Large Normal 240: Baileyposting [game over]

[MalcolmTucker]

So you didn't want them eliminated yet?

I'm not sure what your aim is here? I was fine with the elimination. I voted there expecting Meg would be eliminated because the game was clearly headed in that direction. Had I known I had hammer, I'd have waited or signalled intention to hammer while giving everyone a chance to respond. I'm typically not a sudden-hammer type.

[MalcolmTucker]

Reread some of Firebringer's ISO, very townie.

[MalcolmTucker]

What do people think of Crescent? It's a slot I'd seen as town so far based on posting but wanted to have a greater look. There's a lot of shading people for joining the wagon without supposedly having a valid reason throughout D1 but also acknowledgement of Meg's drop in activity, almost feels a bit like Crescent could have been hedging there, aware they'd been too defensive. But also feels like there's just too many mentions of Meg/too many interactions early on for them to be scum partners together? Unless Crescent just wanted to be assertive in trying to save their partner.

[Unsure]

So if you think the game was headed in that direction, did you feel impatient?

Because it's not adding up.

You're presenting yourself as the type who won't rush a hammer until sufficient discussion was had.
You clearly assumed that the day would have ended in Meg's elimination.
That means you must know that there was a sufficient number in the wagon or that the pressure wasn't letting on.
Still you voted — why? Not consistent with the POV you're trying to present.

And now I ask you if it was a vote to pressure, that confuses you because the vote was to eliminate Meg and you knew it — therefore lying about not knowing it was a hammer.

[MalcolmTucker]

So if you think the game was headed in that direction, did you feel impatient?

Because it's not adding up.

You're presenting yourself as the type who won't rush a hammer until sufficient discussion was had.
You clearly assumed that the day would have ended in Meg's elimination.
That means you must know that there was a sufficient number in the wagon or that the pressure wasn't letting on.
Still you voted — why? Not consistent with the POV you're trying to present.

And now I ask you if it was a vote to pressure, that confuses you because the vote was to eliminate Meg and you knew it — therefore lying about not knowing it was a hammer.

You're overthinking this. I voted for Meg because I thought they were the best vote after D1 had been going on for a while. I carelessly didn't check how many votes they had and it turned out to be hammer. Presuming the day would end in Meg's elimination is not the same as knowing it will. Meg could have eg made a last minute claim to save themselves or someone else could have made a major slip-up. You can pursue this line of thinking if you wish (I understand the reasoning for it) but it's incorrect.

[geraintm]

another player i have zero idea what they have done this game

easy. I pushed fred D1, then Malcolm, and I made a case for UNO no one read D2, game was dead I went "ok fine, lim fred" then people unvoted all "idk about that one!!!" fred was town, and here we are. I still hate malcolm's d1 towards me, and UNO is definitely maf for his stance on Meg d1

I've just been a tad too busy to sit here all day, and especially when this game is just "WHO CAN SHOUT THE LOUDEST" like yesterday... dead game, people went "ok just lim fred" and then there were lots of unvotes and "I'm not sure" like, what? game was dead. yall said "just lim fred and end it" yeah whatever

i might not take yor word for it, might have to actually review your posts

[geraintm]

I wanna end day voting in Malcolm/UNO

VOTE: Malcolm

i wonder how many naughty points one person can accumulate in a game?

[geraintm]

MT at the end of D1, why did you feel as if Meg needed more pressure?

Slightly confused here - not seeing this in my ISO? I hammered without realising after all.

you are saying you hammered without realising....doesnt actually make that true

[geraintm]

What do people think of Crescent? It's a slot I'd seen as town so far based on posting but wanted to have a greater look. There's a lot of shading people for joining the wagon without supposedly having a valid reason throughout D1 but also acknowledgement of Meg's drop in activity, almost feels a bit like Crescent could have been hedging there, aware they'd been too defensive. But also feels like there's just too many mentions of Meg/too many interactions early on for them to be scum partners together? Unless Crescent just wanted to be assertive in trying to save their partner.

iv played with them a few times, always town and they are always (appear) very competent. what they are like as scum is terrfying.

[Vivax]

I wanna end day voting in Malcolm/UNO

VOTE: Malcolm

i wonder how many naughty points one person can accumulate in a game?

