at best.

Nakata thinks that friend Tanner is likely town.

could Nakata elaborate on this?

Do I smell a connection? A forced interaction?
It smells either way.

god
forbid
i ask someone
how they read me

yes how dare you.

VOTE: infinity

Literally 3 posts before this with Infinity interactions/mentions.
"BE YEET FRIEND! I WILLST SEE THOU AGAINST SOON!"

sigh

:3

for the record - i still would prefer to yeet robert. but i see everyone is going by the "he came back and *gasp* made posts and showed emotion, obviously town!!" logic, so.

i'm back to thinking amy is on the scummier side of things. i don't know why, but some of her recent posting feels like she's not happy to be here. (before you ask why i voted infinity - because i'm not townreading her either and there was already a vote on her.)

however, while i was starting to feel better feelings about nakata, 866 feels slightly off to me, specifically the last line. like, i get the idea behind "forcing townbloccs is +scum behaviour", but, that's a *big* part for why you're voting your preferred scumread? i dunno.

tl;dr, reads probably being trash.

Pretty sure this vote is weaker than an RVS vote, and the disclaimer is here again.

I think Tanner is nervous scum Once again we have the self-aware "oh woe is unto me, my reads! They are trash! so low as to even be unworthy of pigs muck!"
-Dramatisation by me. Im that way out currently :3

letting people know when you're aware that your reads aren't what they should be? what is honesty?

No self-meta to back this one up? Interesting.
Peoples reads are generally naff, that's the thing. you're just making excuses here.

i will be doing absolutely zero second-hand meta research, thanks.

how is it supposed to be "obvious" you're town here? you're not being townie.

No but you expect us to. And pretty obvious to you I'd imagine.

no i don't. if i have a second-hand meta point on someone i will present it myself.

And yet...

that amy/nakata back and forth was so unpleasant to read, what the fuck.

Tanner, what makes you think I’m unhappy to be here? I’m really excited about this game, so I really don’t understand where you’re getting that from?

your recent posts before my 868 felt kind of bland and boring. and 844 felt scummy. i'm not too certain about your being scum right now though, recent posting felt better. i'll probably shelf it back to think about it later, as i doubt you're getting run up anyway.

clidd is probably town. also 967 (now that i'm actually reading it and not sleepily skipping over it) does feel like town ydrasse. i don't think i agree with the idea that scum!infinity > scum!nakata, but i wouldn't be *terribly* surprised i was wrong there. to me it feels obvious why nakata isn't extending the same mentality from robert to infinity, and i guess i don't really find it scummy, but this is probably better left for him to answer.

Posts are bland and boring (been reading his own apparently), there's a scummy post but behold! He is upon the fence! Amy is an established SR of Tanners at this point from the gist of the posts, so this jarrs me a little bit. "i'll shelf it for now because you're not getting run up anyway" - I hate this, I hate this so much. Why not case a scumread and get it going? At least establish it? And before you say anything, I've been on you all dang game.

because why would i? i'm a practical person. it takes time and effort to try to iron out a read, a read that i know that (1) won't do anything because i will not manage to convince people to vote amy anyway (2) would not be as good as it could be if i wait a little and get more info. some people take time to be sorted it's not a bad thing to admit that. not everyone needs to be sorted right away, it's ok to take time and strategize about how to get your own reads. again, shows you know nothing about my play.

Thing is I'm pretty good at picking up peoples playstyle. So far you've been pretty passive about this whole thing.
You're not even being reflexive. you are just full, on, passive. you're not ironing out a read at all, and with enough conviction in a read you can sway peoples minds. This is a game of psychology. Just being confident changes a lot.

Like I said, my god complex (fucking BPD) has kicked in, I am now pretty damned confident in myself and my ability to do what I do. Is it true? Well it won't let me say no... but you get the idea.

Spoiler: *twiddles thumbs*

To be completely honest, you actually haven’t been very nice to me so far. I have no idea why?
I don’t see why 844 was scummy. That’s typical how I solve. I’m just trying to figure out who to vote for. If this game was based on who I absolutely would not vote for, this game would be hella easier.

apologies if i've been rude anywhere, but i don't think suspecting you to be scum or asking you why you're posting something is not being nice? we're playing mafia.

844 felt like trying to paint non-scummy things as coming from scum. like, the "if he's so certain on robert!scum, why pivot to tweetie" part felt kind of intentionally trying to make his actions more malicious then they really are.

