Open 710: MKUltra - Foreign Spies Win!

[Beefster]

Uhm. No. I'm trying to point out that GIF is doing those things: dismissing my case for terminology and technicalities rather than actually refuting my points. I find that suspicious.

I'm super suspicious of your defending him. Please, tear apart the flaws in my case piece by piece so that I know it's my ideas that are bad.

Why is it that you admire GIF?

I suspect a Sesq/GIF scumteam.

[GuyInFreezer]

rather than actually refuting my points

Not refuting? You speak as if you had a point in the first place.

OH LOOK HELLO THIS IS BEEFCASE

In general, his tone comes off as trying too hard to be friendly/joking.

False statement that everyone who skims my ISO can clearly see. Hey didn't I say this already?

His RF tunnel strikes me as odd. 197 was the first he ever mentioned RF in any meaningful capacity and he never provided a single justification for the wagon other than that post.

I didn't need to justify anything when people could ISO him and already see what I was talking about. I didn't even bother with responding to this because, hey,

YOU

were one of the people who checked the ISO as I asked and went "yeah scum lol."

GIF does quite a bit of white knighting against PLs in 267, 273, and 378

273 in particular reeks of IIOA.

Using terms that do not fit the situation. Hey, I think I already said this too.
You call it fiddling with terminology but I do it because it matters, when describing what I did with the term you used falsely accuses me of doing scummy things when what I did was totally not what you described.
Some people call this "misrepresentation" using "buzzwords."

311 and 314 are garbage.

Nice points. 10 points for Gryffindor.

He really likes pointing out that this is a multiball game. It seems as if every third post from him makes some reference to that.

Obviously all that multiball thing was mentioned because my point was that PLing in multiball is bad for town. Oh hey, didn't I already say this as well?

Jokes about townflip on 440

And? It's not like I knew that he was actually flipping town. This is multiball, remember? Also silly thing so I didn't even bother.

457 is suspicious.

Your great point #2.

Your "case" basically contained:
1. False statement that can be proven wrong easily just by ISOing me, or well, following the game
2. Skipping context to paint some actions as scummy
3. "misrepresentation using buzzwords"
4. Just calling things "garbage" and "suspicious"

You have 3 posts to accept your shame and stop calling this a so-called case, before I go total war on you for rest of the Day 2.

[GuyInFreezer]

"GIF why the overreaction"

The fact that I have to deal with the "case" so low in caliber is just fucking

insulting

to me.
Even more when it looks like he's serious.

[GuyInFreezer]

RE: being insulted

This just builds my frustration because I can no longer tell if this is just bad or scummy.
Already getting similar thing wrong once (RF lynch was still #justice) doesn't help it either.

[GuyInFreezer]

It'd be easy to just call this scum but fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck

[GuyInFreezer]

Let me please the dead while I decide

VOTE: Mikan

[Beefster]

Honestly, your defense is dismissive. I'll admit I'm not the best at communicating what it is exactly that bothers me about your play so far, but you've sort of taken control of the game in a way I find suspicious.

By all means, go on total war against me. I have nothing to lose. I don't know if I'm right, but we're not going to get anywhere until some other players chime in with their thoughts.

[GuyInFreezer]

but you've sort of taken control of the game

I mean nobody else is posting.

[GuyInFreezer]

Oh by the way, let me tell you the secret of assembling RF wagon so quickly.

Look at the posts I quoted carefully, sans those I told them to check RF.

[GuyInFreezer]

Spoiler: answer

Yes, that is correct.
I actually just formed a "compromise" wagon.

[Beefster]

You literally told me I was voting for the wrong person and I should change it to RF. Sure, you left the choice "entirely" up to me and simply directed me to RF's ISO. I felt pressured and I suspect that affected my biases. If that's not "taking control of the game" I don't know what is.

[Viomi]

VOTE COUNT

Beefster

(2) - Not_Mafia, Iconeum

GuyInFreezer

(2) - skitter30, Beefster

Mikan Tsumiki

(1) - GuyInFreezer

skitter30

(1) - Mikan Tsumiki

Not Voting:

Sky_Paladin, Sesq, Hawk, springlullaby

With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch.

Tick tock... (expired on 2018-03-07 00:00:00)

Flip-posts updated with some flavor and with obvious references to which teams made which kills.

[GuyInFreezer]

Sure, you left the choice "entirely" up to me and simply directed me to RF's ISO. I felt pressured and I suspect that affected my biases. If that's not "taking control of the game" I don't know what is.

I don't understand why you felt the pressure in the first place.
I don't understand how me asking you to look at RF could create bias (enough to change the read, it sounds like). It's not like you were townreading him You had him as a null-scum range the entire Day 1.

[Beefster]

I felt pressure because you told me I was voting the wrong person and that it would be best if I switch votes.

Don't take what I say out of context.

[GuyInFreezer]

Oh that was literally "your vote is in the wrong place because ypu're not voting RF"
You know, rallying call

[Viomi]

Prodding Not_Mafia.

[Beefster]

I'm just going to say drop it and let other players be the judge of my ideas.

[Not_Mafia]

VOTE: Beefster

[skitter30]

B-Because ummm... I think its kinda easy to push someone for pushing a mislynch.
I-I think you're pushing a fact and n-not a read, s-so in the event GiF flips town y-you can u-use your justification you built up as a scapegoat.

Aaaah sorry! I must be wrong.

It's a read based on a fact, so I don't really understand the distinction?

