Mini 438: Mutually Assured Destruction Mafia GAME OVER


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Post Post #75 (ISO) » Wed May 02, 2007 11:20 am

Post by now a ranger »

MoS isn't equally annoyed; he started it on page 1 in the same post as his random vote.

I say we lynch him for distracting the typical human who can't understand foreign languages. :D
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Post Post #76 (ISO) » Wed May 02, 2007 11:24 am

Post by Raffles »

Is a human being really that low, or is it just me that has human beings overrated?
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Post Post #77 (ISO) » Wed May 02, 2007 11:29 am

Post by now a ranger »

Vote: The Fonz
you're scum =D
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Post Post #78 (ISO) » Wed May 02, 2007 11:30 am

Post by The Fonz »

Mastermind of Sin wrote:Je peux dire que je veux...
Translation: I can say what i want... it's not a post restriction, apparently.


I'm certainly not thinking of claiming right now, but I wondered at what point such a strat might be viable... I'm thinking, not for a good while yet.
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Post Post #79 (ISO) » Wed May 02, 2007 11:46 am

Post by Yosarian2 »

There are still thousands of warheads loaded on operational systems and standing on high states of alert on virtually hair-trigger posture. And you have to ask yourself: Why is that? Who is the enemy? What is the threat?

U.S. General Lee Butler, Former Commander in Chief, U.S. Strategic Air Command in 1991-92.

Vote count, page 4.

3 Anlx (Theo, Jack, MOS)
3 The Fonz (NAR, Y, Pooky)

7 votes to initiate a UN millitary action against someone.

Nuclear weapons count: 0
I want us to win just for Yos' inevitable rant alone. -CrashTextDummie
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Post Post #80 (ISO) » Wed May 02, 2007 11:47 am

Post by PookyTheMagicalBear »

fonz wrote:Well, that's an interesting way to start. Milkman pretty much has to retaliate. I was going to begin by saying that the only situation in which it makes sense for a pro-towner to nuke is in retaliation, or if he is a power role and has been counterclaimed, and the town is about to lynch him. Anyone have a different plan?
does this sound like a scum gleefully hoping for townies to nuke each other at the beginning of the game to any1 else?
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It's like witnessing an slow but unavoidable train crash you can't stop."

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Post Post #81 (ISO) » Wed May 02, 2007 11:49 am

Post by now a ranger »

It sure does seem like it to me. His discussion about nuking and everything in the beginning, and then all of his other crud posts look like what you said to me, but this is just the beginning.
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Post Post #82 (ISO) » Wed May 02, 2007 3:36 pm

Post by Mastermind of Sin »

DdS: NAR
Permanent V/LA.
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Post Post #83 (ISO) » Wed May 02, 2007 11:07 pm

Post by The Fonz »

PookyTheMagicalBear wrote:
fonz wrote:Well, that's an interesting way to start. Milkman pretty much has to retaliate. I was going to begin by saying that the only situation in which it makes sense for a pro-towner to nuke is in retaliation, or if he is a power role and has been counterclaimed, and the town is about to lynch him. Anyone have a different plan?
does this sound like a scum gleefully hoping for townies to nuke each other at the beginning of the game to any1 else?
Do you actually believe a day one random nuke could possibly benefit the town? Or are you opportunistic scum?
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Post Post #84 (ISO) » Wed May 02, 2007 11:13 pm

Post by PookyTheMagicalBear »

No I do not believe random nukes will improve the town's chances of winning.

However,

Do you believe a person who randomly nukes on day one is guranteed to be scum?(What would this say about game balance?)

If not a gurantee, what are the odds that the random nuker is scum? Would the scum not want to save their nukes for later?

How does irrational behaviour point towards scum-iness?

If it doesn't, how can you say that milkman "pretty much has to retaliate".
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Post Post #85 (ISO) » Thu May 03, 2007 2:48 am

Post by The Fonz »

PookyTheMagicalBear wrote:No I do not believe random nukes will improve the town's chances of winning.
Do you not think, then, that the threat of automatic reprisal is the greatest deterrent?

However,

Do you believe a person who randomly nukes on day one is guranteed to be scum?(What would this say about game balance?)
Nope, nothing's ever guaranteed. We could in theory have a jester, for example. It's damn likely, though.
If not a gurantee, what are the odds that the random nuker is scum? Would the scum not want to save their nukes for later?

How does irrational behaviour point towards scum-iness?

