League of Legends (Old)

[DoubleJD]

So, we're talking about ad carries, so ill give my input.

Vayne is meh at mid elo. Her laning phase is very bad without the 2v1 meta the pros use, so its very hard to farm her out. Late game she can carry teams though with ease.

Draven/Cait: Bad. Neither can survive if someone like Irelia/Khasix/etc go after them. Even up to 1500 elo, ppl dont understand they have to protect the ad carry. So even though you will, yes will, own your lane...you will get shut down HARD late game. Further, the mobility issues of Draven and poor late game kit of cait make them undesirable.

Kog: SHOULD be amazing, but people dont understand to protect the ad carry. You'll get to late game, and your team's cc is wasted doing retarded shit while you get dived by 3 members of the enemy team.

EZ: Lets talk post nerf. Probably still good. You wont auto win your lane anymore, but his team fight presence will still be spectacular. He will remain a solid choice.

Graves: The short range sucks, but his kit is good. He will still be a solid pick.

Corki: I have no idea why, but corki sucks. Ive played him a ton, seen others play him a ton, and he just loses. Idk if thats just because hes picked too much vs EZ atm or what. Theoretically...corki should be good though. (Note lack of corkis in last tournament).

MF: Strong lane, decent late game. Solid pick.

Varus: Strong lane, poor late game. Id say his late game is better than cait/draven due to his R...but really hes meh.

Trist: Her mid game and poor scaling on abilities is whats holding her back. She currently has a difficult lane phase, a bad mid phase, and wont reach end game often enough. If you're gonna suffer, might as well pick vayne.

[DoubleJD]

Further, if you guys arent...i suggest running AD runes. Theyre currently better on the 'best' ad carries due to the upgraded skill damage. Last hitting is nicer too.

[JDodge]

If you're against people equally skilled as you or partially worse, you're going to lose lane off of runes alone. The armor yellows are core. 100% without-a-doubt core.

Here's a site I like to go to often to check out builds, damage, runes etc. This should probably be added to the first page too. Anyways, KoC, you can check on there what a duel will be like vs. another AD. It will not be pretty. Also, the extra AD is usually not going to be worth it compared to if you're facing a Sona, Taric, Corki, etc. because of how much magic damage they will deal. In addition to that, not running armor means you're going to get hit hard in the early game. Hang on. Fuck it. Fuck the arguments.

Here. Graves vs. Graves. The one with regular AD runes on won every time because the line's always positive. The only time he lost was around 20 minutes, I believe, and that was when they both used basic attacks only, which, in regular Graves' fights, isn't going to happen. And it's not just about the AD's. It's about the supports in lane as well as level 1 fights, how the AD and MR will play out when you're against mages or a jungler ganks bot. You have a default of 30 MR and it does not scale on any AD Carry in the game. Keeping that 30 and not using your runes to buff it means you're going to be taking close to true damage from ALL AP mids who aren't going full retard with their runes and build. It means a lot, even though it doesn't seem like it.

Mr. Robot is a fucking joke and anyone who played WoW can attest to that.

[JDodge]

Further, if you guys arent...i suggest running AD runes. Theyre currently better on the 'best' ad carries due to the upgraded skill damage. Last hitting is nicer too.

They're not. They're better for a period in lane wherein you don't have enough damage that the ArPen makes up for the amount less AD you would have than from running AD runes; they're strictly worse beyond the point where you actually start building damage (aka the point AD carries become relevant).

I would suggest people who need AD reds (including myself for a while when I wasn't focusing on it as hard as I should have) to last hit have bigger problems than what runes they are running and should spend more time practicing their mechanics.

[xRECKONERx]

He just said corki sucks, too.

[pickemgenius]

Draven/Cait: Bad. Neither can survive if someone like Irelia/Khasix/etc go after them. Even up to 1500 elo, ppl dont understand they have to protect the ad carry. So even though you will, yes will, own your lane...you will get shut down HARD late game. Further, the mobility issues of Draven and poor late game kit of cait make them undesirable.