Oh don't worry he's not even pushing the fact well because this guy is clearly not explaining how I was able to get that wagon up so fast in the first place.

a) she

b) I don't really get what you're trying to say. You lobbied for votes and people listened to you and did it. I don't know why people listened to you. Like you, me, and like half the game agree that you were responsible for yesterday's lynch so I don't get what you're asking me about exactly.

to remove a fairly inactive player, although I can't specifically recall why RF was being scum read other than this

Like this kinda articulates why I didn't like the wagon. It felt low-hanging-fruit-y on a guy that was like awkwardly newb town and people were just saying he's scummy but never really explained *why* they thought that. Like it felt compromise-y and like people didn't care enough about who got lynched so they just went along with you, which makes me think it was at least partially scum-driven.

This entire post feels like awkwardly over-explain-y tbh.

What made RF special over Kop?

Turns out the answer was 'nothing'. After that I felt completely disempowered. I was ambivalent on the RF lynch, and then while I was deciding whether or not to push elsewhere, there was a hammer. So I just gave up and called it a night.

K, so from this snippet I think you're saying that you were asking GIF about Kop to see whether or not you ought to join the RF wagon or do something else because you wanted to know what diffrentiated Kop and RF but then hammer happened before you could go anywhere with it.

So this is like weird given that in your initial post you popped in during *twilight* and said as much. Why would you be asking GIF about Kop to try to figure out if you should push RF that day if you knew that the hammer happened already? Like in the snippet I quoted you're making it sound like you first asked GIF about Kop to try to figure out if you should join the RF wagon or do something else but then hammer happened, but the two events actually happened in the opposite order. And you *knew* that at the time given that you literally said in your initial post that it was twilight, and I specifically asked you about making that post during twilight.

Something feels kinda fishy here tbh.

I should not have gone along with you.

VOTE: GIF

Tbh the fact that you're voting here with me makes me want to leave it which means I should probably be voting you.

VOTE: Beef

Reading through the Gif/you thing doesn't really do much to change that opinion.

It's miles-away more towny than TD IMO.

I don't see anything townie and I rather disliked the L-1 tbh. Does the fact that one of your biggest townreads is voting the other bother you?

Spoiler: answer

Yes, that is correct.
I actually just formed a "compromise" wagon.

Yeah, and that's what I don't like about it.

[GuyInFreezer]

Yeah, and that's what I don't like about it.

So just jealousy. gotcha gotcha.
Because I don't know who wouldn't want to lynch their scumreads more effectively than rallying people who have shown interest in lynching the same scumread.

[skitter30]

Yeah, and that's what I don't like about it.

So just jealousy. gotcha gotcha.
Because I don't know who wouldn't want to lynch their scumreads more effectively than rallying people who have shown interest in lynching the same scumread.

I'm saying that I don't like it because it felt compromise-y and like people went along with it because it was just *there* and were just like 'why not?'. I don't actually think that most of these people actually sincerely thought he was the best lynch but just did it because it was an option. Like weren't you getting those same vibes?

Spoiler:

suspicious is a buzzword but i understand

why would you type like that if you weren't trying to obfuscate?

it's for the memes. it's the memes. she's a meme player. pass.

VOTE: rf

VOTE: Sesq

for backtracking... ish.

Sir your vote is in the wrong place.
Please fix it and vote RF asap.
Thank you.

Uhmm... So now I'm supposed to sheep you?

That would be fantastic.

You can always ISO RF to convince yourself if that's the way you prefer.

Maybe I'll hammer after RF claims.

I need to evaluate this for myself.

Like these are very compromising-y posts. Sesq doesn't think that 'suspicious' is a bad thing but voted anyways. Beef just did it cuz you asked him.

[GuyInFreezer]

I'm saying that I don't like it because it felt compromise-y and like people went along with it because it was just *there* and were just like 'why not?'.

I mean as someone pointed out, RF scumread was literally my

only

major scumread that I even pushed D1.
It is impossible for me to push for RF lynch as a compromise when he was literally my only major scumread that I even bothered pushing D1.

I only said that wagon was "compromise" because it probably was for others. It wasn't for me.
#StillTakingFullResponsibiliy #StillNoRegret #StillJustice

[skitter30]

I only said that wagon was "compromise"

because it probably was for others

. It wasn't for me.

OK, and does like concern you at all?

[Beefster]

I'm saying that I don't like it because it felt compromise-y and like people went along with it because it was just *there* and were just like 'why not?'.

I mean as someone pointed out, RF scumread was literally my

only

major scumread that I even pushed D1.
It is impossible for me to push for RF lynch as a compromise when he was literally my only major scumread that I even bothered pushing D1.

I only said that wagon was "compromise" because it probably was for others. It wasn't for me.
#StillTakingFullResponsibiliy #StillNoRegret #StillJustice

You were on the RF wagon for about half the day. That's not compromise. That's going for the low hanging fruit.

[GuyInFreezer]

I only said that wagon was "compromise"

because it probably was for others

. It wasn't for me.

OK, and does like concern you at all?

No?
He was my scumread and I wanted him lynched?
And this game is a multiball so it is totally acceptable and understandable that scum would be on different scum wagon?

You were on the RF wagon for about half the day. That's not compromise.

Good grief.
I literally just said that

I

was not compromising, and explained how it was impossible for me to compromise on RF wagon in the first place.

That's going for the low hanging fruit.

I betcha you wouldn't have said this in Day 1, considering how agreeable (pressured, biased, whatever) you were to lynch him yesterday.
hindsight 10/10