Succession Mafia (OVER!)

[singersigner]

I haven't. But I'm planning to use it today on town consensus. If I'm recruited, I want to be useless to them.

[ooba]

Responding to xvart - I didn't have time to actually go back and re-read the game.

Yeah, but a scum lynch is better than a town lynch.
If we can hit scum over town, let's do it. If we can hit a recruiter, let's do it. But for now, we should at least hit scum.

Fairly early enough in the day - You're not even trying to find scum ..

[xvart]

I haven't. But I'm planning to use it today on town consensus. If I'm recruited, I want to be useless to them.

If you wanted to be useless in case you got recruited why didn't you use your kill last night? You weren't worried about being recruited the next night after you replaced in while being a claimed vig? Wouldn't you want to get your kill off immediately after claiming?

xvart.

[singersigner]

I haven't. But I'm planning to use it today on town consensus. If I'm recruited, I want to be useless to them.

If you wanted to be useless in case you got recruited why didn't you use your kill last night? You weren't worried about being recruited the next night after you replaced in while being a claimed vig? Wouldn't you want to get your kill off immediately after claiming?

xvart.

I thought about it. But I wanted to use my kill during the day where town knew why I was accountable for the kill. Plus, if I used it last night without having a solid enough feel about what the town/I felt about who was mafia, it wouldn't have been a very accurate kill (probably a mis-kill...does that make sense?). If I used it last night prematurely, it wouldn't have helped town, and if I got recruited last night (I wasn't, for the record), forcing me to use it for mafia, it wouldn't help town either. You see how I was stuff between a rock and a hard place.

So this is what I've decided: I WILL use it today, on the biggest wagon that's formed by deadline. I WILL do L-1 and Hammer. I will not start a wagon, nor join one until town has decided there is one worth getting to that point.

I really hope you guys understand my reasoning for this.

[Chronopie]

I thought that during the day it became a double vote?!?

[Friend]

Yos, why was my post accusing you of taking advantage of Furc being Furc, Gandalf being Gandalf, and me being generally blunt and unhelpful "bullshit"? It's not OMGUS and I started a damn thread about this in MD.

[inHimshallibe]

Man, reading back through RC and Yos going on about why or why not Yos would be the perfect recruit candidate, and Yos's staunch retorts, I have this deep gut feeling that Yos is actually a recruiter.

[inHimshallibe]

I'll be back tomorrow with a vote.

[Porochaz]

I haven't. But I'm planning to use it today on town consensus. If I'm recruited, I want to be useless to them.

If you wanted to be useless in case you got recruited why didn't you use your kill last night? You weren't worried about being recruited the next night after you replaced in while being a claimed vig? Wouldn't you want to get your kill off immediately after claiming?

xvart.

I thought about it. But I wanted to use my kill during the day where town knew why I was accountable for the kill. Plus, if I used it last night without having a solid enough feel about what the town/I felt about who was mafia, it wouldn't have been a very accurate kill (probably a mis-kill...does that make sense?). If I used it last night prematurely, it wouldn't have helped town, and if I got recruited last night (I wasn't, for the record), forcing me to use it for mafia, it wouldn't help town either. You see how I was stuff between a rock and a hard place.

So this is what I've decided: I WILL use it today, on the biggest wagon that's formed by deadline. I WILL do L-1 and Hammer. I will not start a wagon, nor join one until town has decided there is one worth getting to that point.

I really hope you guys understand my reasoning for this.

Sorry, when did you claim?

[Lord Gurgi]

Tutorial for how to win a cult game: Lynch the cult leader.

Lynching people we know are not the recruiter is counter productive. So let's lynch Friend.

Andrius: Why haven't you investigated Yos yet?

[Yosarian2]

Yos, why was my post accusing you of taking advantage of Furc being Furc, Gandalf being Gandalf, and me being generally blunt and unhelpful "bullshit"?

I carefully analyzed everything that had happened in the game, spent a huge amount of time trying to figure out who was town and who was scum based on their actions, and did everything I could to figure out who the scum was. Meta is fine, but I hate it when people act like you can't dare attack people because "they always play like that"; it dosn't matter how people "normally" play, you still have to do your best to get a read on them based on their play this game.

You dismissed all the analysis I did with a brush off by calling it "fluffy", which really couldn't be farther from the truth. That is complete bullshit, and it's highly convient bullshit for you, since one of the people who looked like scum in my initial analysis was you.

Also, I didn't attack you for being "blunt", and if you were "unhelpful" and knew you were being unhelpful, then that is inherently scummy, because, pro-town people want to help the town win, pretty much by definition.

