WWE Attitude Era 2.0 Game over nWo'd

[Nexus]

I don't need to justify it!

Town have no reason to be gloating at town deaths!

Do you mind explaining what you mean by this?

Why would Town be happy that some of their own have been killed at Night? It's bad that Town have died...

Hey TGG, would you like to contribute something meaningful to the thread?

[Lance]

Town have no reason to be gloating at town deaths!

Again I ask: where was I gloating? The accusations of insincerity I can kind-of sort-of see, but I'm just confused by the accusations of gloating.

1) You spoke way too much about the night kill and the fact that it was a failed lynch. This is a pretty decent tell. For some reason scum are just more likely to talk about the night-kills/yesterday's lynch results.

Really? Only Scum acknowledge the nighttime results? Town is supposed to just ignore the dead bodies altogether? That seems really silly to me.

Also...uh...CJ Miller was not a failed lynch and I didn't say it was. Where'd you get that idea from?

2) You then go on to say: I'm going to go look at the people who opposed the cj lynch. First of all, iirc, YOU were more or less against the cj lynch. You eventually voted for him but you apparently did this because you felt "damned if you do and damned if you dont" (407).

You recall incorrectly. I supported lynching CJ Miller before everyone else jumped on the bandwagon. *adjusts hipster glasses*

If you're judging "support of a lynch" on votes alone, I already explained here why I kept my vote on Sawyer for a while.

[Nexus]

"Actually kind of disappointed that forehead7 is gone. I had so much to say to him too. On the bright side, at least we didn't lose any power roles."

It just feels like you're saying "LOL FOREHEAD HAS GONE LOLOLOL" idk. My own opinion I guess.

[Elmo TeH AzN]

Mod (Jason) Sorry Im going to request to be replaced. I just can't get into this game and with
My personal issues with work I find motivation hard. Sorry = /

[ThAdmiral]

Also...uh...CJ Miller was not a failed lynch and I didn't say it was. Where'd you get that idea from?

That was a brain-fade from me, I of course meant successful lynch.

You recall incorrectly. I supported lynching CJ Miller before everyone else jumped on the bandwagon. *adjusts hipster glasses*

I'm going to have to disagree with you here. As far as I can tell you mainly stayed on the fence regarding cj and then begrudginly lynched him.
Regarding cj you said the following:

Agreed with forehead7. Regardless of whether CJ Miller is Town or Scum, keeping him around could be dangerous in the long run due to his eyebrow-raising voting habits. If he keeps it up, I might have to offer my support as well.

"regardless of whether he is town or scum", "might have to offer my support (for a lynch)". These are not firm stances by any means, nor do they indicate what alignment you actually think cj is/was.

Please don't make it sound like I want him dead right away or anything. That's not what I said. I just said that keeping him around could be detrimental. Even if he's Town, his play style (from what we've seen of it thus far) doesn't benefit us. It certainly isn't going to help us catch Scum.

If you want to argue against his lynch, that means you'll have to assert that he's a valuable member of team Town. And, uh...good luck with that.

The first bit is really weird. I don't get what you mean by stating you don't want him dead straight away. Lynched another day, taken out by a vig? You also still don't have a firm stance on his alignment with another "even if he's town" statement.

Hey, I have a terrific idea: let's completely ignore the motivations of all the players who are actually on the CJ Miller wagon and focus instead on the one guy who is taking the time to explain why the wagon is a good idea. It would also appear that you've completely overlooked the fact that I have not voted for CJ Miller myself -- and, in fact, I might not even do so at all since another player has caught my eye and seems far more deserving of my vote than either CJ or Sawyer. More on this exciting story as it develops.

You keep talking about the fact that you "support" his lynch, but you seem to be looking to vote/lynch anyone

but

him.

Like, retardscum tend to play even worse than CJM is playing now.

I apologize if this is a newb question, but since this is a non-bastard game, that means there are no Jesters or similar roles, right? Your comment here got me thinking that it's almost like CJ Miller is

trying

to get lynched...and that led me to consider some other unsavory possibilities. Not sure whether Jesters fall under the "bastard" umbrella or not.

