Marvel Avengers Alliance - Game over

[smargaret]

Fourthing the deadline extension.

[jasonT1981]

new deadline

(expired on 2014-04-24 15:11:00)

till Day 4 Deadline

[T S O]

Laziness and focus of discussion on Smarg.

You'll have to be more specific than lazy, seeing as I've been doing my level fucking best to hang smargaret-scum all day.

I agree I've been focusing discussion on smargaret. You're calling smargaret scum, however. So what you're saying here is that after Zekrom got lynched d1, I did my best to focus discussion and lynches on my other scumpartner, because I ...have a death wish?

Thanks for posting that, I guess. It was exactly what I expected, but it at least reassures me you're scum, because I don't think town-Thor could be this unbelievably dense.

At this point, Bulba's scumhunting effort is even more desolate than Smargaret's. It was better before, but it has completely disintegrated today.

And I'm sure the early claiming and setup discussions, along with my V/LA, had nothing to do with it. And it's not like I've been pushing my biggest scumread. Nope, I'm obviously doing nothing.

You're pushing me really badly, and contributing nothing to anything else. You have no read on smargaret, you're not talking to anyone, your read on Thor is unclear and you're damn inactive to boot. So yeah, CTD's hit the nail on the head here.

The fact that Bulba still won't analyse Smargaret is baffling to me and what little he has to say (Spider-Man being a fake claim would upset him) is bizarre.

First, the fact that I can't make heads or tails of Smargaret doesn't mean I haven't analyzed her.

Actually, the net result is the same. I'll put into simple English what you can't:

I do not have a fucking clue about anything whatsoever relating to smargaret. Sorry.

Second, I feel that at this point in the game it's more beneficial to focus on my actual scumreads, since that will tell me more about this game than going after a non-scumread would.

You don't HAVE a read on smargaret; cover it up all you want, Bulba, but that's the truth and it's pretty clear. It's the day before LyLo and you're perfectly okay tunnelling on me while there's a player out there who you don't even have an opinion on. This should bother you. Why doesn't it?

Finally, did you ever consider I'm a big Spider-Man fan and would hate for the mod to use that character as a fake claim? It has nothing to do with my thoughts on Smargaret's alignment, just my fandom of the character in general and part of my overall hesitance.

This is such a pile of horse manure. Whether Spider-Man is or isn't a fakeclaim (hint: it quite probably is) your hesitance has fucking nothing to do with that. You're excusing your laziness by making excuses, and it's pretty damn obvious. This story is so stupidly implausible I don't know why you're posting it.

S-ss-SPIDERMAN FAKECLAIM? *breaks down uncontrollably*

His TSO read is weak and problematic.

I don't think so. It's certainly stronger than the crap case you're presenting.

Your case is shockingly bad. It consists of Zekrom-TSO, which I've proven before and will prove again, just for you, is rubbish and it also has, ehhh, ummm, errr, nothing at all apart from that. Quite literally, that's your case, and you think it's strong?

Bulba claims that he's trying to accomplish a TSO lynch, but he has done preciously little to actually get there.

Yes, because stating repeatedly that TSO is scum and trying to get people to vote him is doing little to acquire a lynch.

"Please vote TSO, I don't have a case on him really, his d1 interactions are sorta bad I guess, please vote TSO" is not a meaningful attempt to lynch me, nor should you expect for a second people will follow it.

The only thing he's accomplishing right now with his play is to not disrupt a Smargaret lynch.

You got me there. I figure if no one will lynch TSO-scum, then a Smargaret lynch will at least be informative.

Why does this feel like you know smargaret's gonna flip Town?

If anything, I think they'd want to stick to the lynch that would get rid of the strongest (or rather most active, to be modest) available town player, and that implicates Thor and Bulba.

You've seen me as scum. When have I ever gone out of my way to try to get the strongest town player lynched? Those are my preferred NKs, not my preferred lynches.

I haven't seen you push Thor this game at all, incidentally. And strong Town players have been dying - penguin_alien, for example. I know you think I'm pretty weak, and now you're pushing me ...wait a minute, isn't this your scum meta?

