A Musical Mafia! (Game over)

[Marquis]

VOTE: Skybird

Whatever, I'm back here.

I feel like a lot of town is just talking past each other today, so whatever alignment TPP is, props to them for at least trying to address everything and making me feel like what I'm pushing actually kind of matters a little maybe.

[podoboq]

Marquis is right. VOTE: Skybird

[The Pied Piper]

I want to scum read Mirhawk but I am going back and forth on this read. Part of the reason I want to scum read him is because he is scum reading me and I agree that is a really shitty reason to scum read someone. I don't think he's right on Dave being scum. I have Dave as town. Most of the things Mirhawk has pointed out against Dave are him asking meaningless questions and not taking strong stances. But town is going to disagree on who we think are scum so again, this isn't a strong reason for scum reading him.

I see what you mean when you say that she's saying things that look good but probably isn't anything that someone actually feels and I think that this post is a great example of that.

Vote: Skybird

[itlepip]

VOTE: Skybird

GI tell is a tell that GI used against me one game and then taught me and now I use it. Basically I think Axel is approaching the game in a kinda scummy way/mindset.

[Marquis]

before anyone comments, I'm already townreading all three players above - TPP the least strongly as I think both heads are able to trick me

[podoboq]

VOTE: Skybird

GI tell is a tell that GI used against me one game and then taught me and now I use it. Basically I think Axel is approaching the game in a kinda scummy way/mindset.

OK, I'll lay off for now, because this is at least a bit more transparent, but it'd be beneficial to town if you could explain what that tell is.

[Skybird]

Criminy, I spend an afternoon outside because it finally made it over 65 degrees around here for the first time this spring and you all choose now to start voting me.

I'm having a hard time finding scum this game. I've been looking at things and re-reading but I'm just not picking up on anything. I'm not sure what I need to do to find scum right now.

[Skybird]

What do you mean by the bolded PP? How do you know how the scum team was behaving?

Mirhawk's point was that he expected the scum not to look outside the major wagons and not to shake up the gamestate; I said what I said because I don't think that two town counter wagons would radically change how scum behaved. If they were the type of players to try to get something started outside of the two major wagons, then they probably would. If they weren't, than they wouldn't.
Does this make sense or are we still misunderstanding each other?

If I had to consolidate, it'd be on VOTE: Axel for his posts reeking of effort concealing motivation.

Not the biggest fan of my wagonmates but I'm not too fond of the other wagons.

Still mostly V/LA; will get access again later tonight.

I'd be happier with Skybird than Axel; why don't you like the Cakez wagon?

I think we are still misunderstanding each other PP.

To me, what you posted looked like a scum slip.

Where do you think the scum were at the end of D1? On the Ranger lynch wagon? On one of the counter wagons? Or on vanity wagons?

[SirCakez]

-Ranger info

Lynching Ranger will basically explode open this game in terms of reads so even though I have this sick feeling she's going to flip town lynching her is the right play here.

What I was looking for here was for you to explain this quote, not so much look at Ranger's wagon and analyze it. I'd expect that if you were as town you'd have a specific idea wrt her wagon in mind (the only way she could get lynched as town is if there was a bunch of scum on her wagon) that would explain why you'd have a bunch of reads as a result of a Ranger lynch, but, if scum, I'd expect you felt a little bit awkward about joining the wagon of someone who you town read and so you posted this to justify jumping on it. Was what you meant by that quote simply that you thought Ranger's wagon would be very analyzable? Why?

-Spiffeh

At the beginning of the day today, you said that you were going to sheep Spiffeh's reads. The reason why that felt weird to me is because you said that if Ranger was town, you wanted Spiffeh to be your voteslave (suggesting that you thought your reads were better than Spiffeh's if Ranger was town). Could you talk about that?

The cause of that vote was because of the unvote and not commenting on anything else, which I find pretty bad considering an IC just revealed who was the leading wagon which means you should be reanalyzing and Skybird didn't.

Just because a player isn't reanalyzing in the same post that they unvoted doesn't mean that they aren't going to do any reanalyzing at all.

