Page 27 of 30
Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 8:28 pm
by kunkstar7
Saki (3)
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StrangerCoug, Porkens, snscompt1
StrangerCoug (1)
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Saki
Snarky (1)
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Paschendale
Not Voting (4)
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RedCoyote, Aegor, The Rufflig, Snarky
With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.
Deadline for Day Four is in (expired on 2014-06-18 15:07:19).
Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 11:58 pm
by Snarky
I don't know about Saki's claim... It fits well...
VOTE: Paschendale
Better chance of hitting scum here.
Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 12:01 am
by Snarky
Oh and I'll switch Aegor and The Rufflig in my reads:
The RuffligL: meh
Aegor: Yep
Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 12:27 am
by snscompt1
I believe Sakis claim but will keep my vote where it is for now until I get a chance to reread some things.
Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 2:27 am
by The Rufflig
In post 648, Paschendale wrote: I don't really like his claim, in that he can use it to get a fake town confirmation on a buddy.
Well, RC has confirmed that he gave that ability to Snarky. It sounds like Snarky is subject to the one node away limitation on its use. Snarky himself has pretty much narrowed down his choice of targets down to 2. If you don't think either of them is one of Snarky's scum buddies then Snarky would be limited to clearing a townie.
He also ignores the fact that he could be killed by scum to setup a framejob on whoever he hides behind.
This argument relies on Snarky being town. I thought you wanted to lynch Snarky because you believed he is scum?
Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 5:34 am
by StrangerCoug
In post 651, Snarky wrote:I don't know about Saki's claim... It fits well...
VOTE: Paschendale
Better chance of hitting scum here.
Could you recap why you think Paschendale is better? I swear you've suspected him before, but I just woke up and I'm too lazy to go dig for it right now.
Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 6:23 am
by Paschendale
In post 654, The Rufflig wrote: In post 648, Paschendale wrote: I don't really like his claim, in that he can use it to get a fake town confirmation on a buddy.
Well, RC has confirmed that he gave that ability to Snarky. It sounds like Snarky is subject to the one node away limitation on its use. Snarky himself has pretty much narrowed down his choice of targets down to 2. If you don't think either of them is one of Snarky's scum buddies then Snarky would be limited to clearing a townie.
Where did this confirmation take place? I must have missed it.
He also ignores the fact that he could be killed by scum to setup a framejob on whoever he hides behind.
This argument relies on Snarky being town. I thought you wanted to lynch Snarky because you believed he is scum?
Neglecting to mention that flaw demonstrates that he is not truly thinking from a town mindset. He's not accounting for ways that scum could throw a wrench into his plan, which is something that scum don't need to account for. It is not the role itself that is suspect, it is how he is talking about it. You know, his content. What he is choosing to say and not say is showing a scum mentality and not a town mentality.
Also the weak ass OMGUS, but if there's anything Snarky is demonstrating lately, it's a lack of actual reads. As I showed in my previous post, his vote on IDK was "shamelessly bandwagoning" and now he'll "vote however". At this point, someone without real scumreads and a real target is either not paying attention, or are scum who can't come up with convincing lies. Snarky is clearly not doing the former, so he's the latter.
Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 7:33 am
by Aegor
VOTE: The Rufflig
Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 7:42 am
by The Rufflig
*sigh* First, Saki and now you. Here:
In post 577, RedCoyote wrote:
Snarky 569 wrote:He gave me a one-shot hider role. I die if I hide behind scum, so I thought I could use it as an investigation tool. At the same time, if I claim who I'm hiding behind, and that person is town, scum can kill that person, and him and I die, thus -2 townies..
If I may be blunt, I don't particularly appreciate you calling me out as the person who gave you the power, but alas, the cat has once again strayed from his bag. To anyone else that may or may not have received powers from me: please use it at your discretion. I gave them to you because I think you are town and I think you'll help the town with them.
I would have thought the cause of death would be a dead giveaway as to how Snarky died. I wouldn't expect a frame job to be possible.
Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 8:23 am
by The Rufflig
In post 649, Aegor wrote:I want a Saki or The Rufflig lynch today. Interesting posts below.
Some of that post was centered on me (or rather cxinlee's interaction with my slot), but it also looked like you had some strong suspicions of Snarky and an FOS on Pasch based on their interactions with cxinlee; (I don't get what you are trying to show with the SC quote). Why Saki, then?
Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 8:27 am
by Aegor
Calling for sns lynch (WTF?), not-so-believable claim, general lack of scumhunting.
Kind of on the fence about Snarky because although I find his content scummy, I also see the possible town motivation. I liked Pasch but re-reads have made be suspect him on feel/gut, but that could be the confirmation bias prompted by others' suspicions of him.
Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 2:48 pm
by RedCoyote
Saki 629 wrote:I'm an inventor that had stuff to give out D1.
I gave idk the Range Extender.
What's your role name specifically, Saki?
Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 4:26 pm
by Saki
In post 661, RedCoyote wrote:Saki 629 wrote:I'm an inventor that had stuff to give out D1.
I gave idk the Range Extender.
What's your role name specifically, Saki?
"Conscripted Inventor"
Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 4:26 pm
by Saki
UNVOTE:
VOTE: Aegor
I changed my mind and I want to start here
Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 4:59 pm
by RedCoyote
Saki is town.
Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 6:15 pm
by Aegor
In post 663, Saki wrote:UNVOTE:
VOTE: Aegor
I changed my mind and I want to start here
Explain plz.
Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 6:59 pm
by Saki
In post 640, Saki wrote:But he died before the next day so my giving him the Jailkeeper action wasn't successful.
So, I'm connected to Aegor, NS, and idk. I could give Jailkeeper and Range Extender to different targets.
I gave idk the Range Extender and NS the JK.
My thought process behind giving Nobody Special the JK instead of Aegor was because Aegor looked the least town to me during D1.
I'd rather waste the JK than give it to likely scum.
And on hindsight, I was probably right. There's probably a catch, along the lines of "oh, you're an inventor that might distribute PRs to scum."
So out of three of my targets, one is probably scum and the other two are probably town.
Two flipped town. Who's scum? Aegor.
^ this plus the fact that you didn't fly into a rage about why I gave Jailkeeper to the person that was obviously the d1 lynch in a nightless setup instead of you
you would, if you were town.
Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 7:10 pm
by Aegor
I am not following your reasoning at all; please explain it as you would to a young child. Also, I have barely been reading your posts, so maybe I should do that.
Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 8:15 pm
by Porkens
I'm lost red, what's the certainty from?
Posted: Fri Jun 06, 2014 5:18 am
by StrangerCoug
I'm still good with Saki. I get the feeling he's trying to be as useless as possible, and I don't get why Aegor not fussing over not getting the jailkeeper ability is indicative of any alignment at all. If Saki is scum, then Aegor is town. I'm willing to stake everything I own on that.
Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2014 2:52 am
by Snarky
StrangerCoug: Hmmm, just thought about it a little, and I don't feel the reasons I had for suspecting Pasch make sense anymore... I'm so confused now. Too many conftown.
To respond to Pasch's case onme:
In post 648, Paschendale wrote:I don't know how he justifies his notion about flips in 636. There's literally no evidence to back that up.
Indeed. That's why I added that I didn't have much experience with inventors. I wanted the input of other players, to tell me if, with inventors, the person granted a power role would flip with this power role, or as vanilla town (or whatever he was at the beginning of the game).
Why? I said it was because maybe it was Lylo.
In post 648, Paschendale wrote:The setup is what it is. Without more information, trying to outguess the setup to inform our lynches is no better than choosing at random.
I didn't use it to inform lynches. I even said it was nothing conclusive. I thought it was information so I wrote it down for people to see.
In post 648, Paschendale wrote:I don't like his "shameless wagoning", nor the completely nonsensical notion that walls are scummy
I admit I had problems with my reads when cxinlee flipped scum, and I still have. The "walls are scummy" thing was more of a meta argument. In his games where we know idk was town, he walled less and posted shorter posts between his walls. The fact that he posted not often here and with big walls felt like he wanted every of his posts to be perfect.=scum.
In post 648, Paschendale wrote:I don't really like his claim, in that he can use it to get a fake town confirmation on a buddy
As The Rufflig said, this doesn't make sense. It would mean you think SC is scum, yet you never expressed any suspicion whatsoever on SC.
In post 648, Paschendale wrote:He also ignores the fact that he could be killed by scum to setup a framejob on whoever he hides behind.
I have not ignored it, I just have not stated it out loud to give hints to scum. And even if I ignored it, I could just have forgotten something. How does it make me scum?
UNVOTE:
I need a reread...
Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2014 3:33 am
by Snarky
VOTE: Saki
After thinking about it a little, nothing prevents inventors from being scum. If Saki flips scum, then RedCoyote is too. I don't feel like both RedCoyote and Saki would have the same rolename, since RC seems to distribute one-shots and Saki distributes full power roles. Feels weird too that Saki decided to give the lame power role to idk and the good one to NS which was about to die. Also, "conscripted" doesn't feel town. "conscripted" means "forced to fight in a war you don't want to fight in". So, the inventors are scum that are forced to give power roles to town. Makes sense. RC scum would also explain:
-Cxinlee pointing out his "townslip"
-The death of beast, maybe.
Makes a lot of sense to me.
Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2014 6:57 am
by StrangerCoug
Do you have anything else for RedCoyote-scum?
Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2014 7:06 am
by The Rufflig
In post 669, StrangerCoug wrote:I don't get why Aegor not fussing over not getting the jailkeeper ability is indicative of any alignment at all.
It took me awhile to realize just what Saki was saying. IMO, Saki believes townies (not just Aegor) should be upset with her for
intentionally flushing a JK ability
.
I went back and looked at the timing. Saki replaced in about before the Day 1 deadline. kunkstar7 added another 24 hours to the deadline because of the replacement being so close to deadline. She saw NS was going to be lynched (L-1) and threw the JK to him knowing that it would pass out of the game with his lynch. She explains her reason for flushing it as a fear that the ability might end up in the hands of the scum. If she actually believed this explanation was reasonable, why would she think that any townie would be upset with her?
Assuming Saki's claim is true (which I don't), there were better ways to handle it.
1) Read the game to try and develop a read on her neighbors (she replaced in on page 14).
2) Take her predecessor's reads as a guide to giving out an ability.
3) Give out a different ability to gain time to read the game and develop her own reads.
and let's not forget
4) Do some scum hunting on your neighbors!
VOTE: Saki
Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2014 8:01 am
by snscompt1
Unless Im mistaken, that was a hammer.