Newbie 1381 Oakhaven is Overrun Game Over

[talah]

AtE

[talah]

Point is, jaymo, if you want people to believe you're incompetent, I'm happy to go along with that.

[Honey bee]

Thank you Rach! Unfortunate you have to mod in those circumstances :(.

@HB: Last try. I'm appealing to your sense of reason. Occam's Razor. If you identify the scum you don't need to go complicating things further if the facts fit the theory exactly, and if the theory was born of facts in the first place.
Tybalt has been so incautious and seemingly distracted I would say he thinks he can explain his way out of whatever he says (eg impulsive gut decisions). The others are fairly advanced players who have a certain cautiousness of playstyle anyway, but have been able to expand on their thinking when pressed.

I am a bit confused. I don't think my thoughts about tybalt are too complicated; What I am examining is his reads and nothing much more than that. Being incautious and seemingly distracted doesn't have much of an effect on my read on him, and I feel that is more of his personality than alignment based.

I sound like a broken record, but if you look at his vote history and his reads, you will find the inconsistencies that point tybalt towards scum. Mala pointed out the problem in his first vote. His second vote I pointed out the hypocrisy in his accusations against jmo. His defense of that vote, where he accuses me of avoiding discussing jmo (which I did later in the post) and how he states that being hypocritical does not mean his arguments are invalid, is such an awful shift of accusation. Tybalt never really explained how his vote was justified. Also look at that defense post (where I'm accused of not acknowledging his points about jmo) and his town read of jmo, moving his vote to greywing. Only a 30 post gap, in which jmo makes no post that should give jmo a town read. Plus, I think voting someone because they had a gut read on someone is bad as well. Compared to his accusation on jmo, he barely says anything about grey, or even why gut reads are scummy, or any good reason on why he changed his mind. If I were to make a guess, tybalt probably fell off the wagon because you put him at L-2. As I said earlier, scum prefer to lynch without being on the wagon.
I know I'm pretty stubborn, but I notice you people are at least conceding on some of my points, so there has to be some truth to it.

I'm interested in a Hyperion lynch. I already prodded you for the reasons you had a scum read on jmo, but to come in to vote him around deadline and ignore all the information (info that differed from your original read) about mothrax's and jmo's cases against each other makes me think you are the one who is coasting on the jmo wagon. Also I'm not a fan of how you offer to hammer in post 290 and later in post post 351 state you're going to read and decide where to place your vote. Why exactly were you in a rush to hammer him?
Also you ignored my other question and that hurt my feelings >:(.

What do you like about Tybalt's analysis? I've made a couple of posts about his analysis. Do you disagree with me?

O Baby Jaymo, you must be so sweeeeepy!

Stop it.

[talah]

HB, look at the evidence. JMO's done nothing (recently) but act crazy and throw down AtE's and pretend he doesn't know what's happening. Tell me, objectively, is that pro-town play?

Sorry for the shortness of my response, I'll get back to the rest soon. Briefly regarding Tybalt, I think he's fallen for the hard emotional tactics too. Look at the context of where he placed his vote on grey, an the discussion between JMO and I that preceded it. I fell for it too, btw.

[jmo16mla]

Me getting pissed off at you and wanting you out of this game, isn't appeal to emotion. It's me wanting someone who is mature enough not to troll. Recently I have been asking people for reads on who they will go after tomorrow, getting others to take stances. I've done a LOT more recently than I had all game. So, that argument is invalid.

[talah]

He's actually quite a masterful player. But the veil has been lifted from my eyes. Quite an appropriate tack for the game theme, actually.

[jmo16mla]

This isn't related to the game^!!!

[tybalt]

I'm sorry, I'll catch up, but I'll be V/LA until tues. Sorry again.

[talah]

Catching scum, isn't flailing hun. Don't be so butt hurt.

Mature? Trolling?

[jmo16mla]

In no way is that trolling?

[talah]

It's a game of Mafia, not a Disney theme park.

[jmo16mla]

Mala, your opinion on talah?

Gen, your opinion on talah?

Talah, your opinion on gen?

[talah]

Keep flailing. Don't be so butt-hurt douchebag. Scum caught.

[talah]

AI HAIZ CAUGHT TEH SCUMZ IN MAI FIRSTEST GAIM!!!1!!!!111

[jmo16mla]

Talah, your opinion on gen?

[talah]

@Hyper: Regarding Grey, scratch that request, I should review it for myself. Maybe I can run a couple things past you later..

