Open 421-Pamplona II: Electric Bullgaloo! Game over

[JohnnyFarrar]

VOTE: DLG

You know what you did.

(Nice to play with everyone again.)

[JohnnyFarrar]

I've caught two scum

Fuck yes

Lol

[JohnnyFarrar]

^Your point?
Inte is playing it cocky.

I figured, I just wanted to see his reasoning.

[JohnnyFarrar]

@Johnny, Shotgun

I know it's early, but anything strike you guys as scummy so far?

I give everyone two or three posts grace to learn their attitude. Give me a few pages of discussion and I'll get back to you.

@McStab, If you can't trust my avatar then I can't trust your name

@Near Oh hey bro, how ya been? 414's been right boring without you.

Now Inte, I'm curious to see who your scum are.

[JohnnyFarrar]

Huh. Inte, you're an interesting one. I'll let you slide without explanations for a little while because I happen to agree with you right now. Though, why Grey? Why not Rach?

I'm giving Rach a little rope right now because it seems that I find her scummy in every game we've played so far, which is either an amazing coincidence or that's just how she plays.

VOTE: Andrew94
Because "bandwagon his ass" is not a legit reason for a vote.

Why pick out

that

stupid reason for voting? The game's fraught with dumb votes right now.

1.

vote:JohnnyFarrar

I can't

trust that avatar

Ironic eh?

VOTE: McStab

2.

Definitely.

Damn shame, that. We'll have to put that lynch-proof thing to the test, though.

VOTE: mcstab

Last to confirm, die scum!

This looks like the closest thing to something worth voting for.

Let's make it a wagon.

UNVOTE: Greywing
VOTE: McStab

Are my eyes deceiving me? Is that a scum-move bandwagon this early?

I also love how your initial reaction was "which of my posts are scummy?" rather then explaining your actions.

Explain to me the scum motivation behind these two posts. I think I know one, but not the other.

Also I take it you guys haven't played with Gunny before?

[JohnnyFarrar]

Never played with him before. Is this his regular playstyle?

Just read Meta's quote in Gunny's sig. You'll understand.

[JohnnyFarrar]

Urgh...Johnny, that means you agree to that right?

lolno I just love that quote. sets peoples' expectations low so you surprise them when you do good.

[JohnnyFarrar]

I don't like it when you two team up...

I have a tentative townread on Bitmap right now, just sayin. Weaker townread on DLG as well.

[JohnnyFarrar]

By the powers, seriously?? I was so excited when I saw there were 100 new posts, but maybe 5 of them were actually worth reading. Dangit guys.

[JohnnyFarrar]

So you're condoning the past day and a half of shitty play Gunny? Or were you just getting impatient with me? Anyway here's what I got so far:

Gunny=Gunny. I'm never convinced he's scum even though he always acts like it. My policy with him'll be waiting until D2 before lynching him if it seems the proper thing to do.

Bitmap is probably town. His logic is flawed, but it is constant. He hasn't really contradicted himself, he's just been posting what he thinks. Being wrong doesn't make you scummy.

DLG is probably town as well. Hasn't done anything in his many posts to say otherwise.

Rach is confusingly quiet right now and I don't like it

BK and Inte need to take a timeout before coming back so they can talk like big boys.

Greywing has thrown up enough red flags to resurrect the USSR:
1. He asked Gunny and me specifically for reads in 34,
2. started a ridiculously strong early wagon on newbie play,
3. unvotes in 117 for seemingly no reason,
4. and started that policy lynch nonsense.

VOTE: Greywing

[JohnnyFarrar]

1.

I think GreyWing is a hypocrite. Scummy of him to ask me and Johnny the question on page 2.

What's hypocritical about my actions exactly? I picked up a scum read and, at the time I posted, you two had both posted minutes before. I wanted discussion.

Or you were trying to goad two vocal players into sheeping you so it would be easier to defend yourself when you got a townie lynched

2. Which got all the way to L-1. I'm hardly the only one who believed him to be scum.

Scum are not going to hammer or put someone at L-1 100 posts in, but starting a wagon is another story. The earlier votes are what I'm worried about.

3.

In two of my previous three games, Town players have stupidly quickhammered on D1. I'd rather avoid having that happen again until I can get some more reads on other players.

So rather than sticking to your guns against someone you perceive as scum, you back off because you're scared they might die?

4. I stand by it. His play has been a blatant attempt at pissing people off, and he's playing anti-Town. He's a distraction.

