Newbie 1881 - Game Over

[Eragon]

I skimmed the whole first page because its just RQS/RVS

[Eragon]

Sarge, how much to you is too much posting or too little posting?

If I can recall correctly, I posted on average about 4-6 times per day on one marathon game.
For me at the moment, I wouldn't post something unless it provides insight or contributes somewhat to everyone is doing.
Even with this though I got called out for posting too little on the third day, so I guess that amount of posting is too little.

Typically speaking, you should at least check in once every 24 hours at the bare minimum to comment on things, answer questions, or ask questions, but as the deadline gets closer, it is good to increase your posting and be more active, especially if no real lynch candidates have been presented imo.

I dont really like people announcing they won't post very much, it seems like a good way to announce your going to slack
Kinda like "OH GUYS! I only post 4-6 times a day so dont scum read me based on me never being around alright cool im also town!"
(edited for artistic purposes)

I like Oka's response, it feels natural to me, its not much to go on but I am starting to lean town

[Eragon]

Fuck. I meant to not answer that until they said something, but I just smoked a bowl on the shitter and forgot.

lol. I agree with whoever said it, but

I think scum would be more careful about their posts, so this leans towny

[Eragon]

Im going to be putting these in spoilers to make it easier to read

Spoiler:

Mostly because they are newer and have 1 post in so far. I don't like the post and it's something I would like to engage her on, but until she gets back in here and posts more I can't do that.

1 post that's not quite good does not a scumbag make.

1 post is all it takes to make a scum slip

sometimes you need to read someone based on one post

Mostly because they are newer and have 1 post in so far. I don't like the post and it's something I would like to engage her on, but until she gets back in here and posts more I can't do that.

1 post that's not quite good does not a scumbag make.

Shit, can we get rid of that altslip?

oopsie.

Fuck. I meant to not answer that until they said something, but I just smoked a bowl on the shitter and forgot.

UNVOTE: maggie

VOTE: FormerFish

Not a fan of drug references

if this is real, its sus
if this is RvS, I dont like it but its NAI

It's scummy because they are making it seem like they don't want to vote because we may be out of rvs already, not very likely when we are barely on page 2. They answer their own question by mentioning that nothing scummy has really come up, which would mean that most likely we are still in rvs.

So if they were concerned about being out of rvs as a reason to have not voted, their own reasoning is negated by their own observation of the game, and should have felt comfortable voting freely.

For some reason they didn't.

*She/her, thanks.

It's possible to be out of RVS on page 2, just as it's possible for scummy things to happen during RVS, so I think your logic here is wrong. From my perspective, it seemed like there might be enough substantive talk, especially based on/around nancy's questions, that we might be out of RVS, but I wasn't positive because I'm still pretty new and I'm not 100% sure when RVS ends (other than everybody agreeing that it's over). So, I could either risk making a random vote and getting scrutinized for that, or I could be wrong about the RVS status and risk being scrutinized for not voting at all. I went with "don't vote, explain why, and assume people will understand," but that failed, and here we are.

Speaking of vote scrutiny...

UNVOTE: maggie

VOTE: FormerFish

Not a fan of drug references

My understanding of RVS is that it only involves one random vote, and then the next vote should be serious. So, why this second non-serious vote?

I would never scrutinize someone for voting someone in their entrance post unless its a vote on confirmed town
also, why would you be so worried about being scrutinzed for an RvS vote? if your town a little bit of scrutinization is actually good because it can help reveal peoples alignments and get discussion going
RvS can be any number of time, posts, or votes as long as there hasn't been serious discussion going on(or too much of it)

[Eragon]

Spoiler:

quote="In post 48, Flicker"]I don't care about being scrutinized overall, and I don't see how you got that out of my post? I just prefer to be scrutinized for better/more substantial reasons than I felt I would have been.[/quote]

You said you had the risk of making a random vote and getting the scrutinized for that versus getting scrutinized for not voting at all which makes me think that getting scrutinized is at the forefront of your mind.