[talah]

I'm sorry, I'll catch up, but I'll be V/LA until tues. Sorry again.

/acknowledge
You know I sent a one-way PM to the mod asking if he was okay in RL after that outburst? What a piece of work huh try to see the humour in it if ya can.

[Gen_Wolf]

Mala, your opinion on talah?

Gen, your opinion on talah?

Talah, your opinion on gen?

Talah is an interesting species. Firstly, he is set on you, quite romantic infact, maybe you should date. Jokes. Seriously though, it is quite hard to get a read on Talah let a lone anyone else because this game has become centered around JMO and Talah's argument and in my opinion for this game to move forward one of the two of you have to be lynched. I think Talah is more newb than scum. He, however, is very stubborn and thus has almost tunneled you. In a way I think he got his first scum read on you and from then on forgotten about the other players in the game. An example of this is where you asked him to give an analysis on me but he has ignored it.

To sum up I would say Talah is newb town.

I also feel the dispute between you two is becoming more personal than professional. Thus, if the game is to move forward one of you two have to go. Else day two is going to be a complete fucking dog show as day 1 has become.

[talah]

either you are working on some higher level thinking or this just makes no sense
muddled double think
You are a very strange player, talah
double-thinking, and a lot of strange side comments
the village noob
you should look over tybalt and maybe vote him
I believe he's more of a dumb townie...It doesn't look like an act
Do you wanna pressure him or not?
Oh your avatar is so appropriate Talah. You are very energetic.
I am a bit confused. I don't think my thoughts about tybalt are too complicated
Stop it.

QFT.

Why should I hold JMO to different standards than anyone else simply because he adopts a persona?

@HB: You know my thinking's evolved a bit throughout this game and I no longer think that the reasons I stated earlier are good reasons for a 'strong town read'.

Combined with the above, I'd say that gives you a 'null' read at best. Not hammering JMO long before deadline when he's obviously anti-town and just making things harder for everyone, makes me withhold my read until I learn the reason. The simpler you can manage to keep it please, the better.

@Mala: Please also explain what the delay or reason for withholding was or is.

Grey has of course currently backed JMO and is free to change his mind, as is anyone as long as they can explain it, and Tybalt gets a pass until he feels like coming back after all the attacks on him.

Both Grey and Tybalt now have null reads until I get around to reviewing their perspectives in the light of day. Which may take a while.

@Gen: (ninja'd) I'm backing my assessment of the situation but I agree. I'm not here to make besties with everyone, but the AtEs and absolute garbage are such a mindfuck and I don't know how to put that politely.

Maybe I should just sub out or self-hammer or something.

[talah]

Fuckit - never one to shy away from a rash decision or two.

VOTE: talah

And this one's to relieve the pressure.

[talah]

..oops autocorrect

VOTE: jarmo

V/LA till Saturday

[Honey bee]

Tell me, objectively, is that pro-town play?

Wrong. Anti-town =/= Scum. And I already told you slots are useful no matter how difficult they are to work with. If I were to advocate policy lynching you'd both be gone forever ago.

Briefly regarding Tybalt, I think he's fallen for the hard emotional tactics too. Look at the context of where he placed his vote on grey, an the discussion between JMO and I that preceded it. I fell for it too, btw.

Wrong again. Don't make assumptions and put words in other peoples mouths, tybalt needs to answer for himself. It still stands that he unvoted for no good reason.

Not hammering JMO long before deadline when he's obviously anti-town and just making things harder for everyone, makes me withhold my read until I learn the reason.

Wow really. The reasons why everything is so difficult is that you're both slapfighting each other and making this game full of crap posts irritating each other. I'm want to vote people who I think is scum, thank you very much. If you want to get someone to hammer for you, why don't you ask mala who has been implying jmo is scum but has never actually voted him. Otherwise you'll just have to be patient, as I won't vote him until I have to.

[Malakittens]

I promise.. I will be getting to this tonight.

[jmo16mla]

Hyper, where did you go?

[talah]

@all Sorry for the shithouse posts above.

@jmo Are you able to put on your pure-IC hat and clarify whether 'suicide-townie' is a valid play in these newb games? That is, a town role which can act as scum by intentionally lying in order to trap scum.

Have seen other (non-referenced) threads say 'the site frowns on lying if you are VT' which is what caused me to go to such lengths to try and poke holes in the logic of what you were saying.

If the answer is 'yes it is' then I actually have NFI whether you are scum or not anymore and will sheep Gen, Mala, and HB and possibly Grey who I would have second thoughts on if the role was valid.