TM2012: Scummies 2011.5 - Let the credits roll!

[MagnaofIllusion]

The MoIputer says that T-Bone and TheAm should be where I vote today. And I will not be voting T-Bone unless I see a TheAm-scum flip.

Still working in QT ...

[MagnaofIllusion]

So looking at flips from all completed games, analyzing probabilities, and lots of mumbo jumbo I also think Zar is most likely scum (based solely on this), Deas and theAm less like, and Reck and BB very unlikely ....

So next step is for me to catch-up today's posting, look at Zar's Day 1 (and general posting) regarding TheAm, and go from there.

[MagnaofIllusion]

First things first – no Fake Scummie here.

@BBmolla

– please summarize the Day 1C group’s discussions for me. Also, who did you vote for to receive the ‘Best Replacement’ scummie?

Zar’s Partnership pairing as opposed to scum-hunting on behavior pings my scumdar.

also the reason you changed your methods on the second one is because i pointed out it was fake/phony to put your name in the first time

so you consciously didn't do it the second time

slamdunkscummotivations

@Zar

– why did you change your process?

@TheAm

– you’ve been stringing along this “I have a theory I am holding on to till later” for awhile. You need to actually give it ASAP.

Night 2 I recieved the "Professor Mafia" scummie. Basically it says that I write a bunch of theory but nobody reads it, and implicates me as a sort of superior thinking being. Due to how uptight and better I am, I get offended when someone is nominated for a non existant scummy. So each night I can check someone to determine if they have a fake scummy or not. That night I checked DV, and was told he did not have any fake scummies. Last night I missed deadline by like 3 hours because I've been busy and it slipped my mind. Had it gone through I would have checked Zar.

Last night I got Best Performance in a Losing Cause fake Scummie(It tells me it's fake.) It makes fun of it not being an actual award anymore, and causes me to lose all my scummies I recieved and all future scummies, basically permanantly vanillerizing me.

More on this in my next post …

@BB

regarding Post 823 – Zor confirmed that all games are 3:10 or 3:9 publicly.

--

First things first, if you're town, that means you have to stop insulting me at every opportunity and we actually have to play this game and start working together.

The problem is, I'm still not sure that you're town.

Deas this is the only time I’m going to address this concept. Don’t expect any futher internet ink on the subject -

Saying that I find your reasoning to be unconvincing and possible scum driven is hardly insulting. If you find it so either toughen up or get a new perspective on what compromises “insults”.

His pushing on Ajax is strong and probably town, but Ajax was looking pretty likely to die at that stage anyway, so I wouldn't be surprised by MoI bussing there.

Funny that you stage it this way. Please review the thread and tell me again that my push on Ajax happened “when he was likely to die anyway” with a link to when I started my push.

I didn't vote for Quilford to receive Best Replacement. I remember on page 2 I was planning to because I had a townread on him and thought he would be an unlikely scum kill, but then I thought he was too pro-town, so I voted for T-bone.

So you voted for T-Bone before the Day 1 lynch for Best Replacement?

Also, I forgot to submit my vote between Molla and T-bone, so it must have been a random decision.

So you are specifically claiming Day 2 you ‘forgot’ to submit a vote before Magua lynch between Molla and T-Bone?

BBmolla: I smell a fakeclaim.

This is scummy. Further elaboration …

First, the way he claimed it is not town fakeclaiming it, because of the detail he provides in explaining the role and his saying I should vote him for it.

I think it is unlikely that it would be in the game at all. It feels out of place and seems to just give more power to scum when town weren't very powerful to begin with considering the limitation of the roles given out and scum's ability to interfere with the judging process.

Why would Town fake-claim anything in an open setup (we still have enough people alive to confirm / deny it happened)?

Furthermore giving said Power to scum helps Town. So the whole second paragraph is a mild Appeal to Fear.

All-in-all this very much smells of scum who know BB was Vanillaized and wants to push on him for that. As a reminder Lost Butterfly specified scum may have other, unknown powers.

I’ll be re-reading you in full next ….

-theam asking for an investigation role
-theam asking why we lynched Magua
-theam being obviously unhelpful

Please explain to me the Town motivation for all of these.