I saw that too I dont really like the defensiveness and shading Oka on saying how did he get scrutinizing out of flicker's post

@nancy what are the point of these questions, especially question number 3

It helps to get a sense of people and to get some conversation started. I always try to develop a feel for people's baseline in games where I don't know anyone and those questions can be good for that. They're also the type of things that will usually come up at some point over the course of the game, so I think it gets that information out there earlier. Plus I feel like people have a tendency to tunnel a bit out of RVS, so I'm not a huge fan of the thing. "Who are we all and how do we play" feels like a healthier and more balanced way to start a game than "lol you're mafia".

I like Nancy's response to this

It's scummy because they are making it seem like they don't want to vote because we may be out of rvs already, not very likely when we are barely on page 2. They answer their own question by mentioning that nothing scummy has really come up, which would mean that most likely we are still in rvs.

So if they were concerned about being out of rvs as a reason to have not voted, their own reasoning is negated by their own observation of the game, and should have felt comfortable voting freely.

For some reason they didn't.

Kinda like this approach to sorting Flicker, and that he saw the same thing that I saw.

agreed, and im getting towny vibes from both FF and you

Fuck. I meant to not answer that until they said something, but I just smoked a bowl on the shitter and forgot.

UNVOTE: maggie

VOTE: FormerFish

Not a fan of drug references

Um. Why are you voting him? Do you think it's scummy that he made a drug reference? I feel like I'm missing something.

agreed

So, I could either risk making a random vote and getting scrutinized for that, or I could be wrong about the RVS status and risk being scrutinized for not voting at all. I went with "don't vote, explain why, and assume people will understand," but that failed, and here we are.

Kinda like the transparency here, I guess.

could you explain what transparency is?

[Eragon]

Spoiler:

And your response feels genuine, which I like? It's not very alignment indicative but sure, let's say it's a little bit towny for now. I mean, it would have been scummy for you to actually call him scum for such bad reasons, so that not being a thing is the main thing I get from your response. Still like you for town, woohoo!

I agree that Trinity feels mostly natural, so light town, but not too much.

I also like Nancy as town more and more

And your response feels genuine, which I like? It's not very alignment indicative but sure, let's say it's a little bit towny for now. I mean, it would have been scummy for you to actually call him scum for such bad reasons, so that not being a thing is the main thing I get from your response. Still like you for town, woohoo!

Yeah, I’m not saying he’s scum. Yet.

This was odd to me. I guess its early D1 and reads aren't really in fruition, but this was as fence-sitty post as ive ever seen

Yet?

Just that it’s too early to tell

if you have any doubts, push, push, push your null/scum reads

I read Flickers post as just confusion about RVS which is justified, i dont really care for it either. I think Formerfish is reading too much into it or taking the wrong meaning of what she wrote rather than trying to play it up tho. i'd put this as NAI for both sides. Also, @Flicker - i've seen people make multiple RVS votes, it doesnt really matter. tbh if playing the RVS in an unorthodox way like voting multiple times kick starts the game then imo its better because i hate the RVS.

HOWEVER - TrinityNZ's vote change and reasoning that she wanted to move it off of a player who is being replaced actually makes me think she is town. Like i said, nothing wrong with throwing your vote around if it kick starts the game. The RVS' only purpose is to get the game moving. mafia players want us to have a nice slow game with low activity, she could have kept her vote on maggie where it would have no affect on getting the game moving and none of us would have questioned her. But she decided to change it and risk drawing attention on herself anyway. i dont think mafia players would do that

first P.: Formerfish saw exactly what Nancy and I saw, so its not really reading into it too much, or taking the wrong meaning, but on the same note its not a super scummy thing(What we saw)

Second P. I agree with this, but also RvS is good for looking at associations.

Anyway, I already feel pretty good about this game considering it's only page 4.