It's not OMGUS and I started a damn thread about this in MD.

If you attack someone because they're attacking you, your attack is quite often OMGUS, even if you don't realize it yourself. I actually explained that in that MD thread you're talking about. When someone attacks you with a legitimate case, and you respond by calling the case "fluffy" and calling the person attacking you scum, that's pretty much the definition of an OMGUS response, and that's what you did in this game. OMGUS isn't something that only scum do, although it's a scum tell sometimes town get pulled into it without thinking, but the way you're trying to claim your response is something other then what it clearly is is not reasuring to me.

I'm actually kind of disturbed by this defense of yours, actually. Was that MD thread in response to this game? I didn't realize that; if so, it's really not cool to start a MD thread in order to defend yourself from something that is happening in an ongoing game.

[Yosarian2]

Tutorial for how to win a cult game: Lynch the cult leader.

Lynching people we know are not the recruiter is counter productive.

Yes, this. I don't know why this is such a hard concept to get, and I don't know why people are still voting for people like ooba who are clearly not a recruiter.

[ReaperCharlie]

I'm gonna go ahead and throws out a guess that speculates on a great many things, all of which are related:

1. ooba and singersigner are scum together
2. ooba is recruiter and signersigner is loose cannon (OR) singersigner is recruiter and ooba is loose cannon (herp)
3. they used the fact that they both knew about the loose cannon role to conveniently create an also-claim opportunity
4. they figured they could 'substantiate' her claim later by letting her claim her faction's kill as her own
5. they both FELT TO ME like they sorta acted like "whew, they bought it" just after they claimed
6. they both laid relatively low for a while before just recently starting their "scumhunting" again
7. even the scumhunting they have done is not really scumhunting, it's just more of... trying to skate.

This is all tinfoil at the moment, but I believe it has some merit.

I've been letting the situation marinate in my mind since posting #1932, some of which now seems silly.

And this is what I came up with. I have been suspicious of ooba all game too, so yea.

[ooba]

1. ooba and singersigner are scum together
2. ooba is recruiter and signersigner is loose cannon (OR) singersigner is recruiter and ooba is loose cannon (herp)
3. they used the fact that they both knew about the loose cannon role to conveniently create an also-claim opportunity

4. they figured they could 'substantiate' her claim later by letting her claim her faction's kill as her own

5. they both FELT TO ME like they sorta acted like "whew, they bought it" just after they claimed
6. they both laid relatively low for a while before just recently starting their "scumhunting" again
7. even the scumhunting they have done is not really scumhunting, it's just more of... trying to skate.

Then singersinger's plan of using the bullet at L-2 should directly contradict this point.

---

Vote: gandalf

Call it gut but he's a recruiter .. (from ISO)

[ReaperCharlie]

Here's a quick info dump (with just the facts, not my opinions):

Mobsters still in the building...

(i.e. WHAT WE KNOW)

---

Andrius (claimed Enforcer before Furcolow flipped)
Chronopie (claimed Roleblocker, claimed being roleblocked on N2 -- POSSIBLE inference/confirmation within N2 mod flavor)
Erg0 ()
animorpherv1/Flameaxe ()
Friend ()
gandalf5166 ()
inHimshallibe ()
Lord Gurgi (investigated to be town by Andrius (night 2))
ooba (claimed Loose Cannon and claimed that he shot zwetschenasserbloke on (what night?))
Porochaz ()
ReaperCharlie (Investigated to be innocent by Andrius (what night?))
vezokpiraka/Robocopter87 ()
TheLonging/singersigner (also-claimed Loose Cannon, after ooba claimed. Has one (claimed) shot left to use.)
xvart ()
Yosarian2 ()

I am VERY likely missing something, as this is only from memory. Feel free to add on to this. That's the point of making this list, so we don't HAVE to rely on memory, and we can easily compare and contrast people's actions/claims/etc at a glance.

One thing I've learned from past games is that if we keep a running tally of what's happened and when, that a town win is MUCH more likely. For an example, check out Wisborg Asylum large theme. We literally CRUSHED the three scum factions, and had a 9-1 town endgame and nailed the final scum easily.

Also, I may be starting an alliance soon. As is becoming the usual, Andrius is tentatively invited.

[ReaperCharlie]

1. ooba and singersigner are scum together
2. ooba is recruiter and signersigner is loose cannon (OR) singersigner is recruiter and ooba is loose cannon (herp)
3. they used the fact that they both knew about the loose cannon role to conveniently create an also-claim opportunity

4. they figured they could 'substantiate' her claim later by letting her claim her faction's kill as her own

5. they both FELT TO ME like they sorta acted like "whew, they bought it" just after they claimed
6. they both laid relatively low for a while before just recently starting their "scumhunting" again
7. even the scumhunting they have done is not really scumhunting, it's just more of... trying to skate.