Also … do you think TheAm is incapable of making a ‘fake’ Town-tell as scum?

--

When SpyreX drew scum with Lady Lambdadelta and fucking chesskid, we all got our morale docked even further.

Funny … I had the exact same reaction seeing LLD pull scum with Chessderp and Llama pull scum with TSQ and Socio …

[MagnaofIllusion]

Judging QTs

Group 1A – Reck,

Quilford

, T-Bone,

Captain Ajax

,

MoI

: Gave out Best Newbie (N1 only Cop) to Fonz
Group 1B –

Hito

,

Magua

, Zar, Theam,

Fonz

: Gave out DOUBLE VOTE Scummie (can’t find proper name ATM) to Reck
Group 1C –

KK

, BBMolla, DeaVail: Gave out Best Replacement (Bodyguard) to Hito

Group 2A -

MoI

,

Quilford

, T-Bone and Zar.
Group 2B - TheAm,

hito

, BBmolla, and

Magua

: Gave out Best IC (Jailkeeper) to Quilford
Group 2C –

KK

, Reck, Deas : Gave out Professor Mafia (searcher for ‘Fake Scummies, unknown at time of release) to BBMolla

[MagnaofIllusion]

@Zar / TheAm

– please provide me with a Summary of your Day 1 discussion. Did you decide in QT (per Hito’s suggestion Day 1) as to who the Scummie was to go to?

[xRECKONERx]

I didn't think I'd ever say this, but...

THANK GOD MOI IS BACK TO BE A BASTION OF SANITY

.

[Lost Butterfly]

Day 4, Votecount 5

Zar (1) - xRECKONERx
theamatuer (1) - BBmolla

Not voting (4) - MagnaofIllusion, Zar, T-Bone, theamatuer, DeasVail

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch or no-lynch.

Deadline:

June 23rd at 7:00 PM (EDT)

Countdown to deadline

: (expired on 2012-06-23 19:00:00)

[MagnaofIllusion]

Reck: Well, Magua-town --> Reck-town was because of you voting Gaoth at the time you did. Magua-scum --> Reck-scum was because I have townreads on everyone else, your vote on Gaoth makes a fair bit of sense if you're scum with Magua and other little things make the idea of you being scum together appeal to me. That and I'm a bit more sure of Magua being scum than I was.

So Deas ... you said this yet Magua has now flipped Town and yet you have kept the "Reck is scum" door open. What happened to this stance from Day 2?

[DeasVail]

MoI:

I think you're town, don't worry. Also, yes to the questions you asked, and regarding Reck, one thing that I think makes him town (and I'm not even sure about that) is not enough to sustain my townread considering I find him scummy otherwise.

I will get around to explaining my townreads soon.

[Zar]

@Zar / TheAm

– please provide me with a Summary of your Day 1 discussion. Did you decide in QT (per Hito’s suggestion Day 1) as to who the Scummie was to go to?

Well,

As per hito's recommendations, we first decided on picking which award we were going to give out, and then we decided to focus on the who part. The idea was to have the award locked in first.

We didn't have much disagreement settling with the Smooth Operator scummie. Fonz was on a bit of a confusion which resulted in the Mod Clarification made in public about rule 4.

Hito and theam voted for SO, and then we went into deciding the nominee. We named Hito the spokeperson of the group.

Fonz suggested Reck, KK and MoI.
Hito suggested Quilford, Reck, and MoI
theam said he preferred Reck
I said I preferred Reck over MoI and Quilford at the time.
Fonz agreed on Reck.

We then confirmed we had sent in our votes and then I locked the QT by voting.

[DeasVail]

@Zar / TheAm

– please provide me with a Summary of your Day 1 discussion. Did you decide in QT (per Hito’s suggestion Day 1) as to who the Scummie was to go to?

Well,

As per hito's recommendations, we first decided on picking which award we were going to give out, and then we decided to focus on the who part. The idea was to have the award locked in first.

We didn't have much disagreement settling with the Smooth Operator scummie. Fonz was on a bit of a confusion which resulted in the Mod Clarification made in public about rule 4.