I like Trinity's kind of guileless attitude, it doesn't feel put on and she doesn't feel nervous. I basically agree with stan's take that it's sorta villagery to have had the thought that she should keep her vote on someone who is active. Could be that she's just trying to do the Right Thing as a wolf, I guess, but that's not really how I'm feeling it.

Sort of like the way FF put down his thoughts on Flicker then immediately oopsed and said he had meant to wait for a response to her. It feels like a bit of a town thing to have thoughts on something that you're holding on to, and I think if he was mafia he would probably be more aware of what he was doing, rather than just plopping them down right away. I'm not a huge fan of way he's using logic there, feels a little forced, but I also thought the way Flicker held on to her vote was a little off, and I can believe that he just took that feeling a little further than I did.

The way OkaPoka is asking people questions feels good, I guess. It's not much but it's a start. I like that he was looking into Flicker's mindset rather than just laying down a superficial take that she was scummy for being self-conscious or something like that.

stan feels super relaxed and I guess I'm reading that as a town thing at this point. I like his Trinity read probably more than anything that's happened so far, I think. It really shows that he's looking for her motivation there and not being lazy with the way he's thinking about the game.

Sorta dislike SA a little, mostly just that he laid down and a vote without commenting on anything that was happening in his first, and hasn't really done anything since. Moar posts, pls.

Peeps should tell me if they think anything I just wrote is insane.

honestly, even if this sounds like sheeping...
I agree with ever single point you made, except...
I dont think Oka asking questions is AI and,
while Stan feels relaxed, his trinity read could be based off a little TMI and coming from scum, so I dont think that is AI either

[nancy]

UNVOTE:

What, dot tm

[OkaPoka]

huh?

[nancy]

okay trinity, nancy, and stanley are town

im having a hard time really scumreading anyone rn tho

thought i had a direction with trinity but meh

im not really seeing flicker scum rn

pretty sure former is town

[nancy]

huh?

Your unvote is weird.

[Eragon]

Spoiler:

@nancy what are the point of these questions, especially question number 3

Now that nancy's responded, I want to know: What was the point of

this

question? You don't seem to have a problem with them, given you answered them (in post 18, although with less detail than basically everyone else). It also seems fairly obvious that at least one of the ways nancy uses them is for hunting, given how she'd already started sorting people based on their answers (12, 15). Plus, it seems a little off to me how it took you so long to wonder about them.

why are you shading Oka because he asked a question about RQS

also, I hope you realize that Nancy's "reads" based off of RQS are either reaction's or light reads, not strong reads.

Sort of like the way FF put down his thoughts on Flicker then immediately oopsed and said he had meant to wait for a response to her. It feels like a bit of a town thing to have thoughts on something that you're holding on to, and I think if he was mafia he would probably be more aware of what he was doing, rather than just plopping them down right away.

I'm not a huge fan of way he's using logic there

, feels a little forced, but I also thought the way Flicker held on to her vote was a little off, and I can believe that he just took that feeling a little further than I did.

Its just that I'm having flashbacks to another newer player that like 3 of us just played a game with, 2.8. He was very stuck on rules and procedures during the game he was scum, and im pretty sure trinity was the partner there. He kept talking about procedures and how he wasnt sure if he was following them correctly. It led to his lynch on day 1.

To me the idea that someone is going to scrutinize everything you say is one from scum. As town I dont give a shit what I say or how I say it. I can either back it up or i end up being wrong and I may end up eating rope. If I'm a PR then that sucks, but as a VT one can only dream of eating the n1 kill. As scum I am much more aware of what I say and when. Everything I do is crafted to try and prey upon someones weak spot.

I've also quite recently played with a new player who awkwardly played rvs in that game and he ended up being scum.

This is all anecdotal.

