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Post Post #18350 (ISO) » Mon Mar 11, 2013 12:01 am

Post by TehBrawlGuy »

If I played this game for e-peen, I wouldn't be asking internet peoples for help. lol

I get my jimmies from clutch plays, anyway. I had a support game where we had frozen lane just before tower and their support was camping river, so I couldn't really re-ward it. Surprise Rammus rolls down while I'm in the warded bot river brush and beelines me for what would be an easy kill. (my adc's already under tower) I juke through him with flash, bait him to powerball
just
into tower range, Crescendo his face, Q + Powerchord him, and just watch him melt. I had already flashjuked a lane gank that game, and my ADC was pretty impressed.

That is the best feel.

Edit: Often enough. Mid/top always get called fast, and if I'm last pick because I'm duo with a higher elo friend, it happens. You'd pick Vayne in soloq? I love her to death but I've stayed away from playing her in ranked.
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Post Post #18351 (ISO) » Mon Mar 11, 2013 12:03 am

Post by mykonian »

TehBrawlGuy wrote:
TheButtonmen wrote:
TehBrawlGuy wrote:5) How far would you go to include this on ADCs or assassins?

7) What do you mean?


It's quite simple, don't play ADC's or assassins.

ADC's are literally the worst role to solo queue as because you have no effect on the game for the first fifteen-twenty mins, you're stuck in your lane, you're item reliant and you need your team to peel for you.

Assassins are also pretty bad because it's snowball or bust and they're also extremely item dependent.

If your playing solely to earn ladder points then it's a lot easier to outplay the enemy team then it is to outplay the enemies individually.


In those games where I'm forced into ADC, or I'm late in pick and they have no hard CC for Kat, etc. what should I do?


basic selfreliant adc. Trist, cait, ashe, maaaaybe vayne. Something that can kite oncoming stuff somewhat well/has range to stay out of the ball.

And seen that buttons already answered this: please do not pick urgot. Urgot is great against a certain type of comp (protect the carry) and that's not as prevalent nowadays. Utility mids are less popular (which is a big ON sign for urgot), and the same goes for tanks top. He's somewhat awkward when there are multiple damage sources and there's nothing that is getting protected.
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Post Post #18352 (ISO) » Mon Mar 11, 2013 12:04 am

Post by Ankamius »

TehBrawlGuy wrote:I had a game as Amumu with Ankamius, and I'd land these amazing 4-5 man QRE combos, but we'd still lose the fight. I kept wondering aloud why we were losing fights when I was repeatedly hitting perfect ults. I still don't know exactly why.


It was the timing. I remember noting several times that not everyone on the team was there, or someone was out of position, or something similar. If you're playing some kind of initiation champion, keep very close track of where your team is and keep in mind what they will have to do in order to follow up on your initiation. It's all well and good to catch someone in a bad spot with a bandage, but it's not going to amount to a whole lot if you went over a wall and the rest of your team doesn't have any blinks.

TehBrawlGuy wrote:Oh, man, that game. Another few things that can definitely be learned from that game are that you have literally no excuse for dying in lane, and that you should always, always, try and slow the bleeding, even in an obviously lost lane. I countered myself super-hard in champ select, (was thinking quinn = adc, forgot she was also a bruiser) but I ended up only dying once in lane, and that was on an all-in I had entirely screwed up. Quinn managed to win in CS by a lot, and took my tower, but I managed to entirely prevent her from outputting presence. I let her push waves into turret and got the CS from those that I could, (she could still poke me very easily, even farming under turret) but I just stayed in lane and willingly missed lots of CS to avoid poke. Because I was constantly in lane, I was not behind in levels, and Quinn was pinned there all game while Anakmius snowballed. Quinn didn't snowball (she lost in kills, thanks to Ahri ganks) and still built pretty squishy, so I wrecked her in teamfights by simply flinging her into 4 people and watching her blow up.

It was amazing. Zilean + Singed is also incredibly hilarious.

Having played with me, is there anything on that lists I don't do?


My memory sucks. I remember the general gist of the games, but very little about the details. I don't have replays either, so I can't go back and look.

All I can really suggest is to be critical of what you are doing in a particular instance. If you die in lane, ask yourself what you did to get into that position and how you could have improved on it. If you're playing a squishy carry and you instantly get blown up at the start of a teamfight, figure out exactly what happened to get yourself caught. For example, AD Carries should never be in the middle of the rest of the team unless you're doing research on what exactly causes Malphite to become an unstoppable force.

