Mini Normal 2041 [Game Over]

[DrDolittle]

VOTE: DVa

[DrDolittle]

Hi Nako! I pref town, but I tend to try a little harder when playing as scum. As town I'm often pretty flippant, and hard to deal with, but usually I'm more willing to compromise, lead wagons, and give a tad more explaination. Tunnel pretty hard as both though, and am working to fix that.

[DrDolittle]

what's that list above, Oka?

[DrDolittle]

why are we policying and worrying about lylo on page 4. And I echo the thoughts that are these numbers that credible at page 4?

[DrDolittle]

VOTE: BEF
weak read, but maybe scum-nervous in finding out the cryptic system he cant control?

[DrDolittle]

I'm really not sure what's going on in this game with all the talks about alts and whatnot.
I'm reading Tchill town I think the wagon on him is dumb. Nako why did you decide to pile on.
Nako misquoting thing is stupid and not alignment indicative.

[DrDolittle]

Joey are you always this conciliatory or only as scum?

[DrDolittle]

Hi to you too

[DrDolittle]

@ALL: Many of you are asking why Dolittle is being wagoned, and I say it's because he's living up to his name. Now unless he tries to act like DrActuallydosomething or DrTryabiyharder I don't think I want to move my vote off him. I find it intriguing he has gone back to the shadows since he started being voted.

guy its been like 15 hours since my last post. here's what i've done. I went to sleep at 1. got up at 10:30. Went to BK to get some chicken nuggets, quickly checked ms at work. i'll get to this tonight.

[DrDolittle]

Man I thought there'd be more to respond to, but honestly there's only two posts

So, Mr Axel Foley; I know you like Party All The Time and all, but would you mind explaining what's so confusing about the alts subject? Also, do you have anything else to share? because I've just ISO'd you and you posts seem void and lack the effort. Are you waiting for something in particular?

alts: I don't think it's relevant to scum hunting, and I don't see why whether someone is an alt matters.
lacking effort: it's literally 2 days into a game give me a break
waiting for something: yes - waiting for more exciting stuff! In fact I think my wagon is a great way to gauge who scum is since I get conf bias that I'm town.

You didn't notice DrD white knighting you while shading what was obviously a pressure wagon for content then?

white knight tchill: this is literally a meta read based on my game with tchill in Mini Normal 2024... he's playing exactly the same way as in this game.
pressure wagon for content: wtf does that mean? I literally just asked why is nako on the wagon when she says she is against the wagon

[DrDolittle]

yeah I'll be here for a bit if you want to engage A50. I'm just trying to reread to find the most likely scum on my wagon. Although I agree the naked votes on me is a bit uncanny, I don't think they necessarily point to scum... I think Nako gives me the strongest aversion, since she straight up dodged my question through vote, and doesn't follow up why.

[DrDolittle]

yeah I think Nako has greatest chance of flipping scum here. VOTE: Nako

[DrDolittle]

Don't particularly like Penguins lack of commitment onto anything, even with his explaination of why
Seph has few content other than a read list, but again it's very on in the game so am not concerned.
Radja's defending me, so right now I feel good about him.

[DrDolittle]

don't you feel good about someone when they are defending you??

[DrDolittle]

@DrD: OK.. let's do some mutual work here and see how it goes. We can ISO players in the order of their appearance on the list and see if there's anything we can come up with, be it a read or a remark. How's that?

I've just ISO'd PP and he has nothing of substance except a push on Kokichi, but it was the same play in this game where he was town and got lynched on D1.

Second on the list is Nako, and I don't know what people are disliking about her. She seems engaged enough, having explicit reads, willing to poke and engage people. If this is scum she's being bold and confident. I have a town lean on her already.

So, do your own ISOs while I do the rest and let's compare.. or maybe you would like to do the next 2 before I do so no one can come back and accuse you of not doing your own homework or something?? Your choice.

uh. so you want me to point out a game where I had nothing of substance up to page 9, and then I'm now town?

[DrDolittle]

@tchill cause dva asked me about radja

[DrDolittle]

and cause I read you town because mini 2024

[DrDolittle]

don't you feel good about someone when they are defending you??

yes

but then you have to ask what are there motivations for defending you

anyways i don't really see radja defending you, could you point to me where he was defending you?

-I share Tchill's confusion as to why DrDolittle is scum.
-The fact that DVa and Brighteyedfish join DrDolittle wagon without any comment is kinda bothering me.

Yeah I know, but Dva was asking me and that was my immediate reaction. I don't see anything particularly standing out from his ISO tho?

