Open 403 - Donner Party (Game Over)

[Tierce]

Votecount 4.1

Not voting

(3) - Mortontfrh, Shadoweh, Phillammon


With 3 alive, it takes 2 votes to lynch.

The deadline is July 8 at 8:07 AM GMT (DST). Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2012-07-08 08:07:00)

[Shadoweh]

Well I'm glad everyone else is as active today as always. >_>
Usually in a LYLO situation we have flips to go over and connections to make. Just as well not to bother with them since the most likely scum to be alive never had someone to be connected to. Let's try putting something on the table to start this awkward talk.

Phil: What was with the Vote/Unvote because 'we could be in LYLO' and why did you drop a hammer? Did you ever have a reason to suspect GNR beyond his confusion over his role?

I like how GNR has once again skated over the fact that the SK is RB immune, so 3 kills just told him that saul wasn't the Vig or the Mafioso who sent the kill. The fact he died means that he wasn't the SK, but there is nothing else to back you up if you really are the Roleblocker.

Considering saulres dying already made him not the SK, why did it matter that GNR didn't think saulres was the SK?

Morty: What exactly changed your mind about GNR going from bumbling town to bumbling scum? It looked more like you just got fed up with him being idiotic and threw him out.

Cut: You caught me. I'm actually the second roleblocker and I roleblocked you last night. Congrats you're clear! If you're going to lie at least make it believable, there is nothing that could cause a 'no result'.

[Phillammon]

Well, that was thick of me. Fail gambit is a fail.

So let's put it another way.

VOTE: Morton

[Shadoweh]

Well I do like ending games before the other guy gets to post.

##Vote: Morton

[Tierce]

Votecount 4.2

Mortontfrh

(2) - Phillammon, Shadoweh

Not voting

(1) - Mortontfrh,

Shadoweh, Phillammon

With 3 alive, it takes 2 votes to lynch.

The deadline is July 8 at 8:07 AM GMT (DST). Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2012-07-08 08:07:00)

A majority has been reached. Mod scene incoming.

[Tierce]

Mood music.

Coincidental misfortune at every turn

They don't deliberate for long. It takes one to know another, maybe--or maybe they are just tired of the pretense. Only a few meters from where they made camp, they face each other, then their unsuspecting companion who is struggling up the slope towards them.

He never saw the blows coming.

Mortontfrh,

Vanilla Townie

, has been lynched.

Game over!

Town

...

Loses...

Mafia

...

Draws!

Serial Killer

...

Draws!

Role distribution, night actions and QuickTopics will be posted soon. Thank you all for playing.

[Shadoweh]

Why can't I resist obvious traps ;_;

[Phillammon]

You didn't realize? At least I've broken my no-win streak, finally.

[Phillammon]

Wait, DAMNIT!

[Tierce]

Setup:

6

Vanilla Townies

:
Elmo TeH AzN

Fritzler

izakthegoomba
Mortontfrh
saulres
vijay2vasandani
Xalxe

1

Town Dietician (Gunsmith)

:
Cogito Ergo Sum

1

Town Roleblocker

:
Guy_Named_Riggs

1

Cannibal Town Vigilante

:
scotmany12

2

Cannibal Mafia Goons

:
Phillammon

Chimera

Glork

1

Cannibal Serial Killer

:
Shadoweh

QuickTopics:

• Scum QuickTopic
  Dead QuickTopic
  Mod QuickTopic
  (includes night actions)

[izakthegoomba]

Noooo, Phil!

Sorry guys, my play sucked this game, so I'm sure I contributed heavily to that loss. This seems to be becoming a trend for me...

[Shadoweh]

Sort of? You voting threw me off. Why would you vote for not-me knowing that I was the SK? I do not understand you!

[Phillammon]

I was playing for the draw, given the only way I could win would require a lynch on you or a no-lynch, and both would require you not knowing who I was, and still be risky.

[Phillammon]

Glork's gonna come in here and kick my ass, isn't he...

[TheButtonmen]

You've gone soft Terrence.

Soft I say.

[Tierce]

Mod thoughts

This setup is very punishing for town. It's essentially non-reveal, and during the game I was left wondering if a massclaim D1 isn't the best strategy for town--it leaves their PRs in the open with no protective roles, but on the other hand it stops the main tool that scum and SK have in this setup, which is the ability to fakeclaim via the janitored kills.

However, there were several aspects that made this even worse:

The Gunsmith died N1. This was not town's fault, but it affected their chances of getting claims right.
The power roles forgot they were power roles, or used their abilities in the weirdest possible way. Blocking someone softclaiming vig N1, GNR? And then you and scot not acting N2? ...and then messing up your role? I was almost physically cringing at it.

Granted, the scum also made a fantastic slip right at the end. I originally thought Phillammon was signaling Shadoweh that he knew she was the SK, thus making him the scum, and that he wanted the draw. His following posts in the QT made it clear that no, that was a complete hit and miss. And the Gunsmith claim? If you had not killed the Gunsmith and no one else claimed it, where did you expect the Gunsmith to be? He was in her belly, Shadoweh would know your claim for a lie the moment she saw it.

