open 841: concgratulations to the winners and losers

[innocentvillager]

i was excited that game too for a similar reason - there was a lot of hype surrounding the event and picking teams and lot of waiting around with our role PMs and shit.

hmm actually that was the second iteration of the event so lol nvm then. i think i was also just really excited to play town on a reroll which had never happened before and we were all just hyperposting real time right at thread open which was fun.

[northsidegal]

VOTE: sleepless

okay so we're coming in hot. as it turns out my prediction on sleepless's post was both wrong and right in a roundabout way. let me just start talking – the post was sort of a lot of nothing i feel. i don't think there was really a ton of towny analysis or anything there. it didn't read

tonally

as super forced but i do think that content-wise it could resemble someone forcing themselves to just have a lot to talk about to look good, which would also fit sleepless' behavior of sort of talking up the post beforehand rather than just doing it. for me personally (and also from what i've seen other people do this as well), when i'm working on getting through some giant catch-up, i still might refresh around the most recent page and at least try some engagement there. to be clear, sleepless

does

do this, but i feel that it's again more mostly insubstantial stuff when he does it: 1518 is basically bare reads and nothing else which isn't itself terrible, but 1527, 1548, and his interaction with skitter starting at 1593 are all just sort of nothing at all. in this case, i take absence of evidence (that is, the absence of an attempt to engage meaningfully with the thread on its most recent page) as a small amount of evidence of absence of the

desire

to do so.

of course, i feel for sleepless in seemingly being busy and having to catch up with the thread frequently, but even still. also, even though i think this behavior on its own is somewhat of a decent enough reason to vote someone, this matches what i recall of and the brief amount i reviewed of my last experience with sleepless as scum, where i explicitly called out the fact that he made a large catch-up post which seemed forced (granted, this was a while ago). whether or not that experience is unduly influencing my opinion here remains to be seen i suppose.

anyways, speaking of engaging with the thread currently while trying to catch up, i still have a decent amount of pages to catch up on, so it's possible that my vote changes from here, but i doubt it. i see that flow is being wagoned and i think i would prefer sleepless over him so yeah.

[SirCakez]

I'd rather do flow than sleepless

[innocentvillager]

im also just a little bothered by midway's lack of urgency about both his wagon status and looming deadline. im not trying to project myself into my read of someone else but i definitely feel that is a scumtell for me.

around the 3 main wagons id prefer midway > flow > sleepless. ig my readslist looks something like

{andante}
{mare}
{datisi, faker}
{cakez, SS, sleepless}
{skitter, nsg, pooky, flow, catboi}
{midway}

[northsidegal]

i think that lack of urgency on being wagoned is either a scumtell or a towntell depending on the personality of the player, like i was talking about when talking about andante. for people who tend not to get elimed as town very often, i might probably a scumtell – but do you have any sort of broader knowledge about midway to say which might be more likely?

also, curious about the sleepless townread there

[northsidegal]

- i just (as in two weeks ago just) played a game with him (i.e. see ss's pyp from like two weeks ago), wherein he was significantly easier to read, had real time interactions, popped in occasionally with thoughts, had follow-through between his posts, had significant scumreads, etc, while also being behind and having the same work schedule, so i don't think he should be given a pass here for that at all

yeah funnily enough this matches exactly what

i

said in the previous game i played with sleepless as scum, referencing another game where he was town

skitter was also in that game as well! time really is a flat circle

[northsidegal]

hm looking at that italicized "I" in my previous post it tonally sounds like i'm being haughty like "oh,

I

also knew he was scum!!!" but that wasn't really the intention

[midwaybear]

i definitely feel that is a scumtell for me

ok? from what

I voted SS because I didn't really want to vote flow and just thought SS was a bit under the radar. But I did say that I was rereading flow's posts. I mostly agree with your assessment that while flow doesn't have much content and is a bit troll, it could just be that this is a tough game and little motivation etc...

[innocentvillager]

wow i thought sleepless was but noooooooo it's midway who's the ultimate beetlejuicer

[midwaybear]

midway's lack of urgency

Also about the looming deadline, I'm pretty sure I talked about that earlier today. I guess I wasn't really urgent but I did acknowledge that that was a problem.

[innocentvillager]

midway you know we have 1.5 days to deadline and we are far from a real wagon and we have to get that person to claim, etc

pedit: wait is it that thing u replied to me earlier right? where u said people are just going to vote you or sleepless at EOD? why are you just naked voting SS without any push at this stage

[innocentvillager]

ur EOD approach isn't making any sense to me from a town perspective

[northsidegal]

iv answer 2179 please

[Faker]

I'd rather do flow than sleepless

As always, this begs the question: Why?

[innocentvillager]

VOTE: sleepless

okay so we're coming in hot. as it turns out my prediction on sleepless's post was both wrong and right in a roundabout way. let me just start talking – the post was sort of a lot of nothing i feel. i don't think there was really a ton of towny analysis or anything there. it didn't read

tonally

as super forced but i do think that content-wise it could resemble someone forcing themselves to just have a lot to talk about to look good, which would also fit sleepless' behavior of sort of talking up the post beforehand rather than just doing it. for me personally (and also from what i've seen other people do this as well), when i'm working on getting through some giant catch-up, i still might refresh around the most recent page and at least try some engagement there. to be clear, sleepless

does

do this, but i feel that it's again more mostly insubstantial stuff when he does it: 1518 is basically bare reads and nothing else which isn't itself terrible, but 1527, 1548, and his interaction with skitter starting at 1593 are all just sort of nothing at all. in this case, i take absence of evidence (that is, the absence of an attempt to engage meaningfully with the thread on its most recent page) as a small amount of evidence of absence of the

desire

to do so.