Even if it means ending the day, possibly killing a townie and letting another die for sure in the nightphase without getting anything done, you're ok with it?

[JohnnyFarrar]

Vote Bitmap

In your own words, why?

[JohnnyFarrar]

Another prod-dodge post to tell you guys to not lynch until I get here

If I see another post like this I may just kill you.

[JohnnyFarrar]

Is that all you're gonna say Rach?

Agree

[JohnnyFarrar]

@Gunny, those quotes look a lot more like "I agree with this post, so you're townie" than actual townie posts. I could see scum motivation in more than one of those quotes(mine included)

[JohnnyFarrar]

I agree that your townreads don't quite add up, gunny. Wanna explain what about me wanting to kill someone for something stupid screams town to you?

[JohnnyFarrar]

@DLG: Why does examining other people's games not work out that well as a strat?

People change their game up sometimes. Or try new things. Or have off games. Playing dynamically should not be punished.

[JohnnyFarrar]

Ohai dashie

[JohnnyFarrar]

Based on what little amount I've played with Near, I can unfortunately say this seems normal. I'll keep watching, but for now he doesn't need my vote.

@Dashie, My shitty case on Grey was to test his reactions. Based on last game I played with him (him-scum, me-town) his reaction leads me to think he's town. He was more submissive there and just tried to seem pathetic (though to be fair, my case on him was a lot better there). So he gets a slight townread from me atm, but not "biggest townread".

VOTE: DJD

For sheeping purposes. Awaiting case.

[JohnnyFarrar]

Alright, awesome, JD's confirmed Town then .

Beat me to the sarcastic comment. Dangit.

[JohnnyFarrar]

Rainbowdash replaces Hyperion effective immediately.

Oh boy.

Try not to post too much until I have time to read the thread please.

resisting..... violent.... outburst....

[JohnnyFarrar]

Bastards -.-

I can't come to any conclusion on JD.... I keep reading his posts and just get nothing.
@DJD, what makes you ok with a mcstab vote?

[JohnnyFarrar]

yeeaaahhh

VOTE: Uber

[JohnnyFarrar]

The town thing to do would be replacing out. The scum thing to do is claim you're reading for four days. My vote moves when I see something useful out of that slot.

[JohnnyFarrar]

Did I say I was just gonna sit here with my thumb in an uncomfortable place? No I did not. I'm putting my vote on the person that exhibits the most scummy behavior. I have other suspects, but none more deserving of my vote.

[JohnnyFarrar]

yeeaaahhh

VOTE: Uber

Uhh why?

Over continues to post without contributing while using the same excuse all the while. If she were that busy she would replace out (so, you know, someone with more freetime could fill that slot and actually play to their win condition). The current play just fills that slot with uselessness, and I'd rather have her be dead instead of being a giant question mark.

[JohnnyFarrar]

I'd hide behind Near.

I dislike massclaims for no reason, but admittedly I don't fully understand this setup so I'll roll with it.

My two bits on Near: He played exactly like this in my only other game with him and he was town.

[JohnnyFarrar]

Dashie's decently complex. She's good enough that I wouldn't want to lynch her day one, but we'll see. Something isn't right about her play thus far. She seems to be focusing on the whole massclaim thing which won't even happen until tomorrow.

[JohnnyFarrar]

I've read up on the setup a bit and now understand the massclaim, and I'm fine with it. We should make the most suspicious guys claim first though.

[JohnnyFarrar]

Thanks for that Dash, I'll be sure to check back on it D2 if I'm still here.

I'll not be part of the Bit wagon.

[JohnnyFarrar]

That sounds complicated and can be thought about later. Reads?

[JohnnyFarrar]

RBD is probably town?

Doesn't this sound scummy?

Are you asking questions? These aren't very strong stances.

[JohnnyFarrar]

Now we're just helping scum through the mass claim by showing how we would catch them.

[JohnnyFarrar]

Now we're just helping scum through the mass claim by showing how we would catch them.

Except scums are not stupid. I expect them to be able to think this through.

In the same way I expect you to be able to think this through?
If it's all the same I'd rather not give them pointers.

[JohnnyFarrar]

D2 mass claiming is fine with me. There's only one really bad scenario that could come from it, but I'll address that if it happens.

[JohnnyFarrar]

No. Tomorrow is better, any PR's can prove or disprove their claims with what action they took the previous night. And none of this is really helping us with who we're going to lynch today.

[JohnnyFarrar]

I'm just getting annoyed now. You all decide what to do and I'll roll with it.

