Open 721: Pick Your Poison (Game Over)

[Scioness Sajj]

ofrhz still scum

but I also want a hammer

[Oxy]

In post 1551, Oxy wrote:
Scioness is a terrible, awful, horrible, no-good lynch today.

Please do not let my counter wagon be sajj.

I'm terrible lynch today but what about tomorrow? Do you think you will have a confident enough read on me, without a clear, to take me into lylo?

A lot can change between now and Lylo, and I can't imagine that I won't reevaluate

but right this second my reads go, from town to scum, ruru, sajj, NSG, mathdino, AP, UglyDuck, Pinturicchio, Sunshine, Skitter30, Draynth, Ofrhz, The Worst.

Change in NSG due to recent content (she's clearly not left shifting to avoid mathdino read. This seems townie all by itself. Her analysis seems townie, and the more I look at Mohab's exit, and knowing that I'm town, the more townie that exit looks.)

Sunshine moved down because he's voting me even though he gut town reads me because he's worried about getting information more than he's worried about lynching scum.

Skitter and Draynth switched places primarily because Draynth has been prod dodging for days on days, but also in part because of how strongly NSG feels.

Ofrhz has been active elsewhere, but hasn't provided content here in days. His scum partners are telling him to dodge this game until the deadline.

The Worst these last few days has just oozed scum to me. Obviously, ya'll don't see it, or else you would be talking about it. If I'm not here D2, please look at this slot very closely. I've got a list of quotes in a spoiler with commentary that you can look at for inspiration.

Also, this is town dino. I'm not sure how you guys are missing it.

[northsidegal]

I'm kinda getting cold feet wrt the oxy wagon.

I guess I dislike the draynth wagon less right now though?

But I don't really think that a lack of content/flaking is AI for him; nor is promising content and not following through. A quick meta-dive shows him flaking/replacing out of towngames.

DOES ANYONE ELSE THINK PROMISING THINGS AND NOT DELIVERING IS A SCUMTELL

#NOBAMBOOZLE

And, like, this isn't for draynth

He got lynched as town day4 in the Newbie 1858; repped out after a week of low content as town in open 692 (made some of those 'I'm reading now, sorry for the inactivity' posts without following through ); did the same in Newbie 1822 as town; got nk'd n1 in newbie 1820; got nk'd n1 in newbie 1817 (his ISO looks fairly active and contributing here); got lynched day4 in lylo as town in newbie 1811 (shared some self-meta here, and was fairly involved and contributing); jumped to scum!draynth in newbie 1803 cuz I got bored - had a few of the 'sorry for inactivity posts', was fairly active otherwise, was present but his content looked kinda empty; looking at some older games he got replaced by the mod for inactivity as town without asking to be replaced.

Like I just don't know if the lack of content is AI for him.

And a metadive indicates that the above *isn't* a scumtell for him; it's an 'I'm busy in real-life' tell and not AI.

And like from *Math* to push that without checking is pretty gross and lazy.

VOTE: Math

Never once have I said that him promising content and not delivering or him just being not active in general makes him scum.

[the worst]

Nsg your case makes sense it's just been withheld til so close to deadline... rawr.

[Sunshine13]

Sunshine moved down because he's voting me even though he gut town reads me because he's worried about getting information more than he's worried about lynching scum.

Is Draynth scum?

[Oxy]

Sunshine moved down because he's voting me even though he gut town reads me because he's worried about getting information more than he's worried about lynching scum.

Is Draynth scum?

There is a pretty good chance that he is, yeah.

The part I find scummy is your focus on how much information you can glean from a lynch.

This is a great cover for a scum motivation.

I think that the information gained on a mislynch should be a secondary consideration. Lynching scum comes first.

Of course, you could be town with a different philosophy, and I can't know how your home site thinks.

And my vote, both by voting someone with good scum equity and by helping to divert a lynch off of myself (0 scum equity), is consistent with the above philosophy.

[Oxy]

Of course, you could be town with a different philosophy, and I can't know how your home site thinks.

This makes it sound less likely than I think it is.

Sunshine is probably town. This is scummy tho, and that's why I moved him down.

[Sunshine13]

You see that’s the problem, I want to lynch you because you’re scum. Draynth I know nothing about, but I do know that you - scum - is voting for him, therefore he is, more likely than not, town.

From that, Draynth is town that nobody has a read on, so it’s objectively the worst mislynch we could possibly have for getting information into the game. That is where I’ve been coming from. That’s what I mean by low information lynch. I shouldn’t have to spell that out.