Here you suggest he might be a jester. Once again implying you think he isn't scum/shouldn't be lynched.

Alright, alright, you made your point. Sheesh. Yes, I can see how my actions could be misconstrued as fence-sitting. My Sawyer vote is going nowhere, so if you want me to put my money where my mouth is, all you had to do was ask nicely.

UNVOTE: Sawyer
VOTE: CJ Miller

There. Happy now?

You finally vote him here, begrudingly...

Yeah, that's worse. You voted CJ because people pointed out that you were scummy for not doing so.

So I'm scummy for not putting my vote on CJ Miller, but I'm also scummy when I

do

put my vote on CJ Miller? I'm damned if I do and damned if I don't. If I'm going to be vilified either way, then what does it matter?

And indicate here that the main reason you voted him is because you didn't like being called "scummy" for not doing so. Now who would be more worried about being called "scum"?

[Platinum Shadow]

Hey guys I've finally caught up with the game, and I'm already working on a big post.

As of now the people who have been pinging my scumdar the most have bee Sawyer and PM, I'll have to do some ISO's on them and check out their interactions again with everyone else, and their reactions prior to the CJ wagon forming. I believe I read Sawyer being pretty against it when it was picking up some steam.

I'm kinda suspicious of IS as well, but he seems more heavily-lurkey town than lurking scum. Gotta ISO him.

DX has been pretty quiet for a major portion of the game, and can also be possible lurker scum, though maybe a replacement on this slot would be better.

ThaD is probably the top town read atm.

[jasonT1981]

Mod (Jason) Sorry Im going to request to be replaced. I just can't get into this game and with
My personal issues with work I find motivation hard. Sorry = /

No worries, real life always takes priority. Hope all will calm down for you soon.

Replacement is being lined up as we speak.

[WrathChild]

Ok, I'm back from VLA. I need to do a careful re-read, but my initial skim makes me still like an Elmo or Lance or Admiral lynch. Yes, I still want to lynch Elmo's slot even with a replacement coming. More later.

[SnakePlissken]

I am also back from the weekend and catching up, I've seen the deaths and my initial reaction was anyone replacing out of a slot was a scum member as I've seen this a few times and even down it myself (Although not because I was scum, life issues played a part but it was an easier decision because I was scum). So while I'm not saying I disbelieve anyone replacing outs reasoning, it's always easier to replace out if your scum. So the Prana and Elmo slots are my top priority to start this day.

[Nexus]

Except for the fact that Prana genuinely had real life issues, and that's an absolutely asinine assumption to make, yeah, great first post back Snake.

[PMysterious]

I don't need to justify it!

Town have no reason to be gloating at town deaths!

Do you mind explaining what you mean by this?

Why would Town be happy that some of their own have been killed at Night? It's bad that Town have died...

Hey TGG, would you like to contribute something meaningful to the thread?

Thank you. You explained all I needed to know.

[pappums rat]

Lance's response to the pressure he has been under and ThAd's #504 make me

Unvote

Vote: Lance

[The Gobbledy Gooker]

The more I see of Lance, the more his newness overwhelms me. To out right say he doesn't think scum would bus CJ Miller is way too cute to believe almost.

Vote: Internet stranger

Chatting with Triple D he reminded me how unlike his town game IS is playing. Lets get a wagon going up in here.

[pidgey]

As much as i do not really like TGG, i have to agree here. IS might have some sort of personal reason but he hasnt even bothered telling us, but by this point in any game i had played with him, he would be focusing of any player, town or scum, and tunnelvissioning the shit out of him.

I kinda prefer a lynch on IaI and i kinda think he might be from the OPPOSITE team of CJ. It looked like asking if people were voting CJ more for policy or for scummyness was a way to set up his votes for the next day.

vote: IaI

[The Gobbledy Gooker]

Hey TGG, would you like to contribute something meaningful to the threa

Would you? I mean the Lance argument is sub-terrible.

