Datisi's Café [game over!]

[Datisi]

vote count 2.11

with 17 votes in play, it takes 9 to make a decision. day 2 ends in (expired on 2022-10-04 01:00:00).

firing

Roden [7]:

mastina, Andresvmb, Malakittens, Ydrasse, Titus, Uncrowned, PenguinPower

Titus [5]:

Roden, Lukewarm, Ausuka, Dannflor, Vivax

Malakittens [1]:

furtiveglance

Dannflor [1]:

fireisredsir

not voting [3]:

jjh927, Something_Smart, Klick

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▶ ❚❚ ─────────────────────────●─────  3:47 / 4:32

[Lukewarm]

Given the context of his earlier posts, in what world does scum!Roden think that this answer is going to do anything but hurt him? Like this is an actively self sabotaging answer when scum can give any answer they want

Wifom. Fake posts are posted.

Hey Titus, can you write a post saying why you believe Roden is scum? Or point me to one?

[Lukewarm]

Given the context of his earlier posts, in what world does scum!Roden think that this answer is going to do anything but hurt him? Like this is an actively self sabotaging answer when scum can give any answer they want

Wifom. Fake posts are posted.

Just shouting wifom is a cop out. Scum can do literally anything, the point is which is more likely.

I just don't think it is very likely at all, that given the situation that he was in, he would take that avenue as scum. And therefore, it being the truth is the more likely reality we live in.

You don't think it's likely at all, because that fits your worldview.

1) This feels like you are talking to someone you think is town.

but

2) Its simply not true. You are trying to act like I have not outlined my reasons for thinking he is town. They are right there for you to look at.

The reasons to think that he is scum, as I remember them, seemed largely to do with ~Vibes~ from Mastina, and then people not buying his claim, and then people not liking him being obstinante. .

I buy his claim, I don't see the off vibes, and I don't think him being obstinate is scum-indicative .

You are also willfully ignoring the fact that I also started to think he could be scum, and said as much, then when I thought on it more, my mental math of how likely he is town to scum settled on town.

[Lukewarm]

I buy his claim,

For anyone who is interested, I think that a role like the one Roden has claimed is almost guaranteed to be in this game.

Compare Peta's role to the standard Wiki description

Each Night, you may

target a player. Assuming no interference with your action, you will learn whether or not that player is able to privately communicate with another living player (you cannot distinguish between a player who is alone in a private topic, and a player who does not have private topic access at all).

during the night,

target a player. assuming no interference with your action, you will learn whether or not that player is able to privately communicate with

at least one

another living player,

via private topics or otherwise.

you cannot distinguish between a player who is alone in a private topic, and a player who does not have private topic access at all.

It is very clear that Datisi copy and pasted the role from the wiki, and then made slight modifications. He purposefully made it extra clear that it included communication methods beyond PTs. That seems to Roden's role.

I also feel like it is good design to make peta's traffic analyst have a false guilty, so that it is not just a cop.

[Vivax]

I buy his claim,

For anyone who is interested, I think that a role like the one Roden has claimed is almost guaranteed to be in this game.

Compare Peta's role to the standard Wiki description

Each Night, you may

target a player. Assuming no interference with your action, you will learn whether or not that player is able to privately communicate with another living player (you cannot distinguish between a player who is alone in a private topic, and a player who does not have private topic access at all).

during the night,

target a player. assuming no interference with your action, you will learn whether or not that player is able to privately communicate with

at least one

another living player,

via private topics or otherwise.

you cannot distinguish between a player who is alone in a private topic, and a player who does not have private topic access at all.

It is very clear that Datisi copy and pasted the role from the wiki, and then made slight modifications. He purposefully made it extra clear that it included communication methods beyond PTs. That seems to Roden's role.

I also feel like it is good design to make peta's traffic analyst have a false guilty, so that it is not just a cop.

Wow, nice catch. But the otherwise is really weird.

[furtiveglance]

I buy his claim,

For anyone who is interested, I think that a role like the one Roden has claimed is almost guaranteed to be in this game.

Compare Peta's role to the standard Wiki description

Each Night, you may

target a player. Assuming no interference with your action, you will learn whether or not that player is able to privately communicate with another living player (you cannot distinguish between a player who is alone in a private topic, and a player who does not have private topic access at all).

during the night,

target a player. assuming no interference with your action, you will learn whether or not that player is able to privately communicate with

at least one

another living player,

via private topics or otherwise.

you cannot distinguish between a player who is alone in a private topic, and a player who does not have private topic access at all.

It is very clear that Datisi copy and pasted the role from the wiki, and then made slight modifications. He purposefully made it extra clear that it included communication methods beyond PTs. That seems to Roden's role.

I also feel like it is good design to make peta's traffic analyst have a false guilty, so that it is not just a cop.

This is cool to think about. You're right that unless JJH and Mastina finally claim Masons, there should be (at least) 1 false guilty to stop a TA taking down the entire mafia team, because all mafia can privately communicate.

[furtiveglance]

Why is Mala in the townlock? Answer without using the word vibes

Mala occasionally pops in with posts that I entirely believe are genuine scumhunting;

from any player they might not look that special but I think Mala!scum wouldn't have reads that look as real as Mala's reads do

. In contrast, I think a lot of her posts have explicitly not been made with the goal of getting the game at large to townread her (which is what her goal would be if she were scum).

181 - I believe the intent of this post is actually just to express an Andre townread, and not to just look like she's scumhunting

She doesn't give two shits about the early suspicion on Ircher because Ircher isn't her buddy and she doesn't care what Ircher's alignment is for a while

UNVOTE:

Luke, mastina, (???)

