Mini 1555 Board Game UPick Mafia--Game Over!


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Post Post #1475 (ISO) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 9:44 am

Post by Porkens »

In post 1471, Hadrian wrote:
In post 1463, Porkens wrote:AUN, how could scum Hadrian make this lylo?
Riddle me this big guy, why didn't I use it? Why haven't I today? If we're so clever we could make this lylo, why fight it. If we're scum and one of morph/username is town why not use it? We could make a case against either and there's enough suspicion to potentially go through. I wouldn't care if I lost because oh ho ho, I wouldn't.

Do you see me using it or do you see me not using it. Oh durr must be because we're town.
The theory is this: If we misslynch today, and there is a nightkill tonight. That leaves 2 scum and 3 town tomorrow. If you are scum, you pop your gladiator on your partner. Then, no matter which scum town lynches, the game is over because the remaining scum has two votes in a 3-way.

Since you could be scum, isn't the best play to lynch you today? Is there a flaw in this I'm not seeing?
In post 1472, Hadrian wrote:
In post 1470, Porkens wrote:I'm going to ignore the personal and needless insults, even though it is quite a challenge for me to do so.

What about lynching you doesn't make sense? You could be scum, and, if you are, this is lylo. Is there something wrong about the logic of that?

They're not personal insults, your play is lazy as fuck. And you know what I probably wouldn't mind, but you came up with the charter, so sorry bout your luck but I'm going to hold you to a higher standard because you thought of yourself so much better. You criticize other peoples play, like you did to us in wizards saying you wouldn't tolerate our nonsense when we were actually giving thoughts about the game. I expect you, if you're going to start the game with a charter, to oh I don't know try to figure out the game. You criticized pless yesterday for actually trying to figure things out because you'd prefer to be lazy and not.

I actually don't mind being lynched if it removes the gladiate fear, which I've already said more than once and interacted with you about. I already suggested gladiating kdub so that we would be certain the double votes would go to town. You've already interacted with me about that.

We are town. This is not lylo. It doesn't make sense to lynch us because it will be a mislynch. It only makes sense in getting rid of gladiator fear.
My initial reaction is "the charter idea was shot down because it infringed on how people liked to play."
My deeper reaction is hurt feelings. I'm not being cavalier or lazy about this game. I'm not sheeping anyone or blowing off any serious discussion. I have strong reads, and I'm pursuing them. AUN has a really good point about your role and what it could mean for the game. I still think he is scum, but I think the right move is lynching you. If someone can come up with a compelling reason why that's not the best move, I'll listen. There are constructive ways to get your point across, and you are utilizing none of them.
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Post Post #1476 (ISO) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 9:48 am

Post by Hadrian »

I couldn't be scum because I'm town. If you want to utility lynch me because of fear of my role go ahead.

It's still stupid because there's not an ounce of scum motivation in how we've approached our role. It's still going to be a mislynch. You're still going to be in lylo tomorrow, just I guess you can pat yourself on the back for getting rid of the scarey role that wouldn't be used in the first place.
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Post Post #1477 (ISO) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 9:52 am

Post by Porkens »

I'll trade away
possible lylo
today
for
possible lylo tomorrow
anytime.
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Post Post #1478 (ISO) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 9:56 am

Post by Hadrian »

And and if the scum team is not morph/awesome what are you going to do then?

You do realize we should be pretty close to confirmed town as it is. You know that's the role we have. We don't want to use it period. We could be using it right now, but as I said before I'd rather be lynched outright than take a chance we lose to scum. Because if we lose to scum today IS lylo. They go into tomorrow with three votes. Why do you think I've been arguing about not using it? Why do you think I said yesterday if we needed to prove it to use it yesterday.

But let's say I'm scum here? I could gladiate my partner today, why wait until tomorrow? I could gladiate town today and hope to win it now and win in the night phase. Why not do that? Why make a fuss about not wanting to use it? Why?
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Post Post #1479 (ISO) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 9:57 am

Post by Hadrian »

In post 1477, Porkens wrote:I'll trade away
possible lylo
today
for
possible lylo tomorrow
anytime.

*shrug*
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Post Post #1480 (ISO) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 10:06 am

Post by Hadrian »

In post 1470, Porkens wrote:What about lynching you doesn't make sense? You could be scum, and, if you are, this is lylo. Is there something wrong about the logic of that?
Everything
is wrong about the logic of it. The aim of the game is to lynch people who are scum. Not to make sure the game takes as long as possible. Putting off the possibility of lylo is not a reason to lynch somebody.