Furthermore, are you really saying that I claimed VT as scum, even thought I was going last and knew it was a power light setup?

This is a really bad argument which is WIFOM as fuck but I believe in trying to sort WIFOM out, so I'll try.

What would you have claimed that would have been a strong and safe fakeclaim for scum? On another train of thought, why would you claim a PR when there were already three claims? Is there meta of scum-Bulba doing this before?

Is your big case really that Bulba as scum is stupid and lurky, even though you've seen plenty of evidence to the contrary?

Town Bulba isn't stupid and lurky either, and you're being both of those things today.

My paranoia levels are starting to notice - it's occurred to me that BRO should have found it suspicious when Thor wasn't dead.

I thought he did?

Then go and find it and show it to me, instead of vaguely contradicting me. Do try a little, dear.

Of the four VT claims, I'm most confident that TSO's is legit.

On another note, I looked back over TSO's posts d3, and I'm not sure what it was I saw.

Guys, I did my best to misrep TSO's play and I still couldn't find a way to scumread him.

He's clearly scum.

There is a big trend of him being very appeasing, especially to CTD.

This is where you show how you think I was appeasing CTD and I show you how you're wrong yet again.

I also didn't like how he misrepped my view on Smargaret, even though I had stated repeatedly what it was.

Then you're going to love this post, because you've never had a read on smargaret because you never wanted to commit to one. No misrepping involved, Bulba.

It appears like he was copying CTD's thoughts more than actually advancing his own, similar to what he did with Porkens and Thor on d1.

Ohhh yeah, I remember this argument! Thor nailed you d1 and when I resurrected that, you said I was sheeping Thor, though Thor had already moved on!

You were dead fucking wrong there as well, I don't sheep people in general and I certainly wasn't sheeping Thor by ...picking up a idea he'd discarded.

I can't even remember anything Porkens posted, except for one thing about Zekrom being a scum lynch, which I disagreed with vehemently. So no, I doubt I was sheeping Porkens either.

Given that the TSO wagon is tied with Smargaret's and my own, I'm not going to move my vote. I'd appreciate it if more people would vote TSO, though.

Well, that seems fair, seeing as you don't even have a read on one of the leading wagons today and you obviously don't have an intention to obtain one ...and the other wagon's you.

[T S O]

Jesus, that took me fucking ages.

I'll try to do TSO-Zekrom tonight, but I can't promise anything, I have other games I need to catch up on.

[Bulbazak]

At this point, Bulba's scumhunting effort is even more desolate than Smargaret's. It was better before, but it has completely disintegrated today.

And I'm sure the early claiming and setup discussions, along with my V/LA, had nothing to do with it. And it's not like I've been pushing my biggest scumread. Nope, I'm obviously doing nothing.

You're pushing me really badly, and contributing nothing to anything else.

It's like you didn't read the actual post you're commenting on, but felt the need to comment on it anyway, because, hey, somebody is insinuating you're scum. You can't have that. Must...Not...Be...Suspected...

You have no read on smargaret

I think I said that. Are you a parrot?

you're not talking to anyone

All my posts must be an illusion then.

your read on Thor is unclear

I'm pretty sure I've been calling him town all game and am only paranoid about him now due to PoE reasons.

and you're damn inactive to boot.

I'm sure that V/LA that lasted half the day phase had nothing to do with it...

So yeah, CTD's hit the nail on the head here.

"Hey CTD!" TSO says, "Be my buddy!"

The fact that Bulba still won't analyse Smargaret is baffling to me and what little he has to say (Spider-Man being a fake claim would upset him) is bizarre.

First, the fact that I can't make heads or tails of Smargaret doesn't mean I haven't analyzed her.

Actually, the net result is the same. I'll put into simple English what you can't:

I do not have a fucking clue about anything whatsoever relating to smargaret. Sorry.

Yes, except you conveniently left out the part where I said that didn't mean I hadn't done any analysis.

You don't HAVE a read on smargaret; cover it up all you want, Bulba, but that's the truth and it's pretty clear. It's the day before LyLo and you're perfectly okay tunnelling on me while there's a player out there who you don't even have an opinion on. This should bother you. Why doesn't it?