Can I see your list to find out?

[geraintm]

Unsure 1419 i don't like.

Why?

I'd like to hear some elaboration on MT here, given I also soft-townread him.

As I said, I don't think town!MT comes in 8 days before deadline with a careless vote/hammer on a slot he townread all day just because a case convinced him — even though the slot ended up being scum.
Their angle on Fred is pure piggyback instead of anything that resembles a spark of originality — but on top of it all, there's nothing about MT's play that makes me think they're curious enough or solving the game.

The points against them being scum is "sloppiness" where people don't believe scum would play the way he did (in a way that endangers their slot/throws them under the bus as i understand it) but what was their alternative here? Anti-spew is a thing, especially if your slot is in danger of real elimination. I even think lack of self-preservation is scummy.

this was it, and i am reading it back now and i am trying to remember why i didnt like it. it is a weird mixture of regurgitating other people's thoughts on Malcolm and half formed thoughts of their own and throwing it all together to get a read and it just didnt feel right. like the bit about not thinking theyd be town but wait they could be town and i dunno....

thanks for asking me a question though

[geraintm]

I wanna end day voting in Malcolm/UNO

VOTE: Malcolm

i wonder how many naughty points one person can accumulate in a game?

Can I see your list to find out?

it is bed time here, i;m planning on looking at the wagons tomorrow to make sense of things and narrowing my pool. though i suspect it will end up me heading in different directions to everyone else

[Unsure]

Unsure 1419 i don't like.

Why?

I'd like to hear some elaboration on MT here, given I also soft-townread him.

As I said, I don't think town!MT comes in 8 days before deadline with a careless vote/hammer on a slot he townread all day just because a case convinced him — even though the slot ended up being scum.
Their angle on Fred is pure piggyback instead of anything that resembles a spark of originality — but on top of it all, there's nothing about MT's play that makes me think they're curious enough or solving the game.

The points against them being scum is "sloppiness" where people don't believe scum would play the way he did (in a way that endangers their slot/throws them under the bus as i understand it) but what was their alternative here? Anti-spew is a thing, especially if your slot is in danger of real elimination. I even think lack of self-preservation is scummy.

this was it, and i am reading it back now and i am trying to remember why i didnt like it.

it is a weird mixture of regurgitating other people's thoughts on Malcolm and half formed thoughts of their own and throwing it all together to get a read and it just didnt feel right. like the bit about not thinking theyd be town but wait they could be town and i dunno....

thanks for asking me a question though

what the fuck are you talking about

[MalcolmTucker]

MT at the end of D1, why did you feel as if Meg needed more pressure?

Slightly confused here - not seeing this in my ISO? I hammered without realising after all.

you are saying you hammered without realising....doesnt actually make that true

There are three possibilities.

1. I hammered without realising.
2. I hammered deliberately as town to eliminate Meg, and am lying now.
3. I hammered Meg to bus as scum and to end the turn early.

You can believe whichever you wish - I am saying it was the first one.

[MalcolmTucker]

Unsure 1419 i don't like.

Why?

I'd like to hear some elaboration on MT here, given I also soft-townread him.

As I said, I don't think town!MT comes in 8 days before deadline with a careless vote/hammer on a slot he townread all day just because a case convinced him — even though the slot ended up being scum.
Their angle on Fred is pure piggyback instead of anything that resembles a spark of originality — but on top of it all, there's nothing about MT's play that makes me think they're curious enough or solving the game.

The points against them being scum is "sloppiness" where people don't believe scum would play the way he did (in a way that endangers their slot/throws them under the bus as i understand it) but what was their alternative here? Anti-spew is a thing, especially if your slot is in danger of real elimination. I even think lack of self-preservation is scummy.

this was it, and i am reading it back now and i am trying to remember why i didnt like it.

it is a weird mixture of regurgitating other people's thoughts on Malcolm and half formed thoughts of their own and throwing it all together to get a read and it just didnt feel right. like the bit about not thinking theyd be town but wait they could be town and i dunno....

thanks for asking me a question though

what the fuck are you talking about

Ger is claiming your read wasn't particularly or original and was just copying from others. I'm not sure I agree - I think you're on the wrong track but you've articulated your case in a way that's reasonable and not particularly opportunistic.