"Just sorting someone" is an excellent excuse to join a wagon without seriously committing.

"Getting this sorted" was a reference to the Ogre-Pistach interaction which did indeed need to be sorted.

That's straight up backtracking.

Well, yeah, but I'd find it weirder if Skybird didn't backtrack on her vote after Pistach revealed to be an IC... Wouldn't you?

-Yes I did, because it was an easy wagon especially towards the end so I wanted to look into the people who had been pushing it for a while off of weak reasoning, for example Mirhawk.
-That was mostly a joke since I was getting frustrated with Spiffeh for still pushing that wagon despite my strong town read on Ranger.
-True, but she just popped in and out which is what I didn't like. 0 other comments.
-If it was I missed that. I thought she meant she wanted to sort Pist.
-It's not backtracking then if she was trying to sort Ogre v Pist, I messed that up if so.

[dramonic]

If I had to consolidate, it'd be on VOTE: Axel for his posts reeking of effort concealing motivation.

Not the biggest fan of my wagonmates but I'm not too fond of the other wagons.

Still mostly V/LA; will get access again later tonight.

*furious dryhumping*

In the meantime, I'll put my vote somewhere I know it belongs. VOTE: dramonic. I get that he's a better vig target, but he's the only person I consider obvscum right now, so that's where I'm gonna park while I finish up some projects over the next two days.

Multiple people have repeatedly talked about and referenced games where dramonic does this as town as well. While I could expect a vote for uselessness, it concerns me that you seem to ignore those points and continue on with just calling him obvscum.

I know your play and I know you're not a shallow thinker. So what's up here?

He's scum is what's up

He's just scumreading the people who are attacking his play.

I'm pretty sure I called out all three of your asses before you adressed me.

VOTE: Podo Dram is actually just town this game, sry mate.

I have absolutely no idea how you came to that conclusion, and I'm legitimately confused as to how you can't see my logic.

1) I think that dram's play is unreadable by its very nature. I think that's a liability for town.
2) I think that dram's play and lack of contribution is scummy, and leads him to be an incredibly easy lynch in the late game. I think that's a liability for town if dram is town, and we should cut our losses early in that case.
3) I also think dram is obvscum based on his bad scumreads, providing no reasoning as to why they're scumreads, and not cooperating with town in any meaningful way.

Right now, any of those three reasons alone is more than enough to make me feel comfortable with dram's lynch. While dram is a better vig hit, I don't feel comfortable right now parking on anybody else, because I don't feel comfortable with the lynch of any other players without further review, which I can't get done at the moment. So if somebody gets lynched while I'm getting work done, I'd much rather it be dram than anybody else, because dram at least

needs

to be removed from this game for the benefit of town.

I understand if you disagree with any of that logic, fine. But I believe you can see where I'm coming from here, and if you scumread me for it, I'm honestly confused as to how you're drawing that conclusion.

That is one shitty excuse to vote me mate. You're "not comfortable" voting someone else without review? That is such wishy-washy bull

His reads aren't solid. I know I'm town, I don't scumread Axel right now, and I'm no longer convinced about tictac. I can see either of them flipping scum at some point, but their alignment is not obvious, and picking the three players he did as early as he did and not wavering is incredibly scummy. It's without logic, and it's proven without logic, BECAUSE HE REFUSES TO PROVIDE LOGIC DESPITE BEING ASKED TO ON MULTIPLE OCCASIONS, INCLUDING

FROM YOU

.

I'm not going to waver unless you provide a reason for me to, but every post you make just confirms my read further so...

Not only is this eight word post from dramonic useless, off base, and not used to support any meaningful dialog, but it's against YOUR SLOT, which theoretically you should KNOW is town. How could you possibly use this as evidence to read dramonic as town, enough to almost consider him obvtown?

Okay, I want everyone to take a moment to read that quote and tell me what sort of town tries to convince someone of a read by saying "But he attacked you, therefore he must be scum!"

So I guess the answer to the rest of that post would be that yeah, you're just a bad player

it's very unlikely that i'm going to want a dram lynch today, but the way he's pushing it is town town town town town town town

TPP come on

VOTE: Skybird

Whatever, I'm back here.