I'm relying more on PoE, like I did in Fire Emblem. I have a strong scumread and 2 others that could be connected with him. It is better, imo, to lynch the scumread I'm surer on, and then use the night phase going back over ISOs given the information obtained to figure out who the likely partner is. Given 2 pools of {Thor, TSO} and {Smargaret, TSO}, it only makes sense that I lynch TSO first. What about that aren't you getting?

Finally, did you ever consider I'm a big Spider-Man fan and would hate for the mod to use that character as a fake claim? It has nothing to do with my thoughts on Smargaret's alignment, just my fandom of the character in general and part of my overall hesitance.

This is such a pile of horse manure. Whether Spider-Man is or isn't a fakeclaim (hint: it quite probably is) your hesitance has fucking nothing to do with that. You're excusing your laziness by making excuses, and it's pretty damn obvious. This story is so stupidly implausible I don't know why you're posting it.

S-ss-SPIDERMAN FAKECLAIM? *breaks down uncontrollably*

Let it be understood that I am a huge fan, having a collection that takes up 5 long boxes. I'm sure anyone who is a fan of a character would hate for their favorite character to end up being a fake claim. However, you will notice that I never said that was my primary reason for not wanting to lynch Smargaret today. Is it a contributing factor? Yes, but not by much. You focusing on it in this way is a strawman argument designed to paint a perfectly natural non-gameplay reaction as scummy.

Your case is shockingly bad. It consists of Zekrom-TSO, which I've proven before and will prove again, just for you, is rubbish and it also has, ehhh, ummm, errr, nothing at all apart from that. Quite literally, that's your case, and you think it's strong?

The Zekrom wagon and flip are by far the most important pieces of evidence that we have in this game. I have been using them to try to find the scum team since Zekrom flipped scum. Given that we are in PoE mode, those types of associative tells are even more important. Out of everyone in the VTs, you protected Zekrom the strongest and sought desperately to derail his lynch. Heck, you even tried to capitalize on my earlier suspicion to create a counter wagon to Zekrom. Given all this, a case primarily based on your actions d1 is not shockingly bad, but actually quite solid. Throw in some later appeasing behavior and buddying, and my case is a veritable slam dunk.

"Please vote TSO, I don't have a case on him really, his d1 interactions are sorta bad I guess, please vote TSO" is not a meaningful attempt to lynch me, nor should you expect for a second people will follow it.

This is a huge misrep of me, especially when I've repeatedly stated my case and have pushed your scumminess when I saw it.

The only thing he's accomplishing right now with his play is to not disrupt a Smargaret lynch.

You got me there. I figure if no one will lynch TSO-scum, then a Smargaret lynch will at least be informative.

Why does this feel like you know smargaret's gonna flip Town?

I don't see how you'd get that from what I said. Smargaret has been the center of attention for most of the game, so of course her flip would provide plenty of information. Just like Zekrom, interactions around her wagon are a treasure trove of information that can only be enhanced by a flip. However, your reaction, which is in direct conflict with your push on Smargaret, is making me not want to be on that wagon whatsoever.

I haven't seen you push Thor this game at all, incidentally. And strong Town players have been dying - penguin_alien, for example.

What are you trying to say? That Thor and I are scum partners? Do you still believe that Smargaret is scum, given that you are pursuing this angle?

I know you think I'm pretty weak, and now you're pushing me ...wait a minute, isn't this your scum meta?

This push is pretty scummy. Especially since we've played twice together as town, and especially after Fire Emblem, I know for a fact that you aren't a weak player. This is just mudslinging.

What would you have claimed that would have been a strong and safe fakeclaim for scum?

You don't think I'd be upset with a Thor VT fake claim as scum and not want to claim something appropriate? Heck, I could have claimed Vengeful. Given the power light setup, that claim would have fit right in and been appropriate flavor-wise.

On another train of thought, why would you claim a PR when there were already three claims?

Yes, because an uberpowerful claim that essentially justifies the role cop by itself and a mason claim from a pair of players previously under suspicion would make me think twice about fakeclaiming as scum.