VOTE: Internet Stranger

There's no way this is town Internet Stranger play. He needs to die, today.

[The Gobbledy Gooker]

lol

[Yates]

I kinda prefer a lynch on IaI and i kinda think he might be from the OPPOSITE team of CJ. It looked like asking if people were voting CJ more for policy or for scummyness was a way to set up his votes for the next day.

vote: IaI

Yup. That's the initial vibe I got from him too and why I feel pretty good about my vote right now.

[Internet Stranger]

I need to do some rereading to see who opposed the CJ Miller lynch the strongest. That seems like a good place to start.

The problem with this stance is that it's generally not how mafia work. With cj in particular, who looked so bad, I imagine there would be a fair bit of distancing. If I was scum-partners with him I would have been on his wagon, and I think it would be fair to say there would most likely be scum on his wagon. Furthermore the other scum team (assuming there is one) would also have been happy to jump on his lynch.
If anything looking at the people who did vote for cj is probably going to prove more fruitful.

With that in mind...

CJMiller 11 - SnakePlissken,

forehead7

, pappums rat, ThAdmiral, PMysterious, Nexus, Lance, sawyer, Elmo, pidgey,

Nerodoesthesplits

Of the non-confirmed-town and non-myself list I like pappums, nexus, sawyer, snake, pidgey.
Which leaves pmysterious, lance and elmo.
Honestly I would be ok with the lynch of any of them, as my impressions of them from day 1 range from bad to nothing. I'll go with lance since I like nexus' suggestion that he was being insincere.

vote: lance

I like this post. Looking for the bussing scum is the right move at the moment. The PMY, Nexus and Lance spots are the most suspicious of the wagon.

I need to do ISO's on those three when I can.

Those people voting for me right now are either opportunistic scum or idiots.

[Lance]

"Actually kind of disappointed that forehead7 is gone. I had so much to say to him too. On the bright side, at least we didn't lose any power roles."

It just feels like you're saying "LOL FOREHEAD HAS GONE LOLOLOL" idk. My own opinion I guess.

Mm-hm. Mm-hm. So, from what I understand, your case against me can be summed up thusly:

"I think you're being insincere, but I can't explain how or why I think that way."
"I think you're gloating, but that's just my personal opinion and I can't prove it at all."
"I don't have to justify my vote."

Fascinating.

UNVOTE: PMysterious
VOTE: Nexus

Don't breathe a sigh of relief just yet, PMysterious. You're still in Mah Fave Five.

I'm going to have to disagree with you here. As far as I can tell you mainly stayed on the fence regarding cj and then begrudginly lynched him.

The "begrudgingly" was because CJ Miller was my #2 lynch choice at the time. I still wanted to lynch Sawyer, which is why I kept my vote on him for so long. (Still do, actually. Him turning into a lurksack over the past few days hasn't made me like him any more.)

The first bit is really weird. I don't get what you mean by stating you don't want him dead straight away. Lynched another day, taken out by a vig? You also still don't have a firm stance on his alignment with another "even if he's town" statement.

That was me covering my butt in case people tried to accuse me of being a bandwagon-jumper. I suppose next you're going to tell me that self-preservation is scummy too.

And indicate here that the main reason you voted him is because you didn't like being called "scummy" for not doing so. Now who would be more worried about being called "scum"?

I addressed a similar concern here and my response is the same now. Call me paranoid if you must, but as I've already pointed out, being lynched is something that both Town

and

Scum players have to worry about. Should I be completely unconcerned about being lynched just because I'm Town? Of course not.

Ok, I'm back from VLA. I need to do a careful re-read, but my initial skim makes me still like an Elmo or Lance or Admiral lynch. Yes, I still want to lynch Elmo's slot even with a replacement coming. More later.

I assume this will be covered in your "More later," but what's your case on ThAdmiral? Even though he wants me dead, he's one of my strongest Town reads at the moment. Perhaps you're seeing something that I'm not.

The more I see of Lance, the more his newness overwhelms me. To out right say he doesn't think scum would bus CJ Miller is way too cute to believe almost.

