FFVII Mafia: Over

[armlx]

Because if everyone lynched liars, then only scum would lie.

Definitely not true. ABR's original stunt proved this.

[Yosarian2]

Not to mention, Jebus, that Albert has already admitted that the power role claim was a complete lie...

Which one, the day-cop one or the Cid one?

being as it said "Power role" and the fact that if you read the posts you would see ABR admitted the day-cop was a lie, but the Cid role was not.

I still think your vote for Armlx is way too weak and not very valid at all.

FoS Jebus

I did, I just thought there might have been something else because Yos2 said that he said his power-claim was a lie after I said he claimed Cid.

That was why I said "power role" claim; daycop was his power role claim, Cid was his name claim

[Empking]

Because if everyone lynched liars, then only scum would lie.

Definitely not true. ABR's original stunt proved this.

It doesn't prove anything as we don't always lynch liars.

[armlx]

Actually, the always lynch liars thing was pretty true about 3 years ago.

[kloud1516]

Actually, the always lynch liars thing was pretty true about 3 years ago.

Yes THREE years ago. A lot has most likely changed since then, and thus does not support anything.

[kloud1516]

EBWOP: thus this statement does not support anything.

[GhostWriter]

1. Is that a suggestion that we should follow LAL on this?

1. I believe in LAL as a way of life.

Then this creates a problem with your thinking. You see, ABR lynched Xtoxm because he knew Xtoxm was lying to save himself. So do you feel ABR should be lynched for lying to lynch a liars?

@ABR: Bruce Wayne doesn't stir up all this trouble. There's not too much similarity here at all. You're just plain distracting, and even if I believed your Cid claim, I still might vote you for this.

This is a horrible way of thinking. If you believed his claim of CID, of all people, you'd still vote for him? Where does that make sense? Would you do it simply to get a sense of revenge for Xtoxm or something?

[TonyMontana]

1. Is that a suggestion that we should follow LAL on this?

1. I believe in LAL as a way of life.

Then this creates a problem with your thinking. You see, ABR lynched Xtoxm because he knew Xtoxm was lying to save himself. So do you feel ABR should be lynched for lying to lynch a liars?

I don't see how the reasons for a lie is of relevance.

[armlx]

I don't see how the reasons for a lie is of relevance.

..............

[Albert B. Rampage]

-facepalm-

[Cavebear with a toothache]

Lynching all liars sounds nice at first, but not when you recall that people, generally speaking, are incompetent morons. I'm not talking about anyone in particular now (well, not anyone in this thread at least, but google Darwin Awards) but humans in general can do really stupid things. We make mistakes, we misremember, we tell white lies for whatever reasons, we post when we really should get some sleep... It all adds up. My point, of course, being that everybody lies, advertently or inadvertently. Town as well as scum. That's why LAL is a bad policy. My point being, of course, that I'm not prepared to vote/lynch ABR (I would consider a utility lynch, but I hate utility lynches and won't do that until it's clear that it's either that or a no lynch; I'm hoping it won't come to that).

The point that is stuck in my mind is this:
ABR plays this way all the time. How often does it get him killed for it? And with that, at what point will it just become "he does it all the time, so there is no reason to lynch him over it" which gives him a free pass to do whatever he wants as either town or scum. This may be the game where he is trying this strategy in order to get by as scum, knowing people will not vote him for this meta, and it gives him a cover to continue.

While I emotionally like the idea of lynching someone to teach him a lesson, it sadly isn't a good plan if the goal is to win this game. Long term, I've already learned to not trust ABR in these situations - the damage is already done. Besides, us lynching him probably won't do much good, he has to figure out why it's a bad idea himself.
As long as ABR refuses to stop doing this, it really does apply as a town tell, and it makes more sense to overlook the fake cop claim thing. Not saying we can't lynch him, but if he's going to get lynched, let it be for doing something else.

Yeah, OK, I guess my ABR vote is more "If he's scum and gets away with this, I will be SO MAD" than actually thinking he is definite scum. And I guess that's not the best play to make.