Also, please stop with “my play in this situation is pro-town so I must be town!” because scum don’t exactly roll over and die when they get wagoned, do they?

Look at ofrhz, likely vig target and your scumread. He claimed VT, so he must be town because that’s what town would do in that situation, right?

Pedit: Why is it scummy that I think differently?

[AP]

@Sunshine: We may still have problem here, which is town!Draynth (assuming you're correct) isn't playing the game, and thus is even more harmful to town than scum are! He's providing no content, and could potentially not even have a grasp on the situation come the point when his vote is the decider. I'm no against people playing relaxed, but I'm firmly against people not even checking in.

P.S. Look at me. I'm not exactly playing the game myself, but I'm around and I'm reading. I may or may not have come to conclusions that may help us later on. There may or may not be some clues I've dropped within my posts for me to refer to later on. In short, I'm doing the bare minimum, whereas Draynth seems not even meet that minimum.

[the worst]

Lynching bad town before lynching probscum is literally playing against wincon surely

Draynth is still gonna be there to lynch d2 if you want to kick his ass, Oxy will slip through if we leave him today.

[Mathdino]

Am I gonna have to towncase this sunuvabitch in the next 20 hours

Or can we just compromise on scioness so we don't have to lynch the lurker and do I don't have to actually nitpick oxys iso

I have intent already, if you wanna stop Draynth wagon you vote scioness

[the worst]

Hmmmm will I listen to your towncase......
Is Sajj or Draynth more likely to flip scum.......

all shrugs, even if this wagon turns vanity I actually have a strong read for once so I will park it til deadline

[the worst]

Uh that is, a hammer > no lynch so I will vote anyone I'm not townreading at deadline [:

[Mathdino]

Sajj is by vca/gamestate analysis

[the worst]

I guess I did arrogantly demand you deliver me scum.

I'll join her wagon if a few more people check in and don't agree with me about Oxy.

[Mathdino]

my god oxy's ISO is already on page 2 and has surpassed mine in post count and word count

i'm not getting to this in the next few hours lol

[Oxy]

Also, please stop with “my play in this situation is pro-town so I must be town!” because scum don’t exactly roll over and die when they get wagoned, do they?

I perceived you to be preparing to call me a hypocrite. I was defending against that. It just so happens to be pro-town.

[the worst]

my god oxy's ISO is already on page 2 and has surpassed mine in post count and word count

i'm not getting to this in the next few hours lol

Oh yeah sorry I was trying to allude in my last post--I probably won't listen to a towncase before EOD.

What do you think of NSG's scumcase on Draynth?

[Sunshine13]

Also, please stop with “my play in this situation is pro-town so I must be town!” because scum don’t exactly roll over and die when they get wagoned, do they?

I perceived you to be preparing to call me a hypocrite. I was defending against that. It just so happens to be pro-town.

I no longer wish to hammer my head against this wall, I am sore and the visions are disturbing.

[AP]

if you wanna stop Draynth wagon you vote scioness

VOTE: scioness

[Mathdino]

What do you think of NSG's scumcase on Draynth?

it certainly was an NSG case wasn't it

i'm less interested in the case and more interested in the fact that skitter seems to be tunneling draynth as not-scum while completely talking past people's real reasons for voting him

it's actually kind of uncomfortable how she keeps framing the draynth wagon as activity-based, and pretty rich that she would accuse NSG of that

^did you like my pivot

[Scioness Sajj]

eh, not the worst idea to lynch me considering everything I guess.

[the worst]

Yeah I'm tearing my hair out on EOD Skitter. On one hand voting you like that struck me as ridiculous from scum!skitter but otoh it felt like she hadnt read everything properly...?

It was definitely an NSG case
I don't think I'm actually convinced by it, felt very much like fitting evidence to a theory rather than vice versa

Math how would you feel if I said I think one of you and skitter is scum and I have no idea currently which one it is

[the worst]

eh, not the worst idea to lynch me considering everything I guess.

great let's do this

[Mathdino]

Yeah I'm tearing my hair out on EOD Skitter. On one hand voting you like that struck me as ridiculous from scum!skitter but otoh it felt like she hadnt read everything properly...?

It was definitely an NSG case
I don't think I'm actually convinced by it, felt very much like fitting evidence to a theory rather than vice versa

Math how would you feel if I said I think one of you and skitter is scum and I have no idea currently which one it is

welcome to NSG cases

i would say you have about a 60% chance of being wrong because skitter is only about 40% scum to me