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Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:37 am
by tea leaves
Ja, I agree with Isis
Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:38 am
by Bell
Have I mentioned yet that I ‘m conflicted between isis and Mt and tea leaves because the only one who isn’t giving me a hard time is MT.
While isis is positioning herself precisely for this moment.
Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:40 am
by Bell
I think I really like this player list and am glad that if I get eliminated I can still bother you guys unless I get burnt to a crisp.
Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:40 am
by Bell
It’s hard though when you guys are clearly all strategizing. I don’t know which ones are coming from a town mindset and which ones are coming from a scum one.
Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:41 am
by tea leaves
Are you saying Morning is sus because she isn't giving you a hard time, or not sus?
Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:42 am
by tea leaves
I hate that I find Isis's dream post towny, buuuuut I thought that post was towny.
Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:43 am
by Bell
I dunno what to say to that. They make sense to me.
If you’re wondering, i’ve used this to correctly and incorrectly identify scum before I have as both scum in multi ball(I was wrong, but my reads were fantastic otherwise!) and town (on white lion in a newbie game). The tell originated from white lion.
Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:44 am
by Bell
In post 2754, tea leaves wrote:Are you saying Morning is sus because she isn't giving you a hard time, or not sus?
It’s sus.
I’m not as experienced as you are, but I’ve been bitten by the that particular archetype of mafia before.
Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:49 am
by Bell
Also, i would appreciate it if you could explain why that argument is bad sometime.
It’s not like most scum tells are any good or more rigorous than that one.
Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:49 am
by tea leaves
Depends on the context though. If Morning was saying she thought you could be scum while not actively pushing you, it's sus. But she's instead calling you town and defending you, and I think she believes in her reasons for it.
Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:52 am
by tea leaves
In post 2758, Bell wrote:
Also, i would appreciate it if you could explain why that argument is bad sometime.
It’s not like most scum tells are any good or more rigorous than that one.
Well, the only way Ydrasse was "pocketing" Isis was being friendly to her. But being friendly is obviously not a scumtell, and was infact town-indicative for Ydrasse before this game.
Remind me: Was Ydrasse pocketing Isis in any other way or was it just that?
Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:54 am
by Bell
I do too and I think there are a lot of reasons she isn’t scum this game.
But I will always be paranoid about the player that doesn’t offend anyone and tackles tea leaves in the side when it’s safe to do so.
Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:57 am
by Bell
When I say pocketing I mean she was focused on normalizing relations. It was a focus for her. She chatted mostly and hunted little.
I have a perfect post about meta realignment when it comes to ydrasse and why her being relaxed didn’t mean she wasn’t scum especially when she seemed to be trying to convince herself to be relaxed as a method of method acting.
Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:59 am
by Farren
In post 2722, Bell wrote:I’m willing to vote tea leaves now. I’m sorry and exasperated but you’ve missed context so many times that this is just bad faith argument at this point. Your view point is so stilted and unable to see context that i’m Having trouble seeing you as being anything other than clumsy scum.
Bell, can you give me an example of tea leaves missing context with respect to you from this game specifically? Or have all of the cases been from missing context in SIN (or other games)?
Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:00 am
by Bell
I also think friendliness is a town tell and say as much later. But there’s A difference between being friendly and buddying on purpose as a part of inoculating yourself from being voted.
Perhaps I should say that when I think about friendliness i’m Looking to see hesitation to engage or speak with someone on a personal level. Where they avoid interaction because thy’re Not on the same team.
Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:01 am
by tea leaves
Everyone else saw that as Ydrasse just being friendly/NAI, but you saw nefarious intent where others didn't. That's the TMI aspect of it that I'm (Isis was) talking about.
What's the post on meta realignment?
Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:05 am
by Bell
In post 749, Bell wrote:Talking to people isn't townie if you're at all competent at this game you're aware that doing so is the bare minimum if you care about not getting eliminated. You've mentioned before in other games that A: You were stressed that you were scum and B: That competent scum will change to adjust for their own meta. Isis has looked at A, but either ignored or doesn't care about B.
It's not a town tell and saying it is without explaining why it is, is not convincing me that it's the opposite of what I said.
Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:07 am
by Bell
In post 2763, Farren wrote: In post 2722, Bell wrote:I’m willing to vote tea leaves now. I’m sorry and exasperated but you’ve missed context so many times that this is just bad faith argument at this point. Your view point is so stilted and unable to see context that i’m Having trouble seeing you as being anything other than clumsy scum.
Bell, can you give me an example of tea leaves missing context with respect to you from this game specifically? Or have all of the cases been from missing context in SIN (or other games)?
I’ll look. I think there were two or three.
Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:11 am
by tea leaves
In post 750, Bell wrote:Oh, I see this is a beeboy vote where you flip them and then sort them afterward.
What did you mean here after that post?
Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:20 am
by Bell
In post 746, Ydrasse wrote:yes, you are right, my vote on tea leaves was for nothing more than fun.
In post 748, Ydrasse wrote:i actually mean it when i am putting a vote on someone and providing reasons and interacting with them. :>
p-edit: i do like campfires...
I was being snippy and defensive at the time when I made the beeboy point due to pressure. (Nahdia has a quote about beeboy from a game I played with her. I guess he might have a habit of death tunneling).
The next post was to balance myself out and try to be more fair by saying that I *could* see where she might be doing what she said she was doing.
Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:28 am
by Farren
Unofficial vote tally:
[2] Something_Smart : Dunnstral, Isis
[2] tea leaves : Morning Tweet, Bell
[1] Bell: tea leaves
[2] Not Voting : Something_Smart, Farren
Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:38 am
by tea leaves
New reads:
Morning/Hobbes > Farren > Isis > Bell
I finally agree that Hobbes's bussing and then unvoting and vanity pushing Bell last second is extremely unlikely to come from scum.
Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:40 am
by Bell
In post 2249, tea leaves wrote: In post 1701, Bell wrote:Seriously though, please don't partner me with Ydrasse, it's insulting. If I was scum this game, I would never have been able to pull that off with Ydrasse scum.
At least partner me with someone that makes sense.
Like tealeaves.
Yeaaah, about this... I don't get why you'd be "insulted" that you were partnered with Ydrasse if you don't think scum!you is good enough to pull that off. Isn't that a compliment rather than an insult?
The rest is all sin I think. With his initial case and subsequent cases not having anything like a counter argument to their own reasoning
I’m also weirded out because I told tea leaves that I knew everything I said would be easily verifiable but he continued down the road of miscontextualizing my posts in other games. When I played in them and can easily dismantle any such miscontextualization.
This brought me down the road of thinking he was being too clumsy to be scum and they would care more about making sure they didn’t misrepresent me, but then I realized that that’s kind of NAI because it’s not good for either alignment to do so. But one relies on me being able to defend myself while the other requires effort on his part. I understand time constraints but this really was not handled well.
Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:42 am
by tea leaves
In post 1144, Isis wrote:Ydrasse has lots of detractors but MT is one of the Ydrasse stans and she has lots of town equity
In post 1145, Morning Tweet wrote:dammit!!!
Ydrasse I will visit your stump biweekly to honour your legacy. i may sit on top of you from time to time (but only when im feeling really tired). i will definitely not carve anything into you!
If I'm scum, then I know you're telling the truth so miscontextualising serves no purpose other than making me look worse when you inevitably counter my points. You should read it as NAI at worse.
Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:43 am
by Bell
That’s what I just said. It really is NAI. Because first I thought you were town for it