Unvote

.

But seriously, if he is scum and gets away with this, I will be SO MAD.

---

I've gone back and reread D1 with the knowledge of iLord's alignment to see if I could pick up a connection with anyone, but I got nothing. Xtoxm/armlx/ABR eclipsed everything else.

Gonna

Vote: CallMeLiam

.

- He made a serious attempt to get someone besides Xtoxm or armlx lynched, thus delaying the resolution of that issue for another day. Up until that was resolved, everyone else would pretty much get a free ride.

- His statement of wanting to "test the cop who claims first" makes absolutely no sense. There is no reason why the order that Xtoxm and ABR claimed in should have made a difference. If he'd said he didn't believe ABR's claim, that would be different, but he never gave any indication that he didn't believe the claim, just that he wanted to ignore it until Xtoxm's claim was tested.

This game could do with some picking up of pace to draw out some more lurkers, and this is a decent case. Also don't forget the part in his last post where CallMeLiam wanted ABR to re-claim if he's got a power role.

Vote: CallMeLiam

[armlx]

Lynching all liars sounds nice at first, but not when you recall that people, generally speaking, are incompetent morons.

This.

[Jebus]

@ABR: Bruce Wayne doesn't stir up all this trouble. There's not too much similarity here at all. You're just plain distracting, and even if I believed your Cid claim, I still might vote you for this.

This is a horrible way of thinking. If you believed his claim of CID, of all people, you'd still vote for him? Where does that make sense? Would you do it simply to get a sense of revenge for Xtoxm or something?[/quote]
No, like I said, I'd vote him because he's distracting.

[GhostWriter]

You'd vote him because he's distracting, even if you believed he's Cid, a role that's very hard to bend into something anti-town? You wouldn't try, oh, I don't know, hunting for someone who'd actually make a better lynch, as opposed to going for someone you believe to be a role that is likely town, simply because they are distracting?

The way you're think is still not good. Not at all.

[Jebus]

Not quite. I meant that if his play for the rest of the day and on distracts the town to a point where it's ridiculous, I'm willing to vote him, even if I believe he's town.

[GhostWriter]

Which is never a good way to think. I'd rather keep someone around, even if they are annoying and distracting, if I think they're town. That's a lynch wasted that could be used on someone who doesn't seem town.

[armlx]

See above.

[wolframnhart]

Lynching all liars sounds nice at first, but not when you recall that people, generally speaking, are incompetent morons. I'm not talking about anyone in particular now (well, not anyone in this thread at least, but google Darwin Awards) but humans in general can do really stupid things. We make mistakes, we misremember, we tell white lies for whatever reasons, we post when we really should get some sleep... It all adds up. My point, of course, being that everybody lies, advertently or inadvertently. Town as well as scum. That's why LAL is a bad policy. My point being, of course, that I'm not prepared to vote/lynch ABR (I would consider a utility lynch, but I hate utility lynches and won't do that until it's clear that it's either that or a no lynch; I'm hoping it won't come to that).

The point that is stuck in my mind is this:
ABR plays this way all the time. How often does it get him killed for it? And with that, at what point will it just become "he does it all the time, so there is no reason to lynch him over it" which gives him a free pass to do whatever he wants as either town or scum. This may be the game where he is trying this strategy in order to get by as scum, knowing people will not vote him for this meta, and it gives him a cover to continue.

While I emotionally like the idea of lynching someone to teach him a lesson, it sadly isn't a good plan if the goal is to win this game. Long term, I've already learned to not trust ABR in these situations - the damage is already done. Besides, us lynching him probably won't do much good, he has to figure out why it's a bad idea himself.
As long as ABR refuses to stop doing this, it really does apply as a town tell, and it makes more sense to overlook the fake cop claim thing. Not saying we can't lynch him, but if he's going to get lynched, let it be for doing something else.

Yeah, OK, I guess my ABR vote is more "If he's scum and gets away with this, I will be SO MAD" than actually thinking he is definite scum. And I guess that's not the best play to make.