Is there meta of scum-Bulba doing this before?

Random Mafia S. I fake claimed Doctor and pulled off the win.

Is your big case really that Bulba as scum is stupid and lurky, even though you've seen plenty of evidence to the contrary?

Town Bulba isn't stupid and lurky either, and you're being both of those things today.

And that certainly doesn't have anything to do with the V/LA and tiredness/apathy that I've been feeling site wide. I'm sure a brief glance of my more recent games would show you that activity from me is not alignment indicative, as it ripples across all my games. Again, trying to connect activity to my alignment this game is a low attack.

My paranoia levels are starting to notice - it's occurred to me that BRO should have found it suspicious when Thor wasn't dead.

I thought he did?

Then go and find it and show it to me, instead of vaguely contradicting me. Do try a little, dear.

My main issue with the Yates kill (and also to a degree with the Porkens kill) is why Thor hasn't been shot yet.

Of the four VT claims, I'm most confident that TSO's is legit.

On another note, I looked back over TSO's posts d3, and I'm not sure what it was I saw.

Guys, I did my best to misrep TSO's play and I still couldn't find a way to scumread him.

He's clearly scum.

No, it means that I thought I remembered something from d3 that I found scummy, but when I went back through your ISO, I couldn't find it. Why would I, as scum, admit to misrembering after an ISO search, instead of misrepping your posts and stretching to make a case, as I've been known to do as scum (mainly due to the pressure of having to back up my assertions, however false)? You are not showing the scum motivation here, instead only implying it exists so that you can play the victim.

That

is scum misrepresentation.

There is a big trend of him being very appeasing, especially to CTD.

This is where you show how you think I was appeasing CTD and I show you how you're wrong yet again.

CTD, we're on the same lines and this makes you town as all fuck.

I feel like I'm really detached from this game at the moment. You've basically taken my opinions, made them better and articulated them a lot better.

It's rather demeaning.

Maybe buddying is the better word.

I also didn't like how he misrepped my view on Smargaret, even though I had stated repeatedly what it was.

Then you're going to love this post, because you've never had a read on smargaret because you never wanted to commit to one. No misrepping involved, Bulba.

Bulba seems to be Townreading smargaret for pursuing cxinlee who he was scumreading. The read hasn't evolved; he's a possible partner.

This after countless posts arguing with CTD that this wasn't what I was doing. You ignored all that and copied CTD's reasoning verbatim.

It appears like he was copying CTD's thoughts more than actually advancing his own, similar to what he did with Porkens and Thor on d1.

Ohhh yeah, I remember this argument! Thor nailed you d1 and when I resurrected that, you said I was sheeping Thor, though Thor had already moved on!

You were dead fucking wrong there as well, I don't sheep people in general and I certainly wasn't sheeping Thor by ...picking up a idea he'd discarded.

I can't even remember anything Porkens posted, except for one thing about Zekrom being a scum lynch, which I disagreed with vehemently. So no, I doubt I was sheeping Porkens either.

Except I never said you were sheeping Thor. I said you were buddying Thor. I do love how you tried to change the particulars of the argument there.

More TSO votes would be lovely.

[T S O]

I don't think you understand the term "appeasing". You seem to be mixing it up with "agreeing". I am not allowed to

agree

with CTD in any manner or you term it

appeasing

. Get out your dictionary, they're completely different and I cannot comprehend how me

agreeing

with CTD on things is scummy. I apologize for agreeing with people. It's a major flaw of mine.

But this is, after all, one of your main points, that I've been "appeasing" people all game. Thor, CTD, Porkens, I've appeased them all, has been your general gist so far, right? Let's talk about the people I've "appeased".

In relation to Porkens, you've brought it up once, without any quotes to back it up. I've denied it and you haven't replied, so I'm going to assume you were just mudslinging to try to embellish your accusations.

