Mini 1277: The West Wing Mafia (Game Over)

[eldarad]

OK. I can't think of who Pine is referring to, but I don't care either. At this point, at least.

Which is why I'm going to
VOTE: Spartan

[eldarad]

Cuz Pine's always scum -.-

See, this is the problem. We have no completed games together. So pushing this hard is super disingenuous, or at the very, very least a noobish grudge.

...Or it's a random vote.

How did you establish that the vote was serious? (Obviously, don't discuss ongoing games in your answer.

[eldarad]

Putting someone at L-2 was something that should have generated responses; it should have made town sit back and go "hold on a minute, this is a little risky", or "wow, why is that guy putting him at L-2 so early? He hasn't even posted yet!"

Pine did this. That's why Pine gets a cookie.

You, however, ignored it completely and put down a rubbish RVS vote when there was NON RANDOM shit going down. You wanted to remain away from the actual content because it would have meant getting your hands dirty from your very first post in the game. Scum are scared of getting their hands dirty so soon. Scum don't want to call someone out who could prove a threat later. Much better to wait and see what happens and try to remain in a nice RVS bubble for as long as possible. Well, sorry buster, but I'm not letting you do that.

Do you believe that Spartan was in danger of being lynched?
Do you believe that the Spartan-wagon was non-random?

[eldarad]

edit:

"non-random" is possibly the wrong word. "Non-arbitary" is probably better.

[eldarad]

No I don't believe he was in danger of being lynched at that point, i.e. I don't believe the next two non-voting people to post would have both voted for him, resulting in his lynch on the first real life day of play.

I believe the wagon swelled to that point not because of anything Spartan did but because a large wagon early in the game is a good and useful thing for town. If the first two votes had been on you, I believe the wagon would still have reached that point.

Namely, I believe the wagon would have gotten a response from him that would have given insight into his alignment (possibly too late now), and furthermore act as a means to gauge the reaction of other players (in this instance, Pine and Vel).

I agree with you on this.
Which is why I am uneasy at your reasoning for your Vel vote. You're essentially saying that you're voting him because he didn't make the newbie mistake of over-reacting at an L-2 vote on page 1.

If I had posted #19 rather than Vel, I wouldn't have batted an eyelid at your vote. In a hypothetical situation (where you hadn't just put down a vote in the previous post) you wouldn't have batted an eyelid since you've already shown that you don't think L-2 is intrinsically dangerous at that point.
But somehow Vel not batting an eyelid makes him scum?

[eldarad]

No, what I was saying is that if I was in Vel's shoes, I wouldn't have reacted/responded to the Spartan-wagon either. I don't think you would have too.

Not acknowledging a random wagon on page 1 is not scummy. Fishing for an (over-) reaction, and then jumping down their throat when they don't react in the 'mistaken newbie' type way that you were hoping for is scummy.

unvote
vote Aurorus

[eldarad]

@ Spartan: I understand you don't have any scum reads. But you must have some thoughts by now? Anything that has happened that you didn't like the look of? Anything that gave you an early town-read on a player?

~~~

"Is there anything I can say other than 'The President rode his Vote Count into a tree?'"

"the President, while riding his Vote Count, came to a sudden arboreal stop."

[eldarad]

Hoynes was part of the Bartlet administration...

I have a name in mind, but since it has no consequence whether I am right or not, I'm not going to share it. Anyone who wishes to discuss Pine's partial claim further needs to first justify how their guessing of Pine's role is beneficial for scumhunting.

[eldarad]

Partial Role Claim:

I see allmost no other way to escape.

What?!
What do you feel you need to escape from, that you think you have no options?
How does a soft claim help you to 'escape'?

[eldarad]

What? have you like...ever played mafia? I ask this legitmately cause it would explain a lot!

<snip>

Honestly, Spartan is town. He's...he's not sharp, and I'll say that with his "high chance of dying", we're blessed it didn't land on someone more pivotal to the game.

I agree with this. His reaction to the early wagon wasn't brilliant, but it is consistent with someone who has only played real-life mafia, per his sig.

[eldarad]

Also, eldarad, no comment on my vote on you at all?

Nope.
Although if you comment some more on your vote I'm happy to talk about it.

So lying/contradicting his own reasoning is a newbtell, not a scumtell? :\

I haven't seen any lying from Spartan.
I've seen his strange reactions to his wagon, and a high degree of nervousness about the very existence of that wagon, and a really odd decision to character claim. All of those things are consistent with someone who has only played mafia in real life rather than on a forum.