League of Legends (Old)

[JasonWazza]

Long matches happen at all elos.

Jason: that's not really a reason it's bad to have jungle timers. You could estimate it and prepare to be early as well. Like... if the enemy team doesn't take into account the risk of a counterjungle at the buff, having the precise timer or not will hardly change that. You outplayed the enemy jungler. Simple as that.

Long matches are less likely at higher elos though because higher elos know how to close games, this game should have been closed really early but i kept making retarded plays that actually managed to work.

Also yes me having rough buff timers would work the same, but the fact is having the exact timer gives me way too much of an advantage for it (and all for one ward that had no real risk to be placed), to the point where, when i stole the third buff, i actually saw the amumu Q flying at my face just out of max range just as i finished the buff.

EDIT: As a note, i never actually took timers and did them off my head, and generally anything like an invade would seriously fuck my buff taking.

But yeah personally i think it's too much info for too easy a ward.

[RayFrost]

shrug

It's equal information. If they can't actually play properly with it, it's on them.

[BROseidon]

It doesn't take "skill" to type in a number.

Timers changed nothing in terms of what the actual gameplay is. It took out the step that wasn't fun.

[BROseidon]

Also there are plenty of games at higher elos because there are fewer mistakes to punish.

Average game time doesn't change much by league, iirc

[JasonWazza]

It doesn't take "skill" to type in a number.

Timers changed nothing in terms of what the actual gameplay is. It took out the step that wasn't fun.

I agree it doesn't take skill to write down the number, i don't agree that giving these jungle timers help the game in any way though.

EDIT: Also i thought junglers always tended to have less gold, i always seem to have more gold then my team when i jungle.

[BROseidon]

It saves me the hassle of writing down the numbers and having to scroll up to find them.

It's not a huge thing, but it's still better

[theelkspeaks]

gragas build:

targons, sightstone, mobi, then branch with wardens/randuins, locket, frozen fist (esspecially for glacial) and visage as the bigger options depending on the opposing team.

I was playing top, not support

If I were playing support, I'd just play Nami or Sona

[hiplop]

I just went a game as support annie and ended with 15/4/28

That was a very fun game

[hiplop]

forgot to mention that none of those were KS either! my adc was super fed I just got whoever she couldnt

[Maestro]

Klaz, Ani, ns, and somebody I soloQed with in Ranked tried a SUPERtroll Team Builder last night and got smashed for our efforts. I was on ADC Thresh, Klaz was on (AP) Support Gangplank, ns was jungling with Annie, the Ranked friend went top on Anivia... and Ani took Talon mid, but he's lame because mainstream things are stupid.

Our match-ups were Jinx/Taric bot, Ahri mid, Shen top, and Kha'zix jungle.

We all lost lane handily; only Ani had more than 1 Kill.

[animorpherv1]

I was in a ranked 5s match and had control over every buff, drafgon, and baron. Good luck with that without timers.

And I was doing pretty well until I met your laners :/

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I can't see what about the extra 9 points in the offense tree makes it worth more than the potential sustain / tankiness options in the defense or utility trees given how abusive a lot of his early-level matchups are

The 9 points in utility are literally worthless on fizz. He doesnt need ms because he has 2 gapclosers already. He doesn't need extra "sustain
either because if you're facing a tough matchup then you should be starting flask/3 pots. In fact, in MOST matchups you should be starting flask. Let say you're facing brand for example. Taking flash means you're trading your health for his mana. If he starts Dorans/2 pots, then he's going to go oom way before you run out of sustain from the flask.

I can see the case made from the defense tree, but again, the 9 points in utility are much better seeing as his q deals 100% AD physical damage, and he autos a crapton.

3 MS and a biscuit always in midlane if you use mana. always!

30/0/0 Fizz would like to counter that.

Anyway everyone should jump on the Fizz hype train because he's one of the last remaining assassin who's good and isn't completely nullified by exhaust.

Sure, give me a primer on fizz plz

Umm, seeing I'm 8-1 with him in ranked (and that one "loss" being me having to emergency leave 5mins into the game), I must be doing something right... maybe. So I guess I'll say what I'm doing.

Runes:
9 hybrid pen marks - obv, since fizz's q deals physical damage and he autos
9 flat health yellows/armor - if you're facing an ap that wouldn't try to get you out of lane by autoing, then take health, otherwise armor.
9 flat mr blues/ap - unless you're facing an ap that deals significant ap in the beginning, then take flat ap (ex. vs akali, kat, diana)
3 ap quints

Masteries 30/0/0



Summoner spells: Ignite/Heal


You basically have to understand that Fizz is an early game champion, and without an early lead, you will fall off hard. However, his early game is VERY strong, so you shouldn't really have a problem with gaining a lead unless the enemy is playing suppppppper safe, which then means they're missing out on farm.