Hito and theam voted for SO, and then we went into deciding the nominee. We named Hito the spokeperson of the group.

Fonz suggested Reck, KK and MoI.
Hito suggested Quilford, Reck, and MoI
theam said he preferred Reck
I said I preferred Reck over MoI and Quilford at the time.
Fonz agreed on Reck.

We then confirmed we had sent in our votes and then I locked the QT by voting.

When deciding on the award, how did you intend it to be used?

[Zar]

@Zar

– why did you change your process?

After doing the Vote Analysis, I noticed and mentioned in my Team QT that all the D2 wagons were innocents.

[Zar]

When deciding on the award, how did you intend it to be used?

It was the least horrible of the pack. The other two were: a Neutral Third Party Flip and a Mafia Godfather Ability.

[Zar]

@Mod please fix my quotes

Done.

[Zar]

I'll explain the T-Bone townread a little later.

DV?

[theamatuer]

[quote="In [url=http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 9#p4117919]

When deciding on the award, how did you intend it to be used?

It was the least horrible of the pack. The other two were: a Neutral Third Party Flip and a Mafia Godfather Ability.[/quote]
No, it was a 1-shot vig that caused the flip to be a serial killer if he didn't use it before he got killed

[Zar]

[quote="In [url=http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 9#p4117919]

When deciding on the award, how did you intend it to be used?

It was the least horrible of the pack. The other two were: a Neutral Third Party Flip and a Mafia Godfather Ability.

No, it was a 1-shot vig that caused the flip to be a serial killer if he didn't use it before he got killed[/quote]

Hito confirmed with the mod that the role was basically a death-miller.

[DeasVail]

T-Bone Townread

As I said before, part of it is because of 58 which is something somewhat unlikely for scum to attempt (as it is different from everyone else) but likely for town to feel.

242 doesn't seem likely from scum with Ajax. This is because he actually said quite strongly that theam was pretty much assuredly scum and Ajax was only maybe scum, but then realises something and decides to vote Ajax. If scum, it would seem better to just go after Ajax all the way.

Also note that I think his questions throughout are pretty good.

His forgetting to vote is something I've decided makes him likely town. This is because scum are likely to be very conscious of who they vote. It seems a lot more important to them because they'd consider perhaps voting for a partner and the risks associated with this, and whether it may just be better to vote for a townie. Basically, they'd think about it a lot more than town would, and T-Bone forgetting is something I find completely believable from town (I did it) but not believable from scum.

Saying that no one in the QT kept up with the game in his absence (441) is something scum could be hesitant to say considering they may think it indicative of them being scum.

The flip on theam is also unnecessary and just attracts attention as scum. Town being convinced by everyone the previous day and then reconsidering seems much more likely.

Those are the main reasons as I skim through his ISO anyway.

Theam Townread

One thing is his questioning of Ajax about the claim. Scum would know that it was a completely bad claim and he would definitely die for it and I'm sure they'd just leave it alone and let Ajax die because question's such as theam's could be seen as a way of trying to keep Ajax alive. Seems more likely from theam-town not completely sure of Ajax-scum.

Again, asking for an investigative role lalala.

I've noticed throughout that his attempts to catch up and provide content seem more like town struggling to find motivation to put effort in and doing things in little spurts rather than scum trying to look town.

Theam's answer to my question in 843 would be unlikely to be said from scum if that was the case, because they would think that their team said that

because

he was scum and would have said other stuff if he was town, and it's also the kind of thing unlikely to be made up.

[BBmolla]

@BBmolla – please summarize the Day 1C group’s discussions for me. Also, who did you vote for to receive the ‘Best Replacement’ scummie?

DV posted what roles we had to select from for convienence. (Others were Funniest Player(Roleblocker) and Favorite Game(self-redirecter I think)) DV said he thought Bodygaurd was most pro-town. I agreed. KK said some stuff about Hito, noting Hito saying "4-0." KK and DV speculate about other groups(how many members and such) I comment to ask what we do cause I didn't read the rules. KK then basically said let's go Bodygaurd, final decision. We agreed. DV asked KK what he thinks of my cluelessness. I said I learn by doing. KK told me to read the rules. Read rules. Said we should vote ASAP so we don't miss deadline. We did.