I know this can be difficult if you don't know what you're looking for, but it should make a good start. If you have trouble with this, ask me to spectate one of your games sometime and I'll take notes. I can't really offer a whole lot when we're playing in the same game since I'm more likely to be focusing on my own mistakes and what caused them. I noticed at least a dozen really retarded things I did in that Ahri game.

EDIT: That quote pyramid looked ugly as hell.

EDIT2: I'd recommend against picking Vayne in solo queue at low levels, especially if you can't be sure your support is on par. Her laning phase is garbage and she's really reliant on getting fed early to be able to snowball fast. She's also unsafe in teamfights unless you're really good at positioning and kiting. If you really want to bully the hell out of your lane opponent, go Tristana or MF. Ezreal and Caitlyn are great for this too.

mykonian wrote:basic selfreliant adc. Trist, cait, ashe, maaaaybe vayne. Something that can kite oncoming stuff somewhat well/has range to stay out of the ball.


Ashe is not self-reliant. She has no escapes and that slow doesn't cut it. She has no real steroids either so she has a harder time standing toe to toe with champions.
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Post Post #18353 (ISO) » Mon Mar 11, 2013 12:16 am

Post by TheButtonmen »

If anyone really felt like grinding elo from the jungle right now I think J4 is probably the strongest choice at the moment he meets all the criteria to be bullshit solo queue jungle annoyance.

-Good ganks
-Good initiation
-Loads of offensive and defensive steroids
-Decent jungle speed
-Lots of build / jungle paths
-Not banned
-Ability to be played in lane
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Post Post #18354 (ISO) » Mon Mar 11, 2013 12:22 am

Post by mykonian »

sorry, ank, you are right. Ashe only works in the cases where the oncoming threat has to walk up to you. Which nowadays doesn't happen so often :(
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Post Post #18355 (ISO) » Mon Mar 11, 2013 12:37 am

Post by TheButtonmen »

Ankamius wrote:I'd recommend against picking Vayne in solo queue at low levels, especially if you can't be sure your support is on par. Her laning phase is garbage and she's really reliant on getting fed early to be able to snowball fast.


Vayne isn't recommended because she's a lane bully, she's recommended because she has an escape with a two second CD, a knockback / stun and post 6 she has one of if not the best escapes of any ADC. She also good because she doesn't need to snowball thanks to her inbuilt steroids (40 ms, 25-55 free AD, silver bolts) which let her still be a threat in the mid-game even if she's behind the opposing ADC.

The fact that she's the second best scaling ADC in the game is really just icing on top.
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Post Post #18356 (ISO) » Mon Mar 11, 2013 1:14 am

Post by Ankamius »

Eh, that is fully situational. You have a definite point if you're not shut down very early in the laning phase, which can be a significant challenge in of itself if you're not very careful. The problem is that she is really easy to shut down. Her only real method of effective poke requires using her Q for the AA reset, which is very dangerous when laning against aggressive supports. It's difficult for her to trade before level 6, and she could be harassed away from the creeps, which can snowball the lane out of her favor unless the jungler ganks or she is able to make a play at level 6. The only real issue there is that she still has issues trading with a lot of other ADCs. Varus, Caitlyn, Tristana, Graves, and Draven are all probably going to win exchanges at level 6, and failing to make a play could just make everything worse.

I don't know, I just feel she's too volatile to being shut down to be a good pick right now for solo queue. Even if she has enough steroids to not be completely worthless in the midgame, being zoned in the early game so easily hurts any ADC really hard, especially one that scales so ridiculously well with items. She doesn't have any wave clear power either, so it's more difficult to come back from a deficit.

I've also had huge problems dealing with multiple people at once in the past with her, likely due to her inability to self-peel except for a long CD single-target knockback.

EDIT: Of course I would only remember this after hitting submit, but Vayne also has the only jump/blink of every ADC that doesn't go over walls. She's definitely safer than Kog'maw, Ashe, or Varus (although the first two can be somewhat debated), but that extra utility could make or break a fight at dragon where the only place you can go to not instantly die is into the dragon pit.
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Post Post #18357 (ISO) » Mon Mar 11, 2013 3:12 am

Post by Brandi »

TheButtonmen wrote:If anyone really felt like grinding elo from the jungle right now I think J4 is probably the strongest choice at the moment he meets all the criteria to be bullshit solo queue jungle annoyance.