[Unsure]

I'm not sure there's even anyone saying the things I'm saying. I'm the one who raised the point against MT's timing, his lack of curiosity, and I'm the only one who refuted the points against MT's case.

[Lowell]

This group getting a lot of traction out of pretending to care about quickhammers.

[Unsure]

Why don't you share your MT read if you think we're wrong then? You've ducked his wagon but you never really told us what you thought about Malcolm other than "MT is a good vote" in D1.

[Crescent]

FancyPants* - lurk idk
Vivax - troll town
MalcolmTucker - prob maf
Greeting - idk always failed at reading
Firebringer - hot null would't care to vote
Fredrick A Campbell - can afford to die
Dwlee99* - lurk
Crescent - eh idk
Lowell - prob town
bugspray - always failed at reading
PookyTheMagicalBear - always mafia
geraintm - prob maf
UNOwen - idk i started yawning at this guy, pretend that's there's something funny drawn at next 3 persons and i call it a day, too much effort for me
Prince of Paterson
Andante
MegAzumarill

Going back to Enchant's reads list, not sure you'd typically expect huge detail, but this is really hedgy in particular - one confirmed scum just left out completely too.

You're going to have to do better than a post almost the entire game dismissed as NAI within 100 posts of it being made to justify saying Enchant is your #1 scum read. This is a really weak point to be latching onto.

[Crescent]

Reading back, KT is way harsher towards Red than my memory was telling me. I remembered it as them being defensive... But it's not quite that. #438-439-448 is kinda horrid spew that accuses Red of defending Galron, and immediately slots her as scum with Galron in a pretty blatant deflection.

Buuuut he also calmed down and backed off pretty quickly after that, which does feel like an actual progression.

[Crescent]

Oh crap I posted that in the wrong game.

Yep I'm tired.

[Vivax]

Oh crap I posted that in the wrong game.

Yep I'm tired.

Have a stimulant on me

VOTE: Crescent

[Vivax]

I should probably take advantage of this phase for a crescendo, and MT looks town to me now.

[Vivax]

VOTE: PrinceofPaterson

soz my vote slipped

[geraintm]

vote count 1.final

with 17 votes in play, it took 9 to make a decision. day 1 ended.

yeet

MegAzumarill [9]:

PookyTheMagicalBear, Greeting, Firebringer, UNOwen, Lowell, Prince of Paterson, Vivax, Crescent, MalcolmTucker

[HAMMER]

bugspray [3]:

Fredrick A Campbell, Enchant, Unsure

MalcolmTucker [1]:

Andante

Fredrick A Campbell [1]:

bugspray

Enchant [1]:

Dwlee99

Lowell [1]:

MegAzumarill

not voting [1]:

geraintm

mod notes

~ this is a mod note.

flavour

this was the day 1 hammer.
of the votes on, we know Pooky was town,


Greeting, Firebringer, UNOwen, Lowell, Prince of Paterson, Vivax, Crescent, MalcolmTucker
these were on the wagon, but i don't consider any of these to be likely town or scum because of likelihood of scum bussing.

the following is from vote 1.11, when there might have been a push for another wagon that wasn't Meg on a player later found to be town

bugspray [4]: Fredrick A Campbell, Enchant, Vivax, Unsure

So Enchant, Vivax and Unsure look suspicious to me - Vivax also managed to switch to be on the final wagon of Meg before the end.

Day 2

Fredrick A Campbell [8]: Prince of Paterson, UNOwen, Andante, Lowell, MalcolmTucker, Firebringer, Gamma Emerald, Enchant

that was the final wagon. Gamma ended up dead, the rest still alive.

Prince of Paterson - also voted meg
UNOwen - also voted for MEg
Andante
Lowell - also voted meg
MalcolmTucker - hammered MEg
Firebringer - also voted meg
Enchant

I am not sure where i am going with this.
i dont think these is much from the wagons to be gleaned. day 1 i think there was scum on the wagon (meg looked a gonner for much of the day and i peg scum as wanting to be on the inevitable wagon), day 2 almost certainly.

i think that triple of Enchant/Vivax/Unsure is where i am going to look at next, and see how much i dislike their slots (though i confess, Vivax is the one name that pings me right now, i have memories of them doing a bunch of stuff that upset me)