[DrDolittle]

first activity doesn't indicate alignment.
second, this is your reason why you are not scumreading PP (meta low content)

I've just ISO'd PP and he has nothing of substance except a push on Kokichi, but it was the same play in this game where he was town and got lynched on D1.

so i am asking you whether its enough to give you a game where I'm also low content...

[DrDolittle]

Seph is a strong TR because he is actually providing some content and even a full read list already. I wanted to poke him in the nose for the messed up vote, but then felt other players won't understand and might think it a distraction, so I held myself back.

Ok so I'm pretty sure A50 is town. You don't pull blatantly crappy reads like this from scum

[DrDolittle]

Please stop calling seph Sephora. he already says he doesn't like it, and continuing to do so is a bit disrespectful.

[DrDolittle]

nah there's just some lines that you don't cross... typically im pretty crass too but i shut up when someone tells me to stop you know

[DrDolittle]

This is a bad reason to read someone as town, because scum can always pocket you.

but then you have to ask what are there motivations for defending you

[...]
Yeah I know, but Dva was asking me and that was my immediate reaction. I don't see anything particularly standing out from his ISO tho?

[DrDolittle]

here's 2 of me doing nothing all game
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=83&t=77301
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=83&t=77250

[DrDolittle]

ah fuck I think one of these I'm scum lol

[DrDolittle]

I am not seeing Nako town despite being repeated being told so as a fact. I think Gamma is town reading her over some one-liner post as well?

[DrDolittle]

@Joey I'm just joking around dude.

[DrDolittle]

yeah I just digged through my meta and turns out i didn't play any recent games unless you want stuff from like 2015 or even 2012. also I thought those 4 pages games are funny.

anyhow, here's me as scum
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... er_sort=Go
where I did try very hard earlier on - that should be a counterfactual right?

[DrDolittle]

counterexample: see the game I linked where I try to drag town out of RVS over complete garbage.

[DrDolittle]

PS its not the bear avi - I'm the dude and the bear is supporting cast, if that's unclear. but i don't mind if you continue bearavi-ing.

[DrDolittle]

Who has a better vote for me rn than tchill?

hb Nako to start

[DrDolittle]

So, my read list roughly looks like this:

Seph

whyu

[DrDolittle]

Seph is a strong TR because he is actually providing some content and even a full read list already. I wanted to poke him in the nose for the messed up vote, but then felt other players won't understand and might think it a distraction, so I held myself back.

Ok so I'm pretty sure A50 is town. You don't pull blatantly crappy reads like this from scum

this is not a reason btw

[DrDolittle]

gamma's not reading tonight and its a cause for concern

[DrDolittle]

when I have a strong early game read they tend to be right

are your strong early game read typically town reads

[DrDolittle]

PS its not the bear avi - I'm the dude and the bear is supporting cast, if that's unclear. but i don't mind if you continue bearavi-ing.

I trust you won't take offense if I call you crown prince Akeem Joffer, will you?

no you're just giving me more eddie murphy movies to watch and its amazing

[DrDolittle]

gamma's not reading tonight and its a cause for concern

Not reading what

the thread.

two examples:
first: you had no idea what Dva was talking about in her job hunt 30 pages cut 6
second: you quoted my two FakeGod examples even after I said it was a joke.

[DrDolittle]

Seph is a strong TR because he is actually providing some content and even a full read list already. I wanted to poke him in the nose for the messed up vote, but then felt other players won't understand and might think it a distraction, so I held myself back.

Ok so I'm pretty sure A50 is town. You don't pull blatantly crappy reads like this from scum

this is not a reason btw

[DrDolittle]

First: that was completely off topic so it was odd?
Second: I read the thread linearly most of the time. As such I didn’t see it was a joke when I posted that. And I took the time to click the links, so your shade is undermined.

1 - if its odd, you can quote many of the posts where dva and joey were bantering
2 - im wrong on that front and it does seem like a linear reading starting from 284

[DrDolittle]

Seph is a strong TR because he is actually providing some content and even a full read list already. I wanted to poke him in the nose for the messed up vote, but then felt other players won't understand and might think it a distraction, so I held myself back.

Ok so I'm pretty sure A50 is town. You don't pull blatantly crappy reads like this from scum

this is not a reason btw

I say I strong TR him for this and you tell me it's not a reason? I've just finished playing a game with the dude. I mean, he himself admits to being good at scum, but I have seen nothing to make me feel he's being deceptive at any rate so far in here.