I concur with these sentiments exactly.
as town you should be relaxed and trust in yourself
as scum you try to act relaxed but you also need to be aware

@nancy what are the point of these questions, especially question number 3

Now that nancy's responded, I want to know: What was the point of

this

question? You don't seem to have a problem with them, given you answered them (in post 18, although with less detail than basically everyone else). It also seems fairly obvious that at least one of the ways nancy uses them is for hunting, given how she'd already started sorting people based on their answers (12, 15). Plus, it seems a little off to me how it took you so long to wonder about them.

because some people like to play RQS over RVS and usually RQS ends up with a stalled game with no where to go because game quickly devolves into asking questions about NAI things.

it doesn't normally end with a stalled game, it actually makes it into more of a natural transition game

@nancy what are the point of these questions, especially question number 3

Now that nancy's responded, I want to know: What was the point of

this

question? You don't seem to have a problem with them, given you answered them (in post 18, although with less detail than basically everyone else). It also seems fairly obvious that at least one of the ways nancy uses them is for hunting, given how she'd already started sorting people based on their answers (12, 15). Plus, it seems a little off to me how it took you so long to wonder about them.

I sorta don't believe that these are things that bother you?

Feels a little more like you're looking for ways to dumpster him for not looking sexy than having legitimate concerns with what his motivations are. Particularly the way that you're kind of passive aggressively painting what he's doing as scummy without actually committing to a scumread. I'd expect that kind of approach when you've maybe had a scumread for a while and been stewing over it and there's just nothing about the person that you like, not in a super early game situation where first impressions are still being made pretty much.

So, uh, why is it scummy to you that he didn't ask me about the RQS thing right away? Why is it a bad thing that he asked me about something that you felt should be obvious? I don't necessarily agree that it should have been obvious and I don't think there's anything super harmful in asking that kind of question, so please help me see why you do?

I don't understand your approach here and I'd like to understand it so if you could talk more about what you're thinking / doing that would be super helpful.

Vote: Flicker

I agree with Nancy here, Flicker ?pushing? and shading Oka based on asking a question is wolfy and I am not getting good vibes from flicker rn.

Sort of like the way FF put down his thoughts on Flicker then immediately oopsed and said he had meant to wait for a response to her. It feels like a bit of a town thing to have thoughts on something that you're holding on to, and I think if he was mafia he would probably be more aware of what he was doing, rather than just plopping them down right away.

I'm not a huge fan of way he's using logic there

, feels a little forced, but I also thought the way Flicker held on to her vote was a little off, and I can believe that he just took that feeling a little further than I did.

Its just that I'm having flashbacks to another newer player that like 3 of us just played a game with, 2.8. He was very stuck on rules and procedures during the game he was scum, and im pretty sure trinity was the partner there. He kept talking about procedures and how he wasnt sure if he was following them correctly. It led to his lynch on day 1.

To me the idea that someone is going to scrutinize everything you say is one from scum. As town I dont give a shit what I say or how I say it. I can either back it up or i end up being wrong and I may end up eating rope. If I'm a PR then that sucks, but as a VT one can only dream of eating the n1 kill. As scum I am much more aware of what I say and when. Everything I do is crafted to try and prey upon someones weak spot.

I've also quite recently played with a new player who awkwardly played rvs in that game and he ended up being scum.

This is all anecdotal.

This is like, extremely nebulous but I am townreading you for all of this, lmao.

lmao

because some people like to play RQS over RVS and usually RQS ends up with a stalled game with no where to go because game quickly devolves into asking questions about NAI things.

Hum. Either a) the questions asked in RQS were bad, or b) the people in the game didn't know how to push the game forward. I don't think RQS as a thing is ever going to be at fault for the game stalling.

Sure, in mafiascum meta people are more familiar with just tunneling on stupid nonsense and yelling at each other, which lends itself better to RVS than RQS for obvious reasons, and might feel uncomfortable actually treating each other with decency and approaching the game from a more reasonable standpoint, but to say that RQS is to blame for people not knowing how to handle it properly is, um, sorta shortsighted, I think.

