Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone Mafia Game Over

[Amrun]

Why didn't highlight yourself green..?

Also, chainsaw doesn't mean what you think it means.

[penguin_alien]

Page 1: Mostly RVS. Saint tries to move it out of RVS, which is a fairly protown move. Penguin attacks him for this, which is strange. Ghost sits on the fence, which looks really bad.

Yes, moving things out of RVS is all to the good, protown, etc. But it's not hard to fake as scum, nor is it a pass to excuse scummy behavior in doing so. He implied his vote was serious, but the reason wasn't anything that struck me as moving toward relevant scum hunting. It was forced, trying too hard to look protown for exactly what you cite: the protowniness of moving things out of RVS. I wasn't attacking him for moving out of RVS, it was the way he did it.

Page 2: In retrospect something sits odd about FBN’s 27. Ghost attacks both p_a and saint, although this sits off with me:

To the point, I sort kinda agreed about Saint's #8, if pseudo serious, is reaching but doesn't really warrant and actual vote on him from PA.

It’s RVS. Something that seems even a little bit off should be attacked. That’s how you generate information. Ghost is basically saying “I think Saint looks bad but not bad enough for someone to pressure the issue,” even though it’s not like there’s any other way to get the game off the ground.

And here you say one should attack anything that seems off in RVS, but I'm scummy for doing that. Contradiction.

Mac towns it up in his attack on me, imo. Seems like town Mac. Saint starts raging. Pretty much everyone starts pressuring Saint, in the following order: Ghost, Mhork, DV, Doc Pepper, penguin. Penguin also responds with a fairly substantial wall, but she does, however, post a touch fluff content to FBN, while her content to ghost, saint, and myself is all pretty spot on with 0 fluff. FBN then responds with a terrible read (DV scumread at any point in the game was actually terrible and anyone who had that should feel aweful). Safety Dance also posts good content.

IIOA. And I'll address this here, since it seems to form a lot of your commenting on me. No, I don't post a lot of fluff, but I'm not completely devoid of a sense of fun. I'm not sure if it's a question of me having more time to post some fluff here relative to the other site where we play, but unless you think there's something FBN was saying that was any content to reply to, I don't see your point.

Even I wouldn't want to see Saint lynched at all now without interaction between players, nor would I see PA lynched.

This is very fast from “don’t like PA” to “no-lynch.”

It's page 4. Do you really think there's anything off about wanting more content down before lynching?

Penguin’s response to RQS is strange. Why bother, it just wastes space. Additionally, the way she questions me is really cautious. She’s not outright attacking me, but trying to poke holes in my game and gauge what I feel. There is a lot of scum motivation in this. Town want to yell about different reads and try to figure out which is true. Scum want to try to sheep consensus as much as possible to induce minimal fighting. She then attacks Saint on the “scum want to blend in” grounds based on something Saint said that was very obviously town-motivated (town want to push for lynches that are optimal for both chance of scumflip and ability to actually make the lynch happen). Saint tries to put together a town-block, which is a protown move.

Again, it's page 4. The game isn't at the point of having a lynch go through, so the idea of prioritizing voting for someone only if the lynch can go through is just an excuse not to follow through. If we were at a day to deadline and had to compromise lynch, sure,. And you say he's trying to put a town voting block together--show me where he does this on or before page 4.

Regarding the fluffy RQS, see the above WRT my posting fluff. And again, my meta here is different . On the other site, we have five days per phase if we're lucky, and the median per person post number is 2 or 3. I have to be provocative to try to get anything out of them when they do post. Here, I'm more inclined to engage in dialogue sometimes with people I'm trying to read.

Page 5: The way FBN talks about DV is strange:

I'm seriously hoping DV isn't scum again.

[….]

DV i'm not too sure about. I'm iffy there.

This lacks good trajectory.

Meaning...?

FBN fencesits on reading me in response to letters’ townreading me, but doesn’t give anything as to why he’s unsure about me.

Saint (4)- Lord Mhork, penguin_alien, SafetyDance, Ghostlin

Early wagon forms on Saint over p_a despite saint making the earlier pro-town move to start the tiff and saint generally scumhunting and taking overtly pro-town moves. Chance of CBD or Ghost being scum seems pretty high from this.

Why does making a pro-town move in a scummy way absolve him of suspicion here?

If he and Lord Mhork are scum together, they're doing a pretty kick-ass job. Lord Mhork seems to be tunneling pretty narrowly so far, although I don't think I agree with the idea that him pointing out all the scumminess from Saint is scummy in turn--it's not his job to point out the towny things someone does if he thinks he's caught scum. And if he was, it would make me think he was getting ready to undermine his own case, indicating he didn't believe in it.