1 not doing anything deceptive != your strongest town read.
2 unless you think seph-scum is blatant on not providing content early game, your strongest town read is also unjustified. + that would make him a shitty scum player.

[DrDolittle]

whoo any hour+ hanging out with my mafia friends. its been fun but I gotta sleep.

[DrDolittle]

fun fact: if i townread everyone, most of the time ill be correct, so yeah. there is that.

Yeah my thoughts exactly - that's why I asked.

I voted DrD to get content and I did.

What content did you get

My gut feeling that this is a town-koki post? If Joey is truly is such good at reading Koki, then Koki is happy with calling him town seems to indicate that koki is town is confident that he will be read correctly.

VOTE: BEF

Good vote.

Do you think BEF is scum or do you like A50's vote despite?

[DrDolittle]

Almost50, what do you think about BEF at the moment?

Would like to chime in that I find the attacks against A50 rather unsettling and maybe telling of who might be on the scumteam

Why? I share BEF's concerns I also dont find A50 to be town.

[DrDolittle]

nako's stonewalling me and i dont like it

[DrDolittle]

Is it important for this game that I go read DDU?

[DrDolittle]

im here skimming ddu and hanging out rn if anyone wants to banter

[DrDolittle]

can you present a case?

[DrDolittle]

he pushed one wagon on BEF.

[DrDolittle]

on post 33?

[DrDolittle]

i do agree that seeing more content from radja would be helpful.

[DrDolittle]

Oka are you raising hand for us to vote Koki? Or for Dva to acknowledge the second part only

[DrDolittle]

maybe if you and gamma both join he will gain some motivation to do more than one post per day?

Fine I can do this
VOTE: Radja

[DrDolittle]

^ Do you read Joey_ town?

[DrDolittle]

usually good unreadable means hes so good at scum that even when he is so town, we still have doubts he might be scum.

it is not hes so bad at town that even when he is so scum, we still have doubts he might be town

[DrDolittle]

Have you found scum yet kokichi?

I'm helping

[DrDolittle]

but actually though.

[DrDolittle]

Hi I'm sucking in participation - works ramping up a little,

LA till Friday

but will be intermittently on and trying to follow up

[DrDolittle]

My catchup up to 771. Surprised at Nako's Dva vote, and am not sure how to process it so will preocess it later.

Nice #metoo moment. I’ve done this before as scum. I now feel less apprehensive about my vote.

you got a problem with #metoo?
anyhow I think you just don't get my jokes and that's ok.

I think i recalled he used the words "Towntold" but what felt the same is that he was being enthusiastic in finding town, you know? That what i felt there with his towntold post

So this is indicative of A50 town? Or rather than A50's exclaimation town reads are accurate? I guess it requires the former for the latter to be true too

I thought Id enjoy playing mafia again but I really cant find the energy to dive into this. I'm sorry.

Replace me out please.

UNVOTE: FYI I still townread Radja's slot.

What is this, OMGUS? What don't you like about my posts? This feels like a really fake reaction to the thread tbh

VOTE: Tyrion

Is anyone actually townreading Tyrion atm?

I think this is tchill's typical I hate day 1 posts. But I agree the vote on you is strange. @Tchill you say that you don't like what you see from DVa.

Personally I'd like kokichi lynched, and I'd rather not have to type a few paragraphs just to explain my play style. Just let it happen lol.

I don't care much for you Playstyle. I just want to follow up on what in the 5 pages you read that you don't like from DVa. And please don't scoot past that question as previous.

Because Kokichi is an EZ PZ lynch bait.
Lynch DDl

I'm extremely frustrated with you. You've just been calling me scum all game since like page 3. You don't give a reason why I'm scum. You don't talk with me. You just say DDL is scum. I'm trying to read whether you are tunneling town, or just scum following a simple he's scum strategy so people don't have a lot to go off you. Gonna go back on this.

VOTE: Nako

can everyone who isn't aboard the kokichi wagon explain why they aren't aboard the kokichi wagon?

because Joey said that he'll sort koki out later. plus koki said he's unlynchable today... so i don't want to pressure a potential PR when there's better

[DrDolittle]

fuck that's a wall sorry.

[DrDolittle]

Me up to 1110. Hopefully will finish catching up. Bolding highlights, and

794: Tchill has no reads still

801: BEF is completely lost. Don’t know whether it comes from lazy scum. OR just clueless.

803: BEF omgus with koki… survival instinct, seems scummy. Joey commented it was obvious but im not sure I agree with it.

851 (Mason outted)...