"just tunneling on stupid nonsense and yelling at each other,"
-is it ok if I quote you on this in my sig?

Also like, I have the starts of two townreads and a scumread from how people responded to the discussion around RQS, so to say that it's not good for generating reads just ain't truth.

yep

[nancy]

Sarge, how much to you is too much posting or too little posting?

If I can recall correctly, I posted on average about 4-6 times per day on one marathon game.
For me at the moment, I wouldn't post something unless it provides insight or contributes somewhat to everyone is doing.
Even with this though I got called out for posting too little on the third day, so I guess that amount of posting is too little.

Typically speaking, you should at least check in once every 24 hours at the bare minimum to comment on things, answer questions, or ask questions, but as the deadline gets closer, it is good to increase your posting and be more active, especially if no real lynch candidates have been presented imo.

I dont really like people announcing they won't post very much, it seems like a good way to announce your going to slack
Kinda like "OH GUYS! I only post 4-6 times a day so dont scum read me based on me never being around alright cool im also town!"
(edited for artistic purposes)

I like Oka's response, it feels natural to me, its not much to go on but I am starting to lean town

Eragon is town!!! jordan_dunk.gif

[OkaPoka]

trinity is town because i don't see a new player interact that much and be scum

nancy ur town because i don't see you interacting that much to be scum

stanley feels like a rational town player

---

i thought trinity might have been scum with the rvs vote thing she did on FF but i don't think so anymore, mainly because i think her not understanding it was l2 seems genuine

flicker seems a bit defensive but nothing concrete yet

former is town because reasons

---
unvoted because we are out of rvs

and ill read that eragon post later

[Eragon]

Spoiler:

because some people like to play RQS over RVS and usually RQS ends up with a stalled game with no where to go because game quickly devolves into asking questions about NAI things.

Hum. Either a) the questions asked in RQS were bad, or b) the people in the game didn't know how to push the game forward. I don't think RQS as a thing is ever going to be at fault for the game stalling.

Sure, in mafiascum meta people are more familiar with just tunneling on stupid nonsense and yelling at each other, which lends itself better to RVS than RQS for obvious reasons, and might feel uncomfortable actually treating each other with decency and approaching the game from a more reasonable standpoint, but to say that RQS is to blame for people not knowing how to handle it properly is, um, sorta shortsighted, I think.

i guess it is shortsighted but you are the IC so you have some semblance of authority making it easy for scum!you to try and derail the game into non scumhunt mode. apathy and inaction are probably some of the leading causes of town losses in non role madness setups.

lolwut

because some people like to play RQS over RVS and usually RQS ends up with a stalled game with no where to go because game quickly devolves into asking questions about NAI things.

Hum. Either a) the questions asked in RQS were bad, or b) the people in the game didn't know how to push the game forward. I don't think RQS as a thing is ever going to be at fault for the game stalling.

Sure, in mafiascum meta people are more familiar with just tunneling on stupid nonsense and yelling at each other, which lends itself better to RVS than RQS for obvious reasons, and might feel uncomfortable actually treating each other with decency and approaching the game from a more reasonable standpoint, but to say that RQS is to blame for people not knowing how to handle it properly is, um, sorta shortsighted, I think.

i guess it is shortsighted but you are the IC so you have some semblance of authority making it easy for scum!you to try and derail the game into non scumhunt mode. apathy and inaction are probably some of the leading causes of town losses in non role madness setups.

Um, I'm pretty sure that would be against IC rules. Like, if I'm mafia then I am straight up not allowed to lie about theory stuff to benefit my wincon. If I did then I would be banned as IC. This is why the IC role is so important in newbies. You need someone to be able to talk about theory stuff that you can trust to be truthful regardless of their alignment.