-Good ganks
-Good initiation
-Loads of offensive and defensive steroids
-Decent jungle speed
-Lots of build / jungle paths
-Not banned
-Ability to be played in lane


100% agree with this.
I'm duo with my friend right now, he's Silver 5 and I'm Gold 5. I'm picking support (usually Leona or Lulu) and he's picking J4, we have won 90% of our games so far and he's about to finish his promotion series for Silver 4.
He's definitely a decent player, but I feel the J4 pick is just so solid no matter what our teamcomp is otherwise.
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Post Post #18358 (ISO) » Mon Mar 11, 2013 4:26 am

Post by Bub Bidderskins »

I'm a big fan of Ashe, and think she's really under-rated, but I agree that it's hard for her to be safe where every champ is a bruiser/assassin with gap closers. But, on the other hand, her arrow is a great initiation. With virtually every other carry you have to rely on your team to initiate for you, but with Ashe if you see the enemy team in a bad spot you can instantly start a fight.

Regardless, I've found it much harder to carry as an ADC this season. Attack speed is more expensive, and when both team's top/mid/jungle are all about diving the enemy carry (and leaving their carry out to dry), it can make the ADC's life a living hell.
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Post Post #18359 (ISO) » Mon Mar 11, 2013 12:00 pm

Post by Fate »

WHY

WONT

THE

ASHE

FUCKING

ARROW
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Post Post #18360 (ISO) » Mon Mar 11, 2013 12:08 pm

Post by SensFan »

LogicalTautology on League.
(11:04:10 PM) senspizzaline: That's actually my bold prediction for the year
(11:04:19 PM) senspizzaline: Miami finishes 2nd in the AFCE.
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Post Post #18361 (ISO) » Mon Mar 11, 2013 12:10 pm

Post by Fate »

mykonian wrote:
TehBrawlGuy wrote:
TheButtonmen wrote:
TehBrawlGuy wrote:5) How far would you go to include this on ADCs or assassins?

7) What do you mean?


It's quite simple, don't play ADC's or assassins.

ADC's are literally the worst role to solo queue as because you have no effect on the game for the first fifteen-twenty mins, you're stuck in your lane, you're item reliant and you need your team to peel for you.

Assassins are also pretty bad because it's snowball or bust and they're also extremely item dependent.

If your playing solely to earn ladder points then it's a lot easier to outplay the enemy team then it is to outplay the enemies individually.


In those games where I'm forced into ADC, or I'm late in pick and they have no hard CC for Kat, etc. what should I do?


basic selfreliant adc. Trist, cait, ashe, maaaaybe vayne. Something that can kite oncoming stuff somewhat well/has range to stay out of the ball.

And seen that buttons already answered this: please do not pick urgot. Urgot is great against a certain type of comp (protect the carry) and that's not as prevalent nowadays. Utility mids are less popular (which is a big ON sign for urgot), and the same goes for tanks top. He's somewhat awkward when there are multiple damage sources and there's nothing that is getting protected.


AShe is not self-reliant

the fuck I leave this thread for 2mins and mykos in here talking like he knows jack shit
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Post Post #18362 (ISO) » Mon Mar 11, 2013 12:20 pm

Post by Brandi »

Fate wrote:WHY

WONT

THE

ASHE

FUCKING

ARROW

I've heard socio say this so many times when watching ashes. @_@
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Post Post #18363 (ISO) » Mon Mar 11, 2013 12:43 pm

Post by PJ. »

SensFan wrote:LogicalTautology on League.


added.

Fate wrote:
mykonian wrote:
TehBrawlGuy wrote:
TheButtonmen wrote:
TehBrawlGuy wrote:5) How far would you go to include this on ADCs or assassins?

7) What do you mean?


It's quite simple, don't play ADC's or assassins.

ADC's are literally the worst role to solo queue as because you have no effect on the game for the first fifteen-twenty mins, you're stuck in your lane, you're item reliant and you need your team to peel for you.

Assassins are also pretty bad because it's snowball or bust and they're also extremely item dependent.

If your playing solely to earn ladder points then it's a lot easier to outplay the enemy team then it is to outplay the enemies individually.


In those games where I'm forced into ADC, or I'm late in pick and they have no hard CC for Kat, etc. what should I do?


basic selfreliant adc. Trist, cait, ashe, maaaaybe vayne. Something that can kite oncoming stuff somewhat well/has range to stay out of the ball.