Most starts should be flask, unless you're sure you can kill an enemy with one to two all ins max, then start dorans.

If you're vs a meele, start w. Auto them as soon as they get into lane. I basically got fb on a diana yesterday because i just kept walking and autoing them as soon as they came to lane. It was pretty funny. If you're vs ranged, start e, wait for them to use blow their first ability (if they ever do). Lets take the brand example again. Say he uses pillar of flame (right, thats what brands starts with? idk i dont play him) to try to harass you and push the wave to gain an early lvl 2. E out of it, and go on him, auto him a few times, back, and drink flask. Keep doing these small trades where you will get out on top because of a) your damage and b) flask. At level 6 you should have no problem killing the enemy.

Build order should be sheen -> dfg -> lich bane -> ap stuff (rabadons, zhonyas, void, etc).

Mid/late game you can destroy teams with your ult. And can delete anyone squishy with dfg. Try to stay in the back and have the tanks fight it out first, then see if you can get to the backline and delete someone.

Last note: Fizz does have a high skillcap (imo) and I did play a TON of games on my smurf with him first.

[animorpherv1]

Summoner spells: Ignite/Heal

... No flash? OK...

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Summoner spells: Ignite/Heal

... No flash? OK...

There are a lot of Fizz players who will go double combat summoners (like Ignite Exhaust or Ignite Barrier) because they feel confident in their innate mobility that Q and E give them.

I'm not confident enough on the champion to take that personally, but it's not a bad call.

[Maestro]

Wow. Did the NA servers just explode?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Wow. Did the NA servers just explode?

idk but I got a huge ping spike like 5 mins ago.

[Maestro]

My client's completely locked me out of a game Ani and I just started.
We were leashing Red buff and ceased all movement, go the Reconnect, reset everything League, and still everything is dead.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Summoner spells: Ignite/Heal

... No flash? OK...

Nope, Fizz doesn't need it. Heal is on a shorter cd anyway, so if you need to escape use that then wait for e to be up (or q backwards through a minion). Plus heal/ignite means your dueling is super good.

[MrZepher]

Summoner spells: Ignite/Heal

... No flash? OK...

Flash isn't necessary, just innately risky to not have.

[chamber]

Played my first game in several months. Learned that fed doom bots are scary shit. Got crushed.

[hiplop]

just build MR and split push and doom bots are piece of cake

[BROseidon]

I was in a ranked 5s match and had control over every buff, drafgon, and baron. Good luck with that without timers.

And I was doing pretty well until I met your laners :/

Were you incapable of typing in a sequence of 4 numbers and looking at it before?

[BROseidon]

The 9 points in utility are literally worthless on fizz. He doesnt need ms because he has 2 gapclosers already. He doesn't need extra "sustain
either because if you're facing a tough matchup then you should be starting flask/3 pots. In fact, in MOST matchups you should be starting flask. Let say you're facing brand for example. Taking flash means you're trading your health for his mana. If he starts Dorans/2 pots, then he's going to go oom way before you run out of sustain from the flask.

I can see the case made from the defense tree, but again, the 9 points in utility are much better seeing as his q deals 100% AD physical damage, and he autos a crapton.

Did you watch the ls video where he coached the Fizz? Because that's literally what he explains.

I still think it's probably better to just take the defense, though. If you're trading health for mana, forcing them to trade more mana for the same amount of health is probably worth more than a bit more AD damage when you already pretty much 1-shot squishies.

[BROseidon]

I also don't play Fizz, or mid lane really.

[BROseidon]

Lets take the brand example again. Say he uses pillar of flame (right, thats what brands starts with? idk i dont play him) to try to harass you and push the wave to gain an early lvl 2. E out of it, and go on him, auto him a few times, back, and drink flask. Keep doing these small trades where you will get out on top because of a) your damage and b) flask

Brand is a terrible matchup for Fizz, actually. One of his harder counters, IIRC.

Basically, Fizz can't E out of Brand's E, so Brand can max it first during laning and get a shitton of free harass. Additionally, Brand has fairly potent autos during the laning phase b/c he has decent base AD/AS and has a really clean AA animation, which hurts Fizz further.

Fizz is not very good 1-4, because you have to basically say "I'm starting a lot of regen and hoping that I can stall out your mana/CDs with my regen." You don't win a lane that way unless the other person fucks up more than you; you're playing to go roughly even. He really spikes at 6, since that ult is super powerful and gives him the damage he needs to close out kills, and needs to develop his lead from like 6-10 either by all-inning (which he can do against a lot of mids), or roaming for kills (he has a very safe and mobile roam). Once he has his lead, he scales reasonably well (sort of like old Akali when she was strong. You're good while you have the lead, and don't really fall off until everyone starts hitting their 5th or 6th item).