How do you solve? Normally I can work out how someone plays and see their style. You're not scumhunting, you're not town hunting. You're not hunting at all that I can see, not even reflexivly.

i've been townhunting and scumhunting, but you're been ignoring those posts because "this read is pulled out of his ass" or "he doesn't wanna iron out on this read" or "he hasn't made a proper case on that read" or "this is obvious setting up buddies/townies" so like

Fucking hell is like you looked into the future on me...

you quoted my wall where i said i thought clidd was scummy to say "really? he's one of my strongest townreads" without explaining why you think so, asking for my reasons, or trying to change my mind. that's a scummy post that adds nothing to the table while attempting to make it look like you're contributing something. so i asked what was the point of posting it.

your constant "oh i'm so frustrated, i don't have a strong scumread, i don't know where to vote, woe is me" are really starting to sound fake.

saying "i don't know who to vote and i don't wanna misyeet" is one of the easiest things to fake as scum. it also adds literally nothing to the conversation. the longer you keep that act up, the more fake it gets, and i'm gonna call you out on it.

I'm cracking up again, your efforts so far have been so half assed that you can call someone out is amazing.

yeah i can. i had stances. you didn't like them but they were there.

[/quote]
*looks around*
Your stances have for the most part been so weak I can blow at them and they'll fall over I reckon.

Look I ain't here to cause beef, I'm here to solve the game.
So far, I'm doing pretty damned good.
If you're town, you got nothing to fear. because my plan will show I'm wrong before we get to Yolo.

[Amy Dunne]

oh am i being thrown out

That's fine, i was gonna reread when I got home but tbh, just dont let Flea/Chara/clidd out of the game and we win

I don’t really get the Chara srs.

[Flea The Magician]

wow I really broke that one.

[Flea The Magician]

oh am i being thrown out

That's fine, i was gonna reread when I got home but tbh, just dont let Flea/Chara/clidd out of the game and we win

I have no intention of leaving the game, you're good.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

Reread Cont'd:

We last left off here:



4-3 Ircher/Nakata.




Clidd/Chara are "ok" with Ircher elim even though they continue to vote Naka.

but here comes Infy the troll:



this is some high quality jester play



and then..



this is like pretty lulzy.



I don't really believe she ever thought Naka was scum, this is such a lol pivot. It's like she finally got an oppurtuniy to yeet someone other than Ircher and she's jumping on with both feet.



Tweet's more ok with infy but still wants Ircher?





kind of like this sequence from clidd a bit? he still wants it between Naka/Ircher



I don't think S!tanner has this take about Infy/Naka scum



I like this post from Chara



Amy swings back to Ircher from Infy.



I don't get why Ydra is so anti-ircher.






Very hard push from Ydra into Infinity and willing to compromise on Naka.

I don't know if Town!Ydra gets to this level of conviction. It would help if she gives me an example of a completed game where she pushes this hard as town on anyone, it doesn't even have to be correct. I tend to think of Ydra as more of a passive player on D1 when town.



Decent post from Clidd






Ydra really wants Infy dead and I'm just not sure town!her gets to this level of conviction?








This is end of D1.

I feel a little better about clidd, a bit worse about Ydrasse, going to begin re-reading D2/3 tomm.

I have trouble with how Ydra pivoted off Naka into Infy and then just turned on the afterburners.

Like it's kind of too much ~.~;;

[clidd]

Pooky is probably going to solve the game if alive so:

VOTE: Morning Tweet

No problem with this too.

[Ydrasse]

v/la few days

[Amy Dunne]

I haven't even looked at the full ISO and I'm seeing very little of a townie mindset here.

Humour me people, you lose nothing by keeping me, Tanner and Chara back with Amy.

oh am i being thrown out

That's fine, i was gonna reread when I got home but tbh, just dont let Flea/Chara/clidd out of the game and we win

I have no intention of leaving the game, you're good.

Flea is scum, because this whole I’m not getting limmed thing is disingenuous. Why? Because there is probably one scum in Clidd/Ydra, which would mean that we would then have no choice but to lim in Chara/Tanner/Flea.

I had this wild tin foil theory yesterday that Flea/Tanner was the team because of how certain Flea was and I strongly suspected scum distancing but it really doesn’t look like scum theatre to me and now fae wants to prevent Chara from being limmed as well.

I don’t think Chara is scum and if it is, 100% never with Tanner or it never would have pushed so hard for Tanner to be voted, so that means that Chara/Tanner cannot both be scum and therefore Flea’s insistence on the criminal 100% = scum thing is transparently wrong.

The only thing that makes sense from fae’s case is that apparently Tanner is shit at reading me, because I don’t believe the case is credible.


So, I think so long as Flea never gets yeeted, we probably win.