Eh? Where did I say that?

[Nexus]

Well no, you were being insincere.

But sure, cover up your OMGUS.

[SnakePlissken]

Except for the fact that Prana genuinely had real life issues, and that's an absolutely asinine assumption to make, yeah, great first post back Snake.

Once again you misquote me by not reading what I said. I said that I'm sure that the drop outs are for genuine reasons. But it's easier to drop out if your scum than town in my experience. I've done it myself. Please read my posts properly. Unless you are deliberately trying to Mis rep me?

[Nexus]

Your post says that you have scumreads on Prana and Elmo's slots, both who have dropped out.

Therefore, I took from your post that you believe they are scum, in part due to the fact they have flaked out.

So, where exactly am I misrepping you?

[ThAdmiral]

That was me covering my butt in case people tried to accuse me of being a bandwagon-jumper. I suppose next you're going to tell me that self-preservation is scummy too.

In a way yes. More so because of what mindset you would need to be in to think like you said above. I figure a normal town member would be more than happy to simply express themselves the way they feel without worrying about how it is perceived. Your sentiments (particularly the "covering my butt in case people think..." stuff) indicate that this is primarily what you are worried about. That in turn indicates a scum mentality.

I addressed a similar concern here and my response is the same now. Call me paranoid if you must, but as I've already pointed out, being lynched is something that both Town

and

Scum players have to worry about. Should I be completely unconcerned about being lynched just because I'm Town? Of course not.

You are right of course; it is in no one's best interest to get lynched. But the way you were acting was less "avoiding being lynched" and more "avoiding ANY suspicion if possible". Once again this is more indicative of scum mentality.
Fruthermore I really dislike the (apparently false) softclaim in that post you pointed out. I'd actually forgotten about that so thanks for reminding me!

[I Am Innocent]

Why? Because I thought CJ was town and I wanted scum to have to take a stance on whether it was a policy lynch or not?

Now that he has flipped town, why is this anti-WWE.

Is it because you think I was defending a scummate

?

1 and

2 are really the same question and my answer is yes

.

I kinda prefer a lynch on IaI and

i kinda think he might be from the OPPOSITE team of CJ

. It looked like asking if people were voting CJ more for policy or for scummyness was a way to set up his votes for the next day.

vote: IaI

Yup.

That's the initial vibe I got from him too

and why I feel pretty good about my vote right now.

Per the 4 underline statements above, can you tell me why your story is all of sudden switching?

[I Am Innocent]

Also, why did you never change your RVS vote D1? And why didn't you ever vote CJ?

These two questions are the same also.

I was indifferent about the CJ wagon

. He didn't scream scum but certainly didn't do anything to make me think he was Town. I'd still be ok with a DavidX lynch, tbh, but he didn't take an active role in attempting to stop the CJ lynch and you did. That's what ultimately nudges you ahead of him in my scum list early this morning.

Underlined is exactly what I would have expected from a scummate of CJ avoiding his wagon.

Tell me this, what is your response to the question I answered for you at the end of the day yesterday [where you asked if anyone had seen scum claim VT Day 1]?

It surprised me. But the fact you knew this and still were not on the wagon leaves me even more suspect.

Likely CJ teammate on the wagon: Lance
Likely CJ teammate off the wagon: Yates

Why is that a good place to start? Where do you think his teammates would most likely lie:

1) At the front of his wagon, pushing from the outset?
2) Hopping on when his lynch became inevitable
3) Ignoring the whole situation while pushing other wagons?
4) Actively opposed to it?

I'd say 2 and 3 based on my experience. What do you think?

Hrm. That's a good point. Thanks. I do have to wonder, though: I fall into category #1, but you're voting for me -- why is that?

I see ThAdmiral already answered this. And while your position on the wagon might seem like a 1, you hardly pushed it. I saw you as more of a reluctant 2, or maybe you need your own category. The key is, you seemed very reluctant when you placed that vote, but then today acted like you masterminded the wagon from the beginning.