You're right that if I'm mafia I super want to derail the game and have people not scumhunting, though. I would just manipulate my position as the most experienced player to do that, not my role as IC specifically. Like, I can totally make shit up like "hey we should lynch this townie who claimed cop, that would totally be the best idea ever, right guys???" but I can't speak as IC and say "yeah it's optimal to lynch someone who claims a role".

Really just treat me as any other player and try not to think too much about the fact that I'm the IC when you're trying to get a read on me and such, because uhm, I actually am just another player and I'm not special in any way whatsoever in that capacity.

Also, kinda think it's a teensy bit towny that you're thinking about this, lmao.

im liking Nancy as town

Then again the way you worded that "leading causes of town losses" etc. feels a little brittle. Hrm. What are Tone Reads.

agreed

Also like, I'm pretty obviously not trying to derail the game into non-scumhunting mode I think, lmao, so yeah actually that's a pretty detached thought to have and from that perspective it doesn't really feel genuine, hm.

You can join the poopoo list.

lol

What are Pregame Readscales lmao

nancy ~ )) ---- )) ---- stan - FF, Trinity - [Iceman, Eragon] % )) - > SA, OkaPoka - Flicker )) ~

can you explain what this means... ive never seen reads like this lol.

[Eragon]

(ignore the part about read scales I saw you explained it.)

[OkaPoka]

odds that scum are iceman and sargealpha?

[Eragon]

has iceman even posted?


also, I dont like the fact that you are asking about a scumteam of 2 people(that might be newbies. I dont know) and have had almost zero thread presence

[Eragon]

Hey, @FF @stan @Trinity, does this feel like a scum-scum interaction to you? Feel free to punt on it.

The question from OkaPoka seems a bit odd to me, but I don’t see why it would be a scum interaction.

Oka's question doesnt seem odd to me. But with Flicker's question I don't see the point at all. I also don't understand why she would feel the need to mention that he didn't answer them as well as other people. (also i checked - Oka actually put in roughly the same amount of effort I did when answering them).

I guess the point of a scum-scum interaction is to make it seem like they are trying to sort eachother without going too hard as hard bussing is a scumtell. Maybe, but i don't think so. Oka had a reasonable answer and i see nothing wrong with his original question. so i don't think it's scum-scum

Here is what i think happened - Oka actually made a question to Flicker in #47 and then in #49 criticized her response. Flicker did not respond to this but instead wrote post #80. So instead of responding to the fair criticism by Oka, Flicker threw some criticism straight back at OKa. I think this is scummy, especially because there was nothing really substantial in what she was saying, its like it was pulled from thin air because she thought she needed to give something back as a way to turn people against Oka instead of herself

VOTE: Flicker

wow I didnt even catch that lol.

Distancing alpha-omega Blueline 42 Redbull between flicker and Oka?

[OkaPoka]

has iceman even posted?


also, I dont like the fact that you are asking about a scumteam of 2 people(that might be newbies. I dont know) and have had almost zero thread presence

saying it cuz im not getting any hard scum pings from the active players

[Eragon]

Spoiler:

Fuck. I meant to not answer that until they said something, but I just smoked a bowl on the shitter and forgot.

UNVOTE: maggie

VOTE: FormerFish

Not a fan of drug references

Fuck. I meant to not answer that until they said something, but I just smoked a bowl on the shitter and forgot.

UNVOTE: maggie

VOTE: FormerFish

Not a fan of drug references

Um. Why are you voting him? Do you think it's scummy that he made a drug reference? I feel like I'm missing something.

I thought we were still in RVS, and as Maggie is being replaced, and isn’t around, thought I’d switch my vote. So I didn’t think the drug reference was scummy, but just the reason for my random vote.

It's scummy because they are making it seem like they don't want to vote because we may be out of rvs already, not very likely when we are barely on page 2. They answer their own question by mentioning that nothing scummy has really come up, which would mean that most likely we are still in rvs.

So if they were concerned about being out of rvs as a reason to have not voted, their own reasoning is negated by their own observation of the game, and should have felt comfortable voting freely.