Based on your most recent reads list, you
think we're town
. So your only reason for voting us now is "oh, it might be lylo, that's scary!". But voting for somebody you think is town just because, on the off-chance you're wrong, the game is currently in lylo is simply not rational. You are merely exchanging an
unlikely
lylo (it's only lylo if we're scum, which you --correctly! -- don't believe is true) for a
more likely
lyo (since once you mislynch us, it's actually lylo for real). How does this make any sense? You don't get a special prize for losing the game a day later.
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Post Post #1481 (ISO) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 11:00 am

Post by The Betting Pool »

Vote Count 4.05:

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch!

morph the cat (L-3): awesomeusername
Porkens (L-4):
Quill (L-4):
SpyreX (L-4):
awesomeusername (L-3): SpyreX
Kdub (L-4):
Hadrian (L-3): Porkens

Not Voting: morph the cat, Quill, Kdub, Hadrian

V/LA:

Deadline is in (expired on 2014-04-17 20:17:36)

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Post Post #1482 (ISO) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 11:34 am

Post by Porkens »

In post 1478, Hadrian wrote:And and if the scum team is not morph/awesome what are you going to do then?
We will cross that bridge when we get to it.
You do realize we should be pretty close to confirmed town as it is.
I don't see it that way at all.
You know that's the role we have. We don't want to use it period. We could be using it right now, but as I said before I'd rather be lynched outright than take a chance we lose to scum.
Well, actually, you'll use it on Kdub if you want to be pro-town
But let's say I'm scum here? I could gladiate my partner today, why wait until tomorrow?
Because if you use it tomorrow, you win.
I could gladiate town today and hope to win it now and win in the night phase. Why not do that? Why make a fuss about not wanting to use it? Why?
Because, as you said, you think you'd be the one to get lynched if you used it today.


Whether I think you are town or not is irrelevant in the extreme. If you are scum, today is lylo. We have to assume you are. If you are not, be protown and gladiate kdub.
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Post Post #1483 (ISO) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 11:45 am

Post by Hadrian »

How about you do the protown thing and start scum hunting.

Until you actually look like you're trying to solve this game, you don't get to tell me what's protown.

I'll continue over in this corner trying to figure out who makes sense as scum, and you can continue picking your nose or whatever it is you are doing while pretending you're playing mafia. If you guys want to utility lynch me, fine, but I'm going to try to find scum.
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Post Post #1484 (ISO) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 11:51 am

Post by Porkens »

In post 1416, Porkens wrote:
I thought about Quill motivating me to get town cred but there are two problems with that. 1-he was already pretty highly town-read 2-he didn't know I was a self-watcher unless he's partners with AUN (which justifies lynching AUN)


I can sometimes get paranoid about SpyreX but then I remember how the Madotsuki lynch went down. No way in hell they were partners.



Hadrian is not lying about their role. But why would they as scum? I don't really think they are scum based on, well, gut mostly.


Morph is the other side of the gut-read coin. In addition, their role claim is very weird.


AUN's claim doesn't make sense to me on a fundamental level. Rolecop is also suspicious. His posts have always seemed scummy to me.
What about this do you hate?
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Post Post #1485 (ISO) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 11:55 am

Post by Hadrian »

What I hate is the not actually looking at things. You've already said that you think the game is won with a hadrian, aun, morph lynch, but if aun and morph are not partners it's not.

You're acting like this game is solved, and I don't think it's that easy.
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Post Post #1486 (ISO) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 11:57 am

Post by Porkens »

I'm inviting you to discuss reads with me.
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Post Post #1487 (ISO) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 12:19 pm

Post by Hadrian »

In post 1486, Porkens wrote:I'm inviting you to discuss reads with me.
Yesterday you got after Pless when he was trying to figure out reads. This is part of my problem with you Porkens. Pless tried to look at the claimed roles and see if the roles made sense with the games, which this is a upick so you would think there would be something there. And you criticized that. THEN he looked back to see if there was anything to warrant Spyrex paranoia, and you got after him for trying to solve the game there too.

You can't have it both ways, either you want us to go through the game and try to figure it out or you don't. But you don't get to criticize our efforts and then say you're inviting us to discuss reads.

One thing though that I was just thinking about while cooking dinner was how much I hate ffery's statement that she wants to go full bore paranoia on who isn't reading her as town here that should be. that just doesn't seem like a ffery thing to me. And I'm sure she'll come say I don't know her meta blah blah blah, but for someone who on more than one occasion has said she doesn't obvtown and who've I've seen get scum read by someone who should have been reading her as town in mafia.raptured and not turn around with paranoia that makes no sense whatsoever. ESPECIALLY in regards to their play here. It doesn't look overwhelmingly town, they don't look like they've put a lot of thought into this game, they seem more focused on their gambits, and less like they're trying to figure it out. I mean this is someone who had a fake guilty put on her in Space Mafia, and didn't even turn around in paranoia on the person claiming they had a guilty on her they couldn't have had. So it just feels manipulative. But I don't know, there are some things that feel not so scum-motivated but it does feel scum too and I'm a waffly waffle house there.