893. (Mewtaph responding on my behalf on DVa’s question) Mewtaph is reading. That’s good

903 (BEF readlist) No way. 100 posts, and he do have a read list. It’s kind of odd. Two scum in A50 and Chill. Not sure why Seph, DVa and Gamma are strongest town read but OK

918 (Koki's read list) could honestly just be lazy and sheep Koki’s PP read

933 Nako’s Read list (and previous set of effort post)… its… a bit generic. But it’s not bad

959 A50 throwing shade at Seph for active lurking…

971 Seph readlist; votes PP [pressure vote]

991 Huh, I really like this vote on Mewtaph by Nako even though Mew is null for me. Two reasons: PP wagon is so easy to coast on as scum; and Nako’s faithful to her readlist which is pretty town. The first reason flips the other way if PP is scum though…

1000 Joey vote on Seph for being not genuine. Later, I think Seph’s response is fine. I don’t find anything strange there, and he did put out a readlist after all. I understand tone readers, but I would not sheep a tone reader.

1033 (A50 on wasting time for PP roleclaim) I don’t agree with, game is going on fine. A50 implies directly that PP is TPR? But I can also see this from a town perspective.

1053 (Seph on 40 pages is too long) I think it’s fine. More content is always better?

1058, 1064 (Mew on wanting a seph flip) Man every Mew Post is a solid null for me.

1081 (BEF saying 2 scum reads are on 3rd scum read) BEF remind me who the other scum reads are?? They have been constant these 200 posts?

1084 Yeah I agree with Nako on BEF rolefishing.

1110 Mew why the hard Town read on seph again?

[DrDolittle]

wait can someone give me a tldr on why PP is scum other than too many gifs. I waded through pages and pages and realized I never got a case.

[DrDolittle]

Do we have any momentum on a PP lynch? It looks stagnant. This is the same reason on why A50 voted PP to get a claim and move out of the way

... but I thought you scum read PP based on that readlist

[DrDolittle]

first UNVOTE:

[DrDolittle]

yeah. here's my plan. I'm going to quickly make a short readlist. then I'm going to go back and look at who are potential lynchables, and then make a judgement based on my readlist.

[DrDolittle]

These last two reasons can literally move to any other wagon. So you are telling me PP only has 3 votes.

[DrDolittle]

poe. I don't think you've been doing anything to move the game forward in recent memory whereas the other slots have done more or made posts that ping me as town. I don't think the reaction to your wagon of just posting images helps your case. Not that it hurts it.

[DrDolittle]

So if I'm understanding correctly seph, from 978 to now, the latter part doesn't apply any more

[DrDolittle]

--Town
Seph, consistent reads that flow smoothly (is this too soft?). I can see the town perspective even if I don’t agree with everything.

Oka, strong town presence throughout. Actively trying to advance the game. Though I might be fooled, and he’s just really good scum acting clueless.

Nako, See my previous post.

Dva, Good vibes in general from what I recall, and nothing scummy jumps out.

PP, Biased since I like the gifs. But also the calm reaction to pressure rather than jolty claiming seems more town than scum.

Mew, Can read him, and it's a solid null. Some post ping me positively, some negative, but nothing strong either way. Looking to sort on day 2.

A50, Can't read him.

Tchill, Apathy is a NAI. It’s consistent play. However the absolute lack of content is scummy. Also it’s bad he’s not reading since he has to read everything bad day 2 anyways to form his god tier reads, apparently.

Gamma, I don’t like this slot. I just don't think it's town here. Feels like he's voting the convienient wagon, and his reasons for it is either nonexistent or garbage. I know some of you put gamma high on the town list... can you give me a hint why?

BEF, Too scum to be scum? Everything (survival, terrible read list that doesn't make sense, lack of engagement) is pinging me the scum way.
--Scum

[DrDolittle]

>Tyrion is not really playing to his town meta imo, and if he is, then he should be lynched so he starts playing d1s again. I would accept a mislynch on a town Tyrion based on his play here, and I would be pissed if he was scum and we gave him a free pass.

fwiw I think it's false. The game tchill and I were in that PP modded is used as an example as why his play today is even remotely acceptable. But if this is town tchill, then the standards to his day 1 has just become even lower, and he would play even less day 1s

[DrDolittle]

VOTE: BEF

[DrDolittle]

>Tyrion is not really playing to his town meta imo, and if he is, then he should be lynched so he starts playing d1s again. I would accept a mislynch on a town Tyrion based on his play here, and I would be pissed if he was scum and we gave him a free pass.

