Xenogears Mafia (Game Over)

[zMuffinMan]

Hey muffin, while it isn't indicative of much: Remember when I said scum were really good at picking up breadcrumbs, and now with Mala as a scum role blocker, having role blocked me night 1? Yeah, I'm pretty certain they picked up on the claim.

yes, if scum was telling the truth (

and i have no reason to believe that scum wouldn't be 100% truthful in any claims they make

) then they may have picked up on your crumbs.

[BROseidon]

part of me really wants us to have a mass claim today

Bad idea is bad. We should hold off a few more days before we claim.

[BROseidon]

err, massclaim >.>

[zMuffinMan]

are you still reassessing your reads or something, bro?

[BROseidon]

Naw, I'm thinking Desp/Aj/Nacho now. TF still isn't rubbing me the right way, but I'm solidly townreading the rest of the game.

Trying to decide which of those three I want to wagon most now.

[waynegg]

Flavor isn't really indicative of roles... Look at Andrius' flip (I'm not quite sure what her role was, but it wasn't standard).

15. RachMarie, Krelian,

Mad Scientist of the Solaris Empire

, was lynched Day 1.
17. Sound of Silence, Seraphita,

Vanilla Townie of the Nisan Alliance

, was killed Night 1.
11. Saki, Sigurd Harcourt,

Vanilla Townie of the Nisan Alliance

, was killed Night 1.
13. nickthename, Maria Balthasar,

Vanilla Townie of the Nisan Alliance

, was lynched Day 2.
3. BeautyAndTheBeast, Emeralda Kasim,

Vanilla Townie of the Nisan Alliance

, was killed Night 2.
12. Malakittens, Miang Hawwa,

Ancient Seductress of the Solaris Empire

, was lynched Day 3.
9. mastin2, Bartholomew Fatima,

Pirate Regent of the Nisan Alliance

, was killed Night 3.

1. Andy hasn't flipped.

2. Who's talking about flavor?? I'm talking about roles. Everything bolded was their role, not their flavor.

Mad Scientist= assigns passive roles
VT= duh
Ancient Seductress= Roleblocker and 1x redirect
Pirate Regent= Mason and 1x JK

An Inquisitor is a defined role, which is factional kill and cult leader. All you peeps trying to make it sound like I'm talking about flavor are pushing wifom.

pedit solidly, huh?

[Faster Than Light]

TD VWNMAR tOWN

no other alterations

nacho i hope you didnt draw a scum role too

</3

[waynegg]

i am not reading that, wayne

just trust me as you once did
the ring must go to frodo

I'm trying really hard to trust you here, even though you opened here pretty much how you opened there.

[waynegg]

Try trusting me. There's been a whole lot of unexplained 180s this game that getting hit by an Inquisitor as defined by the mafiawiki would explain.

[zMuffinMan]

i think you're spending too much time getting caught up in the role name. it's possible that bork didn't realise that there was already an "inquisitor" role. since there's no third parties in this game, i don't really see why you're making a big deal out of this.

i'm inclined to believe the claim because venmar dropped like 69 crumbs about it D1, and further crumbed his investigations.

[Faster Than Light]

I'm sorry if this is jumping the gun a bit, Metal Sonic, but I've decided we should finally reveal everything.

i would like to hear claims from desperado and FTL. those two are the only two people i want claims from today. possibly Nacho too.

also i have absolutely no idea who mastin was with. someone spell it out for me

Already softed, guess it's time to spell it out.

I am Jesiah Black. My power is a non-consecutive Vanilla Cop. I investigated Nacho on N1, and the result was Vanilla, hence my gambit the other day (if Nacho claimed anything but Vanilla, I'd know he was lying). Last night, I investigated Trust Fund. The result was not Vanilla.

That said, there's way too many fucking claimed and softed PRs for them all to be town.