In relation to Thor, I still don't understand how reviving an argument Thor threw aside is ...buddying him. I can think of many ways I'd buddy Thor, but reviving an argument isn't one of them. The reason you're using this is because mean old TSO thought you were a scumfuck d1, which you were, and attacked you legitimately. Seeing as you have to OMGUS everyone who attacks you, you had no other option but to call it scummy. I don't blame you. I's an unfortunate idiosyncrasy of your play.

In relation to CTD, I really want to get into this. You're wrong on so many things here and if you don't want to see it I guess I'll just have to fucking show you.

Firstly, why would I appease CTD? Why was there a need to appease CTD when I'm almost sure he was always Townreading me? If I -was- going to appease someone, I'd try to appease Thor, because Thor, you see, was a universal Townread, whereas CTD wasn't. So unless you can explain why I absolutely had to "appease" CTD, this point is complete rubbish.

More to the point, why would I appease arguably the most suspected player in the game? Thor was strongly scumreading CTD, so what was the point in me appeasing CTD? It wasn't like his reads would have carried huge weight to other players with suspicions on him so strong. Again, my motivation doesn't make sense for scum-TSO, and you need to explain this, because once again it's bullshit.

The problem with your analysis of my play is it's rotten to the core. You're not analysing any of my motivations, because you know they won't align with your suspicions of me. I'm having to fucking analyse my OWN motivations in order to explain to you why they're not scummy at all. I don't understand why you don't want to even contemplate me being Town. It's clear that I'm wasting my time talking to you, because you're so far in the tunnel you can't see light, but I just don't understand why.

[T S O]

Oh, I see you've changed your argument to me buddying CTD, because you couldn't find me "appeasing" once!

CTD echoed all my reads, including my read of smargaret as strong scum. This made him very likely Town, seeing as our conclusions were the exact same.

And CTD -is- more articulate than me. I'm not buddying him by saying that. He'd basically took over my space by being better than me.

And that's it, that's all you've got? 2 measly quotes?

[T S O]

When you go back and try your damned best to find evidence of me appeasing/buddying a player, and you get two rather ambiguous quotes, this is where the fucking Town alarm bells should begin to go off in your head. DING DING, I CAN'T FIND EVIDENCE OF TSO BEING SCUMMY, MAYBE, JUST MAYBE, TSO ISN'T SCUM.

How the fuck can you not see this?

[T S O]

I'd made out a succinct post replying to your wall in bullet form, because I know people will just skip over my posts if it's a wall, but a General Error fucked me, so I guess I'm re-doing it, with my Zek-TSO post to come too.

[T S O]

Peregrine, where the actual fuck are you? Get in here.

[T S O]

Zekrom wagon is shamefully poor. No-one here can read him whatsoever, but almost no-one has admitted they don't have a clue about him. I'd be very surprised if there isn't scum on Zekrom right now, potentially multiple scum.

More to the point, I think you're mistaking Zekrom being an absolute moron for Zekrom being scum. You have a lot of interactions with him which are just him being supernaturally dense as opposed to scummy.

Is this a policy lynch or a scum lynch?

I don't think Zekrom is more likely to be a Village Idiot than scum. I'm saying he's an idiot no matter what and no-one here can read him for shit. Thus, as I've said before, he's quite literally a coinflip in terms of flipping scum.

Porkens calling it a policy lynch and a scum lynch as well really irks me.

But if he's an idiot no matter what, wouldn't we do well to get rid of him? Either way, we get rid of a problem player, because he's either scum, or he's going to work against us as we get closer to endgame. Why are you so adamant that he shouldn't be lynched period?

I'm not incredibly adamant he shouldn't be lynched, though I'm against policy lynches in general. Burned too many times by them. My problem is that some people expect him to flip scum. He won't.

These are the relevant quotes regarding me and Zekrom.

As you can see, my problem is with people calling Zekrom a scum lynch. He wasn't. He was a policy lynch which hit scum.

This is a big part of your case, Bulba, so let's be specific in why I'm scum for these.

[Thor665]

I would say I skimmed everything since my last post - but that would be a lie, since 'scrolling past without reading' isn't the same thing.

I think CTD's read on TSO/Thor is bad...but...meh, duh.
I think TSO still flapping about Thor/Smarg is bad...and also he keeps changing his story and is also talking Bulb/Smarg.
I would have opposed deadline extension.
Pere does need a prod though.