I don‘t know, maybe Ydrasse for third
But I‘m never limming Roden today I think after re-ISOing.
This extremely obstinate defense almost always comes from town in my experience. Especially when it‘s so genuinely egocentrist at times (not negatively connotated as it‘s a townie process)

Id townbin andres

This is def his row. Meta

What is she even trying to accomplish with this content if she's scum, she already said this. She just wants her most confident read in town-Andres to be heard because she's town

I believed her 331 about me as well, I could see her having that take. Not as strong as the other ones, but it did contribute to solidifying the read.

All in all, Mala just wants to solve and that seems obvious to me from reading her posts.



Also, vibes

You think Mala is really obvious as mafia then. Can you back this up? I haven't played with scum!Mala before, I'll go and look now.

[Ydrasse]

i skim roden's iso and it's like

mailman who can get messages back for free right ?

that claim is probably real ya but i don't get how alignment follows that one

[Masquerader Blue]

i skim roden's iso and it's like

mailman who can get messages back for free right ?

that claim is probably real ya but i don't get how alignment follows that one

If you were modding a 21 player and you gave Mafia 4 players (not confirmed), would you give 2 Mafia useless abilities?

[Ydrasse]

everyone point and laugh at the alt slipper

[Ydrasse]

mafia can have like 5000 kills a night regardless so you have to temper that amount of potential kp into something and i think being able to provide reasonable false positives and establish ways of pocketing/getting info/etc works well for the type of game the flips have presented to us so far

[Dannflor]

Klick, I’ll be honest I wasn’t really interested in engaging with you after you failed to engage with any part of my entrance to the game and instead just said “Dannflor scummy af”

That does not give me the picture that you are evaluating your reads in a curious way

[Vivax]

i skim roden's iso and it's like

mailman who can get messages back for free right ?

that claim is probably real ya but i don't get how alignment follows that one

If you were modding a 21 player and you gave Mafia 4 players (not confirmed), would you give 2 Mafia useless abilities?

This FG or Uncrowned? Not that dissimilar in style, but FG writes more neutrally.
Btw this game started as a death metal concert and now it feels more like reggae, vibes-wise.

[Vivax]

Ah, actually it's Dannflor's argument from before I think. Well, one doesn't exclude the other two if you get my drift.

[jjh927]

Friendly reminder that one of the roles that already flipped would be a false guilty for the traffic analyst that would itself create additional false guilties

Also worth noting that scum are also likely to have a role that would be able to 'explain' the guilty if they got hit by the traffic analyst because that's pretty common design

Roden is town regardless but the mechanical reasoning on this page is pretty poor. Roden being town is very much in spite of the mechanical reasons for him not to be

[jjh927]

Now, Dannflor, do you want to talk about Klick

[jjh927]

Can you give a go at answering the question I asked Roden but try and put in the thought that I wanted Roden to put in

@Roden yeah maybe. But you also have to make a decision as Scum. Either you push Ircher right then and there about a potential slip that Ircher may be able to get away from (I didn’t find the “slip” killer, the freezing is what did Ircher in), or you hold off, and you position yourself around the flip that started seeming more and more inevitable as the day went on. Look at Vivax’s play and tell me that’s not what you see.

Look Vivax could have just been wrong and Town that’s always possible. But they were definitely the one player I thought was the Scummiest yesterday. It’s hard for me to look away right now.

I think any scum who joined the Ircher wagon would do so nonchalantly, the slip would've panicked the scum team and they wouldn't be sure whether or not Ircher could get away with it in the moment. The pile up happened so quickly that scum would most likely feel too self-conscious to make a big deal out of it or make a hard push, in fear of coming off as informed.

If I had to guess, I'd say two scum on wagon, one scum off.

Interesting line of thought.

What is your take on Klick right now

[Dannflor]

I’m about to run D&D

I’ll think about Klick and answer when I return tonight

[Vivax]

Friendly reminder that one of the roles that already flipped would be a false guilty for the traffic analyst that would itself create additional false guilties

Also worth noting that scum are also likely to have a role that would be able to 'explain' the guilty if they got hit by the traffic analyst because that's pretty common design

Roden is town regardless but the mechanical reasoning on this page is pretty poor. Roden being town is very much in spite of the mechanical reasons for him not to be

Yeah, jailkeeper causes false guilties.
The flirt causes them too, though iirc the details correctly.
So you'd be expecting a scum neighbourizer if you thought Roden was town, n?

[Vivax]

Anyway, need to make my rounds, collect protection money, have a drink, then send my curriculum to the PLA /jk

But jjh is sort of implying he's neighbourized with Klick and thinks that's the scum, methinks

[Klick]

Like Klick just seems to be in lockstep with you without any real unique pushes or thoughts of his own.

I think if Dannflor had any genuine interest in sorting me and thought this, the town next step would be asking any questions about any of my reads
Instead, he's starting with a conclusion and saying this with intent to sound persuasive instead of to solve
Because he doesn't need to actually solve for me
Because he's scum

i skim roden's iso and it's like

mailman who can get messages back for free right ?

that claim is probably real ya but i don't get how alignment follows that one

Ydrasse is town yay

[Klick]

First quote shouldn't be there

[Vivax]

First quote shouldn't be there

[jjh927]

Anyway, need to make my rounds, collect protection money, have a drink, then send my curriculum to the PLA /jk

But jjh is sort of implying he's neighbourized with Klick and thinks that's the scum, methinks

No, you're completely off, but I wouldn't really expect you to be on the same page as me

[jjh927]

Like, you're conflating two posts about completely different things