I think Mastin was onto this pretty early, as evidenced by his 1329. We've gotten two scum PRs so far, too. The remaining scum are either PRs to balance out town's power, or they are Vanilla and some people are lying. Regardless, I think there's scum among the claimed PRs of ours. Here's my current list;

Aj The Epic - Claimed one-shot BP.
Andrius - Claimed Supersaint.
BROseidon - ???
Desperado - ???
Faster Than Light - Claimed VanillaCop.
Ghostlin - Soft claimed ???
Mac - Claimed Neighborizer.

Malakittens - Confirmed Roleblocker/1-shot Redirect

mastin2 - Confirmed Mason/1-shot JK

Nachomamma8 - Claimed Vanilla, my role confirms he's either VT or Goon.

notscience - Confirmed Innocent Child.

Rach Marie - Confirmed Mad Scientist

waynegg - Claimed Vig.
TiphaineDeath - ???
Trust Fund - NOT VANILLA (I think he softed a claim, too)
dopog - Claimed PGO
zMuffinMan - ???

WHAT DOES THIS MEAN, FASTER THAN LIGHT?

Metal Sonic and I have been discussing this because we're really damn confused as to why scum would kill out of the pool of people who are VT/not claimed. This makes us believe that Scum has already claimed their roles long ago and are actively trying to expose and kill other claimed players. The density of claimed PRs is far too damn high for them all to be town. We've already lynched two scum PRs, and given how many PR claims there are, I'm pretty sure that the whole scum team has power roles. Either that or there's town and/or scum lying about having a PR. Regardless, claimed PRs are people I'm most suspicious of right now.

That said, Mac, you asking for me and Nacho to claim is really suspect. Neighborizer? Sounds like a good scum claim to me, especially if your neighbor is just scum with you. Hell, I was a scum neighborizer in Calvin and Hobbes Mafia, so my only real exposure to the role is seeing it as scum. You've been taking a real distanced approach to play all of this game, so, if anything, all of this boils together to make you one of my biggest suspects for D3.

VOTE: Mac

[Trust Fund]

I fully claimed oneshot vanillizer, and mac has been cop cleared, varsoon.....

[zMuffinMan]

that is derpy on so many levels. so many more levels than i care to talk about.

just to be clear, goons would show up as vanilla to you, right?

[zMuffinMan]

(1) you did not need to claim
(2) asking nacho to claim because if he claimed anything but VT you'd know he was lying is stupid
(3) investigating a CLAIMED NON-VANILLA is stupid
(4) i agree there's too many claimed PRs (because people are claiming PRs like it's the cool thing to do) but i don't think that necessarily means there's scum in the claimed PRs. if there is, it's not mac.
(5) guessing why scum would kill certain players is fucking dumb. especially since

some of the claimed or soft-claimed PRs must be town and they're intentionally ignoring them

HINT: YOU ARE ONE OF THE PEOPLE WHO SOFT-CLAIMED EARLY

(6) i seriously doubt the whole scum team has PRs, and if they actually do, that just means it's more likely town has adequate power to fight this (WHICH BLOWS A FUCKING HOLE IN YOUR THEORY THAT THERE ARE TOO MANY CLAIMED PRS)
(7) mac vote reasoning is horrible. just because scum

can be

neighbourisers, doesn't mean mac is a scum neighbouriser.

i'm probably missing some other places that was entirely derpy but those are just the obvious places

[zMuffinMan]

i think the most hilarious thing about it is that you were asked to claim by the person you apparently think is scum and you were like, "welp, gotta do it"

[notscience]

Regardless of his claim, he does have a point about the pr-density.

I think Muffin is town.

[Faster Than Light]

I be trippin, then.

Well, at the most, I can confirm that you are a PR.

There's plenty of things that could still make Mac's cop-clear not truthful. For instance, if the cop isn't a cop, or if the copping was redirected, or if Mac is a PR that investigates as town, or...

You get the picture.

I give a whole lot less of a shit of people's PRs than I do about their play. You're not confirmed town or scum until the mod says so.



Anyway, to get to Muffin's retort:

It doesn't blow a hole in shit. If there's a lot of scum PRs, and ergo Town PR to balance it, it makes sense that scum is among the claimed PRs, doesn't it?