Remember, if we start a massclaim today, claim Tiers first. Not actual powers. I can just see somebody messing that up.

[JohnnyFarrar]

If we're taking a vote, mine's on tomorrow.

[JohnnyFarrar]

Massclaim starts in tiers first, then we popcorn claim roles by tiers depending on who we think is scummiest.

[JohnnyFarrar]

Says you, who's voting for Uber who has no other votes on him.

Near and Bit are the only two with multiple votes. Near seems to be acting like he always does and Bit looks like a stumbling newbie. neither one of them are particularly strong wagons, which is why I'm getting frustrated that no one is actually talking about anything but a massclaim.

Fixed quote tag. ~~NS

[JohnnyFarrar]

Haven't seen hell of a lot of scumhunting done from you today. Especially with your vote thrown at Uber's side for quite some time.

And that makes me different from EVERYONE ELSE how? At least I'm trying with Uber and earlier today with Greywing. People just seem to think Bit flailing under pressure is all the proof they need that he's scum and have stopped looking at anyone else.

@Inte - So now I'm scummier than our top two wagons?

Fixed quote tag. ~~NS

[JohnnyFarrar]

I begrudgingly and unwillingly will vote bit if that'll actually get us back into scumhunting.

[JohnnyFarrar]

My magical ISO powers tell me Hyperion's been gone 7 whole days. prolly should prod him or something.

[JohnnyFarrar]

In case he can't find it in all this jabber IT'S GREY'S TURN TO CLAIM A TIER

we should stop talking now.

[JohnnyFarrar]

Guys this is a lot to read and digest and I've had a shit day. I'm judging by a few lists I saw that it's my turn, so T1.

[JohnnyFarrar]

My bad, popcorn to whoever's left? MS?

Yeah, McStab.

[JohnnyFarrar]

Wait, whose turn is it? Skimming the last few pages makes my head hurt.

Also, why are there so many votes on BK? Did I miss something?

[JohnnyFarrar]

I guess we're not taking turns anymore? Also why are we accepting JD's "I must go last" plan?

[JohnnyFarrar]

As much as I'd like to be something else, I am in fact the JK. Anyone see any scum sticking out?

[JohnnyFarrar]

Now I feel like a newb for not breadcrumbing anything.

The docs and VTs are our best bets right now. Any scum after the first doc claim could have dropped that in there. This naturally leads me to believe that the first doc was town (too lazy to read back and see who it was :/)

Near all of a sudden getting wordy when trying to say I'm not obvtown strikes me as odd. Scummy even. I've never seen him speak so clearly.

[JohnnyFarrar]

Gahh.

Full disclosure: I've never played with a busdriver or a JOAT.

That aside, I jailed DLG.

[JohnnyFarrar]

Before this turns into another Bitwagon, let's all calmly figure this out.

P I jailed DLG (confirmed)
P Gunny doc'd me
P Near doc'd me
P Bit doc'd McStab
I Inte Died, so no track (confirmed)
R McStab died, so no investigation (confirmed)
H DJD died so he hid somewhere (confirmed)
T RBD
T Grey
T DLG
T Uber
T BK
T Rach

If everyone were telling the truth, there would only be a goon and a 1-shot busdriver. That shouldn't be the case, because Bit said he protected McStab and he died anyway. So either Bit is lying or there is an SK/JOAT, which would mean that someone else is lying. And it has to be one or two of the docs.

Unless Busdriving works on someone under doc protection? I'm not completely certain.

Ill be using Random.org to decide a VT to hide behind.

This leads me to believe that JD pinged scum. Random.org isn't usually that nice, but these things do happen. I doubt the busdriver guessed his target and switched it with scum, and even given that as a possibility I doubt that the busdriver would waste his 1 shot on that guess.

So basically, we know for sure that there is one person amongst the docs that is scum and that there is at least one amongst the vanilla civs.
For the docs, I doubt it's bit, saying he doc'd McStab doesn't make any sense as scum. Since he saw everything that happened and knew that would possibly out him as scum (or at least put him in a small group of really suspicious folk). The safe doc target to claim would have been the survivor between me and McStab, the two most important roles. Since I lived, I'm the safe claim. This makes Gunny and Near the most suspicious in my eyes. And given Gunny's less favorable claim spot yesterday, I'd be willing to bet that he's scum.

Finally, the scum amongst our VTs.
This mess makes BK and RBD look horrid. We'll see if either of them can see something that I can't, but they aren't looking particularly pro-town at the moment (since they're both claimed VT's that jumpstarted a Massclaim that lead to three dead PR's). Dashie wanted to kill Inte because of what he might do if he is scum, which is stupid. BK (as pointed out by Uber) hasn't done a single pro-town thing all game.