For some reason they didn't.

*She/her, thanks.

It's possible to be out of RVS on page 2, just as it's possible for scummy things to happen during RVS, so I think your logic here is wrong. From my perspective, it seemed like there might be enough substantive talk, especially based on/around nancy's questions, that we might be out of RVS, but I wasn't positive because I'm still pretty new and I'm not 100% sure when RVS ends (other than everybody agreeing that it's over). So, I could either risk making a random vote and getting scrutinized for that, or I could be wrong about the RVS status and risk being scrutinized for not voting at all. I went with "don't vote, explain why, and assume people will understand," but that failed, and here we are.

Speaking of vote scrutiny...

UNVOTE: maggie

VOTE: FormerFish

Not a fan of drug references

My understanding of RVS is that it only involves one random vote, and then the next vote should be serious. So, why this second non-serious vote?

Oops. I didn’t realise there was a restriction on how many random votes you could do. Sorry. Should I unvote?

@trinityNZ

1) did you know you were rvs'ing and putting FF L-2 this early into the game?
2) is 64 sarcasm?

are you scum reading trinity off of these 2 points?
if you have more, post it, if not, this is extremely weak and pushy

because some people like to play RQS over RVS and usually RQS ends up with a stalled game with no where to go because game quickly devolves into asking questions about NAI things.

Nancy's questions are hardly random, though. As the IC, it makes sense to ask that kind of stuff.

I sorta don't believe that these are things that bother you?

Feels a little more like you're looking for ways to dumpster him for not looking sexy than having legitimate concerns with what his motivations are. Particularly the way that you're kind of passive aggressively painting what he's doing as scummy without actually committing to a scumread. I'd expect that kind of approach when you've maybe had a scumread for a while and been stewing over it and there's just nothing about the person that you like, not in a super early game situation where first impressions are still being made pretty much.

So, uh, why is it scummy to you that he didn't ask me about the RQS thing right away? Why is it a bad thing that he asked me about something that you felt should be obvious? I don't necessarily agree that it should have been obvious and I don't think there's anything super harmful in asking that kind of question, so please help me see why you do?

I don't understand your approach here and I'd like to understand it so if you could talk more about what you're thinking / doing that would be super helpful.

Vote: Flicker

Funny you think I'm subtly shading Oka, because I felt like I was pretty explicitly scumreading him, based on him subtly shading

you

. I just don't see, with the timing of the question and how many people (including Oka) who had answered it, why to ask that. And if it was a question of RVS vs RQS (which isn't even the case here, your questions aren't random), that's just a playstyle difference that Oka must already be aware of; so why not just mention that, instead of just a general question with some subtle shade (at Q3 in particular)?

I think this question coming from a newbie would have been okay, but Oka's a pretty experienced SE so that kind of "method" question doesn't feel so innocent. And I agree with you that his further thoughts in 93 feel off, too.

(also i checked - Oka actually put in roughly the same amount of effort I did when answering them).

The difference between your responses and his, though, is that even with a similar amount of effort, your answers still have more detail/substance. I mean, your "This my third game so far. I think the most important thing i've learnt is to always think about motivations behind posts." is better than his "yes and still suck, turns out people are good at lying." Maybe that's not enough of a difference to you, but it is to me.

Here is what i think happened - Oka actually made a question to Flicker in #47 and then in #49 criticized her response. Flicker did not respond to this but instead wrote post #80. So instead of responding to the fair criticism by Oka, Flicker threw some criticism straight back at OKa.

I disagree that 49 is a criticism of my response. It just felt like Oka explaining himself, and I didn't have a reply to that other than to reiterate my remarks from 48. Also, in general, if my reply would only be something like "you're wrong," I just don't bother replying.

@trinityNZ

1) did you know you were rvs'ing and putting FF L-2 this early into the game?
2) is 64 sarcasm?