Varus: Strong lane, poor late game. Id say his late game is better than cait/draven due to his R...but really hes meh.

Trist: Her mid game and poor scaling on abilities is whats holding her back. She currently has a difficult lane phase, a bad mid phase, and wont reach end game often enough. If you're gonna suffer, might as well pick vayne.

1. No. You're wrong. They're both really good late game(especially Draven holy shit), and both are more than capable of getting away from people if need be.

2. His late game is definitely not better than Cait's or Dravens.

3.Her laning phase is really easy. Her early base damage on her E along with her other burst make her quite a good laner. Vayne is great and all, but Trist lvl 18 703 range, big AS steriod. NOT TOO BAD. Her mid game might be the worst out of anyone in the history of the planet though. So fucking bad.

[xRECKONERx]

And draven has as many late game problems as any other adc except that he becomes a damn hyper carry

[JDodge]

also kind of flinching at the idea that someone with a 1.85 AD ratio on Q'd auto-attacks doesn't scale well into lategame and the idea that someone with a spammable 60% MS steroid has mobility issues

[DoubleJD]

http://lolmatches.com/championstats

Corki currently loses more games than he wins; so i think thats justified :/

Prove otherwise? He isnt picked in tournaments anymore, and is underwhelming compared to many other carries (EZ, Graves, Vayne, Kog). His kit is good, yet he still loses.

As to the reds, we can argue about it i guess. Are you starting boots or blade? Should be boots. If thats the case, you dont have enough damage to kill the caster mininos under a tower in a single shot. I dont disagree that arpen is better late game, but better doesnt mean useful. You probably wont even notice a difference between a full build with arpen reds and without, and probably not mid game either.

Are you guys kidding about the other points? Theres a reason trist, draven, cait etc were not picked at all...

[JDodge]

http://lolmatches.com/championstats

Corki currently loses more games than he wins; so i think thats justified :/

Prove otherwise? He isnt picked in tournaments anymore, and is underwhelming compared to many other carries (EZ, Graves, Vayne, Kog). His kit is good, yet he still loses.

As to the reds, we can argue about it i guess. Are you starting boots or blade? Should be boots. If thats the case, you dont have enough damage to kill the caster mininos under a tower in a single shot. I dont disagree that arpen is better late game, but better doesnt mean useful. You probably wont even notice a difference between a full build with arpen reds and without, and probably not mid game either.

Are you guys kidding about the other points? Theres a reason trist, draven, cait etc were not picked at all...

The reason Trist/Draven/Cait et al aren't picked as often in competitive play is because Corki/Ez/Graves are ridiculously safe.

I am aware I don't have enough damage to kill the caster minions under a tower in a single shot. That is why I hit them once, wait for tower hit, hit them again.

Better does mean useful for AD carries. AD carries are all about carrying the lategame.

[JDodge]

Again, if you need AD reds to last hit under tower, practice your mechanics.

[Flameaxe]

That site shows Anivia with a losing record.

She's trash.

[DoubleJD]

I would appreciate the nonranked player to quit telling the silver/gold guy to practice his mechanics. Its incredibly rude and im getting kinda sick of it.

What is safer than a ad carry that crushes lane like draven? If you're saynig its because hes bad in team fights...you've just reached the point im arguing :3

I highly doubt 2400 elo players cant position well enough to play draven. Therefore, there must be something aside from his early game thats holding him back. That is late game.

[Flameaxe]

BIG MAN, GONNA START A FIGHT.

[esuriospiritus]

ITT: People who hate the idea that they might be wrong about something

[Flameaxe]

B-but...

His elo.

[Brandi]

someone tell me how to play taric pls
I played him once in an ARAM and won, but I swear I was just spamming buttons and didn't know what I was doing.
pls

[scotmany12]

I would appreciate the nonranked player to quit telling the silver/gold guy to practice his mechanics. Its incredibly rude and im getting kinda sick of it.