Imo this is his town meta stretched to the point of absurdity. Its par for the course for him to be low engagement and not really care about D1 but this is certainly I think beyond his norm. Its also why I don't think PP is misrepping Tyrion's meta, though I will grant that he's being more forgiving than I think is actually backed up by chills post history.

I'm going to dig for a tchill scum game and see what's going on

[DrDolittle]

fyi here's what im looking at https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=76388

[DrDolittle]

compared to townplay here https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=76530

[DrDolittle]

these two games are close in time enough such that it shouldn't be drastically different in terms of time.

perusing the posts, it seems that tchill in the town
"in a general since a lynch day 1 has the most likelihood of hitting town. I'd be willing to bet town usually talk themselves out of lynching scum more than they talk themselves into lynching scum day 1. I usually have no preference unless i feel comfortable with my ability to read certain players or unless somehow someone lands in my "will always be suspicious of" list day 1. "
"Typical day 1. Nobody wants to lynch anybody lol. If we wagon every single player then honestly there's no reason to wagon anyone at all. Feel free to do so though."
"Will lynch today: literally anyone not in the above list." (list of 5 players)
"Please let us just lynch somebody. "

town tchill has one-hit wonders like
"every townie is expendable until from my own perspective have a reason to not vote them. "
"pg 20 should be the d1 limit."
"Scum is in a great spot. Thread is bogged down. We don't want to deal with low activity players. We can't decide on a lynch. This is why day 1 lynches don't matter."

god i hate meta dives. But here's my read. Scum tchill is less abrasive about hating day 1 then town tchill. But otherwise, not likin day 1 is not very alignment indicative.

[DrDolittle]

the first set of quotes are the scum game sorry.

[DrDolittle]

What's this double doctor talk? People make stupid joke claims all the time. I think its is more along Nakos and Kokis line of thought... gonna dig through who has played with BEF in a bit.

[DrDolittle]

a50 say you are town gs. why are claiming with no result.

[DrDolittle]

in that previous game where I modded, you didn't claim even after a guilty on ofrhz.

[DrDolittle]

1 - that's not a good reason to out yourself

2 - dude seeing that you didn't reveal yourself after a guilty as a mod role is like straightforward. To recognizing crumbs you have to be observant?

[DrDolittle]

i agree with seph. i also don't see the point in hypo-claiming. should i list like the roles and tell the truth of who i would target if i were actually that role? or is there more strategy involved? hypoclaiming would literally just give scum more information and help them map into the PR right, you know since they have more information than town to work with yadda yadda.

[DrDolittle]

Up to 1699
1596 – (Joey’s vote on Seph, Dva votes seph as well) Why is seph scum?

1599 - Is mew Ascetic? This is an easy question to ask?

Mew are you ascetic? Y/N suffices.

1600s That’s interesting that A50 thinks Oka is investigative… But I think A50 is reading into it right. In fact, 1606 – Oka does not cc a50. The whole series of post is weird and I don’t like it. Hypoclaiming is essentially kind of outing himself.

So Oka started a hypoclaim I think to try to bait out night information, since as scum he has more to work with.

1609 I don’t like the wagon on Seph

1616 A50 says gamma is town. I think I tentatively can go off his read on this, especially if no one is CCing. I town read A50.

1626 Nope. Oka’s vote of Seph is ew.

1639/1640 Seph’s read on the game state is solid town. 1655 Getting frustrated is also a genuine reaction.

1665: 5 on seph, minus 2 masons, I think there's one or two scum on there: DVa, Oka, and A50. I townread A50.

1669: Nako’s not coming in until Sunday, DVa’s shade is shooting bullets into the air

1680s Oka + Mew interaction. This reads as Oka is trying to bait mew here to trip, and setting up a counterwagon in case seph fails. While Mew's tone reads genuine to me.

VOTE: Oka

[DrDolittle]

Because your shot yesterday on mason failed, and you need to figure out why.

[DrDolittle]

1700: votes Mew for information? I d k. This post seems heavy setup spec. The whole point of the hypoclaim is not to setup spec

1716: No just no voting Mew for information is dumb

1727: (DVa’s case on Mew) 1) fake af play. Elaborate. 2) open wolfing readlist: reads that disagree with yours doesn’t mean scum 3) desperate: Mew was not wagoned at all? Why would he be desperate?

1731: Acknowledged about posting more. Sorry, just been super busy with work during the day.