Meanwhile, here's another example of unnecessary/subtly shading questions from Oka. Trinity mentions RVS in the second quoted post, and Q2 is just a little silly, no? These feel more like busywork than honest/useful questions.

VOTE: OkaPoka

*distancing intensifies*
while this is a better case on Oka than Oka's on trinity
it still pings me as reachy and looking for every little tiny thing you can grab on to
kinda like climbing a mountain

@flicker i mean sure draw conclusions before the q&a session with trinity is over

...

[Eragon]

okay trinity, nancy, and stanley are town

im having a hard time really scumreading anyone rn tho

thought i had a direction with trinity but meh

im not really seeing flicker scum rn

pretty sure former is town

what changed with trinity and flicker?

[Eragon]

trinity is town because i don't see a new player interact that much and be scum

nancy ur town because i don't see you interacting that much to be scum

stanley feels like a rational town player

---

i thought trinity might have been scum with the rvs vote thing she did on FF but i don't think so anymore, mainly because i think her not understanding it was l2 seems genuine

flicker seems a bit defensive but nothing concrete yet

former is town because reasons

---
unvoted because we are out of rvs

and ill read that eragon post later

saw you explain it after I posted, sorry.

so you thought trinity was scum, but when they said they didnt know it was L-2 it went to town????

[OkaPoka]

trinity is town because i don't see a new player interact that much and be scum

nancy ur town because i don't see you interacting that much to be scum

stanley feels like a rational town player

---

i thought trinity might have been scum with the rvs vote thing she did on FF but i don't think so anymore, mainly because i think her not understanding it was l2 seems genuine

flicker seems a bit defensive but nothing concrete yet

former is town because reasons

---
unvoted because we are out of rvs

and ill read that eragon post later

saw you explain it after I posted, sorry.

so you thought trinity was scum, but when they said they didnt know it was L-2 it went to town????

kinda

i was hoping i could bait trinity into saying something incriminating that i could latch onto but she didn't so ehh

[Eragon]

okay...

im going to eat now

AMA and ill respond later

[nancy]

could you explain what transparency is?[/spoiler]

So like, imagine you've got a curtain, and behind the curtain is a big fat messy glob of brainjuice containing all your thoughts about the game. Everyone has their own special and unique glob of brainjuice, is part of being human. When you talk about things in the game, you're extracting stuff from your brainjuices and presenting them to rest of the game, basically by parting the curtain a little and sharing a little sample.

In it's most extreme form, you just make the curtain entirely see-through and everyone can just see all of your brainjuice, it's spilling out everywhere and it's kind of disgusting and no one really wants to look at it but it's also sorta compelling and they can't help but look. Practically speaking, though, it's kinda helpful to form your thoughts about things in a coherent way so that other people don't have to do a lot of work to figure out what the heck all that juice shit is that's happening. That would be, like, making a big ol' soup and when you come out the curtain parts and everyone can take a bit of a look at the big messy yucky glob and then they're given this delicious soup to eat and drink and they kinda get the best of both worlds. A bit of a view of the messy shit behind the curtain and a nice taste of coherency, and they can tell that that soup came from that glob because they can see that both have the same qualities, child like mother.

Thing is, if you're mafia, your brainjuice isn't like everyone else's. Your brainjuice is all contained in a neat little vat and there's nothing messy about it. It has air bubbles and shit, it's basically curated. So when you're bringing out your soup and ladle, people will see the vat behind the curtain and they'll be like, what? Who are you? And like, mafia can dress up their brainjuice and try to make it all messy, they can have these delicious soup recipes to feed everyone, but when it comes down to it, when they're doing the "transparent" thing and showing everyone what they think, there's no foundation to it, all they have is a silly-looking vat, they had to invent everything to make it seem like other people's ugly crap, they can't really part the curtain because if they do then people will notice that there's a disconnect between the soup and what's behind. And they're kinda smug about it, too, more often than not, you know. Power and secrecy does things to people.

Makey sense?