@Mod - requesting immediate Pere prod once the Easter v/la ends

Carrying on carrying on.

[T S O]

Wait a minute, smargaret, you took the exact same stances as me!

I hadn't even noticed that until there - you hypocritical scumfuck!

[T S O]

god I can't work with anyone here

[T S O]

thank you, Thor, for that incisive post, which comments on current events and shows you've been analysing recent discussion.

[T S O]

I think TSO still flapping about Thor/Smarg is bad...and also he keeps changing his story and is also talking Bulb/Smarg.

I agree. If only I had inside information so that I could be sure who it was.

Oh well, I guess I'll just have to interact with them and filter reads out that way. It seems terribly inefficient and outdated. The cool kids these days do nothing but be unhelpful and arrogant. Maybe I'll try that.

[Thor665]

thank you, Thor, for that incisive post, which comments on current events and shows you've been analysing recent discussion.

I have been on record for a while now that I just want to flip Smargaret - and openly stated lack of interest in the conversations happening. I guess you have proven you read my post. Good work.

[BROseidon]

Ugh, walls.

Will read them later.

[PeregrineV]

Peregrine, where the actual fuck are you? Get in here.

Out collecting Easter eggs. But I'm here now.

[T S O]

thank you, Thor, for that incisive post, which comments on current events and shows you've been analysing recent discussion.

I have been on record for a while now that I just want to flip Smargaret - and openly stated lack of interest in the conversations happening. I guess you have proven you read my post. Good work.

If only I could say the same to you.

[PeregrineV]

In this case, I have reasoning for my strongest reads, but for some, like Smargaret, it's more of an impression I've gotten while going through the game, and I can't honestly tell you why. I wish I could, but I can't. There's something telling me she's likely to be town, and I can't figure out for the life of me what it is, and seeing as how I have several stronger scumspects, that's good enough for me. I won't be voting her, but I won't say that I'll cry if she gets lynched.

Not really. Still not interested in lynching her.

I have no clue on Smargaret. However, I wouldn't balk at her lynch, and if I get back, and no one is willing to lynch TSO, I'll compromise on her.

First, the fact that I can't make heads or tails of Smargaret doesn't mean I haven't analyzed her. Second, I feel that at this point in the game it's more beneficial to focus on my actual scumreads, since that will tell me more about this game than going after a non-scumread would.

Yes, except you conveniently left out the part where I said that didn't mean I hadn't done any analysis.

@Bulba

- based on your evolving smarg non-read, I would very much like to see all the details of your analysis you mention in 1360 & 1379.

[PeregrineV]

24 hours and 10 minutes later.

Hey Bulba, 1395.

[PeregrineV]

I would say I skimmed everything since my last post - but that would be a lie, since 'scrolling past without reading' isn't the same thing.

I think CTD's read on TSO/Thor is bad...but...meh, duh.
I think TSO still flapping about Thor/Smarg is bad...and also he keeps changing his story and is also talking Bulb/Smarg.
I would have opposed deadline extension.
Pere does need a prod though.

@Mod - requesting immediate Pere prod once the Easter v/la ends

Carrying on carrying on.

So is the scumteam, in your opinion, Bulba/TSO, Bulba/Smarg, TSO/smarg, or some other pair?

[Thor665]

So is the scumteam, in your opinion, Bulba/TSO, Bulba/Smarg, TSO/smarg, or some other pair?

I have openly claimed TSO/Smarg in thread. TSO has had many long rants about me doing so and it's the central basis of the current issue he has with me. I can provide a link if you need it, but I feel I've been pretty clear on my thoughts.

[PeregrineV]

So is the scumteam, in your opinion, Bulba/TSO, Bulba/Smarg, TSO/smarg, or some other pair?

I have openly claimed TSO/Smarg in thread. TSO has had many long rants about me doing so and it's the central basis of the current issue he has with me. I can provide a link if you need it, but I feel I've been pretty clear on my thoughts.

Just want to trace the evolution from the game start.