1747: Fine I agree that that’s one part I didn’t like about Mew. It’s a simple question really. Asc or not? And this is the post that makes me keep townreading Dva Tbh.

Will save 1753 onwards for tomorrow.

Guys Oka is a solid lynch. His day 2 motivations have been awful.

[DrDolittle]

This might actually be very close to auto-win on mass-claim

if you think the setup design is so crappy that after 2 town deaths its still an auto win you are delirious

[DrDolittle]

fair enough but that implies you know it was a vig shot on BEF?

Nope just a guess - but it makes more sense than scum shooting BEF

[DrDolittle]

No, don't back pedal on this. Your statement lacked qualifiers and you seemed pretty sure of it.

How do you know?

Are you saying that I have to add "I think" to every statement? If I say Oka is scum, now I'm a cop that knows for sure you are scum?

It's literally a hypothesis, one that has been echoed throughout today

[DrDolittle]

^ yeah all these seem extremely likely and makes a lot of sense. Thanks for writing it out explicitly.

[DrDolittle]

when the purpose of hypoclaiming is mainly to get investigative role hypo-claims

Here's the key. You are not investigative, yet you are down and jiggy with hypoclaim. Why? A50 said as much.

[DrDolittle]

its also nice as scum to bait out information

[DrDolittle]

Oka you're flailing.

[DrDolittle]

mb I think you're flailing.

[DrDolittle]

a couple of things.
1) I'm giving a50 benefit of the doubt. there's no sense in even discussing lynching a claimed town investigative role that is not counterclaimed.
2) Oka:"We have PP wagon hit L1, then A50 gives intent to hammer to force out a claim (never follows through as ->" a50 never intended to vote. the hammer threat was empty. plus you should recall that only 2/3 of the votes on PP at that time were "serious votes". what you are pushing in your scenario is misleading.

[DrDolittle]

la till saturday but am

[DrDolittle]

Am going to follow up on the thread

[DrDolittle]

VOTE: koki

[DrDolittle]

A50 claims to have investigated Mew, not Gamma. Why did you drop your SR, even if only tentatively, just because the likely TPR said so? If you’re town, then shouldn’t your reads be equally as valid as A50’s?

In your last towngame (Mini 2023) with (scum)Gamma, you also correctly scumread him and had him as a SR for most of the game, which makes this progression even more strange.

my scum reads are typically not too great and i prefer to hunt for town reads and do poe - so I defer my read to someone who argues that gamma towntold (p.s. you can see the same reaction on me re: koki).

[DrDolittle]

He came in and posted some, but overall I don't see his participation to be active or fruitful.

thats like your opinion man. this game is hard and hard to read and i'm trying my best ok

[DrDolittle]

so why am i your scumread?

because you fake-claimed mason?

[DrDolittle]

tell me why would town fake-claim mason?

my read on you before was lean-scum, but willing to defer to joey for read.

[DrDolittle]

because my read is that joey read you as town, and you pocketed him, and knew that he would go along.

[DrDolittle]

also, you dont seem super invested in the game, so even in the event that joey didn't acknowledge or reject, you could always play it off as nah jk

[DrDolittle]

first i didn't say im extremely invested in teh game. second you should look at the content in addition to the count...

[DrDolittle]

and plus the statement is definitely not false. but glad you are omgus ing me to back it up

[DrDolittle]

first i didn't say im extremely invested in teh game. second you should look at the content in addition to the count...

Yes. And what content are you posting lately, and when I start posting content you start to backtrack?

This is another misrep. I was V/LA for the last couple of days since I was sick. Instead, what type of content have you been posting?

[DrDolittle]

im not voting them for any reason you are.

yeah so what are your reasons? calling you out for noncontent? and scooting by yesterday via a mason claim?

[DrDolittle]

by the wagon development speed, probably two scum there in Koki and Oka?

[DrDolittle]

But DDL later also asked you to claim ascetic/non-ascetic during his catchup and thought it was suspicious that you were taking so long to claim, and you didn't seem to react to that.

I also thought DDL's read on you was lazy. He had you as unsorted at the end of D1, and then later in D2, townread you based on "tone," which is actually really odd because I don't think DDL is a tonereader. He basically soft defended you to further his case on OkaPoka.

1 - if you read, my catchup post was a big lagged, and mew claimed non-ascetic like 2 posts ago I think
2 - yeah, i typically don't tone read, but if you go to the interaction with Oka, you can see that its genuine, and like an active progression of thoughts... i don't know how to explain ... but its town. (e.g. 1677 and 1681 reproduced here)

"WIFOM argument isn't good. Your play D1 was bad and fake af with tchill lol. You enter today with a hypoclaim opening in a closed setup with a "sheep" vote on Seph - now you are pointing out hypocrisy in RL events when there is none."