IDK I'm paranoid about all of you except for kdub, who mind you I was scum reading incorrectly all game so my reads are absolute shit. I think you're more likely town though infuriating at times, and the rest is all up in the sky!
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Post Post #1488 (ISO) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 12:58 pm

Post by Kdub »

Only have time for a quick post.

There is very little chance Hadrian is scum IMO. I'd risk letting them live today because I think the chance is just that small. If we lose to scum-Hadrian because of that assumption, oh well.

I'm almost certainly tonight's kill, so Hadrian gladiating me won't gain town an extra vote tomorrow anyway.
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Post Post #1489 (ISO) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 1:04 pm

Post by Porkens »

In post 1487, Hadrian wrote:
In post 1486, Porkens wrote:I'm inviting you to discuss reads with me.
Yesterday you got after Pless when he was trying to figure out reads. This is part of my problem with you Porkens. Pless tried to look at the claimed roles and see if the roles made sense with the games, which this is a upick so you would think there would be something there. And you criticized that. THEN he looked back to see if there was anything to warrant Spyrex paranoia, and you got after him for trying to solve the game there too.

You can't have it both ways, either you want us to go through the game and try to figure it out or you don't. But you don't get to criticize our efforts and then say you're inviting us to discuss reads.
Let's not fight about this anymore.
One thing though that I was just thinking about while cooking dinner was how much I hate ffery's statement that she wants to go full bore paranoia on who isn't reading her as town here that should be. that just doesn't seem like a ffery thing to me. And I'm sure she'll come say I don't know her meta blah blah blah, but for someone who on more than one occasion has said she doesn't obvtown and who've I've seen get scum read by someone who should have been reading her as town in mafia.raptured and not turn around with paranoia that makes no sense whatsoever. ESPECIALLY in regards to their play here. It doesn't look overwhelmingly town, they don't look like they've put a lot of thought into this game, they seem more focused on their gambits, and less like they're trying to figure it out. I mean this is someone who had a fake guilty put on her in Space Mafia, and didn't even turn around in paranoia on the person claiming they had a guilty on her they couldn't have had. So it just feels manipulative. But I don't know, there are some things that feel not so scum-motivated but it does feel scum too and I'm a waffly waffle house there.
Does this boil down to the fact that she isn't playing the way she should as town? Who does she know enough in this game that she can say "if you are town you should be town-reading me?" I don't know squat about anyone's meta (except Spy's). The first thing that sticks out in my mind when I think about Morph this game is this:
IDK I'm paranoid about all of you except for kdub, who mind you I was scum reading incorrectly all game so my reads are absolute shit. I think you're more likely town though infuriating at times, and the rest is all up in the sky!
I've misread hiplop, Shroomish, the modkilled guy, kdub, and PV, soooooo the scum must be SpyreX and Quill.

Pedit: There is NO need to take that risk, though; it would just be silly to do so. Giving you the double vote would cement you as tonight's kill.
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Post Post #1490 (ISO) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 1:06 pm

Post by Porkens »

In post 1489, Porkens wrote:
In post 1487, Hadrian wrote:
In post 1486, Porkens wrote:I'm inviting you to discuss reads with me.
Yesterday you got after Pless when he was trying to figure out reads. This is part of my problem with you Porkens. Pless tried to look at the claimed roles and see if the roles made sense with the games, which this is a upick so you would think there would be something there. And you criticized that. THEN he looked back to see if there was anything to warrant Spyrex paranoia, and you got after him for trying to solve the game there too.

You can't have it both ways, either you want us to go through the game and try to figure it out or you don't. But you don't get to criticize our efforts and then say you're inviting us to discuss reads.
Let's not fight about this anymore.
One thing though that I was just thinking about while cooking dinner was how much I hate ffery's statement that she wants to go full bore paranoia on who isn't reading her as town here that should be. that just doesn't seem like a ffery thing to me. And I'm sure she'll come say I don't know her meta blah blah blah, but for someone who on more than one occasion has said she doesn't obvtown and who've I've seen get scum read by someone who should have been reading her as town in mafia.raptured and not turn around with paranoia that makes no sense whatsoever. ESPECIALLY in regards to their play here. It doesn't look overwhelmingly town, they don't look like they've put a lot of thought into this game, they seem more focused on their gambits, and less like they're trying to figure it out. I mean this is someone who had a fake guilty put on her in Space Mafia, and didn't even turn around in paranoia on the person claiming they had a guilty on her they couldn't have had. So it just feels manipulative. But I don't know, there are some things that feel not so scum-motivated but it does feel scum too and I'm a waffly waffle house there.
Does this boil down to the fact that she isn't playing the way she should as town? Who does she know enough in this game that she can say "if you are town you should be town-reading me?" I don't know squat about anyone's meta (except Spy's).
The first thing that sticks out in my mind when I think about Morph this game is this:

