Datisi's Micro Normal Review, April 2022

[implosion]

hi!!

i'd like to run a micro normal in the micro queue in the near future, and i'd prefer to have it reviewed in advance. am i allowed to just pm you the setup now and have it reviewed before i /in to mod there? thanks in advance!!

setup:

Spoiler:

1x town loud n1 cop
1x town 1-shot friendly neighbour miller
1x town lazy motion detector
4x vanilla townie

1x mafia informed
1x mafia roleblocker

public info: one mafia member is informed of the setup

would probably reveal that^^ when game enters signups since i know not everyone loves that gimmick. the setup was built after one morning, i had a thought of "can i design a micro normal with a miller and have it actually play a part in the setup?" so i'd ideally want to keep the miller.

[Datisi]

ego

basically what it says in the spoiler. i wanted to try designing a micro game with a miller where miller would actually have some sorta purpose and wouldn't just be a "throw it in for the wifom" role, or a rolecop inno.

somewhere between sending that pm and now, i remembered that universal backup is a role that exists, and that i dislike the idea of the roleblocker getting yeeted day one and the entire setup falling apart of scum. would probably need a buff elsewhere in town in that case, but idk. anyway, what do you think

[implosion]

(oh, and Primary: RadiantCowbells)

[RadiantCowbells]

Ok so let's pause for a second and discuss what power town and scum actually have

The lazy motion detector is only really useful in this setup for accruing clears with 1 scum down but since its existence is known it's easy for scum to make moves to play around it and... it's lazy. So it's essentially not tilting the scales either way

What might end up tilting the scales is the fact that town are highly likely to enter D2 with 3 cleared or close to slots in the FN, cop, and check. It actually becomes considerably better for scum to be checked and end up in a counterclaim situation since if they know they're getting louded and if they win that CC the game is effectively free. Or if the cop is roleblocked.

I just really dislike the interaction of all the roles here, when you consider that assuming a town Lim D1 there is a 1/3 chance barring any PR reads or claims for the cop to be roleblocked or killed leaving town with one fn and no real power and you seem more worried about scum but i would detest playing town in this setup. There is an incredibly high % chance of town power being nullified with scum having lots of info to counter them and lots of ability to come up with claims that make more sense in the setup than towns own roles. It feels weird to call a setup that can enter D2 with 3 conftown scumsided but that's really how i feel about this game; any half decent scumteam should win this with near 100% consistency given the info they have and the existence of the Roleblocker. I'd legitimately say that cutting the Roleblocker makes for the most balanced version of the setup and if scum complain about that version then that's their problem because their information advantage is actually ludicrously powerful with the roles in the game but honestly i think the setup still feels kinda bad like that because skilled scum should still be able to find a way to dismantle town in day or PR hunt effectively in night using their info advantage

[RadiantCowbells]

If i rolled this setup and saw a single scum player who would even try to maximize the advantage that the setup info gives them, even if i removed the Roleblocker, i would just expect them to win no matter who is really on town

Cop can turn around and claim loud and give that as their excuse for being guiltied first but that realistically is not likely to work and given that scum know the roles in the setup they are 100% going to know that it's important for them to be there day start to control the narrative if a guilty happens and i just really think this game isn't fair for town.

[Datisi]

right, thanks.

about to leave the house, will try to figure this out when i'm back.

[RadiantCowbells]

The chance of neither of the actual power roles being impacted (kill/RB) after a town Lim D1 with 0 claims forced during the day is 40% btw

If even one VT (or for the sake of this discussion the lazy MD) gets forced to claim or makes it obvious that they are a VT or the MD then suddenly that becomes 30%

[RadiantCowbells]

also the cop inno can die which i didn't even factor in so yeah

[Datisi]

uuugh. i drafted up a few different ideas, but i feel like all of them suffer from having it be possible to either have 3 people confirmed as town on d2, or to have basically nothing for town. is this like, just Not A Good Idea for a micro game or am i just approaching it wrong?

[RadiantCowbells]

I think you either cut the Roleblocker and go with that or do some major reevaluation of the setup idea

[Datisi]

okay, how about something that keeps the core idea but makes the game a little bit less complex

1x town traffic analyst
1x town combined friendly neighbour mailman
2x town neighbour
3x vt

2x mafia goon

i'm kind of tired and can't tell what the ballpark for balance would be here but that's what we're here for i guess

one immediate concern is that the hood is likely to get outed on d1 (just going from the feel that i got from the way normals with hoods usually go these days) and that feels like a kinda lame thing to happen here, but

basically, is the idea of this still playable

[Datisi]

actually, how about

1x town n1 joat (traffic analyst, tracker)
1x town combined friendly neighbour mailman
5x vt

2x mafia goon

this assumes that whoever gets the joat has enough brain to figure out that they should use ta if scum not yeet d1 and tracker if scum do yeet d1

if scum is yeet d1, then the joat most likely won't get a false guilty if they target the other pr, which seems like an okay reward for yeeting a scum d1

[RadiantCowbells]

mm
i think its better if you just make it a n1 traffic analyst

[RadiantCowbells]

I'll pass this as is with the n1 changed to traffic analyst only, I think giving it also a tracker is just a step too far over the line and its already a very strong town.