"Your play when I replaced in D1 from what I saw was you literally just coasting on town cred and then you suddenly having random pings of paranoia on tchill while also denying any chance of a serious counterwagon because votes on A50 were going to become "vanity wagons". So here's my thought: I don't understand how do you have paranoia pings about someone when literally all they said about you is they like the way you play and they are posting like much less than any other player? How can you feel threatened by being pocketed through that?"

ps ofrhz is town

[DrDolittle]

This doesn't really answer why but town has fakeclaimed mason before

Also joey is no longer in the game. You get me instead ;_;

My scumread comes from the reason to fakeclaim mason - Koki did nothing but shitpost day 1, and fakeclaimed to get out of lynch. It feels like a scum-gambit play, worst case: self is lynched, but he's going to be lynched anyways, but the reward is super high, and likelihood of going through is high too since joey pretty much as said it.

yeah I know - that's why I'm scum-reading koki again - since my townread do

[DrDolittle]

... since my townread of joey who promised to sort koki is no longer here, I have to sort him myself.

[DrDolittle]

@Oka

wait can someone give me a tldr on why PP is scum other than too many gifs. I waded through pages and pages and realized I never got a case.

wait can someone give me a tldr on why PP is scum other than too many gifs. I waded through pages and pages and realized I never got a case.

I believe the arguments include
"PP doesn't explain himself as town" i.e. this is not his town meta -- Kokichi
"PP is misrepresenting Tchill's meta" i.e. he might have been trying to buddy Tchill -- DVa
"PP is lolcatting as caught scum" i.e. he reacted poorly to the push by me and Kokichi -- Gamma-chan
"The day is too long" i.e. it was the leading wagon -- Tyrion
"PP is not me" i.e. he doesn't want to be the leading wagon anymore -- BEF

I think that summarizes everyone's reason for being on the wagon rn

These last two reasons can literally move to any other wagon. So you are telling me PP only has 3 votes.

[DrDolittle]

Joey clearly said he townreads me. So, now that he's gone you're using that to push my mislynch

yes but I remember he also said that your alignment will be more clear and he can read you better as the days go on.

[DrDolittle]

what are you talking about? Are you dense on purpose? The wagon was clearly stalling, seph was going to unvote, a50's didn't plan to hammer, and tchill and bef were willing to switch to any other wagon. all these statements are true. whats your narrative?

[DrDolittle]

VOTE: oka this flips scum.

[DrDolittle]

he's not even trying to scum hunt at this point. he's literally pushing any wagon that's out there trying to do gotchas with abs garbage.

[DrDolittle]

np your play is so bad your character deserves to be attacked

[DrDolittle]

here's seph

I'm not sure I understand the most reasoning behind the start of current PP wagon but I'm okay joining it.

VOTE: PP

What an interesting list.

You believe that I am hard townreading one scum buddy, voting another, and that one more potential is bussing me.

How do you think read lists work? Because that isn't how my read lists work. My 4 top srs on D1 are under no requirement of being scum together. In fact my reads change quite a bit come D2 most of the time.

Why am I scum?

Oh that's -1,

unvote

poe. I don't think you've been doing anything to move the game forward in recent memory whereas the other slots have done more or made posts that ping me as town. I don't think the reaction to your wagon of just posting images helps your case. Not that it hurts it.

I don't understand the start of your wagon because I don't know your meta. Like the whole explaining vs saying reexplain thing seems kind of arbitrary but those who do have your meta feel it pretty strongly.

I'm voting you because you're the current wagon and I wagoning is always a good thing to do

[DrDolittle]

did you just straight out attack my character and fail to refute a single a point i just made?

wtf

yeah i really dont want to refute your points cause they are bug crap and anyone with two eyes can see its big crap but ill humor you

[DrDolittle]

also here's your bullshit on a50: in

@Metaph: So, let me try again.. one more time..

I agree PP should not (and probably will not) be lynched today. What I want is for people to move off him and start voting other people, and then I won't be pressuring him for a claim. I have no particular interest in knowing his role, but if that's what it takes to get people to MOVE ON WITH THE GAME, then that's what I HAVE TO DO.

Can you help me move the game forward by convincing people to UNVOTE PP and join any other wagon 9or start their own if they must)?? Because if we wait for 4 more days, starting a "new" wagon would be hard as hell, simply because anyone who votes someone who does not already have a wagon on them would be dubbed "vanity wagoning", so we'd be like "either lynch X or Y".