IDK I'm paranoid about all of you except for kdub, who mind you I was scum reading incorrectly all game so my reads are absolute shit. I think you're more likely town though infuriating at times, and the rest is all up in the sky!
I've misread hiplop, Shroomish, the modkilled guy, kdub, and PV, soooooo the scum must be SpyreX and Quill.

Pedit: There is NO need to take that risk, though; it would just be silly to do so. Giving you the double vote would cement you as tonight's kill.
Shit, that's about Surye. Never mind. See, this is why I cling to my precious utility lynches.
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Post Post #1491 (ISO) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 2:14 pm

Post by SpyreX »

And and if the scum team is not morph/awesome what are you going to do then?

You do realize we should be pretty close to confirmed town as it is. You know that's the role we have. We don't want to use it period. We could be using it right now, but as I said before I'd rather be lynched outright than take a chance we lose to scum. Because if we lose to scum today IS lylo. They go into tomorrow with three votes. Why do you think I've been arguing about not using it? Why do you think I said yesterday if we needed to prove it to use it yesterday.

But let's say I'm scum here? I could gladiate my partner today, why wait until tomorrow? I could gladiate town today and hope to win it now and win in the night phase. Why not do that? Why make a fuss about not wanting to use it? Why?
Gladiating willy nilly would have been a death warrant.
Gladiating your partner today doesn't actually win the game if you're scum.
Yes in theory if you're scum AND not scum with AUN you could have jumped on that early for a win but thats still a gamble.

I'm not convinced you're scum. I'm convinced that these last two pages of bluster and bullshit get to stop. Because absolutely unless its something worth me
gambling the game right now
on you being town and hitting scum for sure porkens and AUN are right in that gaining a day is better than not (even if AUN may be absolutely self-serving with it).

Cause, again, it takes a lot of effort to not just say fuck it and lynch right now.
Show
I always lynch scum... sometimes they're just not mafia. :P

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Third Party: (2-0)
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Post Post #1492 (ISO) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 2:21 pm

Post by Hadrian »

There wouldn't be bluster in the first place if we didn't get criticized
for trying to figure ut the game in the first place


Just lynch us. This is a town loss anyway if it's not awesome/morph. If it is awesome/morph town win yay utility lynches work woohoo.

But if not, kdub and we are the only people trying to figure out the game, so town loss, shame on people for going on auto pilot.
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Post Post #1493 (ISO) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 2:26 pm

Post by Hadrian »

But thank you for pointing out what wouldn't work again with our role. I appreciate it when people bang it over our heads the way it would or wouldn't work if we were scum. I appreciate you pointing out that we haven't been looking at our role like scum would because we don't have scum mindset.

Thank you for pointing that out.
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Post Post #1494 (ISO) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 2:31 pm

Post by Hadrian »

You do realize if we do mislynch today, we are confirmed town tomorrow the moment we don't use our gladiate?
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Post Post #1495 (ISO) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 2:32 pm

Post by Hadrian »

I would prefer to lynch scum today but that seems to not be on the menu this game!
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Post Post #1496 (ISO) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 2:35 pm

Post by morph the cat »

I'm extremely unlikely to vote you today so there's that.

I've read the last 2 or so pages and now I want to gouge my eyes with a rusty fork.
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Post Post #1497 (ISO) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 2:41 pm

Post by Porkens »

How would no lynching work if you popped gladiator?
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Post Post #1498 (ISO) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 2:51 pm

Post by Hadrian »

In post 1497, Porkens wrote:How would no lynching work if you popped gladiator?
I don't follow?

I did think about suggesting using the gladiate without lynching anyone to get rid of the double vote fear, but I miscounted and we aren't at evens so it doesn't do any good and ends up taking away a lynch, which is unfortunately what lynching us also does even if it's utility.

And I hate the mod for giving us this *prize* with this role.

But if you're asking how it makes us confirmed town, there's been the whole hoopla of if we're scum we could use it to guarantee our win in lylo, so we would be confirmed town when we didn't use it.
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Post Post #1499 (ISO) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 2:57 pm

Post by Hadrian »

I mean I get paranoia but I also don't understand why anyone thinks our role would be given to scum with this prize. That would give town one less mislynch. I just don't see how anyone would think that was good balance. I mean sure if we use it and it gets given to scum, but then that's something town did to itself.
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