I didn't realize the QT would close so I was a bit annoyed when it did.

[BBmolla]

I voted Quilford due to a coinflip, but I kind of wanted him to recieve it anyway because I thought you'd die.

[BBmolla]

I didn't think I'd ever say this, but...

THANK GOD MOI IS BACK TO BE A BASTION OF SANITY

.

Amen.

[MagnaofIllusion]

@Zar

– Thank you for the summary in Post 909

@TheAm

– first please tell me if that summary is accurate.

Then based on this point …

theam said he preferred Reck

Please explain why you posted the following from Post 587

oh right. We have a secret double voter here. I'd like that double voter to vote me just to confirm his/her existence, just so scum can't abuse it lylo/mylo or something

--

Favorite Game(self-redirecter I think)

@BB / Deas

– please explain more fully what this was.

Also please confirm that BB voted to give the Scummie to Quilford and Deas to T-Bone. Also please confirm that no discussion of who to give it to was made in QT ( which I think Deas already said but confirmation can't hurt)

--

I didn't think I'd ever say this, but... THANK GOD MOI IS BACK TO BE A BASTION OF SANITY.

You remember Day 1 when you were all “MoI calling me Town doesn’t sit right with me”? Well right back at you. Yes, bitterness is seeping right here …

--

MoI: I think you're town, don't worry. Also, yes to the questions you asked, and regarding Reck, one thing that I think makes him town (and I'm not even sure about that) is not enough to sustain my townread considering I find him scummy otherwise.

Look, a nice little piece of Dodge with a side of Ignore.

Here are all the questions / statements you not-so-deftly avoided from my post. Answer them in your next one …

Please review the thread and tell me again that my push on Ajax happened “when he was likely to die anyway” with a link to when I started my push.

So you voted for T-Bone before the Day 1 lynch for Best Replacement?

So you are specifically claiming Day 2 you ‘forgot’ to submit a vote before Magua lynch between Molla and T-Bone?

-theam asking for an investigation role
-theam asking why we lynched Magua
-theam being obviously unhelpful

Please explain to me the Town motivation for all of these.

Also … do you think TheAm is incapable of making a ‘fake’ Town-tell as scum?

--

After doing the Vote Analysis, I noticed and mentioned in my Team QT that all the D2 wagons were innocents.

But that’s not an answer to my question. Why did you shift your process from ‘Including yourself in the questionable pile” to “Not including self”.

Reck makes a very good point that you behavior does very much look like someone who is taking actions that they want to be deemed as Town not actual Town actions. You will NEVER catch Town me putting myself in a PoE position where I am analyzing myself as scum. Regardless of whether anyone thinks it is scummy or not. Town you knows you are Town.

[DeasVail]

I really need to work on my deftness! I thought I'd succeeded there.

So that you don't castrate me in your next post for not addressing your request properly:

Your push on Ajax happened "when he was likely to die anyway". Link to when MoI started his push.

Whenever I said that, I forgot that you were in fact the first one to push him and thought you only really started pushing after you voted for him the second time. I have since realised that I was wrong in saying that and that you might just be town.

It seems to me, however, that the only reason you were so pushy about this, after I had repeatedly called you town, is so that I could prostrate myself before your great town-ness.

So here goes:

Almighty MoI! I beg you to forgive my mistake in saying that you pushed on Ajax "when he was likely to die anyway". I acknowledge your overwhelming generosity in not having me lynched yet and assure you that I will avoid questioning your most obvious town-ness in future.

Now and forever your most humble servant,

DeasVail.

The answers to the next two questions are yes.

Regarding theam,

-I know that Magua mentioned it somewhere, but I know that I would have liked an investigative role.
-Possibly just expressing what he's feeling at the time?
-A lack of motivation

No, I don't think he is incapable of that, but I feel that there is enough that I find town about him to have him as a townread.

[DeasVail]

ugh, sorry, I shouldn't have done that.

[T-Bone]

Gonna blatantly prod dodge here. If someone needs me to address something point it out to me and I will at some point tomorrow.