of course, i feel for sleepless in seemingly being busy and having to catch up with the thread frequently, but even still. also, even though i think this behavior on its own is somewhat of a decent enough reason to vote someone, this matches what i recall of and the brief amount i reviewed of my last experience with sleepless as scum, where i explicitly called out the fact that he made a large catch-up post which seemed forced (granted, this was a while ago). whether or not that experience is unduly influencing my opinion here remains to be seen i suppose.

anyways, speaking of engaging with the thread currently while trying to catch up, i still have a decent amount of pages to catch up on, so it's possible that my vote changes from here, but i doubt it. i see that flow is being wagoned and i think i would prefer sleepless over him so yeah.

nsg idk im not really vibing with this ig? i feel like this basically boils down to you not liking that he wrote a big wall that was devoid of obvtown content

which is like maybe like super mildly scum!indicative

then there's the other aside about how you quoted some things that were not super substantial, which for me makes me go, okay? like half the plist me and flow included have a higher noise to content ratio than sleepless so im not really sure how this makes him scum

also i talk about sleepless on the bottom on the previous page if ur interested since u asked. im not sold on him being town at all to be clear.

[midwaybear]

ur EOD approach isn't making any sense to me from a town perspective

Hmm. Well to explain my perspective. I don't have much firm scumreads this game. I do have townreads, light townreads (which are sort of contested), and this big pool of players. So I have been going around voting and trying to figure out that pool. I think my vote on SS was more of a process of that than the incoming deadline. You're right that I should work withtown on the options currently at the table. But I still have doubts on flow (being scum) and my read on sleepless is p similar to yours
What did you think I would do as town though? Put up a fight? I mean I probably would. But even though I agreed with skitter that the gamestate would probably push the elim onto someone like me sleepless (and flow ig), it doesn't seem to rlly be deflecting on me so there's not much of a reason.

[Faker]

I think we all see a difference with Sleepless (Me just from cursory meta), just hard to gauge with how wack this game has been. Will try to review North West's wall in a bit.

[innocentvillager]

i think that lack of urgency on being wagoned is either a scumtell or a towntell depending on the personality of the player, like i was talking about when talking about andante. for people who tend not to get elimed as town very often, i might probably a scumtell – but do you have any sort of broader knowledge about midway to say which might be more likely?

this is fair, again i fall into the andante category that u described earlier. tbh i feel midway can totally clap back at people who are shading him but i think he's done it a little as both alignments. if i had to guess it's more often as town that he acts that way. he was pretty flat in 2180 as scum where basically the whole game was null/scumreading him but he was very nonplussed about everything but that is old meta.

i can't recall a time where he was seriously pushed. the only time ive actually seen him get flipped was as scum in 2167 when he finally got flashed he put up very little resistance and just memed and rolled over after playing pretty well for most of the early game.

[innocentvillager]

What did you think I would do as town though? Put up a fight? I mean I probably would.

so you're not town but if you were town you probably would put up a fight

????????

[innocentvillager]

am i trolling or that a straight up scum slip

[midwaybear]

Sorry if I wasn't clear. I meant that you expect a town!me to put up a fight because I am about to get elimed, but I'm saying that there isn't rlly a reason to because there's not pressure.

[northsidegal]

nsg idk im not really vibing with this ig? i feel like this basically boils down to you not liking that he wrote a big wall that was devoid of obvtown content

which is like maybe like super mildly scum!indicative

then there's the other aside about how you quoted some things that were not super substantial, which for me makes me go, okay? like half the plist me and flow included have a higher noise to content ratio than sleepless so im not really sure how this makes him scum

also i talk about sleepless on the bottom on the previous page if ur interested since u asked. im not sold on him being town at all to be clear.

mmm, I think that it's an exaggeration to say that it's just "devoid of obvtown content", I think that it's devoid of pretty much anything town indicative. Now that I've read a bit more into the thread, so is 1856 – another pretty big response from sleepless that is basically just some (no offense) pretty surface level commentary and some pretty softball questions.

It's not really about just "noise" or anything like that – the fact that I have the reads I do on flow and SA should make that pretty clear, I think. My point was

specifically

this – he spent the time he did have in the thread mostly doing nothing, and seemingly not even really attempting to have meaningful real time interactions. Either that or talking about the post he was going to make. I think that this is somewhat indicative of the pattern of thinking of someone who cares more about the looks of having a giant "content filled" post than someone who actually cares about interacting with the thread in a meaningful way. I also think that this behavior is similar to his observed behavior as scum before, and skitter seems to also agree that (even if the conditions may differ) his behavior is

not

similar to recent behavior as town.

Also, would appreciate you talking about my question on midway in 2197

[innocentvillager]

yknow what im not making the same mistake as in mini normal 2180.

people made excuses for midway's null behavior. he posted reasonable looking analysis. he said he was being a more NAI player lately. people got distracted on other slots that were more polarizing but zero people had him above null some even just probscum. we could've killed earlier but he didn't. i think we should just do it today.

[northsidegal]

oh post p-edit or whatever sorry you already answered about midway. imagine reading p-edits instead of clicking through them to make your post as fast as possible, could not me be.

[innocentvillager]

i was referring to mini normal 2180 ^ but im also kind of talking about this game too now that i reread it. it's the same pattern, it fits