Then singersinger's plan of using the bullet at L-2 should directly contradict this point.

---

Vote: gandalf

Call it gut but he's a recruiter .. (from ISO)

- Refuting ONE of the above SEVEN points with something that HASN'T HAPPENED YET and calling the theory busted... CHECK.
- Hopping onto the next largest wagon for no reason other than GUT... CHECK.

I feel much better about this vote now.

Aim: ooba

[ReaperCharlie]

I'm willing to go onto the ooba wagon at the moment, as every other candidate right now is getting us nowhere. :/
I was going to suggest lynching Friend just because, but Yos made a good case on ooba.

For now:

Aim: ooba

Considering that Roleblocker/roleblocked flavour has to do with *intimate relations* the ambiguous result on ooba is more concerning than ever before. I dig.

Aim: Ooba

These anomalous "HAY I LIKE THE OOBA WAGON TOO!!!" votes don't give me warm fuzzies, though.

Absolutely no reason for voting except sheeping. And in Andrius' case, INCORRECT sheeping.

IGMEOYB(oth)!

[singersigner]

I thought that during the day it became a double vote?!?

It does. And that's exactly how I said I'd intend to use it, just not until the rest of the votes swing that way. Does that make sense?

[ReaperCharlie]

Adding on to my previous case against ooba/ss scum:

8. she seems to want to go out of her way to "also" confirm herself as town, and it LOOKS TO ME like it's in hopes of also confirming ooba as town.
9. WHO THE @#$^ (AS A TOWN VIG) WOULD OPT TO WASTE THEIR ACTION BY DOUBLE-VOTING INSTEAD OF NIGHTKILLING? SUPER SCUM POINTS

That is all.

Love,
ReaperCharlie

[ooba]

It's confirmable in thread RC - thelonging made it obvious that he was a loose cannon .. I don't need to see it happen because I know it can and will happen ..

And if I have read your posts right:
a) I am a cult recruiter and singersinger is a recruit (N0)
b) Chrono\Andrius are suspicious of being my recruit(s) since they blindlessly wagon'd
Are you really that dense to believe that two recruits would wagon their cult recruiter??

P.S: You got your eye on Andrius as one of my potential recruits when there is no way he can be a N1\N2 recruit (Robo's claim)

Preview: singersinger is obviously recruited but wants to confirm role ..

[singersigner]

Reaper...The Longing claimed long before Ooba did. I only confimed Ooba's role when he quoted what he could do directly.

As to your points:
#1. No
#2. I don't see how either would make sense, since as a mutually exclusive speculation, we wouldn't be able to know the other's role to claim identically.
#3. I don't understand this one.
#4. Ooba covered this.
#5. Oookay...I guess the only response I have to this is that when TheLonging claimed, no one seemed to pay any attention or care, so if that mattered, why would it be worth it to me to bring it up again, knowing that it "skated by" the first time it was brought up?
#6. My activity is sparked by understanding the game and how you guys work, AFTER having replaced in, with the knowledge of how recruiting is starting to work now.
#7. I never claimed to be actively scum-hunting. I'm processing. I'm doing what I think is best to help town.
#8. o.O
#9. Why does that make me scummy again? In my experience, this keeps whole town accountable for the kill. Not just me making my own decisions.

[Lord Gurgi]

I'll be honest, keeping the double vote is scummy as heck.

I'd like a vote count.

My problem at the moment is the same as I usually get at this stage in the game. The only lynch candidates that are up for serious contention are active players. Let's lynch someone who has dropped off considerably (FRIEND) at least, rather than a probably-not-recruiter.

I have this awful feeling I'm being run around by a Yos-ooba-Erg0 team. While the other side has Andrius-RC lead by inHim/Friend.

[ReaperCharlie]

THERE ARE MULTIPLE CULTS OOBA OF COURSE THEY ARE GOING TO WANT TO WAGON THE OPPOSITE RECRUITER.

AND EVEN IF THEY ARE IN YOUR CULT, HAVE YOU EVER HEARD OF BUSSING? OH YEAH RIGHT HUH I FORGOT

[/fate]

[Flameaxe]

Aim: Friend

, I'll have something else to add to this when I'm not studying for an exam in 8 hours.

[Lord Gurgi]

RC: If the recruitees are bussing their recruiter as soon as he receives any votes, the town's work is already done.

I support BBM for president.