The only scum who killed PRs (Shadoweh) did not use the fakeclaims they would bring. Granted, they were risky ones--the first one required her to get Gunsmithing claims right, and the second one was too late in the game.

With everything put together, I don't think town deserved a victory here. Shadoweh was actually acting more protown than most townies, and she would have nailed a victory if she waited for Morton to crossvote with Phil and hammered Phil instead. That's what you get for being impatient, little Hungry Hungry Hippo.

I messaged Hoopla yesterday asking what would happen if it came down to the non-BP Serial Killer and scum going into night; her response was a draw. Go complain to her, Buttons.


Again, thank you all for playing. While I understand this setup can be frustrating to play in, I hope you had fun, and welcome you into any future games of mine. If you have any comments/suggestions/complaints about my modding, have at.

[Shadoweh]

I should have used my Glork fakeclaim! :< I just generally don't like fakeclaiming at all, if you live it's like 'why are you alive' and if you type the wrong response well.. also I made a fantastic slip earlier when I was talking about nightkills and forgot to include CES in the list of people the scum could have killed. Luckily no one was around and I added it in the next post but..

Playing as an SK is already Nintendo Hard. I supose I should be glad I didn't get quicklynched for once!


Removing extraneous quote. ~Tierce

[Phillammon]

No, I knew he was SK, I just claimed the wrong thing on him. I forgot the SK isn't Investigation immune...

[Tierce]

No, I knew he was SK, I just claimed the wrong thing on him. I forgot the SK isn't Investigation immune...

I know you did--you shot her, after all.

All that CES/Glork/antiGlork dinner was some kind of BP fat.

I meant that I thought your claim, while lousy, was meant to signal to her that you were the other scum and wanted a draw. Your following posts showed that while you knew this, you failed the claim on accident.

[Shadoweh]

I thought he was just trying to convince the other townie he was the dietician. >_>
Glork was like a fluffy pastry. Filled with Glork. And CES was the beginning of my all alternative meat diet!
Scotmany was more like a tough and gnarly moose that I had to consume before it broke my living room.

[Phillammon]

Ah, got it. Nope. Shame.

[Hoopla]

Mod thoughts

This setup is very punishing for town. It's essentially non-reveal, and during the game I was left wondering if a massclaim D1 isn't the best strategy for town--it leaves their PRs in the open with no protective roles, but on the other hand it stops the main tool that scum and SK have in this setup, which is the ability to fakeclaim via the janitored kills.

Nice modding Tierce. I agree that the setup is punishing on town - no reveal games tend to do that, although I'm not sure it's unbalanced. Playing in a 2:1:9 setup is a decent advantage to compensate for limited reveals. I'm also wondering how effective a D1 massclaim could be - you get the benefits of three confirmed town D1, but they will automatically attract the mafia and SK nightkill, leaving you in a mostly vanilla game (and most importantly eliminating N1 of possible crosskills, which is a massive advantage for town in these sort of games). Most fakeclaims are hard to pull off in this setup, as the other antitown faction will likely target you if you're believed by the town, and you have to get details right, which the other faction might pick up on. All things considered, I think massclaim D1 is probably suboptimal, because the risk of fakeclaims isn't too crippling - at least not enough to sacrifice your PR's N1 and get no crosskill chances that night.

[Tierce]

I don't think it's unbalanced, but the more I think on it, the more I think it's not a setup for everyone. You need players who will stay motivated throughout the whole game, no matter how many town flips they see--because if there are any cross kills, they'll probably not get to witness them. Shadoweh told me something during the game that pretty much nails it: with the state of the game as it was, anyone who was motivated to go on and/or seems to have any remote clue of what is going on is probably scum. Here the informed minority/uninformed majority dichotomy is pushed further than usual, and minor hints at extra knowledge are rather stronger scumtells.

One could feel how demotivated and disheartened the town was as they moved further along; with town flip after town flip, it got to a point in which I fear most of those alive didn't really care. It's a setup that requires a lot of player motivation against bleak odds, because if they don't lynch scum early, their game is a salvo of green and gray flips.

It's rather swingy--Magua's run of it was pretty much spot on for town (poor Matias, all that hunger, so little food). Here they were constantly running up town and making silly mistakes, and the consequences were visible in the final result.

[Hoopla]

I think this run was about as demoralising as the setup could be town - if the town lynched scum on D2 or D3, they could have received a couple of flips to illuminate the early stages of the game. It might be a good idea for the vig to claim after a couple of kills, so the town has some other probable flips, if they believe the claim. But yeah, limited reveal games aren't for everyone - I think the good thing is the amount of death means the game won't go on forever.

[BBmolla]

One could feel how demotivated and disheartened the town was as they moved further along; with town flip after town flip, it got to a point in which I fear most of those alive didn't really care. It's a setup that requires a lot of player motivation against bleak odds, because if they don't lynch scum early, their game is a salvo of green and gray flips.

Just like the real Donner Party.