My first analysis on PP wagon came n like post 1200+

[DrDolittle]

Meh I don’t like DDL as much rn.

intent to hammer

ill deal with you in a bit

[DrDolittle]

??????? so what

[DrDolittle]

also what does 1106 try to convey

[DrDolittle]

i need to clear my head. im seriously baffled at your play. it's like playing the chewbaca defense.

[DrDolittle]

which i guess in essence does work in a way

[DrDolittle]

a period of time like 100 - 150 posts?

[DrDolittle]

im just going to let seph answer his own reads

[DrDolittle]

here's the chewbacca. You want to paint me as scum. You're argument is that my claim of PP's wagon state is false (irrelevance). Not to mention your argument is false. (wookies don't live on endor they live on kashyyyk). And you repeatedly clutter the thread with garbage.

[DrDolittle]

you can still try and argue that the wagon was stalling and you can argue how im employing the chewbacca defense while you are waiting for sephiroth

even if i concede wagon was going "strong" for like 150 posts, the wagon was clearly stalling from A50's 1130s to 1275 (skitters VC) until my new counter wagon.

[DrDolittle]

no i didn't i went out to get some milk jeez

[DrDolittle]

claiming jailkeeper

[DrDolittle]

are you serious?

[DrDolittle]

a50. that's why he got the null result, and thats why i was very ok with his gs claim

[DrDolittle]

Since I made that I'll tell you what in conveys. It spells "I don't want to hammer you,

but if you don't claim I will

." Clear and simple. I wanted PP to claim something or another. Let's say he claims Doctor. He would have been my check target. Doctors have no guns, so I can verify he is not a goon fake claiming.

this is not the sense I got. In particular the bold part. My read is that "Ideally I want a claim, but I'm not going to hammer you". And besides, didnt PP not claim and why didn't you go after him more when he didnt

anyways this is irrelevant since youre town, but i'm just going over my interpretation

[DrDolittle]

Also why A50 over one of the masons?

this is embarassing but I thought he was scum and likely to make the kill on day end

[DrDolittle]

Im here.

[DrDolittle]

DDL, why did you want Mew to confirm if he was ascetic?

because i have mew as a town read and why he had an investigative null, and I think him holding this information doesn't make any sense.

[DrDolittle]

I think A50 is pretty much confirmed GS at this point, barring a scenario of DDL + A50 scumteam which is unlikely and very gusty because double incriminating yourself as scum right now is way too risky.

The way I see the DDL slot is it will resolve itself pretty much in 1 ~ 2 days. Maybe he is lying, but I don't see much we can gain from flipping DDL right now because a town flip gets us nowhere, so we have to be extremely sure of scum DDL.

yup. A50 can check me tonight for guns. (If A50 gets null, then that would indicate I'm scum as well)

[DrDolittle]

Well, his next likely scum on his list was you, and I don't think you were suspected in thread.

Yeah it was 50/50 gamma vs A50 block and I chose A50 in the end.

And DrD didn't crumb at all in any of his long catchup posts?

Idk, I don't get why Mew is doing weird associatives with me instead of pushing drd on his claim, but the claim does seem a bit suspect

I don't crumb. But JK claim is corroborated by my belief in A50's claim in Day 2 as well as my insistence that mew claims that he's not ascetic.

[DrDolittle]

Also why A50 over one of the masons?

this is embarassing but I thought he was scum and likely to make the kill on day end

I guess it is worth asking what about the flip made you change your read of a50 and why you wouldn't use the jk protectively... like why would you assume a50 would be the one to make the kill?

UNVOTE:

I had three scum reads. Knowing BEF is not going to make the kill, its a 50/50 on A50 vs gamma. Whereas if I target a mason for protection, it could easily be WIFOM'd, plus, scum may be interested in shooting others. Overall, my EV computation is that targetting to stop a kill might be better.

hey wait ddl why are you townreading me

im not.

VOTE: DDL

You are seriously voting a claimed TPR

[DrDolittle]

VOTE: DDL

what is it that you don't believe about my role? is it that you hypothesize im scum JK a la Nako or I'm not JK at all?

[DrDolittle]

If DDL is a town jk could that mean that he blocked the scum NK in A50?

actually this could be a reasonable hypothesis on what happened, and my JK actually unintentionally protected A50

[DrDolittle]

this might be setup speculation but mafia gunsmith is way too odd.