And after I dryhumped you for a good fifteen minutes. SHAME man.

[SirCakez]

After reading the conversation between Cakez and Mirhawk, Mirhawk is moving up on my town list. I feel he has made some good points on Cakez.

-snip-

I still kind of think Seniors is town.

You're probably right. I don't think your wagon analysis piece was going to result in anything productive;

two town counter wagons doesn't really mean much with how the scum team was behaving.

-snip-

Why is this game dead all of a sudden
Spiffeh y did you have to die with your great activity ugh
For the tictac case - just look at his posts on the last page and tell me that's not scum.

While I'll commend Cakez if he's scum here because this post is pretty decently ballsy, this post also feels pretty incredibly fake. As I've said before, I don't mind when people read into dead town's reads and all that good stuff but following them blindly when you didn't really follow the player that closely the day before is pretty fucking iffy, and these sorts of "I'll miss you Spiffeh!" posts never really ring true to me.

What do you mean by the bolded PP? How do you know how the scum team was behaving?

In the second part of the quote, I agree with the "I'll miss you Spiffeh" sentiment ringing false. Put this quote along with the "I tried to save you Ranger" quote from Cakez and he just feels incredibly scummy today.

I'm caught back up now and I think it's time to vote.

VOTE: Sir Cakez

Criminy, I spend an afternoon outside because it finally made it over 65 degrees around here for the first time this spring and you all choose now to start voting me.

I'm having a hard time finding scum this game. I've been looking at things and re-reading but I'm just not picking up on anything. I'm not sure what I need to do to find scum right now.

These are all really scummy. Especially after reviewing her ISO earlier when doing the wall for Nacho I agree this is the right vote.
VOTE: Skybird

[pistachi0n]

I'm caught back up now and I think it's time to vote.

VOTE: Sir Cakez

I've definitely been pushing to lynch Cakez but this vote was incredibly opportunistic.

[podoboq]

Not only is this eight word post from dramonic useless, off base, and not used to support any meaningful dialog, but it's against YOUR SLOT, which theoretically you should KNOW is town. How could you possibly use this as evidence to read dramonic as town, enough to almost consider him obvtown?

Okay, I want everyone to take a moment to read that quote and tell me what sort of town tries to convince someone of a read by saying "But he attacked you, therefore he must be scum!"

So I guess the answer to the rest of that post would be that yeah, you're just a bad player

I know that he bolded it for me, but I want to make sure everybody sees this glorious

m

i

s

r

e

p

.

Please do read it in its context, which dramonic somehow failed to include.

itlepip uses a very short post from dramonic in which dramonic casts a minimal amount of suspicion on beeboy as a reason to townread dramonic. I see a problem with this, because it feels to me like itlepip shouldn't read that as town. The problem is that itlepip (theoretically) knows that his slot is town, and dramonic shouldn't be casting suspicion on a town slot for basically no reason.

itlepip has the knowledge that his slot is town, which should make him MORE suspicious of you, rather than less.

[itlepip]

NOT HOW THAT WORKS M8.

you have to realize that town make shit posts all the fricken time. Beeboy made a shit post and got called for it. I think that Dram had every excuse to pressure beeboy and make a scene and get that glorious towncred. However he didn't which is towny. A low content scum doesn't waste posts just to get reads.

[podoboq]

All that said, I'm glad you finally decided to contribute something real. There's finally something to actually discuss!

[dramonic]

Not only is this eight word post from dramonic useless, off base, and not used to support any meaningful dialog, but it's against YOUR SLOT, which theoretically you should KNOW is town. How could you possibly use this as evidence to read dramonic as town, enough to almost consider him obvtown?

Okay, I want everyone to take a moment to read that quote and tell me what sort of town tries to convince someone of a read by saying "But he attacked you, therefore he must be scum!"

So I guess the answer to the rest of that post would be that yeah, you're just a bad player

I know that he bolded it for me, but I want to make sure everybody sees this glorious

m

i

s

r

e

p

.