What is safer than a ad carry that crushes lane like draven? If you're saynig its because hes bad in team fights...you've just reached the point im arguing :3

I highly doubt 2400 elo players cant position well enough to play draven. Therefore, there must be something aside from his early game thats holding him back. That is late game.

What's currently holding him back is that he has no escape, which currently does not fit into the bot lane meta. It's why you see so much Ezreal/Corki/Graves due to their dashes (flash in Ezreals case). Draven is a real terror late game. Go watch aphromoo sometime if you think otherwise.

And before you call someone giving advice rude, maybe you should sit back and consider it. He's right. Armor pen marks add more. If you are using ad marks to last hit, then you really do need to practice your mechanics. And its not like 1500 players have perfect mechanics. Seriously. I mean, you think Draven doesn't have a late game and that Corki sucks. Maybe that's why you can't make platinum.

[JDodge]

I would appreciate the nonranked player to quit telling the silver/gold guy to practice his mechanics. Its incredibly rude and im getting kinda sick of it.

It's incredibly rude to insinuate that I'm a worse player because I don't play solo queue. I Don't Give A Shit™ about solo queue.

Fun fact: You're 1433 now. I was 1473 once, then I realized that solo queue is a worthless exercise in a team game, stopped playing it seriously, and tanked 250 elo off because I kept queueing with the idea that I'd take it supersupersrs and then fail to do so in game. What I do care about is the team game. I regularly lane against 1500ish elo players in team ranked queue, holding my own if not winning my lane most of the time (turns out mid's a pretty popular spot to put your good players, so no clue how I ended up there on my team). And I do that because of the strength of my mechanics - the fact that I know how to last hit under tower is pretty damn good. Don't condescend to me because you're more willing to beat your head against a wall than I am.

What is safer than a ad carry that crushes lane like draven? If you're saynig its because hes bad in team fights...you've just reached the point im arguing :3

The issue is more one of common sense - look at the popular AD carries (Ez, Corki, Graves). They all share one thing in common - they have very, very good mobility tools. Draven is not immobile, and he can crush a lane - the fact that he can crush a lane and relies on flash for an instant escape makes him a pretty damn good gank target. In a higher level of play where the games are decided by who makes the least mistakes, the ability to instantly blink out of a gank more than once every 4 minutes or so is highly rated, because it's a denial of gold to the other team. At a level wherein kills are more frequent, it's a lot less of a concern - you can compensate for it by just killing the other guy over and over again. High level players in high level tournament matches don't get killed over and over again.

Draven will get used a lot more with Ezrael nerfs. We've already seen a lot less of Graves since his nerfs, if the Ez nerfs are significant enough we will see a similar shift away from him.

[JDodge]

someone tell me how to play taric pls
I played him once in an ARAM and won, but I swear I was just spamming buttons and didn't know what I was doing.
pls

Control bushes, land stuns, acquire kills.

[Brandi]

Thanks, haha.
To elaborate on my question, ... I mean like, do I max his heal first or his W first?
Is Frozen Heart really core on Taric over aegis? (I see it everywhere just like with blitz <_<)
All the guides I read say different things. >:I

[pickemgenius]

Max W on Taric. It's so good.

Item builds I will defer to others.

[Flameaxe]

I max w first, build pretty standard support. Never built a frozen heart.

Just because you are in stun range, don't throw it around like its nothing. Taric doesn't actually have mana problems unless you spam your spells. Regen from philo is a-okay.

[Brandi]

Thanks dudes.

[scotmany12]

Thanks, haha.
To elaborate on my question, ... I mean like, do I max his heal first or his W first?
Is Frozen Heart really core on Taric over aegis? (I see it everywhere just like with blitz <_<)
All the guides I read say different things. >:I

I don't play support that much (I'm pretty bad at it), but I believe whether you max W or Q first depends on the lane. If your carry is having trouble then probably Q for the sustain. If not, then probably W.