There is solid scum motivation behind each of these sentences. First one looks like an attempt to set up doubt about the towniness of DV to potentially setup a mislynch later, because leaving him uncontested would result in him being a universal townread. Second and third ones are penguin saying, “town shouldn’t show nuance of thought when making cases. Uncertainty is bad” when everything in this game is probabilistic and including counterpoints adds nuance to cases.

First sentence is a descriptive way to indicate that I don't see DV and Lord Mhork As scum together. And you specifically asked me what I thought of them together, so way to misrepresent how my comment came into being. And as for the rest of the paragraph, my point was that if you're pressuring someone, you don't give them a backdoor to blow off that pressure, not that town shouldn't maintain a view of shades of grey.

Page 6: Holy fuck Jake’s first reads are horrific, and his early DV push is obviously bad. Ghost calls out letters for waffling when Ghost has done the same, just with more nuance. Ghost chainsaws DV in response to Jake’s “nice omgus” comment, which is bad because it indicates scum trying to read to far into town intent.

What Amrun said. Plus not following your point.

Okay I’m out of time for now. From the first 6 pages I want to say scum are most likely Ghost/penguin/FBN, although that third one is a lot weaker. Mhork looks really bad without the mason claim, but I still think the mason claim is legit and scum are banking on town doubting it tomorrow. Saint is fairly obviously town, and the early pressure was largely unjustified.

Also, in case someone decides to hammer before I can work through the rest of the game, scum not killing Rach/Mhork is not alignment-indicative for them. It’s probably LyLo tomorrow on a mislynch, which means that, if the mason claim is legit, it’s better for scum to leave doubt in play as to whether the mason claim is a gambit than it is to have a conf-townie going in.

Re: pseudo-masons--yes...are you trying to coach your scummates or muddy the waters with WIFOM.

As much as it might be entertaining to see you go through a 34 page thread like this, how is it really helpful? Are you changing your opinions as a result? Are you bringing up new points that make a case? Because this looks like scum hoping to find something to pin on anyone else. What is your response to the things we who are voting you think are scummy?

[Amrun]

Honestly I don't understand how anyone town an highlight unconfirmed masons and not themselves.

But I want him to finish, so I'll wait.

[Amrun]

The dead qt is worth a read for some laughs.

[Amrun]

Er. Wrong thread, obviously.

[Lord Mhork]

BRO, your wall is unimpressive and doesn't change my desire to lynch you...

[fuzzybutternut]

BRO, your wall is unimpressive and doesn't change my desire to lynch you...

This.

Also, Amrun, yes, it most certainly was worth a read.

[Saint]

i need to catch up

[Lord Mhork]

To elaborate, BRO, it's just a ton of IIOA. Who should we lynch? Why? Where is the scum?

[RachMarie]

yeah not that impressive there Bro.

[BROseidon]

Since first method was not well received, going to do a lot shorter of a version and save myself time.

Scumlist from most to least likely scum:

Ghost: A lot of his shit has been terrible and he’s basically lurked away all pressure the past few days. It’s bullshit that you are all letting him get away with this shit.

Penguin: Has done nothing useful but deathtunnel me from day 1 and only is really interacting with me. I know I can’t win a 1v1 here but you guys need to wake up and realize that penguin is playing you all.

FBN: Jake was the only person who applied any pressure to FBN on day one, and then Jake ends up dead. FBN’s scumhunting has been more fluff than actual scumhunting.

CDB: Has been overtly pro-town, but has mysteriously disappeared today. Am actually a bit concerned by his lack of recent activity, because it could indicate scum trying to stay away from a mislynch

Amrun: Push today is bad, which makes me think that he’s town. I don’t think scum would so aggressively push me knowing that I’ll flip town.

Saint: Day 1 was very protown, nothing has struck me as odd since then

Masons: Are probably masons.

You can proceed to lynch me now. I deserve this loss as much as the rest of the town

[Amrun]

Why didn't you highlight yourself green?

[BROseidon]

Because I'm only confirmed town to myself.

[penguin_alien]

Er, today I've mostly interacted with you because you're my top scum suspect and you have repeatedly ignored the cases presented on you. On earlier days I had more things to say to others. Unfortunately both days' lynch wagons reached the end of the road at times when personal circumstances prevented me posting. And I'm not following: how is Amrun aggressively pushing you today townie where my push is scummy?

The one thing I do agree on is that Ghostlin needs to get in here. He's gone right past lurking into outright not being here, and ending the day before he speaks up is unacceptable.

And you didn't find Saint's Day Two quickhammer to be odd? Without asking for a claim?

[fuzzybutternut]

Welp.
I'm fairly confident he's scum now.

[BROseidon]

Yes, moving things out of RVS is all to the good, protown, etc. But it's not hard to fake as scum, nor is it a pass to excuse scummy behavior in doing so. He implied his vote was serious, but the reason wasn't anything that struck me as moving toward relevant scum hunting. It was forced, trying too hard to look protown for exactly what you cite: the protowniness of moving things out of RVS. I wasn't attacking him for moving out of RVS, it was the way he did it.

Any first-move out of RVS is going to be to some degree forced. There is no organic way to move out of RVS other than a claim.

And here you say one should attack anything that seems off in RVS, but I'm scummy for doing that. Contradiction.

What you attacked was no longer in RVS.

IIOA. And I'll address this here, since it seems to form a lot of your commenting on me. No, I don't post a lot of fluff, but I'm not completely devoid of a sense of fun. I'm not sure if it's a question of me having more time to post some fluff here relative to the other site where we play, but unless you think there's something FBN was saying that was any content to reply to, I don't see your point.

Your fluff was directed to one specific person who has also largely contributed fluff. It would be one thing if you generally had a high amount of fluff (like Rach tends to), but you don’t have a lot. You have a little and I’m pointing out how you awkwardly only have fluff with respect to one person.

It's page 4. Do you really think there's anything off about wanting more content down before lynching?

No, but there is to moving someone to a “will not lynch” list.

Again, it's page 4. The game isn't at the point of having a lynch go through, so the idea of prioritizing voting for someone only if the lynch can go through is just an excuse not to follow through. If we were at a day to deadline and had to compromise lynch, sure,. And you say he's trying to put a town voting block together--show me where he does this on or before page 4.

1) Because having only your vote on someone is a good way to pressure them at any point in the game. Wait…

2)

AA + BUTTERNUT, VOTING BLOC? PLZ? Seriously, I think you're both town with me, and we can get something done. Tentatively adding Deasvail to that list, because I like how offtopic she was reacting to Dr.P in glancing because where Dr.P bolded it I saw it already... it COULD be read as parroting, but I actually get townie vibes from that clubbing comment... just so out of place for a harry potter game, that I don't see it as scum

Meaning...?

FBN’s internal thought process is disjointed. He moves from “I’m seriously hoping DV isn’t scum again [because I think you are town]” to “DV I’m not too sure about. I’m iffy there

” The trajectory of the thought process, how it moves, is artificial.

First sentence is a descriptive way to indicate that I don't see DV and Lord Mhork As scum together. And you specifically asked me what I thought of them together, so way to misrepresent how my comment came into being. And as for the rest of the paragraph, my point was that if you're pressuring someone, you don't give them a backdoor to blow off that pressure, not that town shouldn't maintain a view of shades of grey.

You’ve attacked me for indirect phrasing as well. We’ll call it even:

Also, how is pointing out non-scummy things giving them a back door out?

Re: pseudo-masons--yes...are you trying to coach your scummates or muddy the waters with WIFOM

I am not dodging the lynch today. The point of doing this is so town can read this tomorrow once my opinions are validated by my flip.

[BROseidon]

how is Amrun aggressively pushing you today townie where my push is scummy?

The one thing I do agree on is that Ghostlin needs to get in here. He's gone right past lurking into outright not being here, and ending the day before he speaks up is unacceptable.

And you didn't find Saint's Day Two quickhammer to be odd? Without asking for a claim?

You've been on me on and off from day one. Amrun just joined in today.

And everything about letters's wagon has me confused.

[BROseidon]

Welp.
I'm fairly confident he's scum now.

Be useful.

Oh wait you're scum so you wont

[Lord Mhork]

Ugh. This is where I doubt my reads.... :c

[RachMarie]

Stay strong my brother ♥

[fuzzybutternut]

Welp.
I'm fairly confident he's scum now.

Be useful.

Oh wait you're scum so you wont

I am useful.
You're redirecting.
Town doesn't do that.

[BROseidon]

Yes, town does not try to push suspicion onto scumreads.

Wait...

[fuzzybutternut]

Umm..
you should have been doing that long time ago, bud.

[BROseidon]

I have been for most of the game.

More than you.

[fuzzybutternut]

Whatever helps you sleep at night, Bro.