Please do read it in its context, which dramonic somehow failed to include.

itlepip uses a very short post from dramonic in which dramonic casts a minimal amount of suspicion on beeboy as a reason to townread dramonic. I see a problem with this, because it feels to me like itlepip shouldn't read that as town. The problem is that itlepip (theoretically) knows that his slot is town, and dramonic shouldn't be casting suspicion on a town slot for basically no reason.

itlepip has the knowledge that his slot is town, which should make him MORE suspicious of you, rather than less.

That is...
so WRONG! <3

[podoboq]

NOT HOW THAT WORKS M8.

you have to realize that town make shit posts all the fricken time. Beeboy made a shit post and got called for it. I think that Dram had every excuse to pressure beeboy and make a scene and get that glorious towncred. However he didn't which is towny. A low content scum doesn't waste posts just to get reads.

We have different opinions then on the quality of post 759. Looks to me like a pretty damn useless comment on beeboy's play. There are plenty of more important things to actually comment on with regards to beeboy's play, but he picks out a post that's incredibly recent. Why?

Is it because he's lazy and not paying attention to the game? Probably not, because he recognized that the change in vote was pretty quick.

Is it because he's jumping on the opportunity to fling shit somewhere it might stick, so he can double back on it later for the purposes of a mislynch? More likely.


I would expect your slot to see that, since it was targeted AT your slot. More than anybody, town!you should see the problem that you're making me point out and defend.

[podoboq]

Not only is this eight word post from dramonic useless, off base, and not used to support any meaningful dialog, but it's against YOUR SLOT, which theoretically you should KNOW is town. How could you possibly use this as evidence to read dramonic as town, enough to almost consider him obvtown?

Okay, I want everyone to take a moment to read that quote and tell me what sort of town tries to convince someone of a read by saying "But he attacked you, therefore he must be scum!"

So I guess the answer to the rest of that post would be that yeah, you're just a bad player

I know that he bolded it for me, but I want to make sure everybody sees this glorious

m

i

s

r

e

p

.

Please do read it in its context, which dramonic somehow failed to include.

itlepip uses a very short post from dramonic in which dramonic casts a minimal amount of suspicion on beeboy as a reason to townread dramonic. I see a problem with this, because it feels to me like itlepip shouldn't read that as town. The problem is that itlepip (theoretically) knows that his slot is town, and dramonic shouldn't be casting suspicion on a town slot for basically no reason.

itlepip has the knowledge that his slot is town, which should make him MORE suspicious of you, rather than less.

That is...
so WRONG! <3

So......itlepip isn't town. Cool. That's kind of what I was expecting at this point anyway.

[pistachi0n]

NOT HOW THAT WORKS M8.

you have to realize that town make shit posts all the fricken time. Beeboy made a shit post and got called for it. I think that Dram had every excuse to pressure beeboy and make a scene and get that glorious towncred. However he didn't which is towny. A low content scum doesn't waste posts just to get reads.

He's towny because he did the thing that would make him less likely to get read as town..? this is the kind of thing where you could find a way to townread him no matter what he did.

[SirCakez]

I still think itle slot is town. His push on Podo for the Dram push is overblown though.

[itlepip]

I have a gut townlean on Dram that I am explaining. Look I'm trying to solve/win the game, and the way I like doing that is by creating a large town circle.

Cakez you need to understand the difference between a push and a tunnel. You tunnel people who you are certain are scum, and you push people to get a better read on them.

[SirCakez]

So this entire push on Podo is just sorting him? Or is this a tunnel?

[itlepip]

No, I don't have any super strong scumreads so I'm not tunneling anyone.

[pistachi0n]

the way I like doing that is by creating a large town circle.

You have done nothing to solidify your town circle.

[dramonic]

I would expect your slot to see that, since it was targeted AT your slot. More than anybody, town!you should see the problem that you're making me point out and defend.

I'm fascinated that you can say bullshit like that with a straight face.

So......itlepip isn't town. Cool. That's kind of what I was expecting at this point anyway.

That's not what I'm saying at all.