[Datisi]

and i thought it would be too weak with just a n1 ta x_x one day i'll understand what balance is, but that won't be today

i can do that, if it's still borderline too strong for town, should i give scum something like a vanilla cop?

[RadiantCowbells]

Sure

[RadiantCowbells]

Role pms asap

[RadiantCowbells]

Actu I'm lazy you do them glgl

[Datisi]

???

i am the one who is supposed to do them tf r u on

i will do it within the next... 1 and a half hours

[RadiantCowbells]

I would normally just do them but I'm not gonna cuz fuck u that's why sucks to suck git gud skill issue noob

[RadiantCowbells]

Ratio

[Datisi]

no u

[RadiantCowbells]

No u

[Datisi]

ur role pms sux anyway

[Datisi]

role pm's:

Spoiler:

vanilla townie

welcome,

playername

. you are a

vanilla townie

.

role abilities:

~ you have no special abilities.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to town and at least one town player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name.

town night 1 traffic analyst

welcome,

playername

. you are a

town night 1 traffic analyst

.

role abilities:

~ on night 1, you may target a player. assuming no interference with your action, you will learn whether or not that player is able to privately communicate with another living player. (you cannot distinguish between a player who is alone in a private topic, and a player who does not have private topic access at all.)

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to town and at least one town player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name.

town combined friendly neighbour mailman

welcome,

playername

. you are a

town combined friendly neighbour mailman

.

role abilities:

~ each night, you may target a player. assuming no interference with your action, the moderator will anonymously send that player a message of your choice (specified when you submit this action), and that player will receive a message from the moderator that states that you are aligned with the town.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to town and at least one town player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name.

mafia vanilla cop

welcome,

playername

. you are a

mafia vanilla cop

.

factional abilities:

~ you are a member of the mafia, along with

playername

, who is a

mafia goon

.
~ once every night, a living member of the mafia may submit a factional kill action.
~ you may talk with your living teammates in the mafia private topic, located here. you may talk there at any time as long as you are alive.

role abilities:

~ each night, you may target a player. assuming no interference with your action, you will learn whether or not your target is vanilla. vanilla townies and mafia goons return "vanilla", all other roles return "not vanilla". you are able to use this power in the same night that you perform a nightkill.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to the mafia (or nothing can prevent this from occurring) and at least one mafia player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name or by posting in the mafia pt.

mafia goon

welcome,

playername

. you are a

mafia goon

.

factional abilities:

~ you are a member of the mafia, along with

playername

, who is a

mafia vanilla cop

.
~ once every night, a living member of the mafia may submit a factional kill action.
~ you may talk with your living teammates in the mafia private topic, located here. you may talk there at any time as long as you are alive.

role abilities:

~ you have no special abilities.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to the mafia (or nothing can prevent this from occurring) and at least one mafia player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name or by posting in the mafia pt.

role results:

Spoiler:

traffic analyst:
~ "

playername

can

currently privately communicate."
~ "

playername

cannot

currently privately communicate."

friendly neighbour:
"you have been visited by a friendly neighbour:

playername

is aligned with the

town

."

mailman:
"you have been visited by a mailman, and have received the following message:

mailman message

Are you kidding ??? What the **** are you talking about man ? You are a biggest looser i ever seen in my life ! You was doing PIPI in your pampers when i was beating players much more stronger then you! You are not proffesional, because proffesionals knew how to lose and congratulate opponents, you are like a girl crying after i beat you! Be brave, be honest to yourself and stop this trush talkings!!! Everybody know that i am very good blitz player, i can win anyone in the world in single game! And "w"esley "s"o is nobody for me, just a player who are crying every single time when loosing, ( remember what you say about Firouzja ) !!! Stop playing with my name, i deserve to have a good name during whole my chess carrier, I am Officially inviting you to OTB blitz match with the Prize fund! Both of us will invest 5000$ and winner takes it all!

I suggest all other people who's intrested in this situation, just take a look at my results in 2016 and 2017 Blitz World championships, and that should be enough... No need to listen for every crying babe, Tigran Petrosyan is always play Fair ! And if someone will continue Officially talk about me like that, we will meet in Court! God bless with true! True will never die ! Liers will kicked off...

vanilla cop:
~ "

playername

is vanilla."
~ "

playername

is

not

vanilla."

multitasking and daytalk turned on by default

do you also need my ruleset