And seen that buttons already answered this: please do not pick urgot. Urgot is great against a certain type of comp (protect the carry) and that's not as prevalent nowadays. Utility mids are less popular (which is a big ON sign for urgot), and the same goes for tanks top. He's somewhat awkward when there are multiple damage sources and there's nothing that is getting protected.


AShe is not self-reliant

the fuck I leave this thread for 2mins and mykos in here talking like he knows jack shit


yeah he named a handful of the least self-reliant carries, while leaving off Ezrael, Corki, Graves. It's cool though because Myko is the faux-est of sages and anyone taking him semi-seriously is bronze league.
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Post Post #18364 (ISO) » Mon Mar 11, 2013 12:44 pm

Post by Ankamius »

Fate wrote:AShe is not self-reliant

the fuck I leave this thread for 2mins and mykos in here talking like he knows jack shit


This point had already been rebutted and he has accepted that he was wrong.
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Post Post #18365 (ISO) » Mon Mar 11, 2013 1:09 pm

Post by Fate »

You have to reinforce how wrong he is

its the only way they learn
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Post Post #18366 (ISO) » Mon Mar 11, 2013 1:44 pm

Post by Jahudo »

Alright Lulu is free this week. I'll have to get some practice with her.
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Post Post #18367 (ISO) » Mon Mar 11, 2013 2:24 pm

Post by Brandi »

253 IP for win of the day with ranked. That's pretty good.
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Post Post #18368 (ISO) » Mon Mar 11, 2013 2:26 pm

Post by Brandi »

Jahudo wrote:Alright Lulu is free this week. I'll have to get some practice with her.

Good luck! Try to practice silencing key targets with her W during teamfights, of if the enemy jungler is around while taking dragon/baron make sure to silence them when it's smitable so they don't smite-steal.
Oh, and use W on your ADC when chasing instead of W on the enemy
unless
its someone with a million escapes.
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Post Post #18369 (ISO) » Mon Mar 11, 2013 2:34 pm

Post by Matias »

Is mid Sona a thing? Did some pro decide to play it? Because I was in a ranked game where first pick (mid) picked Sona right from under me and I was furious

until she went 8/0/2 in lane and decimated the other team. is this an actual thing and why am I just finding this out

I hit continue by accident but the matchup was

Me (Alistar Bot)
Vayne, Wukong, Jax jungle and Sona mid against Ryze mid, Darius top, Taric/Cait bot and Kha'Zix jungle

I'm just kind of lost, I didnt know her Q did that much damage
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Post Post #18370 (ISO) » Mon Mar 11, 2013 2:44 pm

Post by Brandi »

Just because you win with something in a ranked game doesn't mean it's a good idea, especially not at lower ELO's.
I mean, it's not really viable, but like just about everyone if they get fed they can be very strong. Sona with lots of AP has strong heals and poke, but she can't 100-0 anyone like say, LB or Annie or Lux.
It can be good in some situations/comps but I wouldn't recommend it generally.
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Post Post #18371 (ISO) » Mon Mar 11, 2013 2:46 pm

Post by Matias »

Brandi wrote:Just because you win with something in a ranked game doesn't mean it's a good idea, especially not at lower ELO's.
I mean, it's not really viable, but like just about everyone if they get fed they can be very strong. Sona with lots of AP has strong heals and poke, but she can't 100-0 anyone like say, LB or Annie or Lux.
It can be good in some situations/comps but I wouldn't recommend it generally.


This is what I was thinking. Everyone kind of acted like I had 3 heads when I expressed my frustration at the pick
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Post Post #18372 (ISO) » Mon Mar 11, 2013 3:57 pm

Post by TehBrawlGuy »

She can nearly 100-0. Q > LB Powerchord AA > Ult > Q is a kill.
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Post Post #18373 (ISO) » Mon Mar 11, 2013 4:02 pm

Post by Bub Bidderskins »

I once had a game where I was queued up with three friends and I picked Sona support. Our ADC (who was the random) never connected, and so I played AP Sona 2v1 bot. It's pretty hilarious when your Q hits for a bunch of damage late game. The funny part about that game was that we ended up winning it because the other team was so bad (and also because mummy ult and then sona ult is stupid).
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Post Post #18374 (ISO) » Mon Mar 11, 2013 4:06 pm

Post by Brandi »

TehBrawlGuy wrote:She can nearly 100-0. Q > LB Powerchord AA > Ult > Q is a kill.

Yes but that's really late game. The AP carries I mentioned can 100-0 by level 6 with little to no items.
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