Yellowstone

[Infinity 324]

Read my posts

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I think you need a fancy complex explanation for why flea was NKed to begin with, fae wasn't particularly obvtown and faer reads weren't that great iirc?

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Sorry JV, I kinda want to lim DGB without you and find the partner tomorrow.

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JV, I don't get how "scum killed the player that was gonna die to the PGO" isn't a tinfoil

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I haven't read up, I had a migraine today

@Mark: I don't think JV/DGB is possible because the setup wouldn't pass balance. Theoretically the other scum could be a roleblocker

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Who's scum with noraa DGB? And why did you block guillo n2 over noraa?

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Who's scum with noraa DGB?

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I haven't read up, I had a migraine today

@Mark: I don't think JV/DGB is possible because the setup wouldn't pass balance. Theoretically the other scum could be a roleblocker

So let's say DGB is scum here (as you seem to think). That would mean that they would have to have some unusual modifier or JV would be dead if telling the truth.

I can see arguments for a DGB/JV scumteam here (no kill N2 makes more sense if claimed RB is scum) or for Noraa (quickhammer d4) but I'm finding it hard to see DGB being scum here without JV. Who do you see as being a potential partner?

I was looking at some mini-normals to get an idea of how many PRs in a 13p is typical and consider this game with masons - https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=83883 where there are 3 masons w/ a mason+, no other TPRs and multiple scum PRs. If that's balanced, then are you trying to tell me that 6 TPRs here is balanced?? As that is what we would have if DGB/JV are town.

You or noraa is the partner.

You keep talking about 6 TPRs, but one of those is a PGO, which is negative utility. One of those is a fruit vendor, which barely adds anything. One of those is DGB, who is scum. The masons and JV have all the power in the town. Yeah it's a decent amount of power but it's by no means super townsided.

[Infinity 324]

Scum could have no-killed/cross-killed to set up three Town eliminations at once. Vax followed by the blocked (Gills), followed by DGB themself which is actually playing out right now to be completely honest.

But it's not 3 elims if DGB blocked noraa which it was probably going to do lmao

You're literally not nightkilling in order to guilty your own teammate. It makes zero fucking sense and nothing anyone has said has convinced me otherwise.

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Ok so it's mark/DGB.

VOTE: DGB

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All of mark's logic points towards DGB being scum, but he's gonna vote noraa anyway. Make that make sense.

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JV can you at least look at the d1 interactions to see if they make any sense if me/noraa are the team?

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This still feels like scum to me tho. Sending.
VOTE: Horsewoman

This vote was not really backed up by mark's previous reads (he had been going back and forth on horse), and happened right as the DGB wagon was gaining traction.

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Yeah the mason's instincts were on point, it was kind of a tinfoil but now that we have no other explanation for the missing kill n2 it has to be a gambit. If it's a gambit, scum needed to have control over the guilty for it to make sense.

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Rolestopper

This probably makes the most sense to dodge all the investigative power from town.

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Mathblade too! Sorry masons for not listening to you earlier

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scum!DGB mechanically means JV is lying unless DGB has some very specific role modifier

To me, there is a 0% chance that both DGB and JV are scum due to balance concerns. There are a few possibilities that let JV be town when DGB is scum:

-Night-specific ascetic (ok, this is admittedly unlikely)
-Roleblocker (the more I think about this, it could make a decent amount of sense. This is the role that DGB claimed, and due to setup spec it knew that there was missing town power. Maybe it thought JV had more shots on their vig. Note that I don't believe any RBable town PRs claimed on d2, besides the fruit vendor.)
-Rolestopper (this could make sense to counter all the town investigatives. The question is why scum would use it on n2 after DGB was semi-cleared after guiltying pig. Maybe they thought the only way DGB get limmed would be to a guilty.)

[Infinity 324]

And at least one of us is mason+

Ok, they did say this but it was unclear which one scum should block. They probably figured JV was underclaiming their power.

N1 scum probably no killed to confirm DGB's claim.

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I'm ok losing to an 1000 IQ gambit, would've liked a win here but it happens.

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Dw we still win after yeeting you Infinity owo

I wish. I don't twilight troll.

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This setup was absurdly scumsided lol

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I had decent reads, I knew DGB/JV made the most sense from a mechanics perspective, I just refused to believe that town needed a PGO when we had not much power to begin with.

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This setup was absurdly scumsided lol

all scum had was a roleblocker, I mean maaaayyybe town didn't have that much power but I don't really feel it was that scumsided or townsided but I'm bias b/c this is my setup idea so...

Maybe "absurdly scumsided" is exaggerating a bit. But like, fruit vendor isn't power, motion detector is barely power, so town had to rely on 2 conftowns and a RC/tracker and that's it. And we had a PGO.

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I was really obvtown.

You can’t really claim this for yourself its not really how it works

I definitely was. Infinity saw it.

Lol I was so paranoid of a DGB/you scumteam lol

In the end I didn't think scum!you would play like this.

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Be honest Noraa, if DGB flipped standard scum RB would you have elimed me tomorrow over JV?

Yes but only for setup spec reasons.

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JV played really well, the gambit was inspired. Scum played really well.

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the point of the PGO at least from my pov was to serve as a quasi IC. Like, scum are just going to leave that alone and unless you guys lynched it (wich u did) its gonna be there for the whole game. or maybe that makes sense to no one else but me.

This game was weird because of the scum gambit, I do think that scum PGO could be a real role and scum could claim PGO to avoid being investigated and stuff. It's negative utility because it can't be sorted by night actions, but I suppose it's not terrible for town to have one.

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Thanks nero

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I probably just have terrible setup spec then

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Yeah tbf I think massclaim is correct pretty often there, scum gambiting fucked it up though.