Grey's just sort of been quiet, but I think he's V/LA and I'm too lazy to check. If I read later and see that he isn't, I'll be quite onto him

DLG's pretty much clear in my mind. I jailed him, which means either he's a goon (which I doubt, most of the time goons carry out the first kill from what I've witnessed) or he's legit VT.

Uber... UBER. I got nothing. I'd like to see BK's alignment before I decide on Uber.

and Rach is all lurky.

I think our best bet right now is BK, but feel free to comment. I do suspect one of the doctors, but there is a tiny chance that we're all telling the truth (if busdriving someone under doc protection works like I think it does) and that possibility leads me to believe that we should just be killing VT claims for right now.

[JohnnyFarrar]

Whyzat?

[JohnnyFarrar]

I can get behind that real easy. I didn't get back in time to raise any objections yesterday.

VOTE: Dashie

[JohnnyFarrar]

I made a gross error in my earlier long post. I assumed we drew 13 letters and we only draw seven. Missed that part when reading the wiki.

@Gunny ehh do you trust Bit's claim that much?

[JohnnyFarrar]

Popping in to say I'm not voting another PR. (technically I didn't vote the last one, but I'll still say it). If I had to vote one right now though, it'd be near. This is so radically different from his normal play that I'm just plain dazzled. But, I'm not voting him for it and neither should anyone else right now.

That leaves BK, Dashie, Grey, Rach, Uber and DLG (In order of scummiest from left to right.)

BK and Dashie have yet to tell me anything useful that came from the massclaim.

BK is voting Uber for god knows why.

I'm cool with lynching BK, but before I vote I'd like to hear his explanations on the above things.

[JohnnyFarrar]

So it tells us nothing until we kill some more people. Gotcha. Waiting on BK.

[JohnnyFarrar]

Actually reading RBD and BK's interactions on this page have made me think BK's town against all odds including sanity.

Vote: DLG

He is my biggest VT townread. Explain.

[JohnnyFarrar]

So looking back over DJD's posts, I think I'll VOTE: greywing for obvious reasons. There's basically a fifty-fifty shot of hitting scum in the VTs, so killing the one that our dead hider said he would hide behind seems like an easy choice

[JohnnyFarrar]

And even in your calculations you agree that grey is scum Dashie? If so, lets get rid of him!

[JohnnyFarrar]

Slow the hell down guys. Let others talk before just up and lynching him.

[JohnnyFarrar]

Uncomfortable with lynching Rach until I see her actually post something. I'd much rather kill Grey.

[JohnnyFarrar]

I believe DJD targeted him

[JohnnyFarrar]

With the high likelihood of hitting scum amongst VT's and the plethora of docs along with myself, I'm not really concerned about needing mindblowing cases.

[JohnnyFarrar]

I basically know he will. I had a gut feeling day 1, I even voted him at one point. If we've figured this out right, there are 3 scum among 6 VT's, so a 50% chance combined with any good indicator of scum would result in a scum lynch.

P-Edit: Really?

[JohnnyFarrar]

Bro. Look at the votecount.

[JohnnyFarrar]

Is anyone actually getting anything from all these walls?

[JohnnyFarrar]

Boring. Dashie, Uber, Near, each of you be a dear and give me your top suspect in the VT pool if you please.

[JohnnyFarrar]

Top scumspect Uber. Stat.

[JohnnyFarrar]

DLG vote stays. JF, sheep me. I don't give a fuck if you jailed him last night.

This is why I asked for an explanation. I jailed him for a reason, but I'd like to hear your case on him (since, you know, you're in our VT suspect pool as well)

[JohnnyFarrar]

I am not scum any more than Santa Claus is a fucking dinosaur, and you know it.

What's the reason you jailed him? And why were you so quick to clear him?

A) Santa Claus is whatever I want him to be, so come up with a better clear

B) I didn't clear DLG, but he's more townie to me than you are. So tell me why you'd vote him.

[JohnnyFarrar]

I agree with BK actually. Uber's still a suspect. He won't even explain a scumread to me, so he deserves no protection.

[JohnnyFarrar]

This game.... I'm sad I died. End looked fun.

[JohnnyFarrar]

I knew dashie was scum by N2, but I was hoping a successful jail would confirm it for me. Didn't suspect Bit.

That thing with Near was weird, btw.