If it doesn't, how can you say that milkman "pretty much has to retaliate".
The action hurts the town. People who take blatant anti-town actions need to die. Period. Let me ask you, if someone did nuke, would you support their lynch? Would you in general support the lynch of someone who dayvigged day one? If you would, you're accepting they need to die. And nuking rather than lynching extends the day. 'Would the scum not want to use their nukes later' strikes me as a bit WIFOM.
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Post Post #86 (ISO) » Thu May 03, 2007 3:03 am

Post by Raffles »

Then Fonz let me ask you this. What use is a nuke to a townie?
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Post Post #87 (ISO) » Thu May 03, 2007 4:15 am

Post by The Fonz »

Raffles wrote:Then Fonz let me ask you this. What use is a nuke to a townie?
Same as it is to law-abiding nations IRL, as a deterrent. If the townies didn't have any nukes, the scum could nuke with something pretty close to impunity, once they'd secured a mislynch or two. There are a couple of other scenarios I could think of, but none that apply day one.
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Post Post #88 (ISO) » Thu May 03, 2007 4:31 am

Post by Raffles »

But this is no real life, and there is an option to get rid of all nukes if so pleased (i.e. play a non-MAD game). So rather than thinking of it as a dterrent, actually treat it like an ability and use it as a resource? What then?
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Post Post #89 (ISO) » Thu May 03, 2007 4:41 am

Post by The Fonz »

Well then, you're basically thinking of it as a suicidal vig. And you wouldn't vig day one as town, either, would you? Even if it didn't mean the likelihood of immediate retribution.
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Post Post #90 (ISO) » Thu May 03, 2007 4:42 am

Post by Jack »

The Fonz wrote:
Raffles wrote:Then Fonz let me ask you this. What use is a nuke to a townie?
Same as it is to law-abiding nations IRL, as a deterrent. If the townies didn't have any nukes, the scum could nuke with something pretty close to impunity, once they'd secured a mislynch or two. There are a couple of other scenarios I could think of, but none that apply day one.
We can also daykill scum.
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Post Post #91 (ISO) » Thu May 03, 2007 4:46 am

Post by Battle Mage »

Mastermind of Sin wrote:
DdS: NAR
Doigt de Suspicione?
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Survived to the end and won - 11
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winrate as scum: 78%
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Post Post #92 (ISO) » Thu May 03, 2007 4:49 am

Post by Raffles »

If, I was a dayvig in another game, then I would shoot someone if I'm quite positive someone is a scum but no one is seeing it. That's the only way I can see a dayvig can use his powers to full ability. I wouldn't really care much for a threat of reprisal, a town would know that I was trying to act in what my view was their best interest. However in this game, vigging ability doesn't mean that he is town. This is what makes this game different from ordinary dayvig games.
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Post Post #93 (ISO) » Thu May 03, 2007 5:08 am

Post by The Fonz »

Well, yes, that's kinda the point of a town dayvig, but could you really ever be sure of scumminess day one? In any case, what we were discussing is the situation when you're town and get nuked. Scum is going to return fire on a townie who fires on them anyway. Town should act likewise.

On later days, it probably makes sense for Town to request a claim before returning fire.
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Post Post #94 (ISO) » Thu May 03, 2007 5:35 am

Post by Jack »

No man. Scum will return fire because they want to kill as many townies as possible. Why should townies do likewise? I understand you want to discourage random kills but I don't think anyone here is going to random kill.

Townies should only kill back if they think the person who nuked them is scum.
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Post Post #95 (ISO) » Thu May 03, 2007 8:45 am

Post by Y »

Fonz, you're actually saying that if we have a townie that makes a mistake, he should die? Each nuke should cost us two townies?
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Post Post #96 (ISO) » Thu May 03, 2007 8:57 am

Post by Battle Mage »

notice that we dont know how many nukes are in the game, or how many it takes to set off Nuclear Winter. Considering the number of players, i dont think it will be many, and retaliation nukings could double the rate of defeat if used recklessly.
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Survived to the end and won - 11
Nightkilled - 10
Survived to the end and lost - 6
Day-elimmed by majority - 4

winrate as scum: 78%
winrate as town: 55%
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Post Post #97 (ISO) » Thu May 03, 2007 9:35 am

Post by Raffles »

Tactics aside though, if some stupid twit decided to nuke you, wouldn't you be so tempted to nuke him back to teach him a lesson?
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Post Post #98 (ISO) » Thu May 03, 2007 9:37 am

Post by Raffles »

On that note, is it possible to nuke someone other than the initiator during the 48 hours?
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Post Post #99 (ISO) » Thu May 03, 2007 10:03 am

Post by Y »

Raffles wrote:On that note, is it possible to nuke someone other than the initiator during the 48 hours?
I believe so. During the 48 hours the game keeps going. I think you still have the "one nuke per day" though...
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