Unvote

.

But seriously, if he is scum and gets away with this, I will be SO MAD.

---

I've gone back and reread D1 with the knowledge of iLord's alignment to see if I could pick up a connection with anyone, but I got nothing. Xtoxm/armlx/ABR eclipsed everything else.

Gonna

Vote: CallMeLiam

.

- He made a serious attempt to get someone besides Xtoxm or armlx lynched, thus delaying the resolution of that issue for another day. Up until that was resolved, everyone else would pretty much get a free ride.

- His statement of wanting to "test the cop who claims first" makes absolutely no sense. There is no reason why the order that Xtoxm and ABR claimed in should have made a difference. If he'd said he didn't believe ABR's claim, that would be different, but he never gave any indication that he didn't believe the claim, just that he wanted to ignore it until Xtoxm's claim was tested.

This game could do with some picking up of pace to draw out some more lurkers, and this is a decent case. Also don't forget the part in his last post where CallMeLiam wanted ABR to re-claim if he's got a power role.

Vote: CallMeLiam

QFT
and i do agree the case is a good one against Liam

vote Liam

[Zakeri]

I lie just as Bruce Wayne lies, when he is asked if he is Batman.

So then does this mean you actually are a Daycop, and are just using your meta to trick people into thinking you're not while avoiding getting lynched for it?

This vote is not necessarily based on me finding ABR to be scum.

Strong FOS Kloud

.

Did you even bother to look at the rest of this paragraph, or are you just content with cherry-picking certain segments in order to build cases that appear to be more solid than they actually are?

I expressed that I was voting based on utility alone, for I feel the need to rid the game of unhelpful and detrimental players will be the greatest benefit for the town at the moment. Yes, I do indeed believe, as I said, that ABR could in fact be scum, but there is always going to be the possibility of him being town too.

I know I'm late, but I seriously disagree with this. We have a very good chance of catching scum today, and I would totally be pissed off if we wasted that chance killing somebody who "Needs to be taught a lesson." If you plan on pushing for a lynch, please plan on pushing for a lynch that you believe has a

decent chance

of catching scum, not an

off-chance.

[armlx]

So then does this mean you actually are a Daycop, and are just using your meta to trick people into thinking you're not while avoiding getting lynched for it?

This sounds like a bad question for ABR to answer either way.

[Zakeri]

True, but he probably wasn't thinking about the "Sarcastic Confession" trope When he wrote that. I doubt I was actually catching him on that.

[armlx]

I realize, and had I thought the odds of catching him in a slip like that were remotely possible, I wouldn't have said anything. However, as is, the possibilities all come out to where he either reveals he isn't actually a day cop to remaining scum, nothing changes, or he goes back on his claim and is lynched (not actually happening if he is scum). Notice the no positive outcomes?

[armlx]

Unvote

Every time I look at Zakeri's posts, the progressive logic in his decisions becomes more and more visible. While the vote based evidence points that way, in context of his posts it is excusable.

Looking back at my suspects, Zac's behavior is bordering on simple newbishness.

Liam still deserves a strong push. I like how his pushing of a Zac lynch is an essentially minimal info D1 lynch (newbie lynches tend to be hopped on more readily by town, easy targets) and as scum sets up the second mislynch by going to night and killing the investigation target who they know isn't scum with them.

Vote Liam

Of the ABR policy pushers, Kloud is actually trying to back his statements. TM is actually scummier in retrospect, as he is trying to press his opinion by circular logic (the if we lynch all liars only scum will lie, as well as basically defending his position by using that policy).

[Grimmy]

Questions for ABR:

You went all out and fakeclaimed because you were dead set sure that xtomx was scum.

Do you have that same feeling for anyone else in this game?
Was the fake claim because you were sure, or just because you wanted people to follow you and you faked proof to convince them?

[Albert B. Rampage]

1)No.

2)Because I didn't think we would lynch him without my help.