But, fine, I'm a dumbass and my reasons for doing anything are terrible. Fuck me, I guess.

I'm not going to stop playing the game, though.

-V

[Faster Than Light]

Muffin, give me a reason for why scum would ignore the claimed PRs, especially all the way until D4.

What do you think about how the kills and claims have been going?

[Antihero]

Regardless of his claim, he does have a point about the pr-density.

not really

the two scum that have already flipped are juiced up scum PRs; I think this is a role-heavy game

that said, there is a very high probability that one or two of the claimed PRs are scum, but that's just because in any certain X set of people, there's probably a scumbag (you could define X as the list of people on a certain wagon or the list of people with usernames that start with a vowel).

Regardless, we're not lynching a claimed PR today and we aren't lynching a cop clear.

@Varsoon: Well, scum have ignored the mod-confirmed town up to this point, not sure why you're belaboring this point...

[Faster Than Light]

And it's a misrep to say that I claimed solely because Mac asked me to.

It's obvious that the PR density was becoming something more and more jarringly awkward, and so I wanted to clear up any confusion there would be about my role and a few others. In fact, my ability directly clears up confusion over the truthfulness of claims, which is something I've worried about all game.

Now isn't the time to be softing anything, and I was planning to claim today anyway. I was hoping to get results that showed players were lying, but the results I've gotten so far can give some damn clarity, which is good in preventing mislynches.

Also-also, yes, as Bork explained to me, my power confirms if someone is Vanilla (has no abilities outside of factional ones) or is Not Vanilla (Has abilities/a PR). Ergo, I can confirm if someone is a PR or if they are a VT/Goon.

@Antihero: I think that scum have ignored the Innocent Child because he's not a threat to them. It's the only reason I can see for Notscience to not be killed right away.

[Antihero]

There's plenty of things that could still make Mac's cop-clear not truthful. For instance, if the cop isn't a cop, or if the copping was redirected, or if Mac is a PR that investigates as town, or...

I'm telling the truth.
We're not lynching Mac on the ~1/1000000* chance that venmar was redirected.
"Neighborizing Godfather?", you suggest lynching mac on the chance that this role exists?

We're not lynching Mac, Varsoon. Deal with it.

*note: I pulled this number out of my ass, but I do know that the chances of it are really low

[Faster Than Light]

I want this to be on its own line, so that it isn't lost in the clutter. If anything I say gets heard, it should be this:
Unless my night actions were redirected in some way,
Nacho is a Vanilla Town or Goon
and
Trust Fund a PR.

[Antihero]

@Antihero: I think that scum have ignored the Innocent Child because he's

not a threat to them

. It's the only reason I can see for Notscience to not be killed right away.

I think that answers your question about why the soft-claimers have been ignored...

[notscience]

Why would they kill me? I'm not great at finding scum.

There's literally 0 reasoning to kill me.

I have to agree with Anti on this.

I also think Anti is town.

[zMuffinMan]

Muffin, give me a reason for why scum would ignore the claimed PRs, especially all the way until D4.

um, ok

first of all, the claimed PRs on D1 were:

venmar-PGO and andrius softclaiming some sort of vengeful role. neither of these are likely targets for a nightkill (maybe andrius, but you could argue that perhaps he was likely to be protected after d1). there's also the IC but LOL IT'S NOTSCIENCE and he has been helping scum more than town so far this game. i said d1 that scum were going to keep him alive til lylo because it only benefits them.

the claimed PRs on D2 were:

TF claiming 1-shot vanillarising role, mutley claiming 1-shot vig. neither of these are likely targets for a nightkill. you also soft-claimed something but scum could have thought you'd be protected or something.

it's possible that scum

were

trying to hit a PR N3 (because mastin was claiming a fuckton of players were confirmed, which suggested he had some sort of role information to verify people).

so i don't really see your point.

maybe the SoS and BnB kills were trying to target a PR and they guessed wrong. maybe they had other reasons for wanting to